The Holy Spirit, a separate person, essence of God, or force?

[NickHassan]

Hi KW,
SONS OF THE RESURRECTION does not include all men.
Do not fear the book of Revelation.
The Spirit can reveal it

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ April 07 2010,10:19)

Nick Hassan, I do not know of this teaching of the two resurrections.  I am more familiar with the Old Testament that only seems to speak of one.  Is a teaching that comes from the book of Revelations? Are your perhaps misunderstanding scripture that is actually teaching the same thing that Daniel 11:33-35 speaks of? In John 5 the word “judgment” is not for guilt or innocence but rather for sentencing of those found guilty. Since the children of God are found innocent they are not subject to sentencing.  The goats and the sheep will still be separated on that day. I do not know why you would desire to invalidate my words but I did get that impression from what you wrote.  Perhaps I was mistaken and you actually agree with my assessment..

KW

revelation shows the second resurrection as part two of the resurrection plan of God ,first the righteous then the others
and there is 1000 years in between plus a test then destruction.

[GeneBalthrop]

to All………1 Co 13:1……> Though i speak with with the tounge of angles, and have not love, i am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2..> And though i have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though i have all faith, so as to remove mountains, and have not love, i am nothing. 3….> And though i bestow all my goods to feed the poor and though i give my body to be burned, and have not love, it profits me nothing>

Love suffers long, and is kind; love envies not; love wants not for itself, is not easily provoked, thinks (NO) evil; Rejoices not in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; Bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never fails: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail: whether there be tongues: they shall cease: whether there be knowledge; it shall vanish away. Because we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

We need to all think about this>

PEACE AND LOVE TO YOU ALL……………..gene

[terraricca]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 10 2010,15:19)

to All………1 Co 13:1……> Though i speak with with the tounge of angles, and have not love, i am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2..> And though i have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though i have all faith, so as to remove mountains, and have not love, i am nothing. 3….> And though i bestow all my goods to feed the poor and though i give my body to be burned, and have not love, it profits me nothing> Love suffers long, and is kind; love envies not; love wants not for itself, is not easily provoked, thinks (NO) evil; Rejoices not in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; Bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never fails: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail: whether there be tongues: they shall cease: whether there be knowledge; it shall vanish away. Because we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. We need to all think about this> PEACE AND LOVE TO YOU ALL……………..gene

1Co 1:10 I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought.
1Co 1:11 My brothers, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you.
1Co 1:12 What I mean is this: One of you says, “I follow Paul”; another, “I follow Apollos”; another, “I follow Cephas’”; still another, “I follow Christ.”
1Co 1:13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul?

[Lightenup]

Quote (Ed J @ April 04 2010,22:46)

Quote (Lightenup @ April 05 2010,09:00) Nick, Here is your second God…the only one, himself God, who is in closest fellowship with the Father.  And the Father is also God, btw.  Two Gods, one Godhead. John 1:18 Context NET © No one has ever seen God. The only one, 1  himself God, who is in closest fellowship with 2  the Father, has made God 3  known. 4 Hi Lightenup, Why do you play musical manipulated bibles to support the doctrines of the systems of religion's?                    The systems of religion and traditions of men communicate except                     distortions of truth, confusion of mind, and distractions of spirit. The AKJV Bible is the most accurate English Bible we possess. Here is what John 1:18 really says in English… John 1:18 No man hath seen God(יהוה YÄ-hä-vā) at any time; the only begotten Son(יהשוע YÄ-shü-ă),                which is in the bosom of [GOD The Father=117], he(יהשוע) hath declared him(יהוה).                              “YHVH is GOD”=117 PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]! Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17) 117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

This is how John 1:18 is translated in several translations:

John 1:18

NET ©
No one has ever seen God.The only one, 1 himself God, who is in closest fellowship with 2 the Father, has made God 3 known. 4

NIV ©
No-one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father’s side, has made him known.

NASB ©
No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.

NLT ©
No one has ever seen God. But his only Son, who is himself God, is near to the Father’s heart; he has told us about him.

MSG ©
No one has ever seen God, not so much as a glimpse. This one-of-a-kind God-Expression, who exists at the very heart of the Father, has made him plain as day.

BBE ©
No man has seen God at any time; the only Son, who is on the breast of the Father, he has made clear what God is.

NRSV ©
No one has ever seen God. It is God the only Son, who is close to the Father’s heart, who has made him known.

NKJV ©
No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him .

The big question to ask is the original text saying “Son” or “God” after “monogenes?” Here is what the NET Bible translators have to say about it:

Quote

NET © Notes 1 tc The textual problem μονογενὴς θεός (monogenh” qeo”, “the only God”) versus ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός (Jo monogenh” Juio”, “the only son”) is a notoriously difficult one. Only one letter would have differentiated the readings in the mss, since both words would have been contracted as nomina sacra: thus qMs or uMs. Externally, there are several variants, but they can be grouped essentially by whether they read θεός or υἱός. The majority of mss, especially the later ones (A C3 Θ Ψ Ë1,13 Ï lat), read ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός. Ì75 א1 33 pc have ὁ μονογενὴς θεός, while the anarthrous μονογενὴς θεός is found in Ì66 א* B C* L pc. The articular θεός is almost certainly a scribal emendation to the anarthrous θεός, for θεός without the article is a much harder reading. The external evidence thus strongly supports μονογενὴς θεός. Internally, although υἱός fits the immediate context more readily, θεός is much more difficult. As well, θεός also explains the origin of the other reading (υἱός), because it is difficult to see why a scribe who found υἱός in the text he was copying would alter it to θεός. Scribes would naturally change the wording to υἱός however, since μονογενὴς υἱός is a uniquely Johannine christological title (cf. John 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). But θεός as the older and more difficult reading is preferred.]/B] As for translation, it makes the most sense to see the word θεός as in apposition to μονογενής, and the participle ὁ ὤν (Jo wn) as in apposition to θεός, giving in effect three descriptions of Jesus rather than only two. (B. D. Ehrman, The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture, 81, suggests that it is nearly impossible and completely unattested in the NT for an adjective followed immediately by a noun that agrees in gender, number, and case, to be a substantival adjective: “when is an adjective ever used substantivally when it immediately precedes a noun of the same inflection?” This, however, is an overstatement. First, as Ehrman admits, μονογενής in John 1:14 is substantival. And since it is an established usage for the adjective in this context, one might well expect that the author would continue to use the adjective substantivally four verses later. Indeed, μονογενής is already moving toward a crystallized substantival adjective in the NT [cf. Luke 9:38; Heb 11:17]; in patristic Greek, the process continued [cf. PGL 881 s.v. 7]. Second, there are several instances in the NT in which a substantival adjective is followed by a noun with which it has complete concord: cf., e.g., Rom 1:30; Gal 3:9; 1 Tim 1:9; 2 Pet 2:5.) The modern translations which best express this are the NEB (margin) and TEV. Several things should be noted: μονογενής alone, without υἱός, can mean “only son,” “unique son,” “unique one,” etc. (see 1:14). Furthermore, θεός is anarthrous. As such it carries qualitative force much like it does in 1:1c, where θεὸ&#962 ; ἦν ὁ λόγος (qeo” hn Jo logo”) means “the Word was fully God” or “the Word was fully of the essence of deity.” Finally, ὁ ὤν occurs in Rev 1:4, 8; 4:8, 11:17; and 16:5, but even more significantly in the LXX of Exod 3:14. Putting all of this together leads to the translation given in the text. tn Or “The unique one.” For the meaning of μονογενής (monogenh”) see the note on “one and only” in 1:14. 2 tn Grk “in the bosom of” (an idiom for closeness or nearness; cf. L&N 34.18; BDAG 556 s.v. κόλπος 1). 3 tn Grk “him”; the referent (God) has been specified in the translation for clarity. 4 sn Has made God known. In this final verse of the prologue, the climactic and ultimate statement of the earthly career of the Logos, Jesus of Nazareth, is reached. The unique One (John 1:14), the One who has taken on human form and nature by becoming incarnate (became flesh, 1:14), who is himself fully God (the Word was God, 1:1c) and is to be identified with the ever-living One of the Old Testament revelation (Exod 3:14), who is in intimate relationship with the Father, this One and no other has fully revealed what God is like. As Jesus said to Philip in John 14:9, “The one who has seen me has seen the Father.”

I think that “the only begotten God” is the best translation here…the NASB.

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Is that a personal best choice?

[terraricca]

nick

LU says something else in another topic,she is lost in her explanations,this is what happen wen you not fallow the truth of Christ and his father our God.

[Ed J]

Quote (Lightenup @ April 12 2010,09:55)

Quote (Ed J @ April 04 2010,22:46) Quote (Lightenup @ April 05 2010,09:00) Nick, Here is your second God…the only one, himself God, who is in closest fellowship with the Father.  And the Father is also God, btw.  Two Gods, one Godhead. John 1:18 Context NET © No one has ever seen God. The only one, 1  himself God, who is in closest fellowship with 2  the Father, has made God 3  known. 4 Hi Lightenup, Why do you play musical manipulated bibles to support the doctrines of the systems of religion's?                    The systems of religion and traditions of men communicate except                     distortions of truth, confusion of mind, and distractions of spirit. The AKJV Bible is the most accurate English Bible we possess. Here is what John 1:18 really says in English… John 1:18 No man hath seen God(יהוה YÄ-hä-vā) at any time; the only begotten Son(יהשוע YÄ-shü-ă),                which is in the bosom of [GOD The Father=117], he(יהשוע) hath declared him(יהוה).                              “YHVH is GOD”=117 PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]! Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17) 117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org This is how John 1:18 is translated in several translations: John 1:18 NET © No one has ever seen God.The only one, 1  himself God, who is in closest fellowship with 2  the Father, has made God 3  known. 4 NIV © No-one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father’s side, has made him known. NASB © No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him. NLT © No one has ever seen God. But his only Son, who is himself God, is near to the Father’s heart; he has told us about him. MSG © No one has ever seen God, not so much as a glimpse. This one-of-a-kind God-Expression, who exists at the very heart of the Father, has made him plain as day. BBE © No man has seen God at any time; the only Son, who is on the breast of the Father, he has made clear what God is. NRSV © No one has ever seen God. It is God the only Son, who is close to the Father’s heart, who has made him known. NKJV © No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him . The big question to ask is the original text saying “Son” or “God” after “monogenes?”  Here is what the NET Bible translators have to say about it: Quote NET © Notes 1 tc The textual problem μονογενὴς θεός (monogenh” qeo”, “the only God”) versus ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός (Jo monogenh” Juio”, “the only son”) is a notoriously difficult one. Only one letter would have differentiated the readings in the mss, since both words would have been contracted as nomina sacra: thus qMs or uMs. Externally, there are several variants, but they can be grouped essentially by whether they read θεός or υἱός. The majority of mss, especially the later ones (A C3 Θ Ψ Ë1,13 Ï lat), read ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός. Ì75 א1 33 pc have ὁ μονογενὴς θεός, while the anarthrous μονογενὴς θεός is found in Ì66 א* B C* L pc. The articular θεός is almost certainly a scribal emendation to the anarthrous θεός, for θεός without the article is a much harder reading. The external evidence thus strongly supports μονογενὴς θεός. Internally, although υἱός fits the immediate context more readily, θεός is much more difficult. As well, θεός also explains the origin of the other reading (υἱός), because it is difficult to see why a scribe who found υἱός in the text he was copying would alter it to θεός. Scribes would naturally change the wording to υἱός however, since μονογενὴς υἱός is a uniquely Johannine christological title (cf. John 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). But θεός as the older and more difficult reading is preferred.]/B] As for translation, it makes the most sense to see the word θεός as in apposition to μονογενής, and the participle ὁ ὤν (Jo wn) as in apposition to θεός, giving in effect three descriptions of Jesus rather than only two. (B. D. Ehrman, The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture, 81, suggests that it is nearly impossible and completely unattested in the NT for an adjective followed immediately by a noun that agrees in gender, number, and case, to be a substantival adjective: “when is an adjective ever used substantivally when it immediately precedes a noun of the same inflection?” This, however, is an overstatement. First, as Ehrman admits, μονογενής in John 1:14 is substantival. And since it is an established usage for the adjective in this context, one might well expect that the author would continue to use the adjective substantivally four verses later. Indeed, μονογενής is already moving toward a crystallized substantival adjective in the NT [cf. Luke 9:38; Heb 11:17]; in patristic Greek, the process continued [cf. PGL 881 s.v. 7]. Second, there are several instances in the NT in which a substantival adjective is followed by a noun with which it has complete concord: cf., e.g., Rom 1:30; Gal 3:9; 1 Tim 1:9; 2 Pet 2:5.) The modern translations which best express this are the NEB (margin) and TEV. Several things should be noted: μονογενής alone, without υἱός, can mean “only son,” “unique son,” “unique one,” etc. (see 1:14). Furthermore, θεός is anarthrous. As such it carries qualitative force much like it does in 1:1c, where θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος (qeo” hn Jo logo”) means “the Word was fully God” or “the Word was fully of the essence of deity.” Finally, ὁ ὤν occurs in Rev 1:4, 8; 4:8, 11:17; and 16:5, but even more significantly in the LXX of Exod 3:14. Putting all of this together leads to the translation given in the text. tn Or “The unique one.” For the meaning of μονογενής (monogenh”) see the note on “one and only” in 1:14. 2 tn Grk “in the bosom of” (an idiom for closeness or nearness; cf. L&N 34.18; BDAG 556 s.v. κόλπος 1). 3 tn Grk “him”; the referent (God) has been specified in the translation for clarity. 4 sn Has made God known. In this final verse of the prologue, the climactic and ultimate statement of the earthly career of the Logos, Jesus of Nazareth, is reached. The unique One (John 1:14), the One who has taken on human form and nature by becoming incarnate (became flesh, 1:14), who is himself fully God (the Word was God, 1:1c) and is to be identified with the ever-living One of the Old Testament revelation (Exod 3:14), who is in intimate relationship with the Father, this One and no other has fully revealed what God is like. As Jesus said to Philip in John 14:9, “The one who has seen me has seen the Father.” I think that “the only begotten God” is the best translation here…the NASB.

Hi Lightenup,

Do you pick and choose out of all those versions the one
that best suites your views in each and ever different case?
Wouldn't it be best to go “BACK” to the “original text” instead?

Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ April 07 2010,10:19)

Nick Hassan, I do not know of this teaching of the two resurrections.  I am more familiar with the Old Testament that only seems to speak of one.  Is a teaching that comes from the book of Revelations? Are your perhaps misunderstanding scripture that is actually teaching the same thing that Daniel 11:33-35 speaks of? In John 5 the word “judgment” is not for guilt or innocence but rather for sentencing of those found guilty. Since the children of God are found innocent they are not subject to sentencing.  The goats and the sheep will still be separated on that day. I do not know why you would desire to invalidate my words but I did get that impression from what you wrote.  Perhaps I was mistaken and you actually agree with my assessment..

KW

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea

Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works

[kerwin]

Terraricca,

Thank You!

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ April 12 2010,15:43)

Quote (Lightenup @ April 12 2010,09:55) Quote (Ed J @ April 04 2010,22:46) Quote (Lightenup @ April 05 2010,09:00) Nick, Here is your second God…the only one, himself God, who is in closest fellowship with the Father.  And the Father is also God, btw.  Two Gods, one Godhead. John 1:18 Context NET © No one has ever seen God. The only one, 1  himself God, who is in closest fellowship with 2  the Father, has made God 3  known. 4 Hi Lightenup, Why do you play musical manipulated bibles to support the doctrines of the systems of religion's?                    The systems of religion and traditions of men communicate except                     distortions of truth, confusion of mind, and distractions of spirit. The AKJV Bible is the most accurate English Bible we possess. Here is what John 1:18 really says in English… John 1:18 No man hath seen God(יהוה YÄ-hä-vā) at any time; the only begotten Son(יהשוע YÄ-shü-ă),                which is in the bosom of [GOD The Father=117], he(יהשוע) hath declared him(יהוה).                              “YHVH is GOD”=117 PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]! Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17) 117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org This is how John 1:18 is translated in several translations: John 1:18 NET © No one has ever seen God.The only one, 1  himself God, who is in closest fellowship with 2  the Father, has made God 3  known. 4 NIV © No-one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father’s side, has made him known. NASB © No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him. NLT © No one has ever seen God. But his only Son, who is himself God, is near to the Father’s heart; he has told us about him. MSG © No one has ever seen God, not so much as a glimpse. This one-of-a-kind God-Expression, who exists at the very heart of the Father, has made him plain as day. BBE © No man has seen God at any time; the only Son, who is on the breast of the Father, he has made clear what God is. NRSV © No one has ever seen God. It is God the only Son, who is close to the Father’s heart, who has made him known. NKJV © No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him . The big question to ask is the original text saying “Son” or “God” after “monogenes?”  Here is what the NET Bible translators have to say about it: Quote NET © Notes 1 tc The textual problem μονογενὴς θεός (monogenh” qeo”, “the only God”) versus ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός (Jo monogenh” Juio”, “the only son”) is a notoriously difficult one. Only one letter would have differentiated the readings in the mss, since both words would have been contracted as nomina sacra: thus qMs or uMs. Externally, there are several variants, but they can be grouped essentially by whether they read θεός or υἱός. The majority of mss, especially the later ones (A C3 Θ Ψ Ë1,13 Ï lat), read ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός. Ì75 א1 33 pc have ὁ μονογενὴς θεός, while the anarthrous μονογενὴς θεός is found in Ì66 א* B C* L pc. The articular θεός is almost certainly a scribal emendation to the anarthrous θεός, for θεός without the article is a much harder reading. The external evidence thus strongly supports μονογενὴς θεός. Internally, although υἱός fits the immediate context more readily, θεός is much more difficult. As well, θεός also explains the origin of the other reading (υἱός), because it is difficult to see why a scribe who found υἱός in the text he was copying would alter it to θεός. Scribes would naturally change the wording to υἱός however, since μονογενὴς υἱός is a uniquely Johannine christological title (cf. John 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). But θεός as the older and more difficult reading is preferred.]/B] As for translation, it makes the most sense to see the word θεός as in apposition to μονογενής, and the participle ὁ ὤν (Jo wn) as in apposition to θεός, giving in effect three descriptions of Jesus rather than only two. (B. D. Ehrman, The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture, 81, suggests that it is nearly impossible and completely unattested in the NT for an adjective followed immediately by a noun that agrees in gender, number, and case, to be a substantival adjective: “when is an adjective ever used substantivally when it immediately precedes a noun of the same inflection?” This, however, is an overstatement. First, as Ehrman admits, μονογενής in John 1:14 is substantival. And since it is an established usage for the adjective in this context, one might well expect that the author would continue to use the adjective substantivally four verses later. Indeed, μονογενής is already moving toward a crystallized substantival adjective in the NT [cf. Luke 9:38; Heb 11:17]; in patristic Greek, the process continued [cf. PGL 881 s.v. 7]. Second, there are several instances in the NT in which a substantival adjective is followed by a noun with which it has complete concord: cf., e.g., Rom 1:30; Gal 3:9; 1 Tim 1:9; 2 Pet 2:5.) The modern tran slations which best express this are the NEB (margin) and TEV. Several things should be noted: μονογενής alone, without υἱός, can mean “only son,” “unique son,” “unique one,” etc. (see 1:14). Furthermore, θεός is anarthrous. As such it carries qualitative force much like it does in 1:1c, where θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος (qeo” hn Jo logo”) means “the Word was fully God” or “the Word was fully of the essence of deity.” Finally, ὁ ὤν occurs in Rev 1:4, 8; 4:8, 11:17; and 16:5, but even more significantly in the LXX of Exod 3:14. Putting all of this together leads to the translation given in the text. tn Or “The unique one.” For the meaning of μονογενής (monogenh”) see the note on “one and only” in 1:14. 2 tn Grk “in the bosom of” (an idiom for closeness or nearness; cf. L&N 34.18; BDAG 556 s.v. κόλπος 1). 3 tn Grk “him”; the referent (God) has been specified in the translation for clarity. 4 sn Has made God known. In this final verse of the prologue, the climactic and ultimate statement of the earthly career of the Logos, Jesus of Nazareth, is reached. The unique One (John 1:14), the One who has taken on human form and nature by becoming incarnate (became flesh, 1:14), who is himself fully God (the Word was God, 1:1c) and is to be identified with the ever-living One of the Old Testament revelation (Exod 3:14), who is in intimate relationship with the Father, this One and no other has fully revealed what God is like. As Jesus said to Philip in John 14:9, “The one who has seen me has seen the Father.” I think that “the only begotten God” is the best translation here…the NASB. Hi Lightenup, Do you pick and choose out of all those versions the one that best suites your views in each and ever different case? Wouldn't it be best to go “BACK” to the “original text” instead? Ed J http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

LightenUp,

When translations differ one to the next it's best to go back to the original texts,
instead of choosing which translators to follow; following man leads to trouble! (Psalm 118:8 / Jer.17:5-6)

Ed J

[NickHassan]

Hi ED,
Is the AKJV the original
or just a translation of the majority texts?

[terraricca]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 10 2010,15:19)

to All………1 Co 13:1……> Though i speak with with the tounge of angles, and have not love, i am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2..> And though i have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though i have all faith, so as to remove mountains, and have not love, i am nothing. 3….> And though i bestow all my goods to feed the poor and though i give my body to be burned, and have not love, it profits me nothing> Love suffers long, and is kind; love envies not; love wants not for itself, is not easily provoked, thinks (NO) evil; Rejoices not in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; Bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never fails: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail: whether there be tongues: they shall cease: whether there be knowledge; it shall vanish away. Because we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. We need to all think about this> PEACE AND LOVE TO YOU ALL……………..gene

gene

and this what does it means;Heb 12:14 Make every effort to live in peace with all men and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.

[NickHassan]

Hi T,
The Word of Godis Holy.
The Spirit of Christ is Holy.
The servants or God are holy
The church of the world is unholy.

You cannot draw together what must pull apart.

[terraricca]

nick

true,

[GeneBalthrop]

Terraricca………..Two works, One is YOUR Works driven by YOUR (OWN) WILL, the other is GOD'S Work driven BY His SPIRIT and WILL. One is focused in SELF, the other is Focused IN GOD.

UNLESS THE BUILDER IS THE LORD, THE WEARY BUILDERS BUILD IN VAIN , UNLESS THE LORD IS THE CITIES SHIELD THE GUARDS MAINTAIN A USELESS WATCH , IN VAIN THEY KEEP THEIR VIGILANCES.

No self boasting is allowed in the kingdom of GOD. IMO

peace and love to you and yours…………………………gene

[terraricca]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 17 2010,04:17)

Terraricca………..Two works, One is YOUR Works driven by YOUR (OWN) WILL, the other is GOD'S Work driven BY His SPIRIT and WILL. One is focused in SELF, the other is Focused IN  GOD. UNLESS THE BUILDER IS THE LORD, THE WEARY BUILDERS BUILD IN VAIN , UNLESS THE LORD IS THE CITIES SHIELD THE GUARDS MAINTAIN A USELESS WATCH , IN VAIN THEY KEEP THEIR VIGILANCES. No self boasting is allowed in the kingdom of GOD. IMO peace and love to you and yours…………………………gene

gene
God as not predetermined who will not make the right decision to fallow God way.

the grace of God is a offer we have to accept, if not you will have to be considered to have refused it;

Jn 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.
Jn 3:20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed.
Jn 3:21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.”

look who comes in the light,are you in the light??

[GeneBalthrop]

Terraricca………Show scripture where it say the grace of GOD is An (OFFER) and if we don't accept it we are considered to have refused it. I have yet to see that written anywhere in any scripture. DO you just write your own bible when ever you decide to make it say what in fact it does not say. Jesus plainly said, “no man (CAN) come unto him (UNLESS) the FATHER DRAW HIM”. You self Salvation Ideology by your so-called “FREE WILL” teachings is not Scriptural. Grace is GIVEN it is NOT and OFFER. Because GOD has concluded (ALL) under SIN, (that includes YOU to), that He may have mercy on (ALL). Thinking that when we Say By the GRACE of GOD We are SAVED, means a license to SIN is a FLAT LIE. It is BY GRACE we ARE CHANGED BY GOD into HIS Childern and Given HIS Spirit which enables us to have a Heart like HIS.

Now read what you have quoted correctly……..Jn 3:19……Shows this verdict (man)(mankind) loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were Evil. DO you think that does not include you also?

Jn 3:20 …> This is still true today because (ALL) who do evil Hate the Light because the light will expose them.

Jn 3:21…..> But whoever lives (BY) the truth comes into the light NOT the SELF WORKS as you promote. But BY GOD Who WORKS in THOSE HE HAS CALLED and CHOSEN. Man gets no Glory for What GOD DOES. Lest You BOAST.

So your question should be to yourself (ARE YOU IN THE LIGHT) Don't worry about Me GOD has Provided FOR Me all MY LIFE and I Still TRUST HIM to continue to. My Faith is bases on (EVIDENCE) He has given me in my life , You should not set about Judging others here nor their Faith, “HAVE YOU FAITH?, HAVE IT UNTO YOURSELF”. IMO

God bless………………….gene

[terraricca]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 19 2010,04:19)

Terraricca………Show scripture where it say the grace of GOD is An (OFFER) and if we don't accept it  we are considered to have refused it. I have yet to see that written anywhere in any scripture. DO you just write your own bible when ever you decide to make it say what in fact it does not say. Jesus plainly said, “no man (CAN) come unto him (UNLESS) the FATHER DRAW HIM”. You self Salvation Ideology by your so-called “FREE WILL” teachings is not Scriptural.  Grace is GIVEN it is NOT and OFFER. Because GOD has concluded (ALL) under SIN, (that includes YOU to), that He may have mercy on (ALL).  Thinking that when we Say By the GRACE of GOD We are SAVED, means a license to SIN is a FLAT LIE. It is BY GRACE we ARE CHANGED BY GOD into HIS Childern and Given HIS Spirit which enables us to have a Heart like HIS.   Now read what you have quoted correctly……..Jn 3:19……Shows this verdict (man)(mankind) loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were Evil. DO you think that does not include you also? Jn 3:20 …> This is still true today because (ALL) who do evil Hate the Light because the light will expose them. Jn 3:21…..> But whoever lives (BY) the truth comes into the light NOT the SELF WORKS as you promote. But BY GOD Who WORKS in THOSE HE HAS CALLED and CHOSEN. Man gets no Glory for What GOD DOES.  Lest You BOAST. So your question should be to yourself (ARE YOU IN THE LIGHT) Don't worry about Me GOD has Provided FOR Me all MY LIFE and I Still TRUST HIM to continue to. My Faith is bases on (EVIDENCE) He has given me in my life , You should not set about Judging others here nor their Faith, “HAVE YOU FAITH?, HAVE IT UNTO YOURSELF”. IMO God bless………………….gene

gene

is this by a chemical reaction?
It is BY GRACE we ARE CHANGED BY GOD into HIS Childern and Given HIS Spirit which enables us to have a Heart like HIS.

if not could you explain clearly what you mean??

[NickHassan]

Hi,
The secret of eternal life is the gift of the living Spirit.
Without the Spirit, man dies and rises to face the judgement seat of Christ.
Those in Christ cannot not face judgement as God cannot condemn His righteous Son
When the Spirit rules in a man reborn of water into Christ he has passed already from death to life.

Those who do not have the Spirit of Christ are none of his[rom8]
Seek the Spirit.

[Author]

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