The Ordinary Jesus Brigade

[Ed J]

Hi Gene,

Well regardless of your motivation, you have been avoiding answering my y/n questions,
and now you agree with my premise that these questions are sometimes necessary:

In any case, it’s nice to see that you have now reconciled with me…

Edj…..
using yes and no for answers is ok, if done properly to clarify
some thing that needs clarification

_____________
God bless
Ed J

[carmel]

Carmel….. GOD THE FATHER AND HIS WORDS ARE ONE AND THE SAME PERSON.  Jesus had his own will seperate of God’s will,  Jesus plainly “said”  the “words” I am telling you are “not” my words.  So please tell us how is Jesus himself, “is” the word when he denies the words were his?  Don’t you think you should clearify that first?

Gene,

Read Isaiah 55:11

So shall MY WORD be, (A SPIRIT WHICH CAME OUT FROM THE FATHER’S MOUTH, CREATED ALL, AND WHICH CARRIED GOD’S SPIRITUAL TEACHING )

which shall go forth from my mouth: it shall not return to me void, but it shall do whatsoever I please and shall prosper in the things for which I sent it.

Now Back to Jesus:

John 16:28 I came forth from the Father and am come INTO the world: again I leave the world and I go to the Father.( JESUS PRE-EXISTENCE)

John17:10 And ALL MY THINGS ARE YOURS and YOURS ARE MINE : and I am GLORIFIED in them.

Consequently all the Father’s things, in our case GOD’S WORD, are JESUS’ WORDS, and JESUS’ WORDS are THE FATHER’S WORDS!

Now Read hereunder:

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him: If anyone loves me, he will keep my word.( SINGULAR; MY SPIRIT IN HIS HEART AS A SPIRIT/MEDIATOR)  And my Father will love him ( SIMPLY AS JESUS’ WORDS /THINGS ARE THE FATHER’S and vice versa) and WE ( JESUS AND THE FATHER both glorified AS ONE :

THEY ARE NO MORE TWO, BUT TWO IN ONE SPIRIT/FLESH)

John 17:1  the hour has come. Glorify thy Son, that thy Son may glorify thee. HUMANITY ARE FUSED WITH GOD IN

JESUS CHRIST)

(AS YOU WELL SAID Gene ; GOD THE FATHER AND HIS WORDS ARE ONE AND THE SAME PERSON)

YOU SEE GENE THE HOLY SPIRIT SPOKE THE TRUTH THROUGH YOU!  Let’s continue: John 14:23

WE will come to him and will make our abode with him. 24He that loveth me not keepeth not my words (PLURAL, MY GOSPEL, MY SPIRITUAL TEACHING FROM THE FATHER)  ( NOW NOTICE THE EMPHASIS )AND  “THE WORD”  ( THE SPIRIT) which you have heard is not mine; ( JESUS IS NOT AUTONOMOUS, JESUS IS THE FATHER’S WORD SPOKEN, THE WORD OF GOD, asserted by Jesus:)

but the Father’s who sent me. PRE-EXISTED

Now read again and see the difference:

If anyone loves me. He will keep  MY SPIRIT, IN HIS HEART/SOUL. (eternal life) He that loveth me not keepeth not MY GOSPEL, the spiritual teaching from the father.

AND THE SPIRIT which you have HEARD is not MINE, but the Father’s who sent me.

 

Enjoy and praise God for this light

 

Peace and love in Jesus Christ

[GeneBalthrop]

Carmel…..why have you. Completely ignored the scriptures I quoted that shows you are totally wrong”. Please tell us why you did that, I posted scriptures that disagree with you to ignore them is bad form. IMO why don’t you deal with them”

Peace and love to you and yours. …….gene

[Jodi]

Good Morning Carmel,

ME: why Jesus is said to be the Son of God according to the Holy Spirit by his resurrection from the dead.

YOU: Can you produce scripture to substantiate the above, please?

ME:

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 2 (Which HE had PROMISED afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) 3 Concerning HIS Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; 4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

This passage tells you directly that God’s word given to the prophets was HIS words, they were a promise, a promise that had ACTUALLY existed WITH God even before the world was.

JESUS is the name given to the child born of the flesh of David, and he is DECLARED to be God’s Son according to the Holy Spirit. Jesus IS exactly according to God’s promise to David of Psalms 2, David’s son who was on a certain day begotten by God’s Spirit, made into God’s Son. He was resurrected from the dead and thus he is a Son of God for all eternity, a firstborn Son/ firstborn of many brethren as king over David’s throne, such was ALSO PROMISED to David concerning his son. A promise that was God’s word before the world even was. 

ME: JESUS was raised from the dead because he was perfected,

You: Again Can you produce scripture to substantiate the above, please?

ME:

Acts 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: 24 Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it. 

James 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

1 Corinthians 15:56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Sin=Death

Jesus did not sin therefore he could not be held to the penalty of sin which is death. He died we are told having been perfected, it is by that perfecting that he was able to die for our sins. It because he LEARNED OBEDIENCE going to the cross that MADE him perfected. BECAUSE of his unfailing OBEDIENCE with the final test of that obedience being faithful unto his death, remaining therefore without sin, he could not be HELD to the penalty of sin. God had to loosen him from that penalty and raise him from the dead.

WHY did Jesus of Nazareth, the MAN approved of God, NOT SIN and thus wasn’t worthy of it’s penalty, death?

Scripture is rich in giving light to simple truth,

Acts 17:31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that MAN whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Hebrews 5:1 For every high priest taken from among men is ordained for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins: 2 Who can have compassion on the ignorant, and on them that are out of the way; for that he himself also is compassed with infirmity. 3 And by reason hereof he ought, as for the people, so also for himself, to offer for sins. 4 And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is CALLED of God, as was Aaron.

A MAN, Jesus of Nazareth was ORDAINED by God, CALLED by God to offer for sins.

Below passage, is speaking of the offspring of Jesse, elected by God to receive all the fruits of God’s Spirit, (wisdom, understanding, council and might, knowledge and fear of YHWH, power to heal, master to forgive sins, master over the Sabbath, able to raise the dead, able to control and manipulate the elements of the heavens and earth, able to speak YHWH’s truth, a prophet of YHWH, all as a Son of Man from the TIME when the Spirit descended like a dove and rested upon him, an ANOINTING).

Isaiah 42:6 I the LORD have CALLED thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will KEEP thee, and GIVE thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

Carmel, Jesus of Nazareth was ordained by God, CALLED to righteousness, CALLED to be a high priest to offer a payment for our sins. 

THAT ORDAINING, THAT CALLING to RIGHTEOUSNESS to BE a high priest offering his LIFE for our sins, was God KEEPING him from sin, having him LEARN OBEDIENCE to YHWH. He was OBEDIENT BECAUSE the Spirit of God rested upon him, the Spirit of Knowledge and fear of YHWH.  By that act of obedience he was MADE perfect, and thus could die paying the penalty for our sins, being sacrificed like a lamb without spot or blemish. 

The anointing as Jesus of Nazareth called it, that occurred at the river Jordan when the Spirit came down like a dove and rested upon Jesus and God said, “THIS is my beloved Son“, that is WHEN Isaiah’s prophecies of chapter 11, 42, and 61 were fulfilled and that is WHEN the Spirit of Knowledge and fear of YHWH rested upon him, an ordaining, a calling to righteousness, whereby having that Spirit be placed upon him he was CALLED and thus capable through that Spirit to remain obedient through any amount of testing and suffering. 

Mark 14:36 And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.

Hebrews 5:7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

When Jesus was in weak mortal flesh fearing death, he overcame his carnal mind and served YHWH having faith in YHWH over the carnal mind that draws man away from God to serve man’s weak mortal flesh.

Jesus was obedient by having the Spirit of Knowledge and fear of YHWH upon him, he had been anointed, ORDAINED and CALLED by God where God would keep him from sin, perfect him to give for a covenant. That perfecting, NOT only set us free from the penalty of death, it made Jesus not worthy of the penalty of death. YHWH could NOT HOLD Jesus to a penalty he did not deserve, so He raised him from the dead and fulfilled His promise, His word that HE gave before the world even was, YHWH made him the firstborn of the dead of many brethren, as was promised to David in Psalms. He gave a Son of Man dominion over all the works of HIS hands, as was promised to David in Psalms. He set a Son of Man at His right hand, as was promised to David in Psalms. He made him a righteous judge over the quick and the dead as God promised to Isaiah.

[carmel]

Carmel…..why have you. Completely ignored the scriptures I quoted that shows you are totally wrong”. Please tell us why you did that, I posted scriptures that disagree with you to ignore them is bad form. IMO why don’t you deal with them”

Gene read hereunder YOUR OWN QUESTION:

Carmel….. GOD THE FATHER AND HIS WORDS ARE ONE AND THE SAME PERSON.  Jesus had his own will seperate of God’s will,  Jesus plainly “said”  the “words” I am telling you are “not” my words.  So please tell us how is Jesus himself, “is” the word when he denies the words were his?  Don’t you think you should clearify that first?

Can you see the question mark? Now read that actual question you posted:

Jesus plainly “said”

  the “words” I am telling you are “not” my words. 

So please tell us how is Jesus himself, “is” the word when he denies the words were his? 

Don’t you think you should clarify that first? 

Got it Gene your last, I repeat VERY LAST WORDS WERE

clarify that first?

Consequently, Gene, that’s what I posted and commented on! Here it is your question again

YOU: Jesus plainly “said”

  the “words” I am telling you are “not” my words.  

So, please

tell us

how is Jesus himself, “is” the word when

he denies

the words were his?
Don’t you think you should clarify

that first?

Now FIRST AND FOREMOST I POSTED THE SCRIPTURE WHICH CLEARLY SAYS WHAT YOU POSTED: Read

John14:2323Jesus answered and said to him: If any one love me, he will keep my word. And my Father will love him and we will come to him and will make our abode with him. 24He that loveth me not keepeth not my words.

And the word which you have heard is not mine; but the Father’s who sent me.

OK Gene?

Now read what you SAID in this post: why have you. completely ignored the scriptures I quoted that shows you are totally wrong”.

Please tell us why you did that, I posted scriptures that

disagree with you to ignore them is bad form. IMO

Is it Gene, from my side a

BAD FORM

since I did exactly what you

asked?

And if according to your UNDERSTANDING  the scriptures you quoted show that

I am totally wrong,

ISN’T IT EVEN MORE WRONG

since you never substantiated and supported

YOUR OWN PERCEPTIONS and what you see as TRUTH?

Go ahead Gene be HONEST PLEASE, and tell us

WHERE I AM WRONG!

After all, you should be alright, nothing to worry since God reveals things to you as you said hereunder to EDJ:

I know what I am telling you is THE TRUTH, I also know I am still learning things AS GOD REVEALS THINGS TO ME, it’s a growing process.  But I also know unless they or you speak according to God’s words , then you are not his, according to scriptures.

SO GOD IS WITH YOU NO? I AM WAITING!

In the meantime,

I am not ready to answer YET,  to WHAT to me is a clear

Dishonest and desperate move from your part by which

you ignored

First  what I wrote, which  precisely, after all, is  a clear ANSWER to

WHAT YOU ASKED, 

and second, simply an excuse and a clear desperate effort since you found yourself in GREAT DIFFICULTY to comment about

THE TRUTH!

Which both you and Jodi, by the look of things, ARE NOT READY TO TALK ABOUT, AND COMMENT!

NEVER MIND ADMIT!

IT’S TRUTH

Since BACK on page 116, I already posted and commented the same points in general, regarding more or less the same SCRIPTURES.

 

Now to remind you what I wrote on page 116 here it is again in relation to Jesus’ references regarding His own genuine title as “THE WORD”

 

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him: If anyone love me, he will keep

MY WORD ( SINGULAR with the possessive pronoun)……

24He that loveth  me not keepeth not

MY WORDS.(PLURAL with the possessive pronoun)……

THE WORD ( SINGULAR with the article) which you have heard is NOT MINE, but the FATHER’S who sent me.

John15:7 If you abide in me and

MY WORDS( PLURAL with the possessive pronoun)abide in you, …….

John 15:20 Remember MY WORD (SINGULAR with the possessive pronoun) that I said to you: ……If they have kept

MY WORD, (SINGULAR with the possessive pronoun) they will keep yours also.

 

Gene, As you can read Jesus used the singular, plural, the article THE, and the possessive pronoun MY,  as He seems FIT in relation to His message! NO? I don’t believe that John wrote this particular and vital scripture related to “THE WORD” in such MODE for nothing? DO YOU?

Have a go  Gene and explain in your own understanding what are the actual different messages Jesus had in mind.

 

Peace and Love in Jesus Christ

 

 

[Anthony]

Hi Carmel

Your wasting your time on Gene and Jodi. They are from the Father of lies and know it. They use the Word of God like there father does, Deceitful, they lay traps to catch you up with your own words.

Good luck, may God be with you, in your attempt to bring the light of God to them.

God bless 🙏

[GeneBalthrop]

Carmel,   no, what I see is you use  the singular, plural, the article the, and the singular possessive pronoun as you and other false teach chose to. 

By flipping them around as you people do you to deny straight forward scriptures, and try to present the understanding of those plain and simple scriptures as some kind of hidden truth you poses. Your religion is a “mystery religion” that only you people seem to understand.  Your the one claiming some “special ”  hidden understanding, not us. The truth of that scripture I posted  tares down your FALSE TEACHINGS completely.  No matter how hard you try to juggle them around to meet your false teachings. 

But then Jesus did say “many” would come in his name and decieve “many” , as it is this day.  Carmel don’t you think it’s time you stepped away from the “many” and join the “few”.  Who are in the narrow and straight way that leads to life?  Go read what I have written on 2ths2,  right now  you are in the group that turns the “image” of Jesus the christ into a “God” and you worships him as such.  Please notice what happens to those who do that at Jesus ‘ return.

Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene

[GeneBalthrop]

Jodi…..A very, very,  good post sis, but they  simply are unable at this time to understand it. They are simply the blind leading the blind and have already fallen into the ditch. Only one can pull them out, but until the time we simply bare witness,  and it is good we do that, who knows if someone passing through this site might take notice or God the Father might lead others of the truth here, so they might find encouragement here.

Peace and love to you and yours. ……..gene

[Jodi]

Anthony, 

YOU: “I am from the Father of lies and know it“.

ME:  You are telling me and others that you sincerely believe that I am on this forum for the sole purpose to intentionally deceive people?

GIVE ME ONE EXAMPLE where I have DECEITFULLY laid a trap to catch a person up with their own words?

 

[Jodi]

Hi Gene,

Thank you! Same to you, God bless, Jodi

 

[Jodi]

Hi Carmel,

YOU: John 15:20 Remember MY WORD (SINGULAR with the possessive pronoun) that I said to you: ……If they have kept

MY WORD, (SINGULAR with the possessive pronoun) they will keep yours also.

ME:

20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.

Carmel, are not the sayings of Jesus and the sayings of his disciples the word of God, God’s Gospel? Yes it is scripture directly tells you this. Jesus spoke the Gospel of God concerning himself, and the apostles spoke that same Gospel concerning Christ. That Gospel was WITH God before the world was, and it was WITH Him when He spoke it to the prophets, it was WITH Him until the time He determined for it to be fulfilled in the flesh of Jesus.

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)

CLEAR as day, the prophets and the apostles SPOKE the gospel of God, which was concerning God’s Son,

verse 3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; 4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: 5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:

Jesus through having been anointed with God’s Spirit preached also the gospel of God, God’s word of His coming Kingdom, a promise, and it just so happened that which Jesus spoke concerned that which he would fulfill also through having God’s Spirit rest upon him. 

Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to PREACH the gospel…To PREACH the acceptable year of the Lord.

John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. 

Mark 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, PREACHING the gospel of the kingdom of God,

Acts 10:36 The WORD which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all:) 37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached; 38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him. 

Carmel,  The WORD which God SENT was HIS WORD and He SENT HIS WORD to the children of Israel, they HEARD God’s WORD because Jesus gave it to them. Jesus began preaching God’s word of peace beginning in Galilee, AFTER John had been preaching about baptism.  Jesus had been anointed and sent out to preach God’s word, having been baptized and the Spirit resting upon him with God being with him.

That SAME Spirit that anointed Jesus so that he could be SENT out to preach God’s Gospel, had been given to the prophets prior to the anointing of Jesus, and after Jesus ascended to sit as a Son of Man at God’s right hand, that SAME Spirit came to rest in measure onto Jesus’s brethren, making some of them apostles to also speak God’s WORD.

Romans 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another*;) 16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Carmel, Paul says “my gospel“, is his gospel the SAME gospel as that of Jesus? Is it the SAME gospel that Jesus received from God? YES. 

The Gospel of God is written for you clearly by Isaiah, we have the offspring of Jesse being anointed, being called to righteousness with God’s Spirit resting upon him, where he is perfected and dies on the cross for our sins, he then is resurrected becoming the firstborn of the dead, first of many brethren, for we are joint heirs with Christ, as he was an heir of God so we too are also heirs of God. We wait for the adoption, the redemption of our bodies, bodies raised like that of Jesus’s body, raised in power, glory, and incorruptible having eternal life. 

 

[GeneBalthrop]

Carmel…..another scripture that proves that Jesus “himself” is not the word of God, but speaks to us God’s words. 

Heres what the LORD OUR GOD himself says,  maybe you might believe him.

Deu 18:18….”I (God speaking) Will raise up a “prophet” from among their brethern, like unto you,  and will put “my words” in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all the words “I ” shall command him”.

Deu 18: 19….And it shall come to pass that whosoever will not hearken unto “my words” which “he” shall speak  in  “my” name, I will require it of him.

CARMEL,  no “mystery religious ” concepts,  just plain unaltered scriptures.

Peace and love to you and yours. ……..gene

[Proclaimer]

This is what we have been saying all along and yet some who profess to be Believers still do not believe.

John 16:28
I came from the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going back to the Father.”

John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed.

 

[Truthcomber]

HI All,

 

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

Me: The words of God originate from his mind and gives it to Christ’s humanity  in and through the holy spirit. Christ is the Word or vehicle in which God’s words are now expressed to us. We have one teacher, Christ.

Matt 23:8 (NKJV) “But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi’; for one is your teacher, the Christ, and you are all brethren.

[Jodi]

Hi t8,

YOU:

This is what we have been saying all along and yet some who profess to be Believers still do not believe.

John 16:28
I came from the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going back to the Father.”

John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed.

ME: I BELIEVE those scriptures, I believe all scriptures and they work together to give truth.

Jesus CAME from the Father, he likens himself to the manna that came down from heaven in the wilderness that Israel ate for sustenance.

Do you APPLY Jesus’s words in John 6 with that of John 16 t8?

John 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Luke 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

John 16:27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God. 28 I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father.

John 3:5 Jesus answered,Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit….34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. 35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

JESUS speaking the word of God that had been a prophecy, God’s word given to Isaiah made true in the flesh of Jesus. Jesus said he was to be baptized to fulfill all righteousness, he was at the river Jordan born of water and of the Spirit, what Isaiah spoke as a call to righteousness where God would hold his hand and keep him for a covenant, which is the bread dying on the cross, bread that was perfected having been anointed and sent out to preach God’s Gospel and to fulfill God’s Gospel, God’s will that had been established and IN God’s word before the world was.

Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, 19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

Jesus tells you t8 DIRECTLY of his anointing and WHEN God SENT him into the world.

Acts 10:37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached; 38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him. 39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree: 40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly; 

Jesus became the bread from heaven, born of the Spirit of God, an anointed man in the flesh  SENT out into the world. That bread would be made perfect as that anointing was a calling to righteousness, that perfected bread would be broken, learning obedience through suffering unto his death to save us from our sins. 

You really think t8 that what Jesus spoke in John 16, had NOTHING to do with the other words that he spoke, nor what other scriptures said, like Acts 10??????

This below passage was IN God, IN God’s word before the world was.

Matthew 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Matthew 18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.

John 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said,Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. 3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. 4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

TRUE STATEMENT t8, 

God PROMISED eternal life before the world began, and IN HIS WORD before the world began WAS “the Son of Man that would COME to save that which was lost”. The Son of Man that came to the people, was the anointed Jesus of Nazareth, he was born of God’s Spirit SENT to preach God’s word. That word that Jesus preaches was not his word, it was God’s word that had been WITH God before the world was, and that word before the world was CONTAINED Jesus, the son of David who God would make into His own Son to give for a covenant a light to the Gentiles. 

 

[GeneBalthrop]

TC……one is your teacher even the “anointing” this is referencing GOD’S HOLY SPIRIT, it is God the Father who teaches via his “Holy spirit”.  Remember Jesus said no man “can” come to me except the Father draw him, and again, “you shall all be taught of or (by) GOD. We (those who of the truth) are all being taught by the spirit of God , God the Father is himself saving us, he “alone” is our savior. 

And again,   Jesus said unto Peter “blessed are you Simon Barjoni, because flesh and blood” ,  (Jesus was flesh and blood) “did not reveal that unto you, but my Father who is in heaven has “reavealed”  it unto you, and I say unto you, you are Peter, (Jesus had that reavealed understanding from the Father also) , “and upon this “rock” , (the power of God to reveal truth into the minds of people),  “I shall build the church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

It is all a work of God, by the SPIRIT OF GOD, in and through all those he is using, including the “man” Jesus.

Peaceand love to you and yours. ……..gene

[Jodi]

Hello All,

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Isaiah 42:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: 2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD; 3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears: 4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

VERY SIMPLE, the glory that the people beheld was the glory that BEGAN from Galilee, upon the Spirit descending like a dove on Jesus and Jesus being SENT out to preach God’s Gospel, to heal, perform signs and miracles, do good deeds.

John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

Jesus tells you directly that he was anointed to speak God’s words, that he had been sent to preach, to deliver the captives, to heal.

Jesus was FULL of grace and truth BECAUSE he had God’s Spirit rest upon him, the Spirit of Wisdom, Understanding, Counsel and Might, Knowledge and fear of the LORD. Jesus was able to forgive sins and heal BECAUSE he had been anointed at the river.

The people beheld the glory of the Son of Man that came to them who was the only man born of God’s Spirit filled with grace and truth. 

Such is WHY after the Spirit descended upon Jesus God said, “THIS is my beloved Son”.

God’s only begotten Son in John 1 is Jesus of Nazareth who had been anointed with God’s Spirit at the river. 

[Anthony]

Hi Jodi

Jesus is God.
Jodi let’s take a look at a few of the many passages that clearly and consistently answer that question, straight from the pages of Scripture. We’ll begin by going back an additional 700 years before the life of Christ, to the Old Testament book of Isaiah. Jesus is God – Prophecies, Messiah predicted in the Old Testament

Isaiah 7:14:“Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.”

“Immanuel” literally means: “God with us.” See also Matthew 1:23; Jesus was “God with us.”

This Messiah would be born a human son, but have a higher nature
Isaiah 9:6: “For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.”

This was a radical statement coming from a monotheistic Jewish prophet — especially calling a human being “Mighty God”; but one that God fulfilled centuries later in Christ.

A couple hundred years later, but still more than half a millennium before Jesus walked the earth, more was predicted about the Messiah’s divine nature
Daniel 7:13-14: “There before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven . . . He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.”

“Son of Man” was the primary title Jesus used for Himself — and this passage shows that this was a clear and strong claim of deity. And in Mark, the earliest of the four Gospels, He also included the unmistakable phrase, “coming on the clouds of heaven” and applied it to Himself (Mark 14:62). His listeners got the point, refused to believe it, and added it to their reasons to try to kill Him.
Jesus is God – His Earthly Ministry  Jesus was worshiped by the Magi

Matthew 2:11: “On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him.”

Along with being led to the house where Jesus was,  these Magi were apparently informed by God about Jesus’ divine identity, and so they responded appropriately by worshiping Him.

Jesus accepted worship from His disciples
Matthew 14:32-33:“And when they climbed into the boat, the wind died down. Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God.’”

In a Jewish culture, only the one true God can be worshiped; their actions show that they acknowledged Jesus as being divine. And Jesus didn’t correct them or say, “Don’t you realize that I’m just a mortal prophet? Stop worshiping me!” Rather, He accepted their worship, knowing He really was God in human flesh.

Jesus’ claim about Himself
John 8:58-59: “‘I tell you the truth,’ Jesus answered, ‘before Abraham was born, I am!’ At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.”

This is a powerful double claim from Jesus: first, that He pre-existed His human birth and was actually alive and present (as God) before Abraham; second, that His title was “I am” — which was the same title used for Jehovah God in Exodus 3:14. His listeners again got the point, and picked up stones to execute Him!

Another of Jesus’ claims of deity
John 10:30-33: “‘I and the Father are one.’ Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus said to them, ‘I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?’ ‘We are not stoning you for any of these,’ replied the Jews, ‘but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.’”

It couldn’t be clearer than it is here: Jesus’ highly educated listeners understood His claim of deity. They only had two possible responses: to humble themselves and bow before Him as the Magi and the disciples had done earlier, or reject His claim and judge Him as a blasphemer. Unfortunately they chose the latter option. But notice that Jesus doesn’t argue with their accusation, because it was accurate. He really was claiming to be God!

Thomas’ response to the resurrected Jesus
John 20:27-29: “Then He said to Thomas, ‘Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.’ Thomas said to him, ‘My Lord and my God!’ Then Jesus told him, ‘Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.’”

This disciple realized, because of Jesus’ resurrection, who Jesus really was — and humbly worshiped Him and declared His true identity: “My Lord and my God!” Jesus not only accepts this declaration, but blesses all of the disciples — and all of us today — who come to the same realization and place of humble worship.

Jesus accepted worship prior to His ascension
Matthew 28:16-17:“Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted.”

Note that Jesus was worshiped at His birth, throughout His ministry, after His resurrection, and again here — right before His physical ascension into heaven. His divine nature,  was never questioned by Him or by those who really knew who He was and followed Him.

Paul’s understanding as an apostle and leader of the church
Colossians 1:15-16; 2:9: “He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. . . . For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form. . .”

And in Titus 2:13-14 Paul refers to him as “our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us. . .”

Paul’s letters were some of the earliest Christian writings, with most of them actually pre-dating the four Gospels — yet they make some of the strongest statements concerning the first church’s clear understanding of Jesus as the Creator; God in human form.

Jesus will be worshiped by every creature.  Rev.5:13-14:“Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, singing: ‘To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!’ The four living creatures said, ‘Amen,’ and the elders fell down and worshiped.”

The last book in the Bible points prophetically to the time where every living creature will know and acknowledge that Jesus, the “Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world” (John 1:29) is also the God who we must praise, honor, and worship — and certainly was not a mere mortal whose identity needed upgrading by Constantine (Roman emperor) hundreds of years after He walked this planet!

Jesus is God – Why this matters so much

But Jesus and His followers made the truth very clear, as we’ve seen in the pages of the earliest records, concerning who He was and is — and how imperative it is that we understand and embrace that truth. Look at His sobering words about the vital importance of His identity.

“I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life. . . .

“But you have no idea where I come from or where I am going. . .You do not know me or my Father. . .I told you that you would die in your sins if you do not believe that I am the one I claim to be, you will indeed die in your sins.”

“. . .Even as He spoke, many put their faith in him. To [them] Jesus said, ‘If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.’”

Jodi you don’t believe any of this, and you give a false gospel. That’s how I know, that you are a child of the Father of lies, and your Disciple Gene. Renounce  that Jesus Christ is just a man, and believe in God. A man can’t save you. Call Him God like Thomas did.

God bless

[Truthcomber]

Gene:

 

You: TC……one is your teacher even the “anointing” this is referencing GOD’S HOLY SPIRIT, it is God the Father who teaches via his “Holy spirit”. Remember Jesus said no man “can” come to me except the Father draw him, and again… “you shall all be taught of or (by) GOD. We (those who of the truth) are all being taught by the spirit of God ,

Me:

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Me: True

Matt 23:8 (NKJV) “But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi’; for ONE IS YOUR TEACHER  the Christ, and you are all brethren.

Me: The Father draws men to Christ who teaches them the ways of salvation.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

2 Cor 3:17 Now the Lord (kurios) is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

Me: The spirit of God now includes the mind of the Messiah in it.

[Truthcomber]

Gene:

 

You: God the Father is himself saving us, he “alone” is our savior.

 

Me: No Gene, God is one spirit now consisting of the soul of the Messiah in it. This is the new husband. I have shown you this.

John 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Me: You and Jodi have always quoted the next  verse in your defense:

1 Cor 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

Me: So now why do you twist scripture and say the father died for us.

 

Old Testament Husband:

Isa 54:5 For thy Maker is thine husband; YHWH of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.

Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant (marriage covenant) that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith YHWH

Me: The Old husband was YHWH, both the mind and the spirit (the Word) of.

 

New Testament Husband:

1 Cor 7:39 The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.
2 Cor 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

Me: The new husband is YHWH. This includes the mind and spirit (Word) of the OT plus the mind and soul of the seed of David. The New husband died for us through the body and soul of the Messiah bonded as one with God.

John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me?

Me: It is the man in the new husband that died for us, not the Father. This is very elementary, unless you twist scripture, which you and your Father do.

[Author]

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