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Nick……..Show me where God deals with the Heart without the mind? I have never seen that in scripture please point it out to us. I believe if you remove the mind you also remove the heart, if you change the mind you change the heart. You seem to think they are different from each other. You also say intellect is of the (WEAK) Mind where is that at in scripture?
Hi GB,
Again you misunderstand.
The point I make is that the heart is not the mind.
You are obsessed with the mind but it is not the heart and generally an obstruction.
Intellect is not mentioned in scripture so it is odd that you give this aspect of the mind so much attentionIn a number of cases in the Bible where the term “heart” occurs, it evidently focuses attention on the thinking faculties, but not in a sense that would isolate such faculties from the rest of what makes up the inner person. Moses urged the Israelites, “You must call back to your heart [“must recall to your mind,” ftn] that Jehovah is the true God.” And later he told them, “Jehovah has not given you a heart [“mind,” ftn] to know.” (De 4:39; 29:4) Showing that at times the heart, as referred to in both the Hebrew Scriptures and the Christian Greek Scriptures, includes the intellect are instances where it is associated with “thinking” (Mt 9:4), “reasoning” (Mr 2:6), “understanding” (1Ki 3:12; Mr 6:52), and “knowledge” (Pr 15:14).
However, in the Scriptures the figurative heart is not confined to being the seat of affection and motivation, nor is it limited to the intellect. “Among the Semites . . . all that was peculiar to man, in the category of feelings as well as intellect and will, was attributed to the heart.” It is “the sum total of the interior man as opposed to the flesh, which is the exterior and tangible man.”—The Metaphorical Use of the Names of Parts of the Body in Hebrew and in Akkadian, by E. Dhorme, Paris, 1963, pp. 113, 114, 128 (in French).
The condition of our figurative heart is reflected in our disposition, our attitude, whether proud or humble. (Pr 16:5; Mt 11:29) Our feelings and emotions are also part of that inner man. These include love (De 6:5; 1Pe 1:22), joy (De 28:47; Joh 16:22), pain and sorrow (Ne 2:2; Ro 9:2), hate (Le 19:17). Thus the heart can be “anxious” (Isa 35:4), “pierced” by affliction (Ps 109:22), ‘melted’ by fear of distresses (De 20:8).
In the Christian Greek Scriptures, when the mind is mentioned along with the heart, “mind” refers to the intellect while “heart” refers to the emotions, desires, and feelings of the inner person. For example, Jesus said: “You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind.” (Mt 22:37)He thus showed that a person’s desires, feelings, and emotions must express his love for God, but he must also express that love by the way he uses his mental faculties, as by taking in knowledge of God and Christ.—Joh 17:3.
David ……..I have heard it also said we have a conscious mind and a subconscious mind and some say the conscious mind is the present state we are in, while the subconscious mind is the desires state one wants to be in, It doesn't matter you simple can not have a heart without a mind , they make up (ONE SOUL). It would be like taking your Hand off your arm, the arm would not be complete because the arm includes the Hand. The arm is not complete without the Hand. Neither is the mind complete without the heart. IMO
peace……….gene
Nick……So thats why it says who knows the MIND OF MAN except the SPIRIT of the MAN and WHO knows the MIND of GOD EXCEPT THE SPIRIT OF GOD Maybe you mind is feeble Nick, but we Have the MIND OF CHRIST and that MIND IS NOT FEEBLE.
GB,
If you had the mind of Christ would you not speak his words rather than those of men like Isaac Newton?Nick…….If you had the mind of Christ would you not (UNDERSTAND) what he meant by what he said, not just parrot his words without understanding as you seem to do. I think a man who studied the Bible for 72 years of His life and was considered a brilliant person by even Einstein is definitely worth considering what he thinks about bible subjects. And i do not put Newton above Jesus Christ in fact i find His words agreeing with Jesus, its your word i find that do not agree with Christ, not Newtons.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 05 2008,18:40) GB,
If you had the mind of Christ would you not speak his words rather than those of men like Isaac Newton?
Nick What I do not understand that you can't agree with a man, that seems to understand the scriptures pretty good.
If my understanding is of God would you not agree with me?
You know we all receive God's Holy Spirit in measures. Some more then others. So if I can learn from another Brother and
if it is according to Scripture, you feel it is not wise to do so?Peace and Love Irene
GB,
We do know that Jesus and the prophets and apostles were speaking the words of God.
Their teachings are God's teachings and God did mighty things through them.So if Isaac Newton was also doing the same his words would reflect theirs because the Spirit of God does not speak on his own initiative but reminds us of the teachings of Jesus. Likewise his life would manifest the healing and other miracles of God's power. There is no indication he was rteborn from above to be a brother. He know he did have a nervous breakdown and no record exists of any godly supernatural gifts manifested through him.
We should not rate his ideas about God above those that are given through the Spirit lest we be found to be opposing the Spirit of God.
Nick……..I have read what he said on many subject and i don't find any contradictions of Jesus or the Father in them , He was a strong appoint of the trinity which you are also, He wrote about the nature of GOD showing How the word God can be applied to others then The Father himself. Your problem is you really do not understand any thing about His writings on religion, if you did you would not say they disagree with what Jesus said. This is what i find wrong on your part you condemn a person that you know hardly nothing about. You need to research more before you make judgement calls like you do. WE can all learn from each other as Irene brought out , we are told to grow in grace and knowledge, which shows we don't have it all yet. I never stop listening for things that can add to my understanding of GOD's word. If someone brings out something i never realized before that makes good sense, it brings me Joy that i have learned something new.
Nick.. when have i rated Newtons ideas above GOD, that just another of your assumptions, i never said that nor have i ever read where Newton said that nor have i ever saw anyone post that said that, It's your own imagination that saying that no one else is saying it. You really need to quite inferring things people are not saying, I believe you will someday have to give account for twisting up what people are saying, Its not right to do that Nick.
GB,
If you read his views on Satan you will see they changed and only later did he decide that satan did not exist.
Shifting sands are not much use as foundations.What is plain is that he does not rate alongside the proven men of God in scripture who were led by the Spirit of God and you should acknowledge this.
Nick…..in your ignorance you forget we all (GROW) in GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE, why do you think Newton was as brilliant as he was, do you think He instantly understood the things He came to understand, in fact did you know as a child what you know now (NO) you had to learn. Who are you to Judge another mans servant, have you become GOD and are able to see the heart of another. You might be the one on shifting sands Nick.
Your STATEMENTS and JUDGMENTS about others only shows your ignorance, and causes me to doubt YOUR conversion if you want to know the truth.
GB,
All men do not come to a knowledge of the truth and respond to that saving grace offered in Christ Jesus. There are various theories offered in the occult sites as to the source of Newton's knowledge so to assume it was of God is unwise. Worldly knowledge is not recorded among the fruits of the Spirit of God.Nick……to assume the occult sited know anything about Newton's true character is pure foolishness. Why would you even go to those site in the first place, is it in your rush to degrade a fellow Christian, so you can appear right the reason you do that. Wisdom is wisdom in this world or the world to come it makes no difference, Why do we continue to debate these foolish things . Its very frustrating Nick, lets stick to the subjects and leave personal character assassination out of it , What i have read on NEWTON”S writings about the trinity, the nature of GOD, the devil and demons, the prophetic symbolization are all good information. Is he my GOD or LORD (NO) so quite trying to make it out that way. IMO
peace………….gene
Everyone says they have the “Holy Spirit” and that this Spirit leads them…….
Everyone is going in different directions……
I'm sorry but simple observation tells me that there is no Spirit leading here, it is only personal opinion driven by a good ability to debate what you've become convinced of.
Can anyone show me otherwise? Please……
Mandy
Not3in1……..Mandy even the disciples disagreed with each other about things, and it says no man has all the truth and we are to grow in grace and knowledge, which means we don't have it all. We look through a dark Glass now, but then we shall see clearly. I have learned from things that have been brought up here at time, and i am sure you have also. But i see your point it does seem at time that we are going no where here i feel that way also at times, but we may not realize how what we say at time may help a brother and sister grow and give them encouragement and strengthen their Faith. I believe that most here have the spirit or they probably would not even be here, because they would care less about what we talk about here. If you are getting over burdened with it all, just rest for a while.
Love and peace to you and yours Mandy…………..gene
Quote and it says no man has all the truth
I'm just wondering which scripture this is Gene.Quote Everyone says they have the “Holy Spirit” and that this Spirit leads them……. Everyone is going in different directions……
I'm sorry but simple observation tells me that there is no Spirit leading here, it is only personal opinion driven by a good ability to debate what you've become convinced of.
Can anyone show me otherwise? Please……
–mandy
Look! How good and how pleasant it is for brothers to dwell together in unity!–Psalm 133:1
There is no unity here. True. Note these words of Jesus, while speaking of his followers:
JOHN 17:21
“in order that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us, in order that the world may believe that you sent me forth.”The people of this forum are not “one.”
David ………we could all join some organizations and all be one with them is that what you believe is meant by being one. Jim Jones followers were all one with him and look what happened to them. And even in your JW religion they are not all one either, if you are lead by the spirit you will grow in knowledge and understanding. You as about where it says no man has all knowledge, that should be obvious to you or anyone, but here is proof. Phii 1:9 and this i pray that you love may abound yet more and more in KNOWLEDGE) and in all Judgment. What does (MORE) and (MORE) mean to you, if not we don;t have it all. Just one more Col1:10..> that ye might walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing, being fruitfull in every good work, and (INCREASING) in the (KNOWLEDGE of GOD.
peace………gene
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