The Holy Spirit, a separate person, essence of God, or force?

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 01 2010,09:12)

To All………The Holy Spirit (IS) an (IT) , (IT) is the SPIRIT (INTELLECT) of the TRUTH one opf the seven spirit (intellects) of GOD, (IT) gives us awareness of Truth, Now (IF) you speak against (IT) (the spirit of truth) you can NOT be forgiven now or in time to come, why because truth (IS) truth it doesn't change never. The Pharisees were committing an unpardonable sin by speaking out against the Spirit of Truth and equating (IT) with Satan. Does that means they themselves will never be forgiven their sins (NO), it means that (particular) state their in can not be forgiven or overlooked, they must come to a point where they must (CHANGE) their thinking and accept the truth, because as long as they are in error by Speaking against the spirit of truth it is not forgiven them, it Can't BE.

Because they who are preventing the Truth from advancing will have to be dealt with, they (MUST) Change because the truth will not Change ever so Blasphemy against it (spirit of truth) will never be forgiven , Because blasphemy of the (TRUTH) is a state of existence and it is against the truth it can not be forgiven (ever). The Person (MUST) Change, the (TRUTH) will (Never) Change now or in the future. IMO

peace and love to you all……………………….gene

Hi Gene,

According to the Greek you would be correct, Spirit is a neutered noun, and is addressed as “It”….except in the Bible where they address “it” as “He”. Confusing, no?

According to the Hebrew you would be wrong, Spirit is a feminine noun.

Jesus said that he was The Way, The Truth and The Life. Is Truth “intellect”?

The Holy Spirit entered Jesus,
The Holy Spirit enters us, and will TEACH us, all things…
The Holy Spirit is The Counselor, The Helper, The Comforter all characteristics of a “person”.

We know that God is not a “person” so we must identify Him with human terms. However, The Holy Spirit has “its” own identity as a person and carries out the functions as a separate entity. And when YHVH sends out His spirit it is coming from the separate entity, The Holy Spirit.

This aspect confuses matters, the Holy Spirit has the Spirit of YHVH inside of Her….ans She is in control of YHVH. lol

Power, Counsel, Understanding, Wisdom, Knowledge are traits of The Holy Spirit. As well as the Spirit of YHVH and the Fear of YHVH.

The Spirit is first seen in Genesis 1:2 as SpiritElohim.

July 31, 2010 at 4:43 pm#207096

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 01 2010,02:52)

Hi David,

The Holy Spirit is how the work gets done.

The Professor

Hi David,

John 5:17: But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work. (Luke 1:35 / Eph.4:6)

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

July 31, 2010 at 6:40 pm#207114

david

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ July 31 2010,19:16)

Hi David,

I have shown 'you' where The Scriptures document
HolySpirit is “GOD: The Father” of Jesus Christ
(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Click Here)

Yet you continue refer to Him as an 'it'? Have you no respect for HIM?
N.W.T. John 16:7 …but if I go my way, I will send [[[HIM]]] unto you.

Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Spirit (speaketh against the Holy Spirit), it
shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come. (Mt.12:32)

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, I noticed you could not address my actual point. Is it because you have no answer?

Your point of the holy spirit being called “him” no more proves it is a person than it being called God's “finger” or “arm” proves it is his arm or finger.

Why can you not address my actual post?

July 31, 2010 at 8:20 pm#207145

Participant

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,13:40)

Quote (Ed J @ July 31 2010,19:16)

Hi David,

I have shown 'you' where The Scriptures document
HolySpirit is “GOD: The Father” of Jesus Christ
(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Click Here)

Yet you continue refer to Him as an 'it'? Have you no respect for HIM?
N.W.T. John 16:7 …but if I go my way, I will send [[[HIM]]] unto you.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, I noticed you could not address my actual point. Is it because you have no answer?

Your point of the holy spirit being called “him” no more proves it is a person than it being called God's “finger” or “arm” proves it is his arm or finger.

Why can you not address my actual post?

Hello David,

I am curious. What “proof” do you want that shows you that the Holy Spirit exists? Obviously since She is spirit She cannot be a “person”, nor can She be seen. lol

Spirit in Hebrew is a feminine noun, which is a “She”.
In Acts She was lied “to”. You can't lie to an inanimate object.

Psalms 51 David didn't want to lose Her. Solomon wrote much about Her and Her characteristics (Wisdom, Understanding, Knowledge, Counsel, Power) in Proverbs.

She dwells in each believer and She unites us.

Would be glad to “try” to give you “proof”.

The Professor

July 31, 2010 at 9:43 pm#207163

Participant

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,05:40)

Quote (Ed J @ July 31 2010,19:16)

Hi David,

I have shown 'you' where The Scriptures document
HolySpirit is “GOD: The Father” of Jesus Christ
(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Click Here)

Yet you continue refer to Him as an 'it'? Have you no respect for HIM?
N.W.T. John 16:7 …but if I go my way, I will send [[[HIM]]] unto you.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, I noticed you could not address my actual point. Is it because you have no answer?

Your point of the holy spirit being called “him” no more proves it is a person than it being called God's “finger” or “arm” proves it is his arm or finger.

Why can you not address my actual post?

HI David,

What was your point?

July 31, 2010 at 11:50 pm#207175

david

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 01 2010,08:43)

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,05:40)

Quote (Ed J @ July 31 2010,19:16)

Hi David,

I have shown 'you' where The Scriptures document
HolySpirit is “GOD: The Father” of Jesus Christ
(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Click Here)

Yet you continue refer to Him as an 'it'? Have you no respect for HIM?
N.W.T. John 16:7 …but if I go my way, I will send [[[HIM]]] unto you.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, I noticed you could not address my actual point. Is it because you have no answer?

Your point of the holy spirit being called “him” no more proves it is a person than it being called God's “finger” or “arm” proves it is his arm or finger.

Why can you not address my actual post?

HI David,

What was your point?

My point is that you are blind to certain things, and refuse to address them.

July 31, 2010 at 11:51 pm#207176

david

Participant

Quote

Hello David,

I am curious. What “proof” do you want that shows you that the Holy Spirit exists?

–dbf

None, I never ever said it didn't exist.

August 1, 2010 at 12:30 am#207179

Participant

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,10:50)

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 01 2010,08:43)

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,05:40)

Quote (Ed J @ July 31 2010,19:16)

Hi David,

I have shown 'you' where The Scriptures document
HolySpirit is “GOD: The Father” of Jesus Christ
(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Click Here)

Yet you continue refer to Him as an 'it'? Have you no respect for HIM?
N.W.T. John 16:7 …but if I go my way, I will send [[[HIM]]] unto you.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, I noticed you could not address my actual point. Is it because you have no answer?

Your point of the holy spirit being called “him” no more proves it is a person than it being called God's “finger” or “arm” proves it is his arm or finger.

Why can you not address my actual post?

HI David,

What was your point?

My point is that you are blind to certain things, and refuse to address them.

Hi David,

How do you want me to address this point?

John 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind(as Ed J), ye should have no sin: (Is.42:19)
but now ye(David) say, We(the watchtower community) see; therefore your sin remaineth.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 1, 2010 at 1:44 am#207182

Participant

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,18:51)

Quote

Hello David,

I am curious. What “proof” do you want that shows you that the Holy Spirit exists?

–dbf

None, I never ever said it didn't exist.

Hi David,

You are funny.

What proof do you have that the Holy Spirit exists and is an “it”?

As an “it” it is an inanimate object of someone's device. Who's device is it?

You didn't address the other aspects of HS that I mentioned, why?

The Professor

August 1, 2010 at 1:55 am#207183

Participant

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,18:51)

Quote

Hello David,

I am curious. What “proof” do you want that shows you that the Holy Spirit exists?

–dbf

None, I never ever said it didn't exist.

David,

Is 63:10 But they rebelled And grieved His Holy Spirit;

Mt 1:18 ..she was found to be with child “by” the Holy Spirit

Mt 12:32 but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit

Mt 28:19 …them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit

Mk 13:11 …it is not you who speak, but it is the Holy Spirit.

Lu 2:26 …And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit

Luke 4:1 …Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led around by the Spirit in the wilderness

Lu 12:12 …for the Holy Spirit will teach you in that very hour what you ought to say.”

The Professor

August 1, 2010 at 6:48 am#207204

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 01 2010,12:44)

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,18:51)

Quote

Hello David,

I am curious. What “proof” do you want that shows you that the Holy Spirit exists?

–dbf

None, I never ever said it didn't exist.

Hi David,

You are funny.

What proof do you have that the Holy Spirit exists and is an “it”?

As an “it” it is an inanimate object of someone's device. Who's device is it?

You didn't address the other aspects of HS that I mentioned, why?

The Professor

Hi David(TPF),

david sees that others don't answer his questions! (Psalm 18:25-27)
People see others as the weakness in ones own character! (TPF)

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 1, 2010 at 9:44 am#207219

Arnold

Participant

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,10:50)

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 01 2010,08:43)

Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,05:40)

Quote (Ed J @ July 31 2010,19:16)

Hi David,

I have shown 'you' where The Scriptures document
HolySpirit is “GOD: The Father” of Jesus Christ
(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Click Here)

Yet you continue refer to Him as an 'it'? Have you no respect for HIM?
N.W.T. John 16:7 …but if I go my way, I will send [[[HIM]]] unto you.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, I noticed you could not address my actual point. Is it because you have no answer?

Your point of the holy spirit being called “him” no more proves it is a person than it being called God's “finger” or “arm” proves it is his arm or finger.

Why can you not address my actual post?

HI David,

What was your point?

My point is that you are blind to certain things, and refuse to address them.

YOU GOT THAT RIGHT

Georg

August 1, 2010 at 3:18 pm#207228

GeneBalthrop

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 01 2010,03:28)

Jesus said that he was The Way, The Truth and The Life. Is Truth “intellect”?

DBF……….Yes the (PERCEPTION OF THE TRUTH) is indeed INTELLECT. We are given this as the earnest from God,” (IT) both accuses us and defends us”. It is impossible to come to a real understanding of the truth without the (Spirit or (INTELLECT) of the truth being installed into US.

It is impossible to deceive a person who has the Spirit of Truth (IN) HIM. “AND WOULD EVEN DECEIVE THE VERY ELECT (IF) IT WERE POSSIBLE” it is impossible to deceive the elect because of the spirit (intellect) of truth (IN) them.

That is why there are so many different speculations here and the truth is alway being supplanted by these speculators, because they are not being taught by GOD and are not (ABLE) to (PERCEIVE) the truth , so they come up with all these speculation they create. They trust in their own reasonings.

But those who have the Spirit (of Truth) Know the sound of the TRUTH when they hear (IT)>

peace and love to you and yours………………….gene

August 1, 2010 at 4:49 pm#207237

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 02 2010,10:18)

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 01 2010,03:28)

Jesus said that he was The Way, The Truth and The Life. Is Truth “intellect”?

But those who have the Spirit (of Truth) Know the sound of the TRUTH when they hear (IT)>

peace and love to you and yours………………….gene

Hello Gene,

You are right on in so many points.

I accepted Christ when I was 13 and knew I had God's spirit in me. I knew nothing of the Trinity and theology wasn't a big thought at the time.

Even though I had the spirit of truth in me, church teachers, books and other sources of knowledge taught lies that I learned and mimicked. I had some inner questions that didn't seem quite right but the religious jargon of the leaders kept me in line.

I knew Scripture verses and could quote with the best of 'em.

I think I know the truth, you and everyone else here think that they know the truth…and I am sure we all do. But again, like you said the truth gets denied or supplanted by speculations.

Knowledge is one thing,,,,applying it is another.

I believe that what you refer to as “intellect” the Bible uses “understanding” and I try to understand the truth in your statements in those terms….but the idea is basically the same.

The Bible shows many truths about the Holy Spirit. People reject what is written and then they speculate what should have been written….as you said. They cannot even come to a conclusion about their own name and then want to debate God's name….and like you said, “They trust in their own reasonings”.

The word spirit is a noun and feminine and people deny it or want to change it. That is not me saying that the Holy Spirit is a “She”, it's the Hebrew language in which the Bible is written.

We all know that God is not human but every post we get someone objecting to using the terms He, She, person, etc.

Read Gen 1:26 again and read that GOD SAID that He was male and female. Speculate all you want on what it means, IT IS WRITTEN.

We only believe half of it because we beleive in God, the Father. Where's the other half, the feminine side? The Holy Spirit?

The Professor

August 1, 2010 at 5:43 pm#207244

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 02 2010,10:18)

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 01 2010,03:28)

Jesus said that he was The Way, The Truth and The Life. Is Truth “intellect”?

But those who have the Spirit (of Truth) Know the sound of the TRUTH when they hear (IT)>

peace and love to you and yours………………….gene

Greetings,

John 6:63 (a) “It is the Spirit “who” gives life;

August 14, 2010 at 3:24 am#208929

Participant

Quote (kerwin @ July 21 2010,05:58)

Ed J.

You should read and understand those scriptures as none of them state that the Holy Spirit either coupulated with Mary or injected sperm into her in any other way.

What they do state is that Jesus was created in Mary's womb.

The Spirit of God is God's power in action in this case as it was when the world was created.

Your fellow student,

Kerwin

Hi KW,

Gen 2:21 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh at that place.

Does the Scripture tell us which anesthesia God used or HOW He performed the operation or which sutures he used to close up the flesh?

Mat 1:20 But when he had considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife; for the Child who has been conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit.

Luk 1:31 “And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall name Him Jesus.

Luk 1:35 The angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy Child shall be called the Son of God.

CONCEIVE: 1-to become pregnant with 2-Beget

Phl 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,

Phl 2:7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

Since God doesn't explain how he operates as a doctor why would you claim that God didn't inject something into Mary (like Jesus' DNA from his previous existence)? Obviously because she is a “Virgin” God didn't copulate with her. Obvious, too, is that she conceived and the only way a woman conceives is by placing something into her egg….and we now do that thru in-vitro fertilization. We are also learning about cloning.

Back to the thread:

Holy Spirit is feminine by word definition in Hebrew.
YHWH is masculine in the same way. We know that YHWH is the Father so how could anyone in their right mind say that the Holy Spirit, who is feminine can be a “Father”?

People don't like that I point out simple word definitions concerning gender but this thread is a perfect example of WHY we should be concerned with the word origins and gender of the nouns. If you want to be dupped and deceived that is up to you, but the information is there to preclude that from happening.

Therefore, the idea that the HS (feminine) copulated with Mary is absurd. However, She (Power of the Most High) could artificially “inseminate” Mary with the DNA of Jesus so that what would come out of Mary would be 1-the son of God and 2-the son of Man.

God didn't explain How He operated before and God doesn't need to explain How He performed the conception in Mary. We now know that our doctors can inseminate a woman now without having sex and can imitate God's actions with Mary.

The Professor

August 14, 2010 at 5:24 am#208959

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 14 2010,14:24)

Hi KW,

Mat 1:20 But when he had considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife; for the Child who has been conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit.

Luk 1:35 The angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you;
and for that reason the holy Child shall be called the Son of God.

…how could anyone in their right mind say that the Holy Spirit, who is feminine can be a “Father”?

The Professor

Hi David,

Do you believe Jesus was in his right mind?

John 8:19: Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither
know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.
Matt.11:27: All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father;
neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
Matt.25:34: Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father,
inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
Luke 22:29: And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;
Luke 24:49: And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you:
but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.
John 10:17: Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
John 10:29: My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all;
and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
John 10:30: I and my Father are one.

Ed J (Isaiah 27:4-5)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 14, 2010 at 5:59 am#208964

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 14 2010,14:24)

Hi KW,

We know that YHWH is the Father…

The Professor

Hi David,

I gave 'you' a Hebrew “Chart”, that shows there is NO “W” SOUND, have you forgotten this FACT?

YHVH is God's Name translated into English.

GOD’s most sacred Holy Name [יהוה] was given to us directly from the Hebrew language.
Correctly translating Hebrew into other languages can be difficult however.
Some basic linguistical rules need to be considered when translating Hebrew texts.
These include a lack of spacing between words, as a general rule has no written vowels
and the basic direction in which Hebrew is written (opposite: from right to left).
Hebrew word spacing is a modern advent that distinguishes one word from the next,
aiding both translators and multi-linguists alike. Unwritten “implied” vowel sounds
are a concern because, correct pronunciations of Hebrew words are at risk.

GOD’s Name (יהוה) transliterates directly into English as YHVH because the Hebrew alphabet
lacks vowels. Hebrew has No [W] sound, No [J] sound and the symbol ש is pronounced “Sh”.

[יהוה] GOD’s Name [י] Yod [ה] Ha [ו] Vav [ה] Hey is pronounced YÄ-hä-vā & [יה] YÄ

The “Divine”=63 “Deity”=63 of “The Bible”=63 is “YHVH”=63.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 14, 2010 at 6:00 am#208965

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 14 2010,14:24)

Hi KW,

We know that YHWH is the Father…

The Professor

Hi David,

You really know NO SUCH THING!

People of the religion of Judaism spell God G_d and LORD L_rd,
based on not wanting to take God's Name (YHVH) in vain. (Ex.20:7)
So you are inadvertently perpetuating a deception, based on fence laws.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 18, 2010 at 12:08 am#212643