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TC, saying there is a spirit “in” a man does not have anything to do with the man who is a living soul being a spirit being. AND AS FAR AS MY SAYING THAT PAGAN CULTURES BELIEVED IN PEOPLE STILL ALIVE AFTER DEATH, EVEN THE PAGAN EGYPTIANS BELIEVED THAT, that is common knowledge , Plato believed that and even Aristotle was so convienced of t h e after life he excepted poison and died in front of his friends. All pagan cultures believe in after life in another form, even Mexican cultures believe in that, they celebrate the day of the dead still living every year.
Your using scripture that say “who knows” if the spirit of man goes up and the spirit of animals go down? Was a question and no where say that a SOUL IS A SPIRIT OF ANYKIND. BUT did say after he was resurected that, “A SPIRIT HAS NOT FLESH AND BONE AS I HAS.” There he denied he was a spirit of anykind. Do you denied his words? Seems you care less what he says. His other descriptions of a spirit also denies they are living souls of anykind.
Spirit effect the minds of living souls but are not living souls. Therefore it say , Rom 12:1… And be not conformed to this world: but be you transformed by the “RENEWING” of your mind (a physical component of a human BRAIN) , that you may prove what is that good and exceptable, and perfect will of God. Spirit can effect our thinking but the are not living souls at all. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours. ……gene
Hi TC,
Name calling is judgemental and not polite.
It would be more gracious to show things from scripture.
Hi TC
You said: Christ came to destroy the works of the devil. Yes He did, that will be completed at the Lake of Fire. Then death will be no more. Then there’s just life. As we all know that for those that make the first resurrection, we will be changed from mortal to immortal there’s only life for the firstfruits. Now there some that believe we go to heaven at the resurrection or at death, I believe we go where Jesus is going earth to rule with Him as priest and Kings at the resurrection. No Rapture, no heaven. At the end of the ages there’s a New Heaven and Earth. During the time, before the first resurrection and during the 1000 year reign, for those who are still mortal they still have the human nature. Only the firstfruits have the divine nature (fully). Those who are born again have the Divine a Human Nature. The born again people still struggle with sin, those before the first Resurrection and those during the 1000 year reign, because of the human nature. We just don’t have it all. We have a legal standing in Christ, when God see us He see no sin, past, present and future. Thank God for the finish work of our Lord, on the Cross. Took upon His back the sins of the whole world, that’s alot of sins,how He suffered. And we all have to go the same way Christ did, I call it the way of the Cross and we suffer, we die to self, overcoming the Human nature. It’s not so much what we say, but what we do, doing the right thing, and we don’t do and say to work for Salvation, we have Salvation it’s a free gift. Now Salvation as some think, is just saying some pretty prayer, of your on will, but it’s God that wills, He choose us we don’t choose Him. It’s only when He bring you to the place of repentance. It’s more then just a pretty prayer, you know what I’m talking about, repeat after me type prayer for hundreds of people. Some of them are not save, they just said it. Let me show you some scripturers.
“If Christ be not raised, your[Christian] faith is vain; and you are in your sins, then they also which are fallen asleep [those dead] in Christ are perished.”1 Corinthians 15:17-18 the whole man is dead.
the soul that sins, it shall die”(Ezekiel 18:4, 20). “Fear him [God] which is able to destroy both soul and body in hades (Matthew 10:28)
“no man has ascended up to heaven”(John 3:13) not even part of man.
“Behold, he puts no trust in his saints[angels], yea, the heavens are not clean in his sight. How much more abominable and filthy is man, which drinks iniquity like water.”Job 15:15-16, see also Job 4:18 and 25:5 do you see the human nature here?
The children of this world marry, and are given in marriage: but they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: (neither can they die any more:) for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.”Luke 20:34-36 at the resurrection when we are changed to immortal will have life forever (ages of ages) more. The firstfruits.
“Who [God] will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; who gave himself a ransom for all [for all humanity], to be testified in due time[Greek: “in its own time periods].”1 Timothy 2:4-6 Christ paid the price for us. Nothing we did.
“Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.”(Hebrews 12:14). This necessity of possessing holiness is a recurrent one in the Bible.
All of us have come short of practicing righteousness because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.(Romans 3:20). “But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousness are as filthy rags.”(Isaiah 64:6).
“The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it.”Jeremiah 17:9
This was not a description of the so-called “evil” heart, but of all normal human hearts, including yours and mine.
“And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.”Genesis 6:5 mans heart, the whole man,body, soul and spirit.
“I will not again curse the ground any more for man’s sake[as He did with the Flood], for the imagination of man’s heart IS EVIL from his youth.”Genesis 8:21 man’s heart, the whole man, body, soul and spirit.
Paul called himself“the chiefest of sinners” (and gave his judgment about himself in the present tense, not the past). This was around 56 ad. After Pentecost when Paul said this. Still dealing with human nature.
If you believe what Paul wrote (and I do), our apostle had emotional and spiritual problems,that rendered his own attempts at doing righteously as useless in making him perfect and sinless.
I find then a law[within me], that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. For I delight in the Law of God after the inward man: but I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.”Romans 7:21–23
Paul admited that the principal natural law he found within him was NOT the Law of God, it was the law of sin.
“For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) dwells no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.”Romans 7:18
But that does not end it. Paul also said that he was carnal. Paul said,
“For we know that the Law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. For that which I do I allow not: for what I would[do], that do I not; but what I hate, that do I. If then I do that which I would not[normally want to do], I consent unto the Law that it is good. Now then it is no more I that do it[the wrong], but sin that dwells in me.”Romans 7:14–17
That is right! Paul admitted he was nothing but a carnal minded person. His whole person body,soul and spirit. Not part of it.
“That I may know him [Christ], and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death.”Philippians 3:10
And Peter said:
“But rejoice, inasmuch as you are partakers of Christ’s sufferings; that when his glory shall be revealed, you may also be glad also with exceeding joy.”1 Peter 4:13 partakers of His suffering
Only with our resurrections to spiritual glory do all the factors of the Atonement apply to us and to the rest of creation. Paul summed it up well by saying:
“For the creation was made subject [by God] to vanity, not willingly but (by reason of him who has subjected the same) in hope, that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the liberty of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and travails in pain together until now. And not only they, but ourselves also, who have the firstfruit of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves waiting for the sonship, to wit, the redemption of the body.”Romans 8:20–23
We must die to the whole man, body,soul and spirit.And when we’re dead we’re dead till the resurrection. It’s a struggle for the human nature till then. We won’t change to immortal till Christ comes back. Perfectness awaits us. God bless
Anthony…..Glad you understand no one who has died will be resurected untill JESUS returns, all who have dies are dead, and will remain that way untill the resurection tales place. You have that right.
Peace and love to you and yours ……..gene
Hi T8,
This worldly nonsense called Christmas comes from your false traditional understanding.
An infant is worshipped instead of the God Who created him and would anoint him at the Jordan.
Doesn’t sound right Nick.
It was an angel that delivered that true message. So if infant worship as you seem to be alluding to is the result of believing Jesus was born the Christ, then the angel is the one you need to blame, not me. But here is the bad news for you Nick. The angel is but a messenger for someone else. So you are saying that God created this tradition, whereas I would argue that God didn’t do that, but has more to do with the false doctrine of the Trinity or the false view that Jesus is God.
You need to be wise before shooting off fiery darts because you might be aiming them straight that the Most High God and that is not smart.
Nick
I don’t know if you got these scriptures.
the soul that sins, it shall die”(Ezekiel 18:4, 20).
2 Corinthians 7:1.“Dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and SPIRIT.”
Yes Nick body ,soul and spirit sins.
God bless
Hi Anthony,
You: I don’t know if you got these scriptures.
the soul that sins, it shall die”(Ezekiel 18:4, 20).
2 Corinthians 7:1.“Dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and SPIRIT.”
Yes Nick body ,soul and spirit sins.Me: Very Good Anthony.
https://biblehub.com/2_corinthians/7-1.htmHi Nick,
You: This worldly nonsense called Christmas comes from your false traditional understanding.
An infant is worshipped instead of the God Who created him and would anoint him at the Jordan.Me: Yes, Xmas is based on the worship of Baal. Christ was born in the Autumn, not in the midst of darkness. But that doesn’t mean that Christ was not worshiped, even as a child. You fail to separate the Word in him from the human in him. The Word was fully in Christ at conception, the humanity in him grew in it’s bond with the Word.
Hi All,
American Standard Version
John 1:14 And the Word became (joined) flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.
Col 1:19 (KJV) For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell.
New American Standard Bible
Col 2:9 For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form.Me: The Word or express image of God became fully integrated into the flesh of the child, and the child grew in its bond with the Word.
Christians have the Word in them. The human mind and soul grows in its bond with the spirit of God through the Word in them.
2 Cor 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts
Eph 3:19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.Me: We have the fullness of God in us in the sense that the holy spirit is our only spirit in the end (Eph 4:4).
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Hi Anthony,
You: Only the firstfruits have the divine nature (fully).
Me:
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.Eph 3:14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15 of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
Me: Maybe or maybe not. Rev 20:6 suggest this. “Blessed” could related to being kings and priest. This suggest more holy but not necessarily only holy. Eph 3:14 says that all will have the name of God in the end. You cannot have the name of God without being divine.
1 Cor 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming. 23 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
Me The kingdom of God is delivered up to God at the end, not at the first resurrection.
Hi Anthony,
You: “no man has ascended up to heaven”(John 3:13) not even part of man.
Me: Up unto the time Christ was on earth, no man hath ascended into heaven. But that doesn’t mean after Pentecost no man or any part of him hadn’t.
John 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live
Hi Anthony,
You: “If Christ be not raised, your[Christian] faith is vain; and you are in your sins, then they also which are fallen asleep [those dead] in Christ are perished.”1 Corinthians 15:17-18 the whole man is dead.
Me: Nope:
https://biblehub.com/greek/2837.htm
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
to put to sleep, fall asleep
NASB Translation
asleep (3), dead (1), fallen asleep (7), fell asleep (3), sleep (2), sleeping (2).Me: 2837 can mean sleep or it can mean to die.
Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
Me Let’s look at the word “rest” in verse 11.
https://biblehub.com/greek/373.htm
Strong’s Concordance
anapauó: to give rest, give intermission from labor, by impl. refresh
Original Word: ἀναπαύω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: anapauó
Phonetic Spelling: (an-ap-ow’-o)
Definition: to give rest, give intermission from labor, by implication refresh
Usage: I make to rest, give rest to; mid. and pass: I rest, take my ease.Me: Nothing about death here. So to match the meaning of “sleep” in 1 Cor 15:18 with the word “rest” in Rev 6:11, sleep in 1 Cor 15:18 must mean rest and not death. Otherwise, the scriptures contradict.
TC…..JESUS said that Lazeros was asleep and he was going to awake him, the deciples said that it was good that he was sleeping , but Jesus told them he was DEAD. Jesus himself said he was “dead”
Rev 1:18….I am he that lives, and was dead (G3498 ..a corpse; dead (literally or figuratively) ; also as noun :- DEAD.
But you preach he did not actually die? And if he didn’t then you are still in your sins. According to Paul.
The word sleep in scripture does not mean they are actually alive, when they are DEAD, that’s a false teaching. Sleeping applies in the sense of a resurection, the hope of the FAITHFULL. When a person dies he is actually dead m as Jesus said he was and was resurected from death to everlasting life. He was not alive when he died, he was dead just as he said he was.
False teacher belive you are still alive when you die, that is not the truth, scripture say “the dead know nothing” in the day we die our thoughts cease .
Ecc 9:5-6…..For the living know that they shall DIE: but the DEAD know not ANYTHING, neither have they anymore a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. 6…Also their love, and hatred, and envy, is now PARISHED, neither have they anymore, a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.
Peace and love to you and yours. …….gene
Gene,
You: C…..JESUS said that Lazeros was asleep and he was going to awake him, the disciples said that it was good that he was sleeping , but Jesus told them he was DEAD. Jesus himself said he was “dead”
Me: I just showed you the various definitions of G2837. Yes, it this case, Lazarus was dead. Does that mean G2837 was not used for sleep and meant sleep anywhere else?
New American Standard Bible
Acts 12:6 On the very night when Herod was about to bring him forward, Peter was sleeping (G2837) between two soldiers, bound with two chains, and guards in front of the door were watching over the prison.
https://biblehub.com/interlinear/acts/12-6.htmMe: WAS PETER DEAD in Acts 12:6? Neither were those in Rev 6:0-11.
You:
Rev 1:18….I am he that lives, and was dead (G3498 ..a corpse; dead (literally or figuratively) ; also as noun :- DEAD.
Me: ( G3498) is not the same as (G2837).
You: But you preach he did not actually die? And if he didn’t then you are still in your sins. According to Paul.
Me: I do not preach that Christ did not die for our sins. You always TWIST what I say to justify YOUR FALSE understanding. I have always stated that we need to baptized in the holy spirit…many, many, many times. That means dying with Christ and awaking with him.
You: The word sleep in scripture does not mean they are actually alive, when they are DEAD, that’s a false teaching. Sleeping applies in the sense of a resurection, the hope of the FAITHFULL. When a person dies he is actually dead as Jesus said he was and was resurrected from death to everlasting life. He was not alive when he died, he was dead just as he said he was.
False teacher believe you are still alive when you die, that is not the truth, scripture say “the dead know nothing” in the day we die our thoughts cease.
Me: False teachers do not understand that you have to look at the context of the Chapter together with the context of the topic to understand. I have just shown you in Acts 12:6 where (G2837) actually means sleeping.
You:
Ecc 9:5-6…..For the living know that they shall DIE: but the DEAD know not ANYTHING, neither have they anymore a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. 6…Also their love, and hatred, and envy, is now PARISHED, neither have they anymore, a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.Me: This is true for those saints who have died before Pentecost. After Pentecost, they have awaken spiritually. I have shown you this many times. As one of many examples.
John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: 26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
Me: Now will Lazarus never die at this point? No, he will. Thus Christ was talking about the future after Pentecost that you will never die”. Neither was he talking about after the second coming of Christ, because he would die before then. Comprehend, no I don’t think you do.
You are hypnotize by the false religions of this world and are not flexible to change. Most believe how you do. Most believe falsely.
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