John 1:1

John 1:1 says the Word was God. Does that mean that Jesus is God because he is the Word?
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

a) In the beginning was the Word, (en arch hn o logoV)
b) and the Word was with God, (kai o logoV hn proV ton qeon)
c) and the Word was God. (kai qeoV hn o logoV).

John 1:1b says that the Word was with God and John 1:1c says that the Word was God, so how can the Word be God and be with God at the same time? Well part of the answer to discovering the meaning of this verse is found in 1 John 1:1-2

“That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and touched with our hands, concerning the word of life and the life was manifested, and we saw it, and testify to it, and proclaim to you the eternal life that was with the Father and was made manifest to us”.

First when we read 1John 1:2, it suggests to us that the God in John1:1b is the Father himself.

Secondly, we see In John 1:1c, the last word God is missing the definite article, (THE). The definite article is before all other instances of the word ‘God’ and ‘Logos’ in John 1:1. (e.g., the Word, The God.), yet is absent in the last mention of God. Read on because this can be significant as you are about to find out.

Greek sentence construction affirms that if a noun doesn’t have a preceding article, (THE) it can be read as an adjective (a predicate adjective); and if such a noun does have a preceding article it should be considered a noun (a predicate nominative). Understanding this is a game changer. Scholars see the benefit of the rule for affirming the deity of Christ in John 1:1, but haven’t made the difference clear regarding the difference between identity and nature or definite and qualitative. Don’t worry if this makes no sense to you. It will.

Look at the difference between these two sentences.

1) You are an angel
2) You are THE angel.

Notice how the first one is using the word angel in a qualitative way while the second is definite. Hence the term ‘definite article’.

In John 1:1, all instances of the word ‘God” are preceded by the definite article ‘THE’, except the last one.

So it literally says:

John1:1
a) In the beginning was THE God.
b) THE Word was with THE God
c) And THE Word was god.

Why is the last word not capitalised? Where Greek uses the definite article in English we capitalise the word. e.g., the god = God.

So it is grammatically correct to read John 1:1c with a qualitative sense rather reading it as identifying the Word as God himself. It is not only grammatically correct to read it this way, it is also theologically correct because if we read it as THE Theos, then that would be saying that the Logos is exclusively God even to the exclusion of the Father. Now we have two good reasons for reading the last word ‘god/theos’ as qualitative and not as THE God or God.

In rebuttal to this, some say that God in the New Testament doesn’t always have a preceding definite article which is true, however looking at the verse contextually, we understand that there is clearly two being spoken of, i.e., one God and one called the Word with is clearly another who is next to God and is not that God he is with.

Let’s look at Adam and Eve as an example of two beings that were with each other. Before I give an example, it is important for you at this point to understand that the Hebrew word for ‘man’ is ‘adam’. This means that qualitatively, Adam and Eve are both adam. This is similar to the word theos which is translated as the ‘God’ & god. The absence of the definite article can qualify just as the word adam qualifies. As I said before, in English we use capitals to denote when being definite. So the difference between ‘Adam’ and ‘adam’ is that Adam refers to a specific man called Adam while the latter could refer to him as well as Eve and any other member of mankind. This is clearly stated in scripture in Genesis 1:27:

So God created man (adam) in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.

The word for man is adam, so it says: God created ‘adam’ male and female. So saying that ‘Eve is adam’ is a true saying.

In English, If I said “John is the man”, then I am identifying John as  a definite and particular person of the human race. But if I omit the definite article and say “John is man,” then I do not identify him, I classify him. I say “John is human; he belongs to the sphere/nature of man.” Can you see the difference now?

To understand how the article can make a big difference to a piece of text, look at this example. Have a guess as to which one is correct.

a) In the beginning was THE woman
b) and THE woman was with THE man
c) and THE Woman was THE man

a) In the beginning was THE woman
b) and THE woman was with THE man
c) and THE Woman was man

The correct one is the second example because it is saying that the woman belongs to mankind or man. Look at the next example:

a) Tools were used by man.
b) Tools were used by the man.

See how the first example is talking about mankind whereas the second example is talking of a specific man.

In other words the word ‘man’ can be used as an attribute or to describe one’s nature. It is not always used to identify a particular person and it can even refer to more than one person.

Now let’s have a look at the above example, but using Adam and Eve instead. Notice in English that we do not have the definite article preceding Adam or Eve, because capitalising both Adam and Eve leads us to view these words in a definite sense, the same way that Greek requires the definite article. Essentially THE adam/man in Greek is the same as Adam in English.

a) In the beginning was Eve,
b) and Eve was with Adam
c) and Eve was Adam

a) In the beginning was Eve,
b) and Eve was with Adam
c) and Eve was adam

Notice that the second example is still the correct one.

To further understand the important difference between identity and nature, take a look at John 6:70. When speaking of his betrayer Judas Iscariot, Jesus said, “One of you is a devil.” Did Jesus mean that Judas is actually Satan the Devil? No! He merely meant to say that Judas is like (class) a devil, or that he had the qualities or nature of a/the devil. The word “devil” here has no article in the Greek as you have probably guessed, but most translators deem it necessary to add the indefinite article “a” to complete the thought in English even though it is not present in Greek or any Greek. Greek has no indefinite articles, (a,an).

So Judas wasn’t Satan himself, rather he was diabolical, like the Devil. He had the qualities of the Devil. But that doesn’t rule out the fact that Satan is the Devil because it is not actually saying that Judas was the Devil himself. Rather Judas thought as the Devil; and acted as the Devil. He was not the Devil (definite), (Satan is); he was not an actual devil or demon, he was a devil (qualitative). He was one who had the mental disposition, the nature, of the Devil, who is Satan. So it is with John 1:1c.

The Logos was God has no definite article. It is really saying, The Logos was god. This is why the New English Bible and the Revised English Bible translate John 1:1 as “what God was, the Word was.” The TEV (1976) translates it, “the Word was the same as God.” Goodspeed translates this, “the Word was divine.” And Moffatt translates this, “the logos was divine.”

So what kind of being is Jesus then if the Word was theos (without the definite article)? The answer according to John 1:1 is that he must be a divine being if Jesus is the Word of God that was with God. In other words he is a being with God’s nature. A son possessing the nature of his Father. Not just an image, but THE image of God. He is the prototype, the firstborn. He is the mystery that was hidden but has been revealed in our time. He is all these things, but he is not THE God that he is the son of. That God is exclusively the Father and there are many scriptures to prove that which we will look at later in this page.

Many think that the word ‘theos’ and ‘elohim’ always refer to YHWH. They take instances of their choosing to try and prove that Christ is YHWH. In their ignorance they cannot see that there are indeed many god (theos) and many lords, but for true believers there is one God (theos) the Father.

In fact, the word ‘theos’ and ‘elohim’ in scripture are used in reference to God (YHWH), Christ, Man, angels, Satan and idols. So when we see the word ‘theos’ or ‘elohim’, we should ask ourselves what kind of god is being referenced. The god of this age? The Most High God? The Almighty God? The mighty god? A false god? A human? An angel? We must also understand that the word ‘theos’ proceeded by the article (the) is talking of a noun and without the article, it can be an adjective or used to describe or qualify.

Let us now look at some quotes from scholars and writers that understand this. NOTE: this is not an endorsement with all that these authors have written, rather I am appealing to their view regarding John 1:1.

One prominent scholar called Origen is sometimes quoted by Trinitarians who appeal to his wisdom for other purposes. However, they avoid this particular quotation for obvious reasons. Origen wrote in the early 200’s A.D and was a noted expert in Koine Greek.

“We next notice John’s use of the article [“the”] in these sentences. He does not write without care in this respect, nor is he unfamiliar with the niceties of the Greek tongue. In some cases he uses the article, and in some he omits it. He adds the article to the Word, but to the name of theos he adds it sometimes only. He uses the article, when the name of theos refers to the uncreated cause of all things, and omits it when the Word is named theos. Does the same difference which we observe between theos with the article and theos without it prevail also between the Word with it and without it? We must enquire into this. As the theos who is over all is theos with the article not without it, so the Word is the source of that reason (Logos) which dwells in every reasonable creature; the reason which is in each creature is not, like the former called par excellence the Word. Now there are many who are sincerely concerned about religion, and who fall here into great perplexity. They are afraid that they may be proclaiming two theos [gods] and their fear drives them into doctrines which are false and wicked. Either they deny that the Son has a distinct nature of His own besides that of the Father, and make Him whom they call the Son to be theos all but the name, or they deny divinity of the Son, giving Him a separate existence of His own, and making His sphere of essence fall outside that of the Father, so that they are separable from each other. To such persons we have to say that “the theos” on the one hand is Autotheos [God of himself] and so the Saviour says in His prayer to the Father, “That they may know Thee the only true theos [God]; “but that all beyond the theos [God] is made theos by participation in His deity, and is not to be called simply “theos” but rather “the theos “. And thus the first-born of all creation, who is the first to be with the theos , and to attract to Himself deity, is a being of more exalted rank than the other theos [gods] beside Him, of which theos is the theos [God], as it is written, “The theos [God] of theos [gods], the Lord, hath spoken and called the earth.” It was by the offices of the first-born that they became theos [gods], for He drew from the theos [God] in generous measure that they should be made theos [gods], and He communicated it to them according to His own bounty. The true theos [God], then, is “the theos ,” [“the God” as opposed to “god”] and those who are formed after Him are theos [such as the Son of God], images, as it were, of Him the prototype. But the archetypal image, again, of all these images is the word of the theos [God], who was in the beginning, and who by being with the theos [God] is at all times deity, not possessing that of Himself, but by His being with the Father, and not continuing to be theos , if we should think of this, except by remaining always in uninterrupted contemplation of the depths of the Father.”
(Origen’s Commentary on the Gospel of John, Book II, 2)

“Irenaeus [in the second century] could still interpret MK. Xiii, 32 in the following manner: the Son confessed not to know that which only the Father knew; hence ‘ we learn from himself that the Father is over all’, as he who is greater also than the Son. But the Nicene theologians had now suddenly to deny that Jesus could have said such a thing about the Son. In the long-recognized scriptural testimony for the Logos-doctrine provided by Prov. Viii, 22 ff. The exegetes of the second and third centuries had found the creation of the preexistent Logos-Christ set forth without dispute and equivocation. But now, when the Arians also interpreted the passage in this way, the interpretation was suddenly reckoned as false…. A theologian such as Tertullian by virtue of his Subordinationist manner of thinking, could confidently on occasion maintain that, before all creation, God the Father had been originally ‘alone’, and thus there was a time when ‘the Son was not’. When he did so, within the Church of his day such a statement did not inevitably provoke a controversy, and indeed there was none about it. But now, when Arius said the same thing in almost the same words, he raised thereby in the Church a mighty uproar, and such a view was condemned as heresy in the anathemas of Nicaea.” e.a.]
-pp. 155-8. The Formation of Christian Dogma, by Martin Werner, D.D.

When the writers of the New Testament speak of God they mean the God and Father of Our Lord Jesus Christ. When they speak of Jesus Christ, they do not speak of him, nor think of him as God. He is God’s Christ, God’s Son, God’s Wisdom, God’s Word. Even the prologue to St. John {John 1:1-18} which comes nearest to the Nicene Doctrine, must be read in the light of the pronounced subordinationism of the Gospel as a whole; and the Prologue is less explicit in Greek with the anarthrous theos [the word “god” at John 1:1c without the article] than it appears in English… The adoring exclamation of St. Thomas “my Lord and my god” (Joh. xx. 28) is still not quite the same as an address to Christ as being without qualification [limitation] God, and it must be balanced by the words of the risen Christ himself to Mary Magdalene (verse. 17) “Go unto my brethren and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.” Jesus Christ is frequently spoken of in the Ignation Epistles as “our God”, “my God”, but probably never as “God” without qualification.
– John Martin Creed in The Divinity of Jesus Christ.

The word for “god” in Greek is QEOS. In John 1:1 the last occurrence of QEOS is called “a predicate noun” or, “a predicate nominative”. Such a noun tells us something about the subject, instead of telling what the subject is doing. This use of QEOS has reference to the subject, the Word, and does not have the article preceding it; it is anarthrous. This indicates that it is not definite. That is to say, it does not tell what position or office or rank the subject (the Word) occupies. The verb HN “was” follows the predicate noun QEOS; this is another factor in identifying QEOS here as qualitative. This discloses the quality or character of the Word. Of course, the gentleman up above disagrees with me, and he has used Moulton and Colwell to buttress his argument. But what have other Grammarians said about this same type of construction? There is no basis for regarding the predicate theos as definite. In John 1:1 I think that the qualitative force of the predicate [noun] is so prominent that the noun cannot be regarded as definite.
-Philip Harner, Journal of Biblical Literature, Vol. 92:1, 1973, pp. 85, 7.

We must, then take Theos, without the article, in the indefinite [“qualitative” would have been a better word choice] sense of a divine nature or a divine being, as distinguished from the definite absolute God [the Father], ho Theos, the authotheos [selfgod] of Origen. Thus the Theos of John [1:1c] answers to “the image of God” of Paul, Col. 1:15.
-G. Lucke, “Dissertation on the Logos”, quoted by John Wilson in, Unitarian Principles Confirmed by Trinitarian Testimonies, p. 428.

As mentioned in the Note on 1c, the Prologue’s “The Word was God” offers a difficulty because there is no article before theos. Does this imply that “god” means less when predicated of the Word than it does when used as a name for the Father? Once again the reader must divest himself of a post-Nicene understanding of the vocabulary involved.
-Raymond E. Brown, The Anchor Bible, p. 25.

The most natural reading of John 1:1 shows that there are two being mentioned (not three): God and a second who was ‘theos’. They are not presented as two coequal persons in a Binity or Trinity. What we really have is one with the character of THEOS who is with TON THEOS (the God), thus he cannot be the God he is with! The LOGOS is unique however. He/it is identified further in the gospel as “a son from a father, begotten, as a visible being verses the unseen God, Now, without redefining the word THEOS we need to explain how we can have two who are both referred to as “theos.” Either there were two equal Gods or persons called God, or it is talking about a godlike one that is with the Almighty God. When we read all the scriptures we see that the scriptures including the Book of John backs up the last view, that the Father is greater than the Son; that the Father is the only God and the Son is the image of The God.

So what conclusion are we to draw from John 1:1 and the Book of John? In John’s own words he explains the conclusion for his Book. This conclusion is not the Trinity Doctrine. Read the verse below to see what the conclusion is.

John 20:30-31.
30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:
31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. “

So John wrote this gospel so that we may come to the conclusion that Jesus is truly the Christ and the Son of God. In addition to this important truth we are also told that we may receive life through his name. The Trinity Doctrine is not the conclusion that one should draw from this writing. Belief that Jesus is the Christ and the Son is the foundation of true faith and Jesus built his Church on this truth. The Trinity Doctrine is not that foundation, rather it is another foundation.

So why don’t translations of the bible translate John 1:1 as the Word was divine. Well first of all it is not incorrect to say that the Word was god, but Trinitarians translators say the Word was God which makes readers think that Jesus is the God (the person). However, in order to bring out the true meaning, some translations actually use the word ‘divine’. See below:

“In the beginning the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was divine.”
An American Translation, Edgar Goodspeed and J. M. Powis Smith, The University of Chicago Press, p. 173

“The Logos (word) existed in the very beginning, and the Logos was with God, the Logos was divine”
by Dr. James Moffatt

So the idea that Jesus Christ is God is often and supposedly supported by John 1:1. However the rest of John’s Gospel makes careful distinctions between Jesus and his Father as well as Jesus and God. This same distinction and separation is found throughout the rest of the New Testament too. The New Testament actually goes much further than merely distinguishing and separating the two. In John 17:3 Jesus, in prayer to his Father, refers to him as “the only true God”. In John 20:17 the resurrected Jesus refers to his Father as “my Father, and your Father; and… my God, and your God.” In I Corinthians 8:6 the Apostle Paul says of Christians, “to us there is but one God, the Father.” In I Timothy 2:5 Paul states, “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” In Ephesians 1:17 Paul refers to the Father as “the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory.” And in Revelation 3:12 the resurrected and glorified Jesus says, “Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.”

We must also remember that the judges of Israel were called gods/theos. This doesn’t mean that they were part of God or part of the Trinity, it just means that they had authority given to them by God. It is also written that we can partake of divine nature, so that could also make us divine just as partaking in flesh makes us man. It must be noted though, that being divine or partaking in divine nature is different to actually being the Divine himself.

Also see John 10:34-35:
34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, I have said you are gods” (theos).
35 If he called them gods (theos), to whom the word of God (ho theos) came, and the Scripture cannot be broken,

2 Peter 1:4
Through these he has given us his very great and precious promises, so that through them you may participate in the divine nature and escape the corruption in the world caused by evil desires.

Also Jesus said that he was one with his Father and he also prayed that we would be one with them. See John 17:21
that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.

We humans were intended to share in the divine nature too, yet we are not the God. John 1:1 shows us that the Word was god (divine), not (the Word was/is the God, Yahweh) which many seem to think it says. The Word came from God, is of God, is like God, and this is consistent with the scriptures we have looked at thus far. 1 Corinthians 11:3 reinforces this statement because the word “head” in the Greek is translated “from”, source or authority. Remember that the woman came from Man and Man came from Christ and Christ came from God. This is the divine order.

Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.

Jesus Christ is the Word of God, Jesus wasn’t created, rather the Word was born from God in eternity and that is why Jesus is called the Only Begotten of the Father. (John 1:14) (John 1:18) (John 3:16 ) (John 3:18 ) (1 John 4:9 ). The word begotten means (only child, single of its kind). Notice that our spirits are born from God, but through his Word, and our spirits will go back to God who gave it (Ecclesiastes 12:7) . But Jesus was not begotten through the Word because he is the Word, this is why Jesus is unique because he is the only one begotten of the Father and therefore he is the image of his Father. That is why he is called the Image of God and the Firstborn of all creation (Colossians 1:15) and it is also why the Bible says in (Hebrews 1:5) For to which of the angels did God ever say, “You are my Son; today I have become your Father” Or again, “I will be his Father, and he will be my Son”

Unlike his Father who is the invisible Spirit, Jesus does have a body and is visible. Jesus was born from God. We must remember that although his Father is greater than himself, he is also not just a man like us. Yes he partook of flesh and came as a man like us, but he also existed in the form of God as the Word or Logos. We are told that he resides between God and Man and as a man he is our mediator to God. It was indeed the Word that became flesh. God did not  become flesh, instead God resided in Christ who came in the flesh. So just like us, God can be in us who are made of flesh, but God himself did not become flesh. God is not a man and never will be a man. It was the Word who came to us as a man and it was the Word that all things  were created though. See John 1:3.
Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

And to compliment the fact that God made all things through his Word, and that Jesus is the Word of God, even ignoring the fact that Jesus wears a title, “The Word of God” as recorded in the Book of Revelation, we are specifically told, that God created everything through Jesus Christ. See :Hebrews 1:2
but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. 

So Jesus was begotten not created and again, this is why he is called God’s only begotten Son and this is why he is unique. He is seated at the right hand of God and situated between God & Man. This is also why he is the only mediator between God & Man and the only name under heaven whereby Man can be saved. God made creation through him and for him and God redeemed creation through him too. God cannot fellowship with sin that is why he sent his Son into the world, so he could bring us back to himself through his mediator. Jesus came from God and he was in the beginning with God. So what does it mean when it says ‘beginning’? The Greek word for beginning, in John 1:1 “In the beginning was the Word” is ‘arche’ and this word means the following:

1) beginning, origin
2) the person or thing that commences, the first person or thing in a series, the leader
3) that by which anything begins to be, the origin, the active cause
4) the extremity of a thing
4a) of the corners of a sail
5) the first place, principality, rule, magistracy
5a) of angels and demons

Below I will show you a verse where the word “beginning” or ‘arche’ is also mentioned and I think you will agree that it is rather obvious from this verse that it does not mean eternity or eternal. The verse is John 8:44
You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him.

Just for good measure, I will also throw in the first verse in the bible, which also uses the word beginning (note that this a Hebrew word). I am sure we can all agree that the earth has not been in existence for all of eternity.

Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Certainly if we read John 1:1 correctly and in context with all scripture, we see that it is not teaching that God is a Trinity.

← Go back to ‘Supporting the Trinity Doctrine‘.


Discussion

Viewing 20 posts - 12,081 through 12,100 (of 26,009 total)
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  • #337936
    carmel
    Participant

    Quote
    Why can't the words in scripture just mean the most obvious and sensible thing?  

    Mike,

    Your mentality is as clear as crystal.

    Scriptures are God's words! No???

    God is a spirit,and if we worship him we must worship him in the spirit and in the truth! No??? IN WHATEVER WE DO! No???

    CAN YOU EXPLAIN TO ME HOW ON EARTH THEN,YOU EXPECT SCRIPTURES TO BE LITERALLY ONLY???

    CAN YOU EXPLAIN TO ME WHY SCRIPTURES MUST BE AS YOU SAID:

    just mean the most obvious and sensible thing

    CONSIDERRING THE FACT THAT ALMIGHTY GOD IS THE MOST INVISIBLE,MYSTERIOUS,HIDDEN,UNKOWN BEING???

    DON'T YOU KNOW MIKE THAT EVEN THE JEWISH NAMES ARE NOT JUST LITERALLY MEANT???

    DON'T YOU KNOW THAT EVEN CHAPTERS, VERSES,NUMBERS, AND PUNCTATION MARKS ARE  PLACED AND USED NOT JUST TO GIVE THE MOST OBVIOUS LITERAL MEANING???

    MIKE, I PRAY FOR YOU THAT YOU START IGNORING COMPLETELY THE LITERAL MEANING,AND REFLECT,MEDITATE,AND PRAY THAT THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL GIVE YOU LIGHT.

    YOU ONCE SAID THAT I COMPLETELY DEFINE SCRIPTURES THE OPPOSITE WAY YOU DO!

    YES MIKE,YOU ARE RIGHT!

    BECAUSE I SEE GOD:

    BOTH GOD AND MAN, BOTH FATHER AND SON, BOTH  LIGHT AND DARKNESS, BOTH  SPIRIT AND FLESH, BOTH FIRE AND WATER,BOTH WATER AND BLOOD,BOTH INVISIBLE AND VISIBLE,  BOTH MALE AND FEMALE, BOTH MAN AND WOMAN, BOTH JUST AND UNJUST, BOTH HOLY AND CURSED, BOTH GOOD AND BAD,BOTH LIFE AND DEATH, BOTH SINLESS AND SINFULL,BOTH MASTER AND SERVANT,

    BOTH ALPHA AND OMEGA,BOTH THE BEGINNING AND THE END,BOTH FIRST AND LAST

    SINCE:

    HE IS ONE SPIRIT ENTIRELY!

    ALL IN HIM,ALL BY HIM, AND ALL FOR HIM!!!

    Matthew 11:27 ……….And no one knoweth the Son, but the Father: neither doth any one know the Father, but the Son, and he to whom it shall please the SON to reveal him.

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles

    #337948
    carmel
    Participant

    [quote=mikeboll64,Mar. 09 2013,12:10][/quote]

    Quote
    Jesus is saying that THE WAY TO eternal life is taking in knowledge of both him, AND the “only true God”, who is not only OUR God, but also JESUS' God.

    Mike,

    So I have to twist scriptures according to you, in order to convince you that God is not only ONE, but also in three PERSONS OF FATHER,  SON, AND HOLY SPIRIT.

    I TELL YOU THIS MIKE, THAT THE THREE PERSONS IN THE SAME MAGNITUDE WERE INTRODUCED BY JESUS HIMSELF AFTER HE ASCENDED IN THE STATE OF BOTH OF HIS FATHERSPIRIT BEING AND OF OUR FATHER FLESH BEING

    ALSO HIS DISCIPLES BAPTIZED IN THE NAME OF JESUS NOT IN THE NAME OF THE THREE PERSONS,CONFIRMING THAT JESUS IS THE WORD, GODHEAD IN FLESH, ALMIGHTY IN FLESH.

    THE UNIQUE IMAGE THAT GOD HAS!!!

    NOW LET’S SEE YOUR WAY OF TWISTING SCRIPTURES:

    THIS IS THE SCRIPTURE

    John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: That they may know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent

    Quote
    Jesus is saying that THE WAY TO eternal life

    WHERE, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, JESUS SAID THOSE WORDS, SINCE THEY ARE NOT IN THAT VERSE???

    Quote
    is taking in knowledge of

    WHAT, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD THAT BIZZARE PHRASE MEANS, APART THAT IT IS ALSO NOT WITHIN THAT VERSE

    Quote
    of both him, AND the “only true God”

    HOW FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, IN THAT VERSE GOD ALMIGHTY IS KNOWN AS THE ONLY TRUE GOD

    SINCE JESUS CONFIRMED THAT IT WAS ONLY THROUGH THE ETERNAL LIFE PROCESS THAT ALMIGHTY GOD MIGHT BE KNOWN AS SUCH???

    ONLY THROUGH JESUS CHRIST’S DEATH AND GLORIFICATION THAT THERE WOULD BE NO DOUBT REGARDING THE IDENTIFICATION OF THE ONLY TRUE GOD.

    IT ISN’T  LITERALLY CLEAR ENOUGH WHEN HE SAID:

    NOW THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE:  

    NOTICE THE ABOVE STATEMENT IS ON ITS OWN, FINISHED .

    SO JESUS CONFIRMED THAT NOW NOT BEFORE:

    THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE: FOR ALL THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN THE SON!!!THE WORD!!! GOD IN FLESH!!! THE FATHER IN THE SON!!!

    THE OT GOD WAS OF NO USE. HUMANS COULD  IN NO WAY COMUNICATE WITH THE ALMIGHTY GOD,EXCEPT THE SELECT!NOTWITHSTANDING THE FACT THAT HE CHOSE HIS OWN PEOPLE.

    IMMEDIATELY IN A NEW SENTENCE HE SAID:THAT THEY MAY KNOW YOU;

    SO ONLY THROUGH THE PROCESS OF THE ETERNAL LIFE, JESUS’ DEATH,AND HIS GLORIFICATION,THAT THEY GOD’S ENEMIES, MAY KNOW ALMIGHTY GOD, AS THE ONLY TRUE GOD.

    IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE FOR THE FATHER AS A SPIRIT! BUT AS A FLESH BEING IN JESUS CHRIST.

    SO OBVIOUS REFERED TO HIMSELF, SINCE FIRST ALL WAS CREATED IN HIM, AND BY HIM, AND THEN HE HIMSELF DIED AND THROUGH HIS DEATH HE, NOT ONLY ELIMINATED SATAN’S SPIRIT FROM ALL SOULS,AND THE ENTIRE CREATION, BUT  RECONCILED ALL  ONTO HIMSELF NO MATTER WHAT,AND WHOEVER WAS DEAD IN HELL FROM ADAM ONWARDS WAS GIVEN FREEDOM FROM DEATH,THERFORE BACK TO LIFE.ETERNAL LIFE MANIFESTED. HE RECREATED ALL CREATION A NEW, AND BECAME THE FATHER OF ALL CARNAL BEINGS. GOD OF ALL FLESH. BEFORE HE WAS ONLY GOD OF ALL SPIRITS!BUT NOW!!! HE IS GOD AND FATHER OF BOTH SPIRITS AND FLESH BEINGS. THE ONLY TRUE GOD, AND JESUS CHRIST, THE ONLY TRUE SPIRIT, AND FLESH BEING!!!

    THIS WAS MANIFESTED WITH ALL THOSE SAINTS WHICH CAME BACK TO LIFE ON JESUS’ DEATH TO CONFIRM THAT DEATH IN HIM  WAS AND IS GLORIFIED, HOLY AND NOT ANYMORE A CURSE SINCE IT IS IN JESUS CHRIST. HE WAS CURSED FOR US,IN HIS SINLESS BODY.

    1John1:2 For the life was manifested; and we have seen and do bear witness, and declare unto you the

    LIFE ETERNAL, which was with the Father, and hath appeared to us:

    SO LIFE ETERNAL IS THE WORD, JESUS CHRIST,GOD IN FLESH!

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles

    #337950
    carmel
    Participant

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 10 2013,14:58)
    [/quote]
    [quote=mikeboll64,Mar. 10 2013,14:58]


    Quote
    What I do know is that WE were created, and so was Jesus.

    Mike,

    It seems you know nothing not even literal, because scripture says:

    Genesis 2:3And he blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because in it he had rested from all his work which God CREATED AND MADE

    SO YOU HAVE A HEADACHE DISTINGUISH WHAT FOR GOD IS A REFERENCE TO WHAT WAS CREATED AND A REFERENCE TO WHAT WAS MADE

    ALSO JESUS CHRIST BECAME SO, ONLY THROUGH MARY THEREFORE BORN, NOT CREATED.

    HE WAS BORN THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT, AND IF WE WERE TO TAKE JOHN'S WORDS HE SAID:

    John 1:3 All things were MADE BY HIM: and without him was MADE nothing that was MADE.

    I:14 THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!

    SO HERE JOHN HAS DISINGUISHED THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE WORD CREATED AND the word MADE! WHEN HE REFERRED TO JESUS CHRIST, YOU KNOW WHY?

    HE SIMPLY USED THE WORD MADE

    FIRST HE SAID THAT :

    ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM, so regarding Jesus Christ's FUNCTION, participation, and share in creation throughout was DEFINED AS MADE not created! and this is DEFINITELY a reference to the SPIRIT STATE OF THE SON, THE WORD, GOD HIMSELF WITHIN HIS SON'S SPIRIT IN ORDER TO CREATE ALL IN HIM, AND ALL BY HIM!

    SO IF YOU WANT TO DISCERN SOME TRUTH, REGARDING OUR WORLD,GOD CREATED ALL  MATTER, AND WITHIN ALL THIS MATTER OBVIOUS TO KEEP IT IN EXISTENCE AND WITHIN THE TERMS OF ETERNAL LIFE NO MATTER WHAT , HE PLACED HIMSELF WITHIN HIS SON'S SPIRIT,THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT TO ESTABLISH THE WORD, AS THE ONLY MEDIATOR,AS THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT,IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE GOD'S GENERAL WORK ON EARTH SINCE GENESIS 1:3 NOTHWITSTANDING THE FACT THAT HE WAS WITHIN DARKNESS,SATAN HIMSELF.

    Genesis 1:3And God said: Be light made. And light was made. 4 And God saw the light that it was good; and he divided the light from the darkness. 5 And he called the light Day, and the darkness Night; and there was evening and morning one day.

    John 1:3All things were made by him: and without him was made nothing that was made. 4In him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5And the LIGHT SHINETH IN DARKNESS, and the DARKNESS DID NOT COMPREHEND IT.

    THEN HE SAID:

    THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!

    THIS TO MAKE US AWARE THAT NOTWITHSTANDING THE FACT THAT SATAN HAD EVERYTHING UNDER HIS CONTROL, AND POSSESSED  ALL  SOULS, LOCKED IN FLESH BEINGS, HIS EARTHLY SUBSTANCE,THROUGH ADAM'S SIN,IT ONLY MEANT FOR GOD THAT:

    THE FLESH COUNTS FOR NOTHING.IT IS THE SPIRIT THAT GIVES LIFE TO ALL EXISTENCE! EVEN TO SATAN HIMSELF AS MATTER, AS THE WORLD ITSELF!!!

    Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thy iniquities, and by the iniquity of thy traffic: therefore I WILL BRING FORTH A FIRE FROM THE MIDST OF THEE,to devour thee, and I will make thee as ashes upon the earth in the sight of all that see thee.

    19All that shall see thee among the nations, shall be astonished at thee: thou art brought to nothing, and thou shalt never be any more

    Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a CONSUMING FIRE.

    SO JESUS CHRIST’S FLESH BODY WAS NOT JUST FLESH ONLY  LIKE OURS, SINCE IT IS NOT OF THE EARTH, BUT FROM HEAVEN,BUT ALSO SPIRIT IN ITSELF!IT NEVER DIES.  

    EVEN MORE:

    IT GIVES LIFE THROUGH DEATH ITSELF.

    WE OURSELVES BELIEVEING IN JESUS,NEVER REALLY DIE BUT  LIVE ETERNALLY, ONLY THE FLESH, SATAN'S ELEMENT THAT OBLITIRATES! AND ON THE LAST DAY, GOD KNOWS WHEN, WE WILL OWN A UNIQUE FLESH BODY LIKE THAT OF JESUS CHRIST.

    GOD THEREFORE BECAME AND MANIFESTED HIMSELF IN A FLESH STATE THROUGH HIS SON’S SPIRIT,AND STILL MAINTAINED THE  SPIRIT STATE IN ITSELF! SINCE HE WAS CONCEIVED IN MARY,THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT SEED, THERRFORE FULLY GOD AND FULLY MAN! NOTHING LESS WOULD HAD BEEN POSSIBLE FOR THE FATHER TO ABIDE WITHIN!

    THIS WAS DEMONSTRATED ON MOUNT TABOR WHEN HIS FLESH BODY BECAME COMPLETELY SPIRITUAL TO CONFIRM THAT THE WORD IS GOD IN FLESH!!! THE FATHER IN THE SON.

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles

    #337959
    Lightenup
    Participant

    t-

    Firstborn = first to be born. It is already alive before being born. :;):

    #338009
    abe
    Participant

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 10 2013,08:43)
    [quote=mikeboll64,Mar. 09 2013,12:10][/quote]

    Quote
    Jesus is saying that THE WAY TO eternal life is taking in knowledge of both him, AND the “only true God”, who is not only OUR God, but also JESUS' God.

    Mike,

    So I have to twist scriptures according to you, in order to convince you that God is not only ONE, but also in three PERSONS OF FATHER,  SON, AND HOLY SPIRIT.

    I TELL YOU THIS MIKE, THAT THE THREE PERSONS IN THE SAME MAGNITUDE WERE INTRODUCED BY JESUS HIMSELF AFTER HE ASCENDED IN THE STATE OF BOTH OF HIS FATHERSPIRIT BEING AND OF OUR FATHER FLESH BEING

    ALSO HIS DISCIPLES BAPTIZED IN THE NAME OF JESUS NOT IN THE NAME OF THE THREE PERSONS,CONFIRMING THAT JESUS IS THE WORD, GODHEAD IN FLESH, ALMIGHTY IN FLESH.

    THE UNIQUE IMAGE THAT GOD HAS!!!

    NOW LET’S SEE YOUR WAY OF TWISTING SCRIPTURES:

    THIS IS THE SCRIPTURE

    John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: That they may know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent

    Quote
    Jesus is saying that THE WAY TO eternal life

    WHERE, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, JESUS SAID THOSE WORDS, SINCE THEY ARE NOT IN THAT VERSE???

    Quote
    is taking in knowledge of

    WHAT, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD THAT BIZZARE PHRASE MEANS, APART THAT IT IS ALSO NOT WITHIN THAT VERSE

    Quote
    of both him, AND the “only true God”

    HOW FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, IN THAT VERSE GOD ALMIGHTY IS KNOWN AS THE ONLY TRUE GOD

    SINCE JESUS CONFIRMED THAT IT WAS ONLY THROUGH THE ETERNAL LIFE PROCESS THAT ALMIGHTY GOD MIGHT BE KNOWN AS SUCH???

    ONLY THROUGH JESUS CHRIST’S DEATH AND GLORIFICATION THAT THERE WOULD BE NO DOUBT REGARDING THE IDENTIFICATION OF THE ONLY TRUE GOD.

    IT ISN’T  LITERALLY CLEAR ENOUGH WHEN HE SAID:

    NOW THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE:  

    NOTICE THE ABOVE STATEMENT IS ON ITS OWN, FINISHED .

    SO JESUS CONFIRMED THAT NOW NOT BEFORE:

    THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE: FOR ALL THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN THE SON!!!THE WORD!!! GOD IN FLESH!!! THE FATHER IN THE SON!!!

    THE OT GOD WAS OF NO USE. HUMANS COULD  IN NO WAY COMUNICATE WITH THE ALMIGHTY GOD,EXCEPT THE SELECT!NOTWITHSTANDING THE FACT THAT HE CHOSE HIS OWN PEOPLE.

    IMMEDIATELY IN A NEW SENTENCE HE SAID:THAT THEY MAY KNOW YOU;

    SO ONLY THROUGH THE PROCESS OF THE ETERNAL LIFE, JESUS’ DEATH,AND HIS GLORIFICATION,THAT THEY GOD’S ENEMIES, MAY KNOW ALMIGHTY GOD, AS THE ONLY TRUE GOD.

    IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE FOR THE FATHER AS A SPIRIT! BUT AS A FLESH BEING IN JESUS CHRIST.

    SO OBVIOUS REFERED TO HIMSELF, SINCE FIRST ALL WAS CREATED IN HIM, AND BY HIM, AND THEN HE HIMSELF DIED AND THROUGH HIS DEATH HE, NOT ONLY ELIMINATED SATAN’S SPIRIT FROM ALL SOULS,AND THE ENTIRE CREATION, BUT  RECONCILED ALL  ONTO HIMSELF NO MATTER WHAT,AND WHOEVER WAS DEAD IN HELL FROM ADAM ONWARDS WAS GIVEN FREEDOM FROM DEATH,THERFORE BACK TO LIFE.ETERNAL LIFE MANIFESTED. HE RECREATED ALL CREATION A NEW, AND BECAME THE FATHER OF ALL CARNAL BEINGS. GOD OF ALL FLESH. BEFORE HE WAS ONLY GOD OF ALL SPIRITS!BUT NOW!!! HE IS GOD AND FATHER OF BOTH SPIRITS AND FLESH BEINGS. THE ONLY TRUE GOD, AND JESUS CHRIST, THE ONLY TRUE SPIRIT, AND FLESH BEING!!!

    THIS WAS MANIFESTED WITH ALL THOSE SAINTS WHICH CAME BACK TO LIFE ON JESUS’ DEATH TO CONFIRM THAT DEATH IN HIM  WAS AND IS GLORIFIED, HOLY AND NOT ANYMORE A CURSE SINCE IT IS IN JESUS CHRIST. HE WAS CURSED FOR US,IN HIS SINLESS BODY.

    1John1:2 For the life was manifested; and we have seen and do bear witness, and declare unto you the

    LIFE ETERNAL, which was with the Father, and hath appeared to us:

    SO LIFE ETERNAL IS THE WORD, JESUS CHRIST,GOD IN FLESH!

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles


    Hi Carmel,

    HE RECREATED ALL CREATION A NEW, AND BECAME THE FATHER OF ALL CARNAL BEINGS. GOD OF ALL FLESH. BEFORE HE WAS ONLY GOD OF ALL SPIRITS!BUT NOW!!! HE IS GOD AND FATHER OF BOTH SPIRITS AND FLESH BEINGS. THE ONLY TRUE GOD, AND JESUS CHRIST, THE ONLY TRUE SPIRIT, AND FLESH BEING!!!

    Jer.32:27 “Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh; is anything too difficult for Me?”

    Num.16:22 But they fell on their faces and said, “O God, God of the spirits of all flesh, when one man sins, will You be angry with the entire congregation?”

    Peace brother.

    #338013
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 11 2013,01:13)
    t-

    Firstborn = first to be born. It is already alive before being born. :;):


    Kathi

    when you have a plan in your heart at what point is it born ???

    when you first thought about ??? or when the first time you start to realized it, or made it come through ???

    a child may be in construction but unless it is born and so come out of the womb ,there is no child ,only a dream of it ,

    also at what point you think the spirit of live enter the infant ???

    having a living gestation does not make it a living soul right ???

    #338016
    abe
    Participant

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 10 2013,09:14)

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 10 2013,14:58)
    [/quote]
    [quote=mikeboll64,Mar. 10 2013,14:58]


    Quote
    What I do know is that WE were created, and so was Jesus.

    Mike,

    It seems you know nothing not even literal, because scripture says:

    Genesis 2:3And he blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because in it he had rested from all his work which God CREATED AND MADE

    SO YOU HAVE A HEADACHE DISTINGUISH WHAT FOR GOD IS A REFERENCE TO WHAT WAS CREATED AND A REFERENCE TO WHAT WAS MADE

    ALSO JESUS CHRIST BECAME SO, ONLY THROUGH MARY THEREFORE BORN, NOT CREATED.

    HE WAS BORN THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT, AND IF WE WERE TO TAKE JOHN'S WORDS HE SAID:

    John 1:3 All things were MADE BY HIM: and without him was MADE nothing that was MADE.

    I:14 THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!

    SO HERE JOHN HAS DISINGUISHED THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE WORD CREATED AND the word MADE! WHEN HE REFERRED TO JESUS CHRIST, YOU KNOW WHY?

    HE SIMPLY USED THE WORD MADE

    FIRST HE SAID THAT :

    ALL THINGS WERE MADE BY HIM, so regarding Jesus Christ's FUNCTION, participation, and share in creation throughout was DEFINED AS MADE not created! and this is DEFINITELY a reference to the SPIRIT STATE OF THE SON, THE WORD, GOD HIMSELF WITHIN HIS SON'S SPIRIT IN ORDER TO CREATE ALL IN HIM, AND ALL BY HIM!

    SO IF YOU WANT TO DISCERN SOME TRUTH, REGARDING OUR WORLD,GOD CREATED ALL  MATTER, AND WITHIN ALL THIS MATTER OBVIOUS TO KEEP IT IN EXISTENCE AND WITHIN THE TERMS OF ETERNAL LIFE NO MATTER WHAT , HE PLACED HIMSELF WITHIN HIS SON'S SPIRIT,THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT TO ESTABLISH THE WORD, AS THE ONLY MEDIATOR,AS THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT,IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE GOD'S GENERAL WORK ON EARTH SINCE GENESIS 1:3 NOTHWITSTANDING THE FACT THAT HE WAS WITHIN DARKNESS,SATAN HIMSELF.

    Genesis 1:3And God said: Be light made. And light was made. 4 And God saw the light that it was good; and he divided the light from the darkness. 5 And he called the light Day, and the darkness Night; and there was evening and morning one day.

    John 1:3All things were made by him: and without him was made nothing that was made. 4In him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5And the LIGHT SHINETH IN DARKNESS, and the DARKNESS DID NOT COMPREHEND IT.

    THEN HE SAID:

    THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!

    THIS TO MAKE US AWARE THAT NOTWITHSTANDING THE FACT THAT SATAN HAD EVERYTHING UNDER HIS CONTROL, AND POSSESSED  ALL  SOULS, LOCKED IN FLESH BEINGS, HIS EARTHLY SUBSTANCE,THROUGH ADAM'S SIN,IT ONLY MEANT FOR GOD THAT:

    THE FLESH COUNTS FOR NOTHING.IT IS THE SPIRIT THAT GIVES LIFE TO ALL EXISTENCE! EVEN TO SATAN HIMSELF AS MATTER, AS THE WORLD ITSELF!!!

    Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thy iniquities, and by the iniquity of thy traffic: therefore I WILL BRING FORTH A FIRE FROM THE MIDST OF THEE,to devour thee, and I will make thee as ashes upon the earth in the sight of all that see thee.

    19All that shall see thee among the nations, shall be astonished at thee: thou art brought to nothing, and thou shalt never be any more

    Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a CONSUMING FIRE.

    SO JESUS CHRIST’S FLESH BODY WAS NOT JUST FLESH ONLY  LIKE OURS, SINCE IT IS NOT OF THE EARTH, BUT FROM HEAVEN,BUT ALSO SPIRIT IN ITSELF!IT NEVER DIES.  

    EVEN MORE:

    IT GIVES LIFE THROUGH DEATH ITSELF.

    WE OURSELVES BELIEVEING IN JESUS,NEVER REALLY DIE BUT  LIVE ETERNALLY, ONLY THE FLESH, SATAN'S ELEMENT THAT OBLITIRATES! AND ON THE LAST DAY, GOD KNOWS WHEN, WE WILL OWN A UNIQUE FLESH BODY LIKE THAT OF JESUS CHRIST.

     

    THIS WAS DEMONSTRATED ON MOUNT TABOR WHEN HIS FLESH BODY BECAME COMPLETELY SPIRITUAL TO CONFIRM THAT THE WORD IS GOD IN FLESH!!! THE FATHER IN THE SON.

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles


    Hi Carmel,

    (quote)
    SO JESUS CHRIST’S FLESH BODY WAS NOT JUST FLESH ONLY  LIKE OURS, SINCE IT IS NOT OF THE EARTH, BUT FROM HEAVEN,BUT ALSO SPIRIT IN ITSELF!IT NEVER DIES.

    SINCE IT IS NOT OF THE EARTH,

    Was Mary from the earth?

    1Jn.4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2Hereby know ye {5720} the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

    Peace brother.
     

    #338073
    carmel
    Participant

    Quote (abe @ Mar. 11 2013,12:33)
     [/quote]
    quote=abe,Mar. 11 2013,12:33]


    Quote
    Was Mary from the earth?

    Abe,

    IT IS QUITE OBVIOUS THAT THE LINAGE OF MARY, WHICH WAS TO SUPPLY THE PURE FLESH OF THE WORD FROM THE CONTAMINATED FLESH OF EVE IT WAS DEFINITELY A PROCESS OF THE WORD BOTH REGARDING her FLESH SUBSTANCE, AND  EVEN MORE HER  SPIRIT.

    THEREFORE THE SPIRIT ITSELF OF THE SON,THE WORD, THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT AS THE MEDIATOR, WAS UNFATHOMABLE FOR US, DOING HIS WORK THROUGHOUT THE LINEAGE OF MARY RIGHT FROM SETH.

    THROUGH THE PROCESS OF CREATION , THEREFORE CREATED, REGARDING  MARY'S FLESH BODY ONLY, THE WORD PRODUCED THE IMMACULATE FLESH SUBSTANCE WHICH GOD NEEDED TO BECOME GOD IN FLESH

    SO MATERIAL WISE  THE LINAGE OF MARY AND ALL THE SELECT WERE SHIELDED,SEPARATED WITH THE POWER OF THE WORD FROM SATAN'S EVIL SPIRIT.

    IT MEANS THAT SATAN HAD NOT THE LEAST AWARENESS WHAT WAS HAPPENING,NEVER MIND THE  CHANCE TO GET INVOVLED IN ANY WAY THROUGH HIS SEED, AND STAIN WITH HIS EVIL SPIRIT THE PROCESS WHEREVER MARY'S SEED WAS CONCERNED.

    JEREMIAH 31:22 How long wilt thou be dissolute in deliciousness, O wandering daughter? for the Lord hath created a new thing upon the earth: A WOMAN SHALL COMPASS A MAN.

    THE ABOVE IS DEFINITELY A REFERENCE TO MARY. NOTICE AS WELL THE STATEMENT FOR THE LORD HAD CREATED A NEW THING UPON THE EARTH SO IT HAS NOTHING TO BE COMPARED WITH THE NORMAL CONCEPTION PROCESS REGARDING MARY!

    IT IS ALSO GOOD TO NOTICE THAT WHEREVER THIS HOLY GENERATION WAS BEING PROCESSED IT WAS ALWAYS THROUGH BARREN, OLD WOMEN OR BOTH, AS PROOF THAT THE WORD WAS DOING ITS MYSTERIOUS WORK!

    GOD WAS CLEAR REGARDING MARY AND SAID:

    Genesis 3:15 I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: ………….

    REFLECT:
    ALMIGHTY GOD HIMSELF THROUGH THE WORD, THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT

    put enmities between Satan and the woman,

    and Satan seed and her seed:

    SO SATANIC SPERM, WOULD NEVER TOUCH HER LINAGE AND HER HOLY OVUM. EVEN IF SHE WAS ATTACKED, RAPED AND VIOLENTLY HAD INTERCOURSE WHILE ON HER WAY TO VISIT  ELIZEBETH .

    CONFIRMATION:

    Hebrews 4:12 For the

    WORD OF GOD IS A LIVING AND EFFECTUAL, AND MORE PIRCING THAN ANY TWO ENDGED SWORD;

    AND REACHNG UNTO THE DIVISION OF

    THE SOUL AND THE SPIRIT,

    OF THE JOINTS ALSO AND MARROW,………..

    THE ABOVE IS A DESCRIPTION, REGARDING THE POWER OF THE WORD  IN UTMOST DETAIL HOW GOD MADE THINGS CONCERNING HIS PERSONAL AND UNIQUE PROCESS TO FURNISH HIMSELF WITH THE MOST IMMACULATE FLESH SUBSTANCE AND STORES IT IN THE OVUM OF MARY.

    NOTWITSTANDING THE FACT THAT CAME THROUGH SATAN'S EARTH.

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles

    #338074
    carmel
    Participant

    abe,

    I would like to add:

    THE WORD LOWERED HIMSELF AND UNFATHOMABLY BECAME ONE OF US, FIRST AS WOMAN IN MARY, PURPOSELY TO REVOLUTIONIZE THE WOMAN EVE!

    FROM SATAN'S ENTITY TO GOD'S ENTITY!

    WHO CAN FATHOM GOD’S LOVE???

    RIGHT FROM THE MOMENT OF ADAM SIN,SIMPLY HE DID WHAT SATAN DID TO ADAM. THAT IS:

    SATAN TOOK THE FIRST EVER PURE SOUL,

    AND GOD TOOK THE FIRST EVER EVIL FLESH SUBSTANCE.

    NO WONDER WHY JESUS NEVER CALLED MARY MOTHER BUT OPTED TO CALL HER WOMAN OBVIOUS IT WAS HIS INCONCEIVABLE VERSATILE SPIRIT ITSELF AS WOMAN!

    1 Corinthians 11:3…………THE HEAD(spirit) OF THE WOMAN IS THE MAN(Jesus)
    8 For the man is not of the woman, but the WOMAN OF THE MAN. 9 For the man was not created for the woman, BUT THE WOMAN (MARY)FOR THE MAN(JESUS).

    ALL CREATION WAS PERFECTED TO THE LEAST DETAIL IN THE MICROCREATION BODY OF MARY TO SUPPLY JESUS WITH THE APPROPRIATE IMMACULATE FLESH BODY IN ORDER TO REDEEM AND RCONCILE THE ENTIRE OF OUR CREATION IN HIS IMMACULATE FLESH.

    Matthew 13:45 Again the kingdom of heaven is like to a merchant seeking good

    PEARLS

    46 Who when he had found ONE PEARL OF GREAT PRICE,( MARY) went his way, and sold ALL THAT HE HAD,( THE WORD ) and bought it.

    To conclude and in order to eliminate all doubts, read hereunder:

    John 17:6 I have manifested thy name to the men whom thou hast given me OUT OF THE WORLD. YOURS THEY WERE, and to me thou gave them; and they have kept thy word. 17:14 I have given them thy word, and the world hath hated them, BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT OF THE WORLD; AS I AM NOT OF THE WORLD.

    17:16 THEY ARE NOT OF THE WORLD AS I ALSO AM NOT OF THE WORLD

    JESUS, TALKING IN THE NATURE STATE OF MAN SINCE HE WAS ABOUT TO DIE, EMPHASIZED FIRST IN 6 AND  SAID: OUT OF THE WORLD, THEN : YOURS THEY WERE, THEN BOTH IN 14, AND 16  MADE IT CLEAR THAT THEY ARE NOT OF THE WORLD AS HE IS NOT OF THE WORLD,

    SO THE APPOSTLES WERE ALSO NOT OF THE WORLD.

    SO IT WAS NOT JUST MARY WHICH WAS NOT OF THE WORLD, BUT ALL THE GENERATION OF HEAVEN. AND THEY STILL ARE BEING SENT!

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles

    #338075
    jammin
    Participant

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 08 2013,12:24)

    Quote (jammin @ Mar. 06 2013,03:12)

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 05 2013,11:18)

    Quote (jammin @ Mar. 03 2013,02:00)

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 28 2013,08:59)

    jammin, do you agree with me that ONLY the MOST HIGH God should get the capital “G”?  YES or NO?


    the capital G should be given to the true God, the most high God and not god.


    Okay, I agree that the capital “G” should only be given to the Most High God, the One called “the only true God” by Jesus himself.

    So let's use what we learned in our discussion about whether or not Satan was God Almighty, and apply that same logic and reasoning to Jesus.  

    We both concluded that Satan is NOT God Almighty – not because there is a scripture that specifically says, “Satan is not God Almighty” – but because Satan is many times listed as someone OTHER THAN God Almighty, right?

    Let's use that same common sense in the following scriptures:

    John 17:3
    Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

    Since Jesus lists himself as someone OTHER THAN “the only true God” in the above verse, we should be able to use the same common sense we used while discussing Satan, and conclude that Jesus is NOT “the only true God”, right?

    Mark 5:7
    He shouted at the top of his voice, “What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? In God’s name don’t torture me!”

    Luke 1:32
    He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High.

    In both of the above scriptures, Jesus is identified as someone OTHER THAN “the Most High God” – once by an angel, and once by a demon.  So once again, if we use that same common sense we used when discussing Satan, we will conclude that Jesus can't BE the Most High God if he is someone OTHER THAN the Most High God.

    So what we have here is evidence that you, jammin, are smart enough to realize Satan can't be the Most High God because he is identified in many scriptures as someone OTHER THAN the Most High God.

    And we have evidence that I use that same reasoning and common sense when it comes to Jesus……….. but YOU don't.

    Why do you suppose that I'M consistent in my logic, common sense, and reasoning, while YOU are inconsistent?

    Is it perhaps because you are a Trinitarian, and for your comically flawed, man-made doctrine to be fulfilled, you must force yourself to completely ignore the common sense you applied to our Satan discussion when it comes to discussing Jesus?

    (Btw, why do you think the demon asked Jesus to swear to him “in God's name” that he wouldn't torture him?  Why can't Jesus swear in HIS OWN name, if he is actually God?)

    jammin, if your doctrine only allows you to practice common sense and logic SOME OF THE TIME, perhaps it's time for you to find a new doctrine.


    the father is truly God


    jammin,

    Haven't I just listed scriptures that identify Jesus as someone OTHER THAN “the only true God” and “the Most High God”?  YES I have.

    And didn't you just say that the “only true God” and “Most High God” is the ONLY one who should get the capital “G”?

    Yes you did.

    Now you only need to adhere to your own words, jammin.


    what you are saying is not in the bible.
    you do not want the truth of the bible mike/.
    the bible said Christ is truly God and you ignore this truth.

    the bible said the father is truly God
    the said said the son is also truly God just like his father.

    make your own bible boy LOL

    #338076
    jammin
    Participant

    Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Mar. 08 2013,01:14)

    Quote (jammin @ Mar. 06 2013,20:16)
    if the bible is silent, you must be silent.

    do not conclude that Christ was the first creation created by God bec paul did not say that.

    he said firstborn of all creation and that is not literally created.
    the context proves that it refers to the supremacy of Christ. pls read commentaries also. scholars know more than you know.
    also, the bible proves that it talks about supremacy of Christ.

    Colossians 1:15

    New Century Version (NCV)
    The Importance of Christ

    15 No one can see God, but Jesus Christ is exactly like him. He ranks higher than everything that has been made.

    did you see that boy? study hard


    Jammin……………You are right in this Boy,  :)

    peace and love to you and yours…………………………gene


    thanks gene but mike does not want to believe this truth.

    he wants illusion LOL

    #338099
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (jammin @ Mar. 11 2013,15:54)
    you do not want the truth of the bible mike/.
    the bible said Christ is truly God and you ignore this truth.


    You've got it backwards, sonny.

    YOUR OWN WORDS said that ONLY the Most High God deserves the capital “G”, right?

    Did I show you TWO different scriptures that CLEARLY identify Jesus as someone OTHER THAN “the Most High God”?

    End of story, jammin. You will either adhere to YOUR OWN WORDS, or show us all that you are NOT a man of your word.

    #338100
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (jammin @ Mar. 11 2013,15:55)
    thanks gene but mike does not want to believe this truth


    I believe the truth of the Bible, jammin. Not the truth of the likes of you, who desperately WANTS Jesus to be the Most High God he is the Son and Servant of.

    And not the truth of Gene, who desperately WANTS Jesus to have begun his existence as a human being born of Mary.

    I understand the words “firstborn of every creature” to mean Jesus was the first thing God ever created. I believe Prov 8:22 confirms my understanding, by saying this wisdom (Jesus) was created as the first of God's works.

    I believe Jesus himself confirms it in Rev 3:14, when he calls himself “the beginning of the creation by God”.

    I believe Micah 5:2 confirms it, when it speaks of Jesus' ORIGINS being from days of old.

    You don't have to believe these things, but keep in mind that I'm just reading the words of the scriptures the way they were written – while you and Gene both read those same scriptures in whatever way compliments your own man-made doctrines.

    #338103
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 10 2013,10:43)

    Quote (mikeboll @ 64)
    is taking in knowledge of

    WHAT, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD THAT BIZZARE PHRASE MEANS, APART THAT IT IS ALSO NOT WITHIN THAT VERSE

    The Greek word used by Jesus was “ginōskōsin”.  It is Strong's #1097, and the very first words in Strong's definition are:  I am taking in knowledge.  

    Luke 8:10
    To you is given knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God

    The bolded “knowledge” is the same Greek word.

    So now that we've gotten that part sorted out…………….

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 10 2013,10:43)

    Quote (mikeboll @ 64)
    Jesus is saying that THE WAY TO eternal life

    WHERE, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, JESUS SAID THOSE WORDS, SINCE THEY ARE NOT IN THAT VERSE???


    How do YOU understand it, Charles?  Do you think that taking in knowledge of Jesus and his and our God, IN ITSELF, is LITERALLY “eternal life”?  Will I live forever just by reading the Bible once and taking in knowledge of God and his servant Jesus Christ?

    Jesus is OBVIOUSLY talking about “the way” to eternal life.  Or the “requirement” to gain eternal life.

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 10 2013,10:43)

    Quote (mikeboll @ 64)
    of both him, AND the “only true God”

    HOW FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, IN THAT VERSE GOD ALMIGHTY IS KNOWN AS THE ONLY TRUE GOD


    I'm not sure I understand the question.  But I have one of my own:

    Charles, is it abundantly clear in John 17:3 that Jesus identifies himself as someone OTHER THAN the one he calls “the only true God”?  YES or NO?

    The only honest and correct answer is “YES”……… so don't bother posting a novel to “explain”, okay?

    #338116
    abe
    Participant

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 11 2013,12:45)

    Quote (abe @ Mar. 11 2013,12:33)
     [/quote]
    quote=abe,Mar. 11 2013,12:33]


    Quote
    Was Mary from the earth?

    Abe,

    IT IS QUITE OBVIOUS THAT THE LINAGE OF MARY, WHICH WAS TO SUPPLY THE PURE FLESH OF THE WORD FROM THE CONTAMINATED FLESH OF EVE IT WAS DEFINITELY A PROCESS OF THE WORD BOTH REGARDING her FLESH SUBSTANCE, AND  EVEN MORE HER  SPIRIT.

    THEREFORE THE SPIRIT ITSELF OF THE SON,THE WORD, THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT AS THE MEDIATOR, WAS UNFATHOMABLE FOR US, DOING HIS WORK THROUGHOUT THE LINEAGE OF MARY RIGHT FROM SETH.

    THROUGH THE PROCESS OF CREATION , THEREFORE CREATED, REGARDING  MARY'S FLESH BODY ONLY, THE WORD PRODUCED THE IMMACULATE FLESH SUBSTANCE WHICH GOD NEEDED TO BECOME GOD IN FLESH

    SO MATERIAL WISE  THE LINAGE OF MARY AND ALL THE SELECT WERE SHIELDED,SEPARATED WITH THE POWER OF THE WORD FROM SATAN'S EVIL SPIRIT.

    IT MEANS THAT SATAN HAD NOT THE LEAST AWARENESS WHAT WAS HAPPENING,NEVER MIND THE  CHANCE TO GET INVOVLED IN ANY WAY THROUGH HIS SEED, AND STAIN WITH HIS EVIL SPIRIT THE PROCESS WHEREVER MARY'S SEED WAS CONCERNED.

    JEREMIAH 31:22 How long wilt thou be dissolute in deliciousness, O wandering daughter? for the Lord hath created a new thing upon the earth: A WOMAN SHALL COMPASS A MAN.

    THE ABOVE IS DEFINITELY A REFERENCE TO MARY. NOTICE AS WELL THE STATEMENT FOR THE LORD HAD CREATED A NEW THING UPON THE EARTH SO IT HAS NOTHING TO BE COMPARED WITH THE NORMAL CONCEPTION PROCESS REGARDING MARY!

    IT IS ALSO GOOD TO NOTICE THAT WHEREVER THIS HOLY GENERATION WAS BEING PROCESSED IT WAS ALWAYS THROUGH BARREN, OLD WOMEN OR BOTH, AS PROOF THAT THE WORD WAS DOING ITS MYSTERIOUS WORK!

    GOD WAS CLEAR REGARDING MARY AND SAID:

    Genesis 3:15 I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: ………….

    REFLECT:
    ALMIGHTY GOD HIMSELF THROUGH THE WORD, THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT

    put enmities between Satan and the woman,

    and Satan seed and her seed:

    SO SATANIC SPERM, WOULD NEVER TOUCH HER LINAGE AND HER HOLY OVUM. EVEN IF SHE WAS ATTACKED, RAPED AND VIOLENTLY HAD INTERCOURSE WHILE ON HER WAY TO VISIT  ELIZEBETH .

    CONFIRMATION:

    Hebrews 4:12 For the

    WORD OF GOD IS A LIVING AND EFFECTUAL, AND MORE PIRCING THAN ANY TWO ENDGED SWORD;

    AND REACHNG UNTO THE DIVISION OF

    THE SOUL AND THE SPIRIT,

    OF THE JOINTS ALSO AND MARROW,………..

    THE ABOVE IS A DESCRIPTION, REGARDING THE POWER OF THE WORD  IN UTMOST DETAIL HOW GOD MADE THINGS CONCERNING HIS PERSONAL AND UNIQUE PROCESS TO FURNISH HIMSELF WITH THE MOST IMMACULATE FLESH SUBSTANCE AND STORES IT IN THE OVUM OF MARY.

    NOTWITSTANDING THE FACT THAT CAME THROUGH SATAN'S EARTH.

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles


    Hi Charles,

    (quote)
    THROUGH THE PROCESS OF CREATION , THEREFORE CREATED, REGARDING  MARY'S FLESH BODY ONLY, THE WORD PRODUCED THE IMMACULATE FLESH SUBSTANCE WHICH GOD NEEDED TO BECOME GOD IN FLESH

    Num.23:18 And he took up his parable, and said, Rise up, Balak, and hear; listen to me, you son of Zippor:
    19God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: has he said, and shall he not do it? or has he spoken, and shall he not make it good?

    (quote)
    IT MEANS THAT SATAN HAD NOT THE LEAST AWARENESS WHAT WAS HAPPENING,NEVER MIND THE  CHANCE TO GET INVOVLED IN ANY WAY THROUGH HIS SEED, AND STAIN WITH HIS EVIL SPIRIT THE PROCESS WHEREVER MARY'S SEED WAS CONCERNED.

    Ps.51:5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.

    2Cor.5:20 Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were making an appeal through us; we beg you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God :21For he hath MADE him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

    Heb.9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

    Peace brother..

    #338375
    carmel
    Participant

    [quote=mikeboll64,Mar. 12 2013,14:05][/quote]

    Quote
    The Greek word used by Jesus was “ginōskōsin”.  It is Strong's #1097, and the very first words in Strong's definition are:  I am taking in knowledge.  

    Mike ,

    Hereunder is the

    TEXT ANALYSIS

    STRONG’S               GREEK                       ENGLISH
    3778 [e] hautē              αὕτη                             this            
    1161 [e] de                     δέ                             moreover          
    1510 [e] estin                ἐστιν                              is              
    3588 [e]  hē                     ἡ                                   –                
    166   [e] aiōnios           αἰώνιος                       eternal            
    2222 [e] zōē                    ζωὴ                              life,
    2443 [e] hina                 ἵνα                                that              
    1097 [e] ginōskōsin     γινώσκωσιν*         they should know
    4771 [e] se                        σὲ                               you,

    NOW YOU WROTE:

    Jesus is saying that THE WAY TO eternal life is taking in knowledge of both him, AND the “only true God”, who is not only OUR God, but also JESUS' God.

    THE PHRASE  :

    THE WAY TO ETERNAL LIFE, which YOU invented, has nothing in comparison with:

    NOW THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE which in itself  justified Jesus mission on earth, which was the redemption from death of all creation, confirmed:

    THE TWO NATURES OF JESUS CHRIST AS FULLY MAN AND FULLY GOD,

    and OFFICIALLY, declared the most  VITAL:

    THE UNIFICATION OF JESUS CHRIST WITH THE FATHER THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT.

    THE GLORIFICATION!

    THEREFORE THE ONLY TRUE GOD,AND JESUS CHRIST. IN THE TRUTH.

    BOTH SPIRIT AND FLESH BEING FOR ETENITY!

    Now I PERSONALLY EXPECT THAT YOU EXPAND IN ORDER  FOR US TO BE AWARE WHAT THE TRUTH IS ! SINCE IT IS A VAGUE INTERPRETATION!

    Quote
    Charles, is it abundantly clear in John 17:3 that Jesus identifies himself as someone OTHER THAN the one he calls “the only true God”?  YES or NO?

    IT IS NOT ONLY IF IT IS ABUNDANTLY CLEAR BUT WHAT IT IS ABUNDANTLY CLEAR FOR HIM, AND IN THE SAME TIME, INFACT IT IS NOT!SINCE HE GIVES A DIFFERENT INTERPRATION THEN WHAT IT REALLY IS.

    JESUS CONFIRMED NOT ONLY THAT THE FATHER IS:

    THE ONLY TRUE GOD, BUT ALSO THAT THE FATHER BECAME SO,CONJOINED WITH JESUS CHRIST.

    SO HE IN THE SAME INSTANT CONFIRMED THAT HE ALSO IS THE ONLY TRUE GOD, SINCE JESUS CHRIST IS INCLUDED IN THE TITLE.

    SO IF YOU ARE SAYING WHAT IT IS ABUNDANTLY CLEAR THAT THE FATHER IS THE ONLY TRUE GOD , IN THE SAME TIME YOU ARE SAYING,BUT IT IS NOT ABUNDANTLY CLEAR FOR YOU, THAT JESUS CHRIST IS ALSO THE ONLY TRUE GOD.

    Peace and Love in Jesus

    Charles

    #338441
    carmel
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 10 2013,09:22)

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 09 2013,21:50)

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 09 2013,12:10)

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 08 2013,00:53)
    IT IS DIFFICULT FOR YOU MIKE, SIMPLY BECAUSE YOU IGNORE THE BELIEF THAT GOD IS A TRIUNE GOD.


    Actually Charles,

    The fact that you DO want our ONE God to be some kind of multi-personality freak is the reason you can't accept “I am the beginning of the creation by God” for the most obvious and sensible meaning – which is:  Jesus was the first thing God ever created.

    It's not like there is just ONE scripture that you have to twist into a nonsensical meaning.  You have to twist Prov 8:22, Col 1:15, Micah 5:2, Rev 3:14, Heb 1:6…… and many others as well.

    Do ALL of those scriptures have some oddball, nonsensical meaning, Charles?  Must we imagine that ALL of them mean something other than the most obvious and sensible meaning – just so your comically flawed, man-made doctrine can be fulfilled?

    You do it if you want to.  I refuse to make nonsense out of perfectly clear scriptures – just to appease my own personal desires.

    I do, however, wish you the best on your spiritual journey, and hope that you will soon come to accept the words of scripture as they were written.

    I pray that you will come to accept our one God, the Father, AND His only begotten Son……… instead of a made up God who CONSISTS OF a Father and a Son.


    Quote
    Do ALL of those scriptures have some oddball, nonsensical meaning, Charles?

    Mike,

    ARE YOU GOING TO SUBSTANTIATE YOUR POINT THAT THE BELOW IS A PROOF THAT THE SON'S SPIRIT WAS CREATED?

    HAVE A GO MIKE!

    define:

    THE FIRSTBORN OF EVERY CREATURE!

    IN ORDER TO PROVE THAT JESUS WAS EVER CREATED!

    I AM WAITING !!!

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles


    Charles

    Quote
    define:

    THE FIRSTBORN OF EVERY CREATURE!

    firstborn = first come into  live

    of every creature = before all other creature


    Quote
    firstborn = first come into  live

    of every creature = before all other creature

    Terraricca,

    REFLECT:

    firstborn = first come into  live, BUT EACH DIFFERENT SPECIES, IN NATURE,NOT JESUS’SPIRIT.

    JESUS’SPIRIT WAS USED BY THE FATHER,THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT TO CREATE EVERY SPECIES IN NATURE FOR THE FIRST TIME,AND THEN NATURE, THROUGH THAT PARTICULAR FIRST ONE, PRODUCED QUANTITIES OF IT.

    FOR INSTANCE READ:

    And he said: Let the earth bring forth the green herb, and such as may seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after its kind, which may have seed in itself upon the earth. And it was so done.

    GOD SAID: LET THE EARTH BRING FORTH THE GREEN HERB,

    Notice: it says HERB, not HERBS, SO IT IS REFERRING TO THE FIRST EVER CREATURE IN THE PLANT PROCESS IN THIS CASE THE   HERB, THAT PARTICULAR FIRST HERB, SINCE IT WAS CREATED FOR THE FIRST TIME,

    IT WAS CREATED BY THE WORD GOD'S MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT WHICH WAS IN THAT PARTICULAR HERB TO GIVE IT LIFE AND EXIST.

    NOW THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE WORDWAS CREATED, BUT THE HERB WAS.

    THEN THROUGH ITS SEED IT PRODUCED QUATITIES,BUT THE FIRST ONE WAS CREATED BY THE WORD GOD’ S SPIRIT,composed purposely in

    THREE SPIRITS,

    THE FATHER, THE SPIRIT OF LOVE

    THE SON, THE SPIRIT OF WISDOM,

    AND THE  HOLY SPIRIT THE SPIRIT OF POWER,

    IN ORDER TO CREATE ALL.

    BUT ALL IN THE SON'S SPIRIT, THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT,AS THE ONLY MEDIATOR.

    WHICH IS STILL IN NATURE NO MATTER WHAT,TO KEEP IT ALIVE, AND FUNCTIONING.

    Peace and love in Jesus

    Charles

    #338462
    terraricca
    Participant

    Charles

    Quote
    JESUS’SPIRIT WAS USED BY THE FATHER,THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT TO CREATE EVERY SPECIES IN NATURE FOR THE FIRST TIME,AND THEN NATURE, THROUGH THAT PARTICULAR FIRST ONE, PRODUCED QUANTITIES OF IT.

    God created Jesus as a spirit being ,called THE WORD of GOD ,the holy spirit is not used of what we know prior to men creation ,

    Quote
    THREE SPIRITS,

    THE FATHER, THE SPIRIT OF LOVE

    THE SON, THE SPIRIT OF WISDOM,

    AND THE HOLY SPIRIT THE SPIRIT OF POWER,

    IN ORDER TO CREATE ALL.

    BUT ALL IN THE SON'S SPIRIT, THE MOST POWERFULL SPIRIT,AS THE ONLY MEDIATOR.

    WHICH IS STILL IN NATURE NO MATTER WHAT,TO KEEP IT ALIVE, AND FUNCTIONING.

    this is purely your own fabrication ,you do not know God or his son ,the trinity is still doing is demolition in your mind and soul,

    #338463
    terraricca
    Participant

    Charles

    Quote
    Notice: it says HERB, not HERBS, SO IT IS REFERRING TO THE FIRST EVER CREATURE IN THE PLANT PROCESS IN THIS CASE THE HERB, THAT PARTICULAR FIRST HERB, SINCE IT WAS CREATED FOR THE FIRST TIME,

    Ge 1:11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so.

    Ge 1:12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.
    Ge 1:13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

    I can not follow you ,you are lost

    #338468
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (carmel @ Mar. 14 2013,14:36)
    JESUS CONFIRMED NOT ONLY THAT THE FATHER IS:

    THE ONLY TRUE GOD, BUT ALSO THAT THE FATHER BECAME SO,CONJOINED WITH JESUS CHRIST.


    No he didn't, Charles.  Jesus confirmed that eternal life is the taking in of knowledge of the only true God (which is both our God AND his God) – and also taking in of knowledge of the servant, prophet, sacrificial lamb, priest,, anointed one, and son OF that God.

    If you are reading something about Jesus and God being “conjoined” from the words of John 17:3, then you are apparently reading your own imagination into that verse – because there is nothing mentioned about such a thing in 17:3.

    Instead, that verse CLEARLY identifies Jesus as someone OTHER THAN “the only true God”.  Charles, try reading the words that were actually written, and forming your understanding around THOSE WORDS.  Because it seems you are doing the opposite.  It seems you have already formed your understanding, and are trying to force the words of scripture to fit around YOUR OWN understanding.
     
    Btw, here is where you can read Strong's definition of ginóskó.  Notice that “taking in knowledge” is the first definition listed.

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