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Hi Berean,
YOU: God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, 2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
ME: Perfect scripture that shows Jesus did not pre-exist as God’s WORD. God gave His word, His pleasures that He declared before the world began to the prophets and IN that word was the man Jesus, the son of David who God promised he would be a Father to. This man is a Son ACCORDING to the Spirit, God begat the son of David on a certain day, and having received the Spirit without measure Jesus was SENT to preach to us God’s word.
WHO did God appoint to be heir of all things? A HUMAN that is who!
THIS is God’s WORD from before the world was that God gave unto the prophet David who was God’s servant, His beloved.
Psalm 8:2 Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies, that thou mightest still the enemy and the avenger. 3 When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained; 4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? 5 For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour. 6 Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet: 7 All sheep and oxen, yea, and the beasts of the field; 8 The fowl of the air, and the fish of the sea, and whatsoever passeth through the paths of the seas. 9 O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth!
Berean, ALL THINGS CONSIST because of ONE MAN who brought righteousness and life. Isaiah 45 tells you that God made heaven, earth and man himself, and He made it not in vain but for it to be inhabited.
God’s word before the world began was a promise of eternal life, which is given to us by God through a MAN. When God made His promise of eternal life before the world began, you don’t think that IN that same WORD was JESUS, the son of David who God promised to raise up to be our savior? COME ON! God made the world according to His determined purpose, to fulfill His pleasure, and that pleasure was to be mindful of a man, and crown that man with glory and honor where he is given dominion over the works of God’s hands.
God created Adam/human in His own image and He gave him dominion over all the works of His hands, but Adam sinned and died. The man who God perfected and then who shed his blood is he who is SAID to exist in the image of God, this son of man/human is the second Adam/human who receives the inheritance of a firstborn, he receives dominion over all the works of God’s hands. He lives in the image of God because upon shedding his blood he was raised from the dead being begotten by God receiving the promised Holy Spirit.
Jodi
To deny the texts that AFFIRM THE DIVINITY OF CHRIST AND ITS CREATIVE POWER, IT IS SERIOUS … VERY SERIOUS …
YOU WILL TIRE YOU TO FORCE TO RESIST THE EVIDENCE.
I CAN ENSURE THAT YOU ARE NOT ON A GOOD TRAIL.Gene
Please Stop resisting the truth. … Jesus is THE WORD made flesh
How can you deny this fact, I’m dismayed.This simple verse proves that Jesus existed before the world was.
Jesus pray here
[5] And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Hi Jodi,
YOU: READ Isaiah 45 it is clear that Jesus did not pre-exist,
Isaiah 45:13 I HAVE RAISED him up to justice,….
Jodi: I HAVE RAISED is in the
PRESENT PERFECT TENSE
AN ACTION COMPLETED IN THE PAST!
JESUS PRE-EXISTED (1)
Answer Jodi:
WHEN HAVE GOD RAISED JESUS?
Isaiah45:15 Verily thou art a hidden God,…
YOU ARE A HIDDEN GOD…
The above is in
THE PRESENT TENSE , A REFERENCE TO THE
PAST, PRESENT and FUTURE!
ETERNAL
JESUS PRE-EXISTED (2)
Isaiah 45:23 I have sworn by myself,
I HAVE SWORN is in
THE PRESENT PERFECT TENSE
AN ACTION COMPLETED IN THE PAST
JESUS PRE-EXISTED (3)
Luke 4:18 The spirit of the Lord is upon me. IS UPON ME: PRESENT TENSE, ETERNAL
Wherefore he hath anointed me : HE HATH ANOINTED ME: PRESENT PERFECT TENSE. AN ACTION COMPLETED IN THE PAST.
to preach the gospel to the poor,
he hath sent me: HE HATH SENT ME: PRESENT PERFECT TENSE. AN ACTION COMPLETED IN THE PAST.
to heal the contrite of heart,
19To preach deliverance to the captives and sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, to preach the acceptable year of the Lord and the day of reward.
ALL THE ABOVE Jodi, simply made it
AS CLEAR AS CRYSTAL THAT
JESUS PRE-EXISTED AS A SPIRIT
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Hi, Jodi
YOU: Perfect scripture that shows Jesus did not pre-exist as God’s WORD.
Isaiah 45:13 I have raised him (JESUS) up to JUSTICE,
Isaiah 45:23 I have sworn by myself,
the word (JESUS) of JUSTICE shall go out of my mouth,…
John 16:27 …. have believed that I(“THE WORD”) came out from God.
28I came forth from the Father…Isaiah 45:25Therefore shall he say: In the Lord (JESUS) are MY JUSTICES …
Rev.19:11 And I saw heaven opened: and behold a white horse. And he that sat upon him was called faithful and true:
and with JUSTICE doth he judge and fight.
12And his eyes were as a flame of fire: and on his head were many diadems.
And he had a name written,
which no man knoweth but himself.
13And he was clothed with a garment sprinkled with blood.
And his name is called:
THE WORD OF GOD.
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh
and dwelt among us
Answer Jodi: WHY IT WAS VITAL FOR JOHN TO MAKE IT AWARE THAT “THE WORD” DWELT AMONG HUMANS?
IF JESUS WAS ONE OF THE MORTAL HUMANS OF EARTH
THERE WAS NO NEED TO AFFIRM THAT JESUS DWELT AMONG HUMANS. NO?
(and we saw his glory, the glory as it were of the only begotten of the Father), full of grace and truth.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Hi Berean,
Can you discuss Acts 2 and 13 along with 1 Chronicles 17 or not? How about Psalms 2, 8, 89 and Isaiah 45?
Can you discuss this truth? Here is a very simple fact for you, Jesus quoted a prophecy that was made true in him, he quoted Isaiah 61 in Luke 4, this IS a most fine example of God’s WORD being made true in the flesh, made true in the man Jesus.
Hi Berean,
You are directly told of Jesus’s glory that he was to receive in Psalms 8, you think the man Jesus when he knew his time was coming to die that he would not be speaking to God of his faith in this word of God, and asking him to receive of that word?
Remember God declared the END from the beginning so the glory of the man Jesus according to Psalms 8 was OF God before the world was, and such is the glory that the man Jesus was asking God for. This is simple truth directly laid out for you in the words that God spoke.
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. 3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. 4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do (recall Luke 4, Jesus was anointed and sent TO preach, heal, perform signs and miracles, in the name of God). 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me (the son of David speaking who God made into his own Son according to the Spirit) with thine own self with the glory which I had with (para meaning OF) thee before the world was.
Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
If Christ does not return before I die, my last words in this life will be me asking my Heavenly Father in the name of Jesus Christ, for the glorify that I had of my Father before the world began, eternal life.
Just as Jesus had glory of the Father by the Father’s WORD given in a promise, I do likewise, for he is firstborn of many brethren having been first to be raised from the dead receiving eternal life, I am promised to be made as he is.
Romans 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. 18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Now as he is I will be, and we are told that the same Jesus who ascended is the same Jesus who is descending, that it is the Son of Man that is coming in glory who is the root and offspring of David going to sit on his father David’s throne according to the flesh, as God did not make humans in vain, but for them to inhabit the earth for all eternity, being Sons of God as they are Led by the Spirit of God where God’s Spirit is a witness to our human spirit that we are children of God.
Carmel,
The people saw the glory of Jesus because God’s Spirit came to abode upon him where by that Spirit he followed all of God’s commands, spoke what God taught him to speak, healed who God told him to heal, went to the cross because that was God’s will.
As said, Isaiah 61 is God’s WORD made true in the flesh of Jesus.
Can you comprehend and admit to this clear fact Carmel?
God’s WORD said that He WOULD rest His Spirit upon a man, set him a part from all other men, an anointing, and SEND him out into the world TO perform deeds and preach the gospel in God’s name, this WORD was made true in the flesh of Jesus.
Jodi
there is nothing in all these texts (Acts2; 13; psalms2 … etc) which prove that Jesus is only human or that he is not divine.If the child who is born of Mary is only a simple man, then why did the Magi from the East bow down before him to WORSHIP him?
Can you Jodi answer this question?
Antichrists deny this
The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
For in Him all things were created, things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities.
All things were created through Him and for Him.
He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.…In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He was with God in the beginning.
Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made.…He has eyes like blazing fire, and many royal crowns on His head.
He has a name written on Him that only He Himself knows.
He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and His name is The Word of God.T8…..interesting how you leave out words and add words that are not written, to force our text to say what in fact the are not actually saying.
As far as made in the “image of God” goes, scripture says we “All” are made in his image , so are we not “also “over All things” along with Jesus” scripture say we are, Are we not heirs and “joint heirs” with Christ? Tell us how you deal with these scriptures.
Isa 42:5, Isa 45:23, Isa 44:24, these are just a few, there are hundreds more. , what you not doing T8, is comparing the new testement with the old Testement , as we were told to do. ACTS 17:11
You or no one else have ever shown any activity in all scriptures, that show any activity of Jesus before his berth on this earth. If you have found some please post it, and by the way no scripture say “Jesus ““is” the word of God” what it says is, “he is “CALLED” the word of God. He is “Called” the word of God because he speaks “GOD’S WORDS” TO US. NOT “HIS” WORDS.
John 14:10 …….believe you not that I am in the Father ; and the Father in me?, that “words” that I speak unto you I speak “not” of (from) myself : but the Father that dwells in me, “he” does the work.
JOHN 3:34……For he whom God has sent speaks the words of “GOD” : for God gives not the Spirit by measure unto him.
T8….can you understand the above scripture. Now who’s word was Jesus speaking?, and what is God’s words ? Are the not the spirit of God speaking through those he sends? TRYING TO MAKE JESUS HIMSELF THE WORD OF GOD HIMSELF IS A ” LIE” when are you going to start to actually believe what Jesus himself says about t h e word he speaks to us T8.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene
Isaiah 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. 18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell; And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth,or things in heaven. And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
The LORD who created heaven and earth by himself promised us redemption, and it pleased the Father to bring us our redemption through one body of flesh who would shed his blood unto death on a cross. By him in the flesh who shed his blood all the fullness does dwell, all things reconciled by God through him.
Isaiah 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;
Acts 13: 38 Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins: 39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.
Psalms 8: 3 When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained; 4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? 5 For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour. 6 Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:
Acts 4:24 And when they heard that, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord, and said, Lord, thou art God, which hast made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all that in them is: 25 Who by the mouth of thy servant David hast said, Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things? 26 The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ. 27 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, 28 For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.
Acts 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Before the world began, God made all things by reason of and for the man that God would anoint and send to the cross having his body of flesh die to bring forth our redemption.
The man of flesh, Jesus of Nazareth in Luke 4 quoted Isaiah 61 concerning himself, where this man of flesh through the Spirit descending like a dove coming to abode upon him was set apart/anointed for to be sent out into the world to bring forth redemption that people might be called trees of righteousness.
Isaiah 61: 1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; 2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn; 3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that he might be glorified. …10 I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels. 11 For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord GOD will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.
Before the world began IN God’s word was the one man who would bring righteousness and life, all things were created by reason of and for him, God would have not made the earth and man if it were not for this one man.
God declared the END from the beginning. His WORD from His powerful voice of the END is a beginning that starts with the firstborn of the dead. The firstborn of the dead was raised in glory, raised in power, raised incorruptible fulfilling God’s WORD before the world began, eternal life. Jesus was IN God’s WORD before the world began. God’s pleasure was to bring forth eternal life, which Jesus received first and by him having been perfected by learning obedience through suffering as he went to the cross he BECAME our source for eternal salvation. This is why all things consist in him, this is why scripture says that God made all things by reason of and for him.
WHAT IS ANTICHRIST is to DENY Jesus’s OWN words in Luke 4 as to WHEN God ANOINTED him and WHEN God SENT him.
Hi, Jodi,
YOU: As said, Isaiah 61 is God’s WORD made true in the flesh of Jesus.
Can you comprehend and admit to this clear fact Carmel?
God’s WORD said that He WOULD rest His Spirit upon a man, set him a part from all other men, an anointing, and SEND him out into the world TO perform deeds and preach the gospel in God’s name, this WORD was made true in the flesh of Jesus.
YOU: God’s WORD said that He WOULD rest His Spirit upon a man,
The above Jodi
IS YOUR TWISTED VERSION.
Produce the actual scripture!
Read scripture:
Isaiah 61:1 The spirit of the Lord IS upon me,….
(IS upon Me, in PRESENT TENSE Jodi, a reference to the PAST, PRESENT, and FUTURE)
ETERNAL! JESUS PRE-EXISTED AS A SPIRIT!
THE WORD OF GOD!
the Lord hath anointed me:
he hath sent me….
Jodi the above TWO PHRASES are in THE PRESENT PERFECT TENSE.
https://www.grammarly.com/blog/present-perfect-tense/
Present Perfect Tense
Grammarly
BASICSThe present perfect tense refers to an action or state that
either occurred at an indefinite time in the past
(e.g., we have talked before) orbegan in the past and continued to the present time
(e.g., he has grown impatient over the last hour). This tense is formed by have/has + the past participle.NOW IF YOU ACCEPT THE ABOVE LESSON,
Isn’t it THE GENUINE TRUTH that
JESUS AS A SPIRIT PREEXISTED ???
ANSWER PLEASE:
When in actual fact hath the Lord
ANOINTED JESUS?
Now read Isaiah 61 and there is no such statement.
The only thing which is CLEAR and TRUE IS
THAT JESUS PRE-EXISTED
1The spirit of the Lord is upon me,
because the Lord hath anointed me:
he hath sent me
to preach to the meek, to heal the contrite of heart, and to preach a release to the captives, and deliverance to them that are shut up.
2To proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord, and the day of vengeance of our God: to comfort all that mourn:
3To appoint to the mourners of Sion, and to give them a crown for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, a garment of praise for the spirit of grief: and they shall be called in it the mighty ones of justice, the planting of the Lord to glorify him.
4And they shall build the places that have been waste from of old, and shall raise up ancient ruins, and shall repair the desolate cities, that were destroyed for generation and generation.
5And strangers shall stand and shall feed your flocks: and the sons of strangers shall be your husbandman, and the dressers of your vines.
6But you shall be called the priests of the Lord: to you it shall be said: Ye ministers of our God: you shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and you shall pride yourselves in their glory.
7For your double confusion and shame, they shall praise their part: therefore shall they receive double in their land, everlasting joy shall be unto them.
8For I am the Lord that love judgment, and hate robbery in a holocaust: and I will make their work in truth, and I will make a perpetual covenant with them.
9And they shall know their seed among the Gentiles, and their offspring in the midst of peoples: all that shall see them, shall know them, that these are the seed which the Lord hath blessed.
10I will greatly rejoice in the Lord, and my soul shall be joyful in my God: for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation: and with the robe of justice he hath covered me, as a bridegroom decked with a crown, and as a bride adorned with her jewels.
11For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth her seed to shoot forth: so shall the Lord God make justice to spring forth, and praise before all the nations.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ.
Jodi
You
Before the world began, God made all things by reason of and for the man that God would anoint and send to the cross having his body of flesh die to bring forth our redemption.
The Word of God:
For if there are beings who are called gods, either in heaven or on earth, as there are really many gods and many lords,
8:6 Nevertheless to us there is ONE GOD , THE FATHER, FROM WHOM ALL THINGS COME, AND FOR WHOM WE ARE;
and one Lord, Jesus Christ,BY WHOM ALL THINGS ARE, AND BY WHOM WE ARE.(1 Corinthians 8:5,6)
GOD FROM WHOM……
JESUS CHRIST BY WHOM…
Is Paul a liar?
Jesus’ activities before his
incarnation .He was the angel of JEHOVAH…
HIS WORD >>> HIS MESSENGER
THE SPIRITUAL ROCK THAT COMMUNICATES THE SPIRITUAL WATER OF LIFE.And they all drank the same spiritual drink, for they drank of the spiritual rock that followed them, and that ROCK was CHRIST (1 Corinthians 10:4).
AMEN
ALLELOUIA
JESUS SAID
BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS
I AM
Jesus Ordinary man ?
Certainly not.
Berean , your problem is you do not understand the word “by” properly , look it up and you will find it mean “for the sake of”. NOT EVERY THING IN OUR TEXT IS WRITTEN RIGHT. This is on of those places. The word in Greek “en” can mean many things , that is why you must consider all scriptures inorder to get the right context. The spirit of God should have already taught you that.
Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene
Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
[13] Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his DEAD SON :[14] IN WHOM (dear Son)we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
[15] Who(dear Son) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
[16] For BY HIM (dear Son)were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him(dear Son), and for him:
[17] And he (dear Son)is before all things, and by him(dear Son) all things consist.
[18] And he (dear Son)is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he (dear Son) might have the preeminence.
[19] For it pleased the Father that in him(dear Son) should all fulness dwell;
[20] And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him (dear Son)to reconcile all things unto himself(dear Son); by him(dear Son), I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.Hi Berean,
YOU: Jodi
there is nothing in all these texts (Acts2; 13; psalms2 … etc) which prove that Jesus is only human or that he is not divine.ME: the Messiah to come was to be a human, Jesus is said to be a human while he was on the earth both before and after he died and rose again, he is also said to be a human now in heaven and a human when he returns. If he was more than a human he wouldn’t be called a human because he wouldn’t actually be a human.
Direct scripture tells you exactly what Jesus is. He is a human, a son of the human David, and this root and offspring of David is God’s Son according to the Spirit, of which he received in fullness at the river Jordan, and then received upon him rising from the dead where you are told that is when the son of David was begotten by God, that is when he received the promised Holy Spirit.
Romans 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
2 Peter 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
God made a promise unto humans that they would be partakers of His divine nature, where God is ALL in you, where His Spirit is a witness to your human spirit that you are a child of God. Those that are led by the Spirit of God are the Sons of God.
John 8:26 I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him. 27 They understood not that he spake to them of the Father. 28 Then said Jesus unto them,When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things. 29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.
Jesus is not sent to earth as a divine son that becomes a human. Jesus doesn’t speak God’s word because he pre-existed as a divine son. Jesus speaks God’s word because at the river Jordan he received God’s Spirit not by measure. Jesus did not receive of God’s Spirit because he pre-existed as God’s divine son, but because he is the fulfilled prophecy given to David where God promised He would be a Father unto David’s son, and because he is the fulfilled prophecy unto Jesse’s son in Isaiah 11, 42, 45, and 61, such was God’s pleasure for one man, and God made all things by reason of and for him before the world began.
The one who God sends into the world is JESUS of Nazareth, the son of David who God begat with the fullness of His Spirit, where God’s WORD that Jesus quotes from Isaiah is made true in his flesh at the river Jordan. This Jesus can do nothing of himself, the Spirit is righteousness and life, and by that Spirit leading Jesus’s spirit he is of the divine nature, a Son of God sent TO preach God’s word and be obedient to all that God commands him to do. The Son of Man is sent to save that which was lost, and beginning in Galilee people were a witness of a man come from heaven/God SENT TO preach the kingdom of heaven/God, TO heal, TO deliver captives.
John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. 35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. 36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Berean, how is it that people believed Jesus was the promised Messiah, that he was the promised descendant of David who God said He would be a Father to? They believed on him because of the words that he spoke through the Spirit, and by all the signs, miracles and wonders that he performed by the power of the Spirit.
Nathanael in the passage below identifies Jesus as the Son of God according to being the promised King of Israel, a human of the house of David.
John 1:49 Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.
Now think about this, when Jesus was anointed with the Spirit in full measure having all the powers of God and he was sent out to perform God’s will with all signs, miracles and wonders, and speak God’s words, what the people witnessed was Jesus in the form of God. Jesus had all the gifts of the Spirit and all the powers of the Spirit and he could have used those powers for himself and made himself to be known as a god, but he did not use those powers for his own will (he emptied himself of his own will), and all that he did he gave God full credit for saying he could do nothing of himself it was all God who was dwelling in him, (he humbled himself). When he was sent into the wilderness he was tested, he went without food 40 days and when he hungered he was tempted to make bread out of stones, but he declared that “MAN does not live on bread alone but by every word that proceeds out of God’s mouth.” Jesus who was in the form of God humbled himself in the wilderness and he left the wilderness as God’s servant, and he was tested again going to the cross, where he asked God to take this cup from him, but not as he willed but as the Father willed, but such was not the Father’s will, and thus Jesus learned obedience through suffering going to the cross. Jesus took the WORD of God to the cross having faith in it, giving his last living breath unto it. He believed in God’s promises, the mercies that God promised to David concerning him and the prophecies told by Isaiah. Jesus believed that he was the man God promised to raise up in glory and honor and give him dominion over all of creation as a firstborn of many brethren with eternal life. He believed in Isaiah 53:12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.”
You are directly told that God said He created all things alone, Jesus himself speaks of God creating them male and female. Jesus never says he pre-existed as God’s WORD, or that he created all things through God for himself. You are told all things that God created He promised to give it into the hands of ONE MAN, one man who God appointed to judge not through his own eyes and ears but through having God’s Spirit directing him.
Passages don’t reveal Jesus pre-existed they reveal that Jesus was IN God’s WORD before the world was and God created all things through His WORD, that word was that the man who shed his blood is a firstborn overall creation, the man who God perfected going to the cross having died by living in faith of God’s word is he that is the image of God.
God’s word from the beginning was eternal life and God making man in His own image. God declared the END from the beginning, when you read that the man who shed his blood is the firstborn overall creation and he is the image of God that is exactly the word of God declared from the beginning of which was the END, and of which He made all things by reason of and for.
Hi Berean,
YOU: If the child who is born of Mary is only a simple man, then why did the Magi from the East bow down before him to WORSHIP him?
Can you Jodi answer this question?
ME: Berean, come on now I do not speak of Jesus as a SIMPLE MAN, a MAN YES, but not a simple man or an ordinary man. You don’t call the man who God appointed to be a king of kings and lord of lords, before the world even began, a simple man. He is the man who we obey and give deep respect to because our One True God made him to be for us our lord and Christ and because, “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;” (1 Timothy 2:5)
WORSHIP -Proskuneo to give reverence – deep respect
The wise men worship the child BECAUSE they believe God’s word of prophecy that the child is the future king, “1 Chronicles 17:13 I will be his father, and he shall be my son: and I will not take my mercy away from him, as I took it from him that was before thee: 14 But I will settle him in mine house and in my kingdom for ever: and his throne shall be established for evermore.
Matthew 2:1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, 2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him. 3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him. 4 And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born. 5 And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet, 6 And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel. 7 Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, enquired of them diligently what time the star appeared. 8 And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also. 9 When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was. 10 When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy. 11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh.
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