The Holy Spirit, a separate person, essence of God, or force?

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 01 2012,21:15)

Quote (journey42 @ Jan. 01 2012,20:16)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 26 2011,06:00)

Quote (Marlin1 @ Dec. 25 2011,03:19)

After reading through these 110 pages, I kind of felt like Paul walking through the streets of Athens.

I seen signs of the one God, the one & one-half (Jesus small god), the two-ness God, the three-ness God( Trinity) and the seven-ness God.

I have a question for you.

Quote

MAT 28:19 † Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

What is the Name here?

And please don't tell me that father, son or Holy Ghost are names. For we all know that they are not.
I am a father and a son and I have a spirit. Those are just titles to my name.
And also remember it says 'name' here, a single name.
Isa 9:6 may help.

Marlin

Hi Marlin,

The name of the Father is: JEHOVAH (Exodus 6:3)
The name of the Son of God is: “Jesus” (Matt. 1:21)
The name of the HolySpirit is: “The Word” (Rev.19:13)

I hope these verses clarifies that for you now, Marlin.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi Ed J

Jeremiah 33:2 Thus saith the Lord the maker thereof, the Lord that formed it, to establish it: The Lord is his name.

Luke 11:1 And it came to pass, that as he was praying in a certain place, when he ceased, one of his disciples said unto him, Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his disciples.

Luke 11:2[//b] And he said unto them, when ye pray, say Our Father which art in heaven….

Jesus told us exactly how to pray. Why do men try to be more holier than Jesus? Jesus was the most holy, and we follow what he says, not man.

I think it is more endearing and personal to call God “Father” He is our true father, and it shows our closeness to him, and how close he is to us.

Hi Georgie,

Jesus prayer was fulfilled on Pentecost, when God's kingdom came. (Link to Pentecost thread)

Eph.4:4-6 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord,
one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who
is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Hebrews 12:6-9 For whom the LORD loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence:
shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi EDJ.

Why dont you answer my post re, ISIAH CH.11. AND CH.65??
why the silence,or maybe when you come to it.

wakeup.

January 3, 2012 at 2:32 am#270491

Participant

Brother Ed J,

you said,

Quote

The name of the Father is: JEHOVAH (Exodus 6:3)
The name of the Son of God is: “Jesus” (Matt. 1:21)
The name of the HolySpirit is: “The Word” (Rev.19:13)

So is that how you do what Jesus commanded in Mat 28:19.
Do you baptize in the Name of “JEHOVAH Jesus The Word”?

That would be just as good as most of the church world today, for they use the titles Father, Son, & Holy Ghost. Which is no name at all!!

God Bless
Marlin

January 3, 2012 at 5:07 am#270511

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 03 2012,12:23)

Hi EDJ.

Why dont you answer my post re, ISIAH CH.11. AND CH.65??
why the silence,or maybe when you come to it.

wakeup.

Hi Wake-up,

What questions concerning Isaiah Chapters 11 and 65.
Could you please be specific as to what questions
you want me to answer; OK? I didn't see any?
If it is in another thread, please bump it.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 3, 2012 at 5:19 am#270513

Participant

Quote (Marlin1 @ Jan. 03 2012,12:32)

Brother Ed J,

you said,

Quote

The name of the Father is: JEHOVAH (Exodus 6:3)
The name of the Son of God is: “Jesus” (Matt. 1:21)
The name of the HolySpirit is: “The Word” (Rev.19:13)

So is that how you do what Jesus commanded in Mat 28:19.
Do you baptize in the Name of “JEHOVAH Jesus The Word”?

That would be just as good as most of the church world today, for they use the titles Father, Son, & Holy Ghost. Which is no name at all!!

God Bless
Marlin

Hi Marlin,

The name יה-שו-ע
YÄ-shü-ă means “YÄ's Salvation”.
We all must be baptized into “YÄ's Salvation”.

Perhaps you were never taught what the name Jesus means?
Here is a verse that “may” help you to understand this a bit more…

Eph.5:26-27 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle,
or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 3, 2012 at 1:41 pm#270585

Participant

So, Brother Ed, are you saying that you don't believe that water baptism is necessary?

God Bless
Marlin

January 3, 2012 at 3:14 pm#270601

Participant

joHN 16:7. Never the less i tell you the truth; it is expedient for you that I go away: For if I go not away, the COMFORTER WILL NOT COME unto you; but if I depart, I WILL SEND HIM TO YOU. (greater is he that send than he that is send.)
Are you concentrating?.

V13. Howbeit when HE,THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH is come,he will guide you into ALL truth: for HE shall not speak of HIMSELF; BUT WHATEVER HE SHALL HEAR, THAT SHALL HE SPEAK: And he will show you things to come.

Holy spirit =spirit of truth=comforter: will not speak of himself.
What he hears that shall he speak; HEAR FROM WHO?

V14. HE SHALL GLORIFY ME: (JESUS). FOR HE SHALL RECEIVE OF MINE,(JESUS), and shall show it to you.

The holyspirit will glorify jesus.(he is not Jesus; Jesus is greater than him, because greater is he that send than he that is send.

V15. All things that the father hath are mine:Therefore said I,THAT HE SHALL TAKE OF MINE,and shall show it unto you.

JOHN 15:26. But when the comforter is come,WHOM I WILL SEND TO you,from the father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, WHICH PROCEEDETH FROM THE FATHER.HE SHALL TESTIFY OF ME.

Jesus will send the holy spirit( he who send is greater.).

Holy spirit proceedeth from the father.
The word proceedeth from the father; Jesus the word also proceedeth from the father. ALL FROM THE FATHER; and Jesus will send him to whom he will.

wakeup.

January 3, 2012 at 3:35 pm#270603

Participant

Quote (Marlin1 @ Jan. 03 2012,23:41)

So, Brother Ed, are you saying that you don't believe that water baptism is necessary?

God Bless
Marlin

Hi Marlin, No.

The way you have this question worded, you would not
necessarily know what an answer of “No” means; do you?
Here are “three points” that I want you to carefully consider.

Acts 19:3-5 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people,
that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Are you suggesting that these people were “re-water-baptized”?

1 Cor 1:14-16 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name. 16 And I baptized
also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
ARE YOU SURE that all of the Apostle Paul's (Shaool) converts were “water-baptized”?

Mark 1:8 I(John) indeed have baptized you with water: but he(Jesus) shall baptize you with the HolySpirit.
Being baptized with the HolySpirit, do you believe that this is the same as “water-baptism”?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 4, 2012 at 2:19 am#270675

From here. Click on footnote 3 of the first translation to read the rest of the info about this verse.

Participant

Brother Ed,

Let us analyze this;
John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance…… Was this speaking of water baptism? Absolutely……

they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus
Now since they are talking about water baptism then Paul had them be rebaptiszed here.

Now on your second question
ARE YOU SURE that all of the Apostle Paul's (Shaool) converts were “water-baptized”?
You bet, I am positive.

Your third question.
Being baptized with the HolySpirit, do you believe that this is the same as “water-baptism”?
Of course it is not. The baptism of the Holy Ghost, comes after God accepts your faith. It does not come when you believe, like is taught by most churches. If you want scriptures just ask.

Paul had the exact same revelation as Peter had and you know that Peter was given the keys to the kingdom. Jesus told him whatever he bound on earth would be bound in heaven. So Acts 2:38 is the only acceptable way of water baptism in this day.

The proof of that is Paul had the same revelation.

God Bless
Marlin

ARE YOU SURE that all of the Apostle Paul's (Shaool) converts were “water-baptized”?

January 4, 2012 at 3:11 am#270691

mikeboll64

Blocked

Quote (Marlin1 @ Jan. 01 2012,11:29)

Quote

JOHN 2:19 † Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

Who was it that raised Jesus…………….

Acts 2:24
But God raised him from the dead……

Acts 2:32
God has raised this Jesus to life…….

Acts 3:15
You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead……

Acts 3:26
When God raised up his servant……

Acts 4:10
It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead……….

Acts 5:30
The God of our fathers raised Jesus from the dead……..

Acts 10:40
but God raised him from the dead on the third day ………….

Acts 13:30
But God raised him from the dead………….

Acts 13:34
The fact that God raised him from the dead…………..

Acts 13:37
But the one whom God raised from the dead did not see decay.

Romans 4:24
but also for us, to whom God will credit righteousness—for us who believe in him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead.

Romans 6:4
just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father………

Romans 10:9
That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

1 Corinthians 6:14
By his power God raised the Lord from the dead…………

1 Corinthians 15:15
for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead.

Colossians 2:12
having been buried with him in baptism and raised with him through your faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.

1 Peter 1:21
Through him you believe in God, who raised him from the dead and glorified him………….

Galatians 1:1
Paul, an apostle—sent not from men nor by man, but by Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead—

You tell me, Marlin.

January 4, 2012 at 3:20 am#270693

mikeboll64

Blocked

Quote (Marlin1 @ Jan. 01 2012,11:29)

Quote

JOHN 3:13 † And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Here Jesus standing there talking to them, says He is in heaven. According to your logic, it must just be another mistake in the bible.

Joh 3:133tc
Most witnesses, including a few important ones (A

Θ Ψ 050 Ë1,13 Ï latt syc,p,h), have at the end of this verse “the one who is in heaven” (ὁ ὢν ἐν τῷ οὐρανῷ, Jo wn en tw ouranw). A few others have variations on this phrase, such as “who was in heaven” (e syc), or “the one who is from heaven” (0141 pc sys).
The witnesses normally considered the best, along with several others, lack the phrase in its entirety (Ì66,75 א B L T Ws 083 086 33 1241 pc co). On the one hand, if the reading ὁ ὢν ἐν τῷ οὐρανῷ is authentic it may suggest that while Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus he spoke of himself as in heaven even while he was on earth. If that is the case, one could see why variations from this hard saying arose: “who was in heaven,” “the one who is from heaven,” and omission of the clause. At the same time, such a saying could be interpreted (though with difficulty) as part of the narrator’s comments rather than Jesus’ statement to Nicodemus, alleviating the problem.

I'll try to hit your other points soon. OR, we could have a point by point debate about this whole “Jesus is God” subject in an exclusive debate thread if you'd like.

peace,
mike

January 4, 2012 at 3:58 am#270702

jammin

Participant

mike,
prove first to me your doctrine. do not argue with them. i am challenging you mike.
have you finished your aasingments mike??? hahahahhaah
answer john 1:1
phil 2:6
col 1:15
and many more. hahahahaha

January 4, 2012 at 6:34 pm#270757

terraricca

Participant

wakeup

this is were you can start from

January 5, 2012 at 9:50 am#270882

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 04 2012,01:14)

Holy spirit =spirit of truth=comforter: will not speak of himself.
What he hears that shall he speak; HEAR FROM WHO?

V14. HE SHALL GLORIFY ME: (JESUS). FOR HE SHALL RECEIVE OF MINE,(JESUS), and shall show it to you.

The holyspirit will glorify jesus.(he is not Jesus; Jesus is greater than him, because greater is he that send than he that is send.

V15. All things that the father hath are mine:Therefore said I,THAT HE SHALL TAKE OF MINE,and shall show it unto you.

JOHN 15:26. But when the comforter is come,WHOM I WILL SEND TO you,from the father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, WHICH PROCEEDETH FROM THE FATHER.HE SHALL TESTIFY OF ME.

Jesus will send the holy spirit( he who send is greater.).

Holy spirit proceedeth from the father.
The word proceedeth from the father; Jesus the word also proceedeth from the father. ALL FROM THE FATHER; and Jesus will send him to whom he will.

wakeup.

WHY THE SILENCE?

Why is there no one commenting on this post?
Are we hiding from the truth?

wakeup.

January 5, 2012 at 2:50 pm#270910

seekingtruth

Participant

wakeup,
I posted the same observation sometime ago, that if the Holy Spirit wasn't anything more than just the Father's Spirit, then you would have Jesus telling His Father what to do. The Holy Spirit is God’s Spirit, but somehow the nature of the spiritual reality has “it” existing separately, possibly similar to Jesus being an image of the Father in this reality so the Holy Spirit is a manifestation of the Father in the spirit realm.

My opinion – Wm

January 5, 2012 at 3:17 pm#270911

terraricca

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 04 2012,08:14)

Holy spirit =spirit of truth=comforter: will not speak of himself.
What he hears that shall he speak; HEAR FROM WHO?

V14. HE SHALL GLORIFY ME: (JESUS). FOR HE SHALL RECEIVE OF MINE,(JESUS), and shall show it to you.

The holyspirit will glorify jesus.(he is not Jesus; Jesus is greater than him, because greater is he that send than he that is send.

V15. All things that the father hath are mine:Therefore said I,THAT HE SHALL TAKE OF MINE,and shall show it unto you.

JOHN 15:26. But when the comforter is come,WHOM I WILL SEND TO you,from the father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, WHICH PROCEEDETH FROM THE FATHER.HE SHALL TESTIFY OF ME.

Jesus will send the holy spirit( he who send is greater.).

Holy spirit proceedeth from the father.
The word proceedeth from the father; Jesus the word also proceedeth from the father. ALL FROM THE FATHER; and Jesus will send him to whom he will.

wakeup.

wakeup

i will now make a change to your comment;; Once you know that the Holy spirit is the WILL of our heavenly God that is to be the unifying foundation of the new creation things become clearer.
Then the unusual ways of expressing the nature and abilities of the one WILL in Jn14-17 can be learned from.

wen Christ came he had and received the action(power) part of the will of God (holy spirit)he then went on to do the WILL of his father ,that is what he said and did.and told over and over again.

Pierre

January 5, 2012 at 3:39 pm#270913

Participant

Quote (seekingtruth @ Jan. 06 2012,00:50)

My opinion – Wm

Seekingtruth;

So what we have learned from those scriptures is
That all is from God; The word comes from God, and the spirit of truth,is in every word that God speaks.Jesus is the word,and in him is the truth.

THis is the reason that we can not blaspheme the spirit of truth. If we have been given the truth and still blaspheme,there is no forgiveness.

bless you.

wakeup.

January 5, 2012 at 3:49 pm#270915

Participant

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 06 2012,01:17)

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 04 2012,08:14)

Holy spirit =spirit of truth=comforter: will not speak of himself.
What he hears that shall he speak; HEAR FROM WHO?

V14. HE SHALL GLORIFY ME: (JESUS). FOR HE SHALL RECEIVE OF MINE,(JESUS), and shall show it to you.

The holyspirit will glorify jesus.(he is not Jesus; Jesus is greater than him, because greater is he that send than he that is send.

V15. All things that the father hath are mine:Therefore said I,THAT HE SHALL TAKE OF MINE,and shall show it unto you.

JOHN 15:26. But when the comforter is come,WHOM I WILL SEND TO you,from the father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, WHICH PROCEEDETH FROM THE FATHER.HE SHALL TESTIFY OF ME.

Jesus will send the holy spirit( he who send is greater.).

Holy spirit proceedeth from the father.
The word proceedeth from the father; Jesus the word also proceedeth from the father. ALL FROM THE FATHER; and Jesus will send him to whom he will.

wakeup.

wakeup

wen Christ came he had and received the action(power) part of the will of God (holy spirit)he then went on to do the WILL of his father ,that is what he said and did.and told over and over again.

Pierre

Yes Pierre:

Jesus is the word of God and in the word is truth(the spirit of truth) The spirit of truth will always glorify the word of God.

The word comes from God,and in his word is truth.

The word of the prince of this world is lies,cause he is the father of lies.This world is based on the word of satan(lies)

God bless you.

wakeup.

January 6, 2012 at 2:46 am#270971

mikeboll64

Blocked

Quote (Marlin1 @ Jan. 01 2012,11:29)

Quote

COL 2:9 † For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Exactly what He did, God came to earth and dwelt in Jesus

Is that what the scriptures truly teach, Marlin? Or do they teach that God so loved the world that He GAVE His only begotten SON?

It seems to me that scriptures teach God sent His Son to earth, not that God Himself came to earth. Show me where scripture says God Almighty Himself came to earth.

New International Version (©1984)
For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form,

You won't find many newer translations that have the word “Godhead”. There never was any reason to translate
“theotes” as “Godhead” in the first place. There is no “Godhead” mentioned anywhere in scripture. There is a God, HIS Son, and HIS Holy Spirit – not a “Godhead”. (You'll notice that even the KJV, which used to translate as “Godhead”, has come to their senses in the 2000 version quoted above.)

Quote (Marlin1 @ Jan. 01 2012,11:29)

Quote

JOHN 5:19 † Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

It was Jesus, the man(Flesh), only repeating what He had seen already done, by God.

Hmmmm………….. Jesus was repeating what he saw “GOD” do? And yet he was this God whose actions he saw and repeated? Does that really make sense to you, Marlin?

peace,
mike

January 6, 2012 at 5:01 am#270986

Participant

Brother Mike,

you said,It seems to me that scriptures teach God sent His Son to earth, not that God Himself came to earth. Show me where scripture says God Almighty Himself came to earth.

Quote

MAT 1:23 † Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Not another God, But the one and only God.

Quote

ISAIAH 9:6 † For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Here He is the all of it, the Father, Son, & Holy Ghost.

Jesus was the God/Man.
He was a man going along there, crying with those that were crying, grieving with those who grieved. He was a Man. But when He straightened up, and said, 'Lazarus, come forth, He was more then a man. It was God in the man, Jesus.

When He was out there in the sea tired and SLEEPING, when they woke Him, it was NOT a tired man that SPOKE to the wind and said PEACE be still and the wind and sea obeyed.
That was more then a man, that was God in the man.

you said,Hmmmm………….. Jesus was repeating what he saw “GOD” do? And yet he was this God whose actions he saw and repeated? Does that really make sense to you, Marlin?
I totally believe He only did what He saw by vision. Jesus, the son of man, a prophet. A true prophet always waits for God to show what to do.

One day Jesus walked into a place where many people were sick, He walked up to one person there and pronounced him healed and then He walked out. He only did what was showed to Him to do.
He was the sinless man that God chose to use to reconcile all that belong to Him in the world to Himself.

God Bless
Marlin

January 7, 2012 at 6:42 am#271083