December 4, 2018 at 6:26 am #836011TruthcomberParticipant
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You: You proclaim the Word was in Jesus at conception.
But without proof.
Me: On this page
December 4, 2018 at 1:18 am
That’s proof enough, what do you need, a vision?December 4, 2018 at 6:52 am #836012
You have shown no evidence for your own idea.
Jesus of Nazareth was anointed with the Holy Spirit and power.
Acts 10December 4, 2018 at 7:53 am #836013
PAUL SAYS THAT MAN SINS IN BODY, SOUL AND SPIRIT.
You have not shown where Paul said this. Please do so.December 4, 2018 at 8:15 am #836014
I agree the kingdom is delivered up to God at the end of the 1000 year reign
You said: Maybe or maybe not. Rev 20:6 suggest this. “Blessed” could related to being kings and priest. This suggest more holy but not necessarily only holy. When we have Immortality we have God’s Nature, that would be Divine. The firstfruits, they will have a new name.
You said: In Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
All will die in Adam Spiritually and literally and some of the firstfruits will be changed at His coming All will be made alive after the lake of fire, death will be no more and then just life All will be saved.
You said : Up unto the time Christ was on earth, no man hath ascended into heaven. But that doesn’t mean after Pentecost no man or any part of him hadn’t.
That Scripture says no one. There wasn’t a time, in that scripture. I took it at face value, (no one.)
You: “If Christ be not raised, your[Christian] faith is vain; and you are in your sins, then they also which are fallen asleep [those dead] in Christ are perished.”1 Corinthians 15:17-18 the whole man is dead.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
to put to sleep, fall asleep
asleep (3), dead (1), fallen asleep (7), fell asleep (3), sleep (2), sleeping (2).
Me: 2837 can mean sleep or it can mean to die.
You said: So to match the meaning of “sleep” in 1 Cor 15:18 with the word “rest” in Rev 6:11, sleep in 1 Cor 15:18 must mean rest and not death. Otherwise, the scriptures contradict.
It means death in this scripture. 1 Cor.15:17-18 I’ll send word study next post. Or do you want to look it up??? Apparently you don’t have the right concordace. I’ll send it. I’m using my phone I can’t look right now.
There wouldn’t be Salvation for us. If He didn’t die for the sins of the body ,soul and spirit of man also He had to be resurrected and go to God to sprinkle His blood in the heavenly sanctuary.
You said: Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
This is just like Able crying out from the ground (grave) to God about Caleb
Jesus Christ had to die in all three parts body, soul and spirit to make Atonement for us. I’m not talking about the breath of God (life)>Spirit.that goes back to God at death Paul speak as we have three parts. Body ,soul and spirit.
God bless. I’ll send the word study.December 4, 2018 at 8:26 am #836015
Nothing survives the lake of fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.
And do not fear those who kill the body,but are unable to kill the soul;
but rather fear Him Who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.December 4, 2018 at 9:04 am #836016TruthcomberParticipant
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You, I’ll send the word study.
Me: Don’t bother, I just had sent it. I have never seen such gibberish. I care not to read more.December 4, 2018 at 9:24 am #836017
The spirit of a man cannot die but returns to God Who gave it.
ecc12December 4, 2018 at 9:38 am #836018
Therefore, having these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all defilement
of flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
That which proceeds out the of the man, that is what defiles the man…
All of these evil things proceed from within and defile the man.
Sin in the flesh.Lusts.
Now if a man cleanses himself from these things, he will be a vessel of honour,
sanctified, useful to the master, repaired for every good work. Now flee from youthful lusts,
and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with all who call on the lord from a pure heart,December 4, 2018 at 1:43 pm #836027GeneBalthropParticipant
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To All……No one has risen yet from the grave they who have died are still dead, if they are of the true Faith, they shall attain unto the first resurection, “that will witness the redemption of their BODIES”, JUST AS THE APOSTLE PAUL SAID. Jesus was the first one resurected from the dead, They who died will experience the exact same resurection Jesus did. Jesus is not a spirit being, he is a flesh and bone human being just as he said he is. And exactly as we will be after we are resurected also.
He is the FIRST BORN OF MANY BROTHERS. THE FIRST TO BE RESURECTED FROM THE GRAVE. He will return as a flesh and bone “SON of MAN”. To sit on the throne of king David, JUST AS HE SAID, and after a thousand years of REGIN with the resurected Sain’ts, he will turn over the kingdom to GOD the Father, and become subject to the kingdom of God as everyone else will be. those who will be with him will be just as he is, all human beings, not resurected spirits of anykind,but actual human being who have eternal life in them.
Mystery Religion has changed human beings to spirit being of some kind, no scripture even hints at that. We are God’s physical creation who he will come and live in and among us all. We are not spirits of anykind, spirits can cohabit us, even God who is spirit can INHABBIT all , JUST AS IT SAY “know you not that your body is the temple of THE LIVING GOD?” According to PAUL.
Peace and love to you and yours. …….geneDecember 4, 2018 at 1:59 pm #836028
Do you honestly think that the lake of fire is literal, Revelation is a book of symbols, you’ll find if you look at other scriptures where the word fire is used , in the old and new Testament, it’s pretty obvious you find it’s a fire of correction and that the word eternal means a age,which it has a starting point and a ending He is a consuming fire He bring the unjust to the place of repentance just like you Nick He the Savior of the whole world, Nick.
God bless.December 4, 2018 at 2:29 pm #836032
Hi Nick let me know if you want me to post what you need to see, kind of long you probably wouldn’t read it anyways k. God bless.December 4, 2018 at 2:49 pm #836033
REVEALED AND TRIED BY FIRE
“Now if any man build upon this [spiritual] foundation [Christ]gold, silver, precious stones[godly character traits], wood, hay, stubble [carnal character traits]; Every man’s work [thoughts, words, and deeds] shall be made manifest[become known, come to light]: for the day shall declare it[make it evident], because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is” (I Cor. 3:12-13December 4, 2018 at 2:52 pm #836034
“Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he has built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; YET SO AS BY FIRE“
(I Cor. 3:13-15).December 4, 2018 at 3:11 pm #836035
SCRIPTURAL USE OF FIGURATIVE FIRE
“His head and His hairs were white like wool, as white as snow, and His eyes were as a flame of FIRE” (Rev. 1:14).
“That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perishes though it be tarried with FIRE, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ” (I Pet. 1:7).
“And the tongue is a FIRE…”(James 3:6).
“And of the angels He says, Who makes His angels spirits, and His ministers a flame of FIRE”(Heb. 1:7).
“Every man’s work shall be made manifest; for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by FIRE; and the FIRE shall try every man’s work of what sort it is” (I Cor. 3:13).
“For our God is a consuming FIRE” (Heb. 12:29).
“Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing you shall heap coals of FIRE on his head” (Rom. 12:20).
“John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I comes, the latchet of Whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: He shall baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with FIRE”
“For EVERY ONE shall be salted with FIRE, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt” (Mark 9:49).
“But who may abide the day of His coming? And who shall stand when He appears? For He is like a refiner’s FIRE, and like fullers’ soap” (Malachi 3:2).
“…for all the earth shall be devoured with the FIRE of my jealousy”
“For in My jealousy and in the FIRE of My wrath have I spoken”
“From above has He sent FIRE into my bones…” (Lamentations 1:13).
“Is not My word like as a FIRE? saith the Lord” (Jer. 23:29).
“Who makes His angels spirits; His ministers a flaming FIRE”
Nick do you honestly think that the lake of fire is literal???
Did you think that literal fire fire make a difference with man works. Look at this again.
wood, hay, stubble [carnal character traits]; Every man’s work [thoughts, words, and deeds]
God bless NickDecember 4, 2018 at 3:17 pm #836036
To All……No one has risen yet from the grave they who have died are still dead, if they are of the true Faith, they shall attain unto the first resurection, “that will witness the redemption of their BODIES”, JUST AS THE APOSTLE PAUL SAID.
Good post God blessDecember 4, 2018 at 3:31 pm #836037
Yes there are fires of testing.
But the lake of fire is used after the final judgement.
All opportunity and hope is lost for those consigned to be thrown into it.December 4, 2018 at 8:43 pm #836047t8Participant
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I agree that the Lake of Fire is destruction for all that is wicked. Then there will be a new heaven and new earth, and no more sin.
Those that reject God reject love and life. Does God force those that reject him to live with him forever despite their rejection. I doubt it.
God gave us free will. It is really the only thing we own and thus it is because of this we are judged.
Maybe trillions of years from now in the new creation, God could bring in a new plan of salvation for those that rejected it in the previous iteration of the cosmos, but that is conjecture. I only say this because God said the soul that sins will die and while this is still true, out of his love, he made a plan to enable this required death to be defeated in us to give us life.
In short, we can not say for sure anything about God because he is sovereign. If he speaks it, it will come to pass though. Even death came to pass, but so did the life that superseded it. What God does we have been given a glimpse of. Anything else is conjecture.December 5, 2018 at 1:08 am #836051
Hi Nick and T8
Do you believe the following Scriptures:
<b>”For God sent NOT his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that <u>THE WORLD</u> through Him </b>m<b>ight be SAVED” (</b>John 3:17)!
<b>”…the Lamb of God</b>, which<b> takes away the sin of <u>THE</u> <u>WORLD</u>” </b>(John 1:29)!
<b>”And He </b><b> is the propitiation for our sins </b>[satisfactorily covered all sin]<b>and not for our’s only, but also for the sins of <u>THE WHOLE WORLD</u>” </b>(I John 2:2)!
<b>”And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son </b><b> to be the SAVIOUR OF <u>THE WORLD</u>” </b>(I John 4:14)!
<b>”…for when Thy</b> <b> judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of <u>THE WORLD</u> will learn righteousness” </b>(Isaiah 26:9)!
<b>”…for we have heard Him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, </b><b>, the Saviour of <u>THE WORLD</u>” </b>(John 4:42)!
<b>”To wit that God was in Christ</b><b>, reconciling <u>THE WORLD</u> unto Himself, NOT imputing their trespasses unto them…” </b>(II Cor. 5:19)!
<b>”This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation </b>[will<i>you</i> accept it?]<b> that Christ Jesus </b><b> came into <u>THE WORLD</u> to SAVE SINNERS…” </b>(I Tim. 1:15)!
<b>”And if any man hear My words, and believe not, I judge Him not, for I </b><b> came not to judge the world, but to SAVE <u>THE WORLD</u>” </b>(John 12:47)!
How then can one believe all of these Scriptures and yet believe that Jesus will NOT SAVE, but will eternally torture in the lake of fire, most of <u>THE WORLD</u>? My prayer is that many of you will, for the first time in your lives, repent of your stubbornness, and <i>start believing </i>these Scriptures.
Also do you know that no where in Scripture does it says that man will be tormenting Hell in Fire forever.
We know Hell really means grave, and forever means age.
The more I think about this subject if this was literal, I wonder why . ire is in a Lake, wouldn’t it have a hard time staying going. Well anyways, God bless.December 5, 2018 at 1:57 am #836052
T8 I looked up freewill, here are the results.
“Free Will” DEFINED
The American Heritage College Dictionary:
“free will n. 1. The ability or discretion to choose; free choice. 2. The power of making free choices that are unconstrained by external circumstances or by an agency such as fate or divine will.”
My Meriam-Webster Collegiate Dictionary/Eleventh Edition has an even more precise definition:
“free will n. freedom of humans to make choices that are not determined by prior causes or by divine intervention.”
It is useless to have a study on this term “free will” unless we stick to a strict, concise and precise definition of the term. As can be seen from our dictionaries, “free will” does not have for a concise or precise definition the ability to “make choices.” Yet this is the way it is often defined.
Notice that our dictionaries are specific in stating that it is “FREE choice” that is the definition of “free will,” rather than just “choice” alone. To be an expression of “free will,” choices must also be free. Free from what? We just read it:
- Free from “PRIOR CAUSES.”
- Free from “CONSTRAINT.”
- Free from “EXTERNAL CIRCUMSTANCES.”
- Free from “FATE.”
- Free from “DIVINE WILL.”
- Free from “DIVINE INTERVENTION.”
Those who would argue for free will, however, refuse being held to these precise and concise definitions. They want the mere ability to “make a choice” to be considered an act of “free will.” Well it is nothing of the kind.
God blessDecember 5, 2018 at 2:23 am #836053
ONLY THE SPIRIT CAN CAUSE THE CARNAL MIND TO REPENT
The carnal mind is a mind debarred of spiritual understanding. Not only does it not understand spiritual things; it is an impossibility to do so. The carnal mind cannot spiritually repent. Therefore it is not “free.” It is in fact, enslaved to sin. No “slave” is “free.” Let’s learn a few very basic Truths:
- “God [ is] SPIRIT” (John 4:24).
- “…the Words that I speak unto you are SPIRIT…” (John 6:63).
- “Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the SPIRIT which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teaches, but which the Holy SPIRIT teaches; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
But the natural man [still being carnal-minded] receives not the things of the SPIRIT of God: neither CAN HE know them, because they are spiritually discerned“ (I Cor. 2:12-14) .
Clearly, the natural mind of man unaided by the Spirit of God, is not “free” to receive “the things of the Spirit of God, neither CAN HE KNOW THEM…”
God is SPIRIT and the words of Christ are SPIRIT. To understand these words we must have the Spirit, which is of God. We can then “compare” spiritual with spiritual, and understand.
If we have the Spirit of God we can do this. But if we are carnal-minded and have not the Spirit of God, we cannot do this. Here is why:
“Because the carnal mind is enmity [hatred] against God: for it is NOT subject to the [spiritual]law of God, neither indeed CAN BE” (Rom. 8:7).
Now follow me closely. What, pray tell, happens between being carnally-minded and not loving God or being subject to His spiritual law, and later, loving God and being subject to His spiritual law? What happened and WHO was responsible for causing it to happen?
According to “free-willers,” a person must choose of his own will, to love and obey God. Any person with a “free will” is supposedly able to hate and disobey God on one day and then decide for himself on another day to love and obey God. This is believed to be self-repentance. And this, we are told is something that every individual must do on his own, seeing that God will not make one or force one to do this. It must be “freely” chosen, or of what value is “forced love,” as they argue?
Here is a problem of major proportions starring us right in the face with this free will assertion. If a carnal minded person cannot love God and cannot be subject to God’s law, how in the world is he going to choose to love and obey God with his carnal mind? God’s Word says that it is not possible ( “…neither indeed CAN BE”-King James/ “…for neither is it ABLE”-Concordant Literal New Testament ).
God’s word tells us that the natural, carnal mind of man, [all mankind-the human race], cannot love or obey God. For it:
“receives not the things of the spirit,” “neither indeed CAN BE/for neither is it ABLE.”
Therefore the will of man, of all mankind-the entire human race, is not ‘free’ to contradict these Scriptural Truths of God.
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