The Holy Spirit, a separate person, essence of God, or force?

[Lightenup]

Nick,
So the answer is yes, he had the spirit of himself, Christ.

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Christ means anointed one.
He was Jesus before he was anointed.

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,

The prophets of old had the Spirit of Christ before He was Jesus. In other words, the Spirit of Christ existed before Jesus was born a man.

LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Agreed.

1Peter1
10Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

11Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

12Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

But the Spirit is ONE.
God unites all in Him in the Spirit of Christ

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,

Acts 16:6-8
7 and when they had come to Mysia, they were trying to go into Bithynia, and the Spirit of Jesus did not permit them;
NAS
And here we have what is called the “Spirit of Jesus”. Hmmmm. Would that be the same as the Spirit of Christ? So after Jesus died and rose again, His Spirit was guiding others. It may have returned to God but also guiding others. It doesn't seem to claim that of other men in general.

Well, we have established the spirit of Christ to have existed before Jesus became flesh, and the spirit of Christ being sent into our hearts after Christ died and was resurrected and we also have the spirit of Jesus guiding men after Jesus died and was resurrected. I think that this Spirit of Jesus is the same as the Spirit of Christ. It pre-existed his birth of Mary, was within Him as a man because all men have their own spirit, and exists and actively guides other men after the resurrection.

Does the ordinary man have a spirit that pre-exists his conception and indwell others, then lives within his own body during his earthly life and then dwells within other believers while guiding them? The spirit of Christ did. I think that Jesus's spirit is unique as well as His conception as well as His origins from ancient times.

LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
If there are in fact two spirits how do you read these verses?

Rom8
9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

1 Corinthians 12:8
To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,

1 Corinthians 12:11
All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.

Which one?

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,

I would say that the below passage indicates that oneness can happen amongst the joining of more than one things of the same type in some situations. For instance two flesh can become one flesh and when our spirit unites with God's spirit the two spirits apparently become one spirit. So, I think that the spirit of man can join with the spirit of Christ AND the spirit of God and also be considered one spirit. Now, that three-in-one I would agree with. The greater spirit rules and our body becomes not our own.

1 Cor 6:16-19
16 Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH.” 17 But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. 18 Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?
NASU

The same with evil spirits. From this passage below we see that a man can have more than one spirit within himself, even seven. The strongest spirit overtakes the others and possesses the man and rules him.

Luke 11:24-26

24 ” When the unclean spirit goes out of a man, it passes through waterless places seeking rest, and not finding any, it says, 'I will return to my house from which I came.' 25 “And when it comes, it finds it swept and put in order. 26 “Then it goes and takes along seven other spirits more evil than itself, and they go in and live there; and the last state of that man becomes worse than the first.”
NASU

LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
I do not think two spirits become one.
Both our spirit and the Holy Spirit are mentioned in Rom 8
Men are vessels designed for the Spirit of God [2Tim2]and often men rather harbour other spirits.

[gollamudi]

Hi LU,
Once again you are deviating from the scriptures by interpreting that we received more than one Spirit. See Eph 4:4, 1 Cori 12:12-13 ” there is only one Spirit” not two, three or many. It is called Holy Spirit or Spirit of God or Spirit of Christ or Spirit of sonship, but not that all these names are different different spirits. Not at all. You also told that “Spirit of Christ was pre-existing with flesh” in the O.T. show me where did you find such words?
One thing you have to understand is that the 'Spirit of Christ' is nothing but it is the Spirit of God which anoints God's people as it was happened in O.T as well as on Jesus. That's why Jesus was called the Christ (anointed or messiah) not that he was pre-existing as that spirit in O.T. See Acts 10:38, ” God anointed Jesus of Nazareth..”
I hope you will appreciate this
Adam

[Is 1:18]

LU, many astude points made, kudos. The implication of your conclusion is that Yeshua's Spirit is divine, since the Father's is. Is this what you affirm?

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
You mean the spirit that left him at calvary?
Mt27.50

[Lightenup]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ June 06 2008,04:38)

LU, many astude points made, kudos. The implication of your conclusion is that Yeshua's Spirit is divine, since the Father's is. Is this what you affirm?

Good morning Is 1:18,
Thanks, I love kudos!
Well, is the Spirit of the Son godlike? Hmmm…I would say yes, however I believe that, unlike the Holy Spirit of God, it didn't always exist. I believe that it had a beginning, and that beginning was on day one of creation. Is it equal to the Holy Spirit of God, no. Since I believe that the Holy Spirit of God always existed, no spirit that had a beginning could be its equal. I believe that the Spirit of the Son is under the authority of God Most High, His Father, and resides in the Son of God (and not a seperate person or being) since before anything was in heaven or on earth, day one of creation.

TGIF!
LU

[Lightenup]

Quote (gollamudi @ June 06 2008,04:16)

Hi LU, Once again you are deviating from the scriptures by interpreting that we received more than one Spirit. See Eph 4:4, 1 Cori 12:12-13 ” there is only one Spirit” not two, three or many. It is called Holy Spirit or Spirit of God or Spirit of Christ or Spirit of sonship, but not that all these names are different different spirits. Not at all. You also told that “Spirit of Christ was pre-existing with flesh” in the O.T. show me where did you find such words? One thing you have to understand is that the 'Spirit of Christ' is nothing but it is the Spirit of God which anoints God's people as it was happened in O.T as well as on Jesus. That's why Jesus was called the Christ (anointed or messiah) not that he was pre-existing as that spirit in O.T. See Acts 10:38, ” God anointed Jesus of Nazareth..” I hope you will appreciate this Adam

Hi Golla,
You quote me as saying:

Quote

You also told that “Spirit of Christ was pre-existing with flesh” in the O.T. show me where did you find such words?

Never said that, you deviate from my post! Please be more careful in the future. I did say:

“Well, we have established the spirit of Christ to have existed before Jesus became flesh, and the spirit of Christ being sent into our hearts after Christ died and was resurrected and we also have the spirit of Jesus guiding men after Jesus died and was resurrected. I think that this Spirit of Jesus is the same as the Spirit of Christ. It pre-existed his birth of Mary, was within Him as a man because all men have their own spirit, and exists and actively guides other men after the resurrection.

Does the ordinary man have a spirit that pre-exists his conception and indwells others, then lives within his own body during his earthly life and then dwells within other believers while guiding them? The spirit of Christ did. I think that Jesus's spirit is unique as well as His conception as well as His origins from ancient times.”

I hope that you will appreciate this,
LU

[gollamudi]

Hi LU,
May be I misquoted you in that, but read my post fully there is only one Spirit of God it is also called as the Holy Spirit or Spirit of Christ. You seem to believe that spirit of persons(human) pre-exist before their birth as you are applying it to Jesus that as if his spirit pre-existed. This is the doctrine belongs to Mormonnism wherein they believe all spirits are eternal and they pre-exist in heaven before they take birth as humans. You can't imagine things like that to prove your pre-existence mythology.
take care
Adam

[gsilva72]

John 4:24 says God is a Spirit. The Holy Spirit has to be the Spirit of the Father. If the Holy Spirit is a seperate person than the Father, then you are saying there are 2 spirits. My Bible says there is one. If the Father and the Holy Spirit are seperate persons, then which one is the Father?

[gollamudi]

Hi Silva,
Who told that Holy Spirit is a separate person ?

[gsilva72]

Hi Gollamudi

I understood Lu making mention of more than 1 spirit. Sorry if I misunderstood.  

[Lightenup]

Hi Gollamundi,
Yes there is one Holy Spirit that fills us. However, I think that the Spirit of the Son exists, can be sent into our heart, was within the prophets of old, and guides others. I believe that the Spirit of the Son is different than the Holy Spirit of the Father. I'm just reading the scriptures that I have quoted in the last couple of pages here. I am trying to understand it also. I do not think that the Spirit that searches the deep things of God is the same spirit of the Son. The Father and the Son are two different persons each having a spirit dwelling within them. There are many spirits in the spirit world. These two spirits, can both be within the believer. They possibly join two as one within us, I'm not sure. It is possible since two flesh can join as one. Of course you can't see this, I do not know why I am telling you. But ya never know. I press on.
LU

[seek and you will find]

Quote (Lightenup @ June 07 2008,10:49)

Hi Gollamundi, Yes there is one Holy Spirit that fills us.  However, I think that the Spirit of the Son exists, can be sent into our heart, was within the prophets of old, and guides others.  I believe that the Spirit of the Son is different than the Holy Spirit of the Father.  I'm just reading the scriptures that I have quoted in the last couple of pages here.  I am trying to understand it also.  I do not think that the Spirit that searches the deep things of God is the same spirit of the Son.  The Father and the Son  are two different persons each having a spirit dwelling within them.  There are many spirits in the spirit world.  These two spirits, can both be within the believer.  They possibly join two as one within us, I'm not sure.  It is possible since two flesh can join as one.  Of course you can't see this, I do not know why I am telling you.  But ya never know.  I press on.   LU

Yes, I believe that Jesus was a separate Spirit then the Fathers Holy Spirit. If that would not be the case, Jesus would not be able to say for instance that He does not know when He will come again. Only the Father knows.
So they are separate. But they also are one in their believes tho. I hope that all makes sense. When we look at Ephesians 4:4-6 we can tell that there is the Son Jesus Christ and the Father, who is above all. And the One Spirit is what combines them and makes them one. That also makes us one with the Father and the Son who dwell in us. We are the Temple of God. The Spiritual Temple. That Christ is the Head of.
Peace and Love Irene

[Is 1:18]

Quote (Lightenup @ June 07 2008,01:06)

Well, is the Spirit of the Son godlike?  Hmmm…I would say yes, however I believe that, unlike the Holy Spirit of God, it didn't always exist.  I believe that it had a beginning, and that beginning was on day one of creation.

Thanks for the clarification LU, very informative!

I have looked and find no mention of the beginning of the existence of the Logos. From which scriptures do you derive your conclusions here?

Quote

Is it equal to the Holy Spirit of God, no.  Since I believe that the Holy Spirit of God always existed, no spirit that had a beginning could be its equal. I believe that the Spirit of the Son is under the authority of God Most High, His Father, and resides in the Son of God (and not a seperate person or being) since before anything was in heaven or on earth, day one of creation.

Question: If the Holy Spirit of God is greater than the Spirit of Yeshua why is He seemingly subservient to Him?

John 15:26
26″When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me

John 16:13-14
13″But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. 14″He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.

And why are the phrases “Spirit of God” and “Spirit of Christ” used interchangeably and equated by Paul:

Romans 8:9-11
9However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.
10 if Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
11But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

Questins, questions, questions….

Quote

TGIF!

TGIF?

Blessings
Is

[Author]

Posts