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@ Carmel,
I am stunned by your response! None of what you said is supported by scripture. The only thing that comes to mind is, “get behind me Satan.” Then to claim you are a “true christian” as if not believing as you do somehow makes a “false Christian.”
It is no wonder the “church” is falling apart, you have created Jesus, a self proclaimed MAN, into someone who is greater than the creator of everything. There is a fiery place waiting for you.
You then go on to claim “darkness” is a title?!?!? Have you completely gone off the deep end? Darkness ISN’T a title, it’s the lack of light, where did you come up this statement? Then to say it refers to Jesus??!!? Jesus is “Darkness”?!? Is Jesus Satan? If Jesus is “darkness” how can “light” be in him? If Jesus is “darkness” and the NT is all about Jesus, does that mean the NT is deception? I think you better put the lid back on Pandora’s Box.
Then to say Jesus is the “spirit of God”; I thought Jesus was God. How many bottles of wine did you drink first!?
You need to explain this passage Isa 45:5-7 “I am HaShem, and there is none else, beside Me there is no G-d; I have girded thee, though thou hast not known Me; 6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside Me; I am HaShem; and there is none else; 7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am HaShem, that doeth all these things.”
If God does all things where exactly does Jesus factor into all this?
If Jesus is “darkness”, God created him, so how exactly could Jesus preexist, let alone be the creator? Or is this “kid’s stuff”? Apparently answering where in the OT the Messiah was to die for the sins of mankind is “adult stuff”, because you and everyone else has avoided that question like the plague.
I realize what I have been writing lately goes against everything I have said in the past; but, what Paul said about the Messiah is huge by claiming “according to scripture” the Messiah was to die for the sins of mankind, be buried, and raised on the third day. Paul wasn’t saying when you read between lines of the OT you will find Jesus, he was saying it is written in the OT. This means there are passages that explicitly state this and I have yet to find anything written saying “the Messiah” was to take on the sins of mankind and die for them, let alone be raised from the dead. I’ll repeat myself; if these statements cannot be found in the OT, Christianity has a huge problem.
For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; Neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
I’m not sure that Israel has a single soul.
Anyhow, Isaiah 53. The New Testament presents a unified and exclusive understanding of Isaiah 53 by recognizing Jesus of Nazareth as the suffering servant. His crucifixion and resurrection are depicted as the realization of the prophecy.
But you disagree and say it is Israel instead and I have little time right now to address this, although I have addressed this in the past. For now, I post this excerpt from Wikipedia.
Isaiah 52:13–53:12 makes up the fourth of the “Servant Songs” of the Book of Isaiah, describing a “servant” of God who is abused but subsequently vindicated.[2] Major themes of the passage include:
- Human opposition to God’s purposes for the servant. The servant has an exalted status in the eyes of God, but people despise him and consider him hated by God (Isa 52:13-53:3).
- The servant’s violent torture and death. This passage uses violent language to describe the fate of the servant, including suffering, smitten, afflicted, wounded, crushed, bruising, cut off, anguished and exposed to death.
Prophetic incredulity. The prophet questions whether anyone will believe what he is reporting (Isa. 53:1). - The servant’s innocence. In the moment of crisis, the servant is described as innocent of retaliation (Isa 53:7), violence, or deceit (Isa 53:9).
- Blessings upon his persecutors. As a result of the servant’s sufferings, his persecutors are given peace (Isa 53:5), healing (Isa 53:5), release from their guilt (Isa 53:6, 12) and escape from punishment (Isa 53:8).
- The vindication of the servant after death. After his violent persecution and death, the servant is given long life and prospers the purpose of the Lord (Isa 53:10).
- Extending righteousness to others. The righteous servant will “make the many righteous,” thus extending his righteousness to others (Isa 53:11).
- Forgiveness and intercession. Because of the servant’s actions, “the guilt of the many” is removed from them (Isa 53:6, 12) and they receive intercession on their behalf from the servant (Isa 53:12).
Desire Truth, you said……..> , I realize what I have been writing lately goes against everything I have said in the past; but, what Paul said about the Messiah is huge by claiming “according to scripture” the Messiah was to die for the sins of mankind, be buried, and raised on the third day. Paul wasn’t saying when you read between lines of the OT you will find Jesus, he was saying it is written in the OT. This means there are passages that explicitly state this and I have yet to find anything written saying “the Messiah” was to take on the sins of mankind and die for them, let alone be raised from the dead. I’ll repeat myself; if these statements cannot be found in the OT, Christianity has a huge problem.
When you say the “spirit of truth” teaches all things and is no lie, this “spirit of truth” that everyone claims is revealing the “truth”, why is there zero agreement on what is plainly said within the pages of the bible? When crossing between religious beliefs, no one agrees on what the NT says; everyone has there own interpretation. How can this be possible IF the “spirit of truth”, who cannot lie, is in everyone? We should all be one in thought and purpose; yet, we are completely divided.
Desire Truth……> First of all where does scripture say “everyone has the Spirit of truth”. In fact “only a few have it”, Wide is the way that leads to destruction and many go in threat thereof , but “NARROW’ is the way to life and “FEW’ there be that find it. Properly 95% of all going to churches do not have the “SPIRIT” OF TRUTH ABIDING IN THEM.
Now that being said……we need to understand that Jesus most definitely was a suffering Servant, and he also was a “Messiah”. Just like Mosses who spoke about him was also.
I think I see the problem your dealing with concerning Jesus dying for the sins of individual people as in”paying off” their sin debt, for them, I also agree Jesus paid no one’s sin debt off, we will all suffer death for our own sins. We must understand in what context Jesus died for “all”our sins.
what did Jesus “demonstrate to us all” by his death on the cross, or tree? That our sin are paid for and therefore we have no Sin? “No” , he did not die to pay anyone’s sin debt off, you’re going to die for that, not Jesus. ” is there unrighteousness with God, God forbid. “Everyone shall give account for there “OWN” sins before God, neither shall the Father pay for the sins of his son nor the son pay for the sins of the Father for everyone will give account for his own sins, says the LORD our God.”So then how was it that Jesus died , did he die “for” or “because of”? Big difference “for” implies he paid them off, but “because off, implies dosent mean he paid off anyone’s sins. it implies implies something different, like for instance Jesus’ death was to demonstrate to us all the right way to have a “right” relationship with God the Father, again his death was to “DEMONSTRATE ” HOW WE MUST LIVE IN ORDER , TO HAVE A RIGHT RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD THE FATHER, and it is “EXACTLY” the same as his IS AND was. That has nothing to paying off “YOUR” SINS.
THE WHOLE IDEA OF PAYING “OFF” SOMEONES SIN FOR THEM , goes totally again, the righteousness of God> not to even mention against his own words.
Except we become ‘EXACTY” as Jesus Christ, we will in no wise enter in to the Kingdom of God, just as Jesus himself said, “he that overcomes “EVEN”. as I have, I will grant to sit with me in my kingdom even as I have “OVERCOME” , and am sitting down in my Fathers kingdom.”
The proper way to understand this is to realize Jesus died to “DEMONSTRATE”, TO US ALL”, what is required “OF US ALL” . and in that “sense” he died for or (because of) the sins of the world . Remember what he said, when ask what the greatest commandment was, ……>”you” shall “LOVE”, the LORD , your God, with “ALL” you heart , “ALL’ your mind, “ALL” your soul, and “ALL ” YOUR STRENGTH.
This is the GREATEST OF “ALL” THE COMMANDMENTS. GOD THE FATHER MUST BE OUR TRUE and “ONLY”, “FIRST LOVE”, ALL THE REST must be second loves.
“He that has an ear let him hear”
peace and love to you and yours Desire Truth………..gene
@Gene,
I Cor 15:3,4 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.
I agree with you, individually we will be held accountable before God for our sins, our unrighteousness. Every major translation however states Christ died “for” our sins; not “because” of them. Using your definition Christ paid off our sins according to Paul. This is why I want the passages in the OT to be given; where are they? Paul said it was there and the OT should confirm it; not buried between the lines, but explicitly stated. If this isn’t in the OT as Paul stated, Christianity has a HUGE problem! Christ’s death on the cross is the basis of Christianity and if that “cornerstone” is kicked out from under it, Christianity will be proven false and the entire NT means what?
The implications of this are massive. I can no longer just accept what I am told is truth; show me where in scripture what you say is truth, which is why I want those passages. I hope you fully understand the gravity and where I’m coming from? I’m not here to fight anyone on this issue; this is a plea for answers and if these questions can’t be answered, what is the next step? That scares the ____ out of me!
No one has provided a single passage that states what Paul said in I Cor 15. Every passage given as “proof” has either been read between the lines or taken out of context. Therefore nothing given! Truth isn’t what you believe or want it to be, truths are cold, hard facts. Paul made the claim, now where are the facts?
Isa 53 has been shown to not be pointing to Jesus, he didn’t have a long life or many children. WHEN did Jesus have to “acknowledge guilt”? Thought he was “sinless.” Yet Isa 53 is all about Jesus.
Psa 16 a phrase in that chapter is used for proof; who’s speaking in this Psalm? Every “I”, “me”, and “my” are referring to the author, David. Are you saying every “I”, “me”, and “my” refer to David except in verse 10? How does that make any sense? Read the chapter in its entirety and when you get to verse 10, explain how this can possibly be talking about Jesus?
Of course we can’t forget our “Jesus jackpot” Psa 22, another Psalm of David. In this Psalm David is lamenting and is in anguish, asking God where HE is because his enemies are closing in on him. From 22 to the end David is praising God because he knows God heard his pleas and will be his rescuer. How do you see Jesus in this, because there are parallels? Your reaching!
These are the three “proof texts” I have been given for I Cor 15, and not one says the Messiah was to die for the sins of mankind. Not one says the Messiah was to be raised from the dead. What other verses in the OT support Paul’s claim? If you can’t come up with anymore, we have a problem; what I have been give are not proof.
Hi Desiretruth,
You; @ Carmel,
I am stunned by your response!
Me: Read what I made clear to you:
YOU AND I ARE PULLING THE SAME ROPE ALRIGHT BUT
IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION!
WE SHOULDN’T WASTE TIME!
You: None of what you said is supported by scripture.
Me: The above is of no use unless you specifically mention what I said and also contradict me BY USING SCRIPTURE NOT WITH YOUR USELESS OPINIONS. Also please no more of your blahs, which I will leave out, and replace them with DOTS, as to me it is a clear sign of your weakness.
You: …..you have created Jesus, a self proclaimed MAN, into someone who is greater than the creator of everything……
Please If you expect my answers, BE SPECIFIC BY CUT AND PASTE MY WRITING!
You: You then go on to claim “darkness” is a title?!?!?
Me: For you, it isn’t, A CARNAL MINDED PERSON, with every respect.
For me just read hereunder!
Psalm 18:11He made DARKNESS his secret place;….
2 Chronicles 6:1Then said Solomon, The LORD hath said that he would dwell in
the thick darkness.
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness,
Daniel 2:22 He revealeth the deep and secret things:
he knoweth what is in the darkness,
and the light dwelleth with him.
You: Have you completely gone off the deep end?
Darkness ISN’T a title, it’s the lack of light,
Now just explain WHAT DARKNESS IS in the above scriptures, especially
THE LAST ONE, please
where did you come up this statement?
Then to say it refers to Jesus??!!? Jesus is “Darkness”?!? Is Jesus Satan?
AGAIN, refer to the scriptures above, please!
If Jesus is “darkness” how can “light” be in him? If Jesus is “darkness” and the NT is all about Jesus, does that mean the NT is deception?
AGAIN I REPEAT, READ THE ABOVE SCRIPTURES PLEASE!
Then to say Jesus is the “spirit of God”; I thought Jesus was God…….
You need to explain this passage Isa 45:5-7 “I am HaShem, and there is none else, beside Me there is no G-d; I have girded thee, though thou hast not known Me; 6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside Me; I am HaShem; and there is none else; 7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am HaShem, that doeth all these things.”
ME: NOW READ THE REST OF ISAIAH 45
13 I have raised him up to justice,
and I will direct all his ways:
he shall build my city,
ME: WHAT CITY?
THE NEW JERUSALEM!
THE HUMAN BODY IN FULL GLORY!
JESUS, THE SON OF MAN!
THE ABODE OF GOD THE FATHER ON THE LAST DAY OF THE LORD AS
JESUS CHRIST
GODMAN!
and let go my captives,
WHAT CAPTIVES!
THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE IN FLESH AND BLOOD UNDER THE DOMINION OF SATAN FROM EVE’S SIN!
PURIFIED AND PERFECTED ALL SPIRITUAL,
ONE SUBSTANCE WITH THE HOLY GHOST, BOTH SPIRIT, AND FLESH ON JESUS DEATH ON THE CROSS, ISAIAH 53:9
not for ransom, nor for presents, saith the Lord the God of hosts.
ME: FOR GOD THE FATHER!
14 Thus saith the Lord:
The labour of Egypt, and the merchandise of Ethiopia, and of Sabaim, men of stature shall come over to thee, and shall be thine: they shall walk after thee, they shall go bound with manacles:
WHO ARE BOUND WITH MANACLES?
ALL THOSE BELIEVERS WHO DIED FOR THE SAKE OF JESUS UP TO THIS DAY!
and they shall worship thee, and shall make supplication to thee:
only in thee is God,
and there is no God besides thee.
15Verily thou art a hidden God,
the God of Israel the saviour.
16They are all confounded and ashamed: the forgers of errors are gone together into confusion.
17Israel is saved in the Lord with as eternal salvation: you shall not be con- founded, and you shall not be ashamed forever and ever.
If God does all things where exactly does Jesus factor into all this?
Read the above, please!
If Jesus is “darkness”,
AGAIN, refer to the scriptures above, also keep in mind that:
LIGHT SHINES IN DARKNESS,
AND DARKNESS COMPREHENDED NOT!
God created him, so how exactly could Jesus preexist, let alone be the creator?
Proverbs 8:22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
23I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
24When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.
25Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
26While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world.
27When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
28When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep:
29When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
30 Then I was by him, as one brought up with him:
and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him;
31Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Carmel……Attributes are not beings , not now nor ever where. They are what beings can poses , “as in “the attributes of God, are seen by the things created “, Forcing our text to say what they absolutely do not say , is all you seem to be able to do. Wisdom is an attribute not a “real person”, as you falsely describe it, anyone can poses it, scripture says…….>Proverbs 3:13-18
“Happy is the “man” that fines “WISDOM”, and the “man” that gets understanding. For the merchandise of it is better the the merchandise of silver, and the gain thereof then fine gold. She is more precious than rubies: and all the things you can desire are not to be compared to her. Length of days are in her right hand; and in her left hand riches and honor . Her ways are ways of pleasantness, and all her paths are peace. She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her, and happy is everyone that retains her.”
peace and love to you and yours Carmel…………gene
Desire truth…….The word “for” , in English used in our translations come from at least 5 different Greek words, which they translated into the English word for. Most all of them carry the meaning “because of”. For, always carries “causality ” with it. Especially in old English writings.
so as I said I see Jesus’ death as a result of “all’ human sins, not that his death “paid” for them , but Jesus did pay with his life for us all , by sacrificing his life to “demonstrate” to us all what it takes to have a right relationship with God the Father. That relationship is centered in “Complete” FAITH AND TRUST IN GOD THE FATHER., Just as Jesus “demonstrated ” to us all. IMO.
peace and love to you and yours Desire Truth………..gene
Hi Gene,
You: Carmel……Attributes are not beings , not now nor ever where.
Me: When will you learn, that you never put God and his characteristics in the same basket as humans?
All God’s attributes are spirits! Read:
John 6:63 It is the SPIRIT that quickeneth:
the FLESH profiteth nothing.
The words that I have spoken to you, are
SPIRIT AND LIFE.
ANSWER Gene,
ARE YOUR WORDS SPIRIT, NEVER MIND LIFE?
You: They are what beings can possess,
BUT THERE ARE DIVINE BEINGS, AD INTRA, WITHIN GOD, and
CREATED BEINGS, AD XTRA, OUTSIDE OF GOD!
NOW READ HEREUNDER AND ANSWER, ABOUT THE ONLY DIVINE HUMAN BEING WHO WALKED ON THIS PLANET!
DID HE POSSESSED THE SEVEN SPIRITS OF GOD or
SEVEN ATTRIBUTES OF GOD
Isaiah 11:1 AND there shall come forth a rod out of the root of Jesse, and a flower shall rise up out of his root.
2And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him:
(1) the spirit of wisdom, and
(2) of understanding,
(3) the spirit of counsel, and
(4) of fortitude,
(5) the spirit of knowledge, and
(6) of godliness.
(7) 3 And he shall be filled with the spirit of the fear of the Lord.
Now to
1 Corinthians 1:19 For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the prudence of the prudent I will reject. 20Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this world?
Hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21For seeing that in the wisdom of God the world, by wisdom, knew not God, it pleased God, by the foolishness of our preaching, to save them that believe. 22For both the Jews require signs, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: 23But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews indeed a stumbling block, and unto the Gentiles foolishness: 24But unto them that are called, both Jews and Greeks,
Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
THE POWER OF GOD IN
THE HOLY GHOST, JESUS, THE SON OF GOD, JESUS’ DIVINE NATURE and
THE WISDOM OF GOD IN
“THE WORD” JESUS THE SON OF MAN, JESUS’ HUMAN NATURE.
INTEGRATED AS ONE BOTH SPIRIT AND FLESH ON THE CROSS
GLORIFIED AS
JESUS CHRIST
GODMAN!
25For the foolishness of God is wiser than men;
and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26For see your vocation, brethren, that there are not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble:
27But the foolish things of the world hath God chosen,
that he may confound the wise;
and the weak things of the world hath God chosen,
that he may confound the strong.
28And the base things of the world, and the things that are contemptible, hath God chosen,
and things that are not,
that he might bring to nought things that are:
29That no flesh should glory in his sight.
30But of him are you in Christ Jesus,who of God is made unto us wisdom,
and justice, and sanctification, and redemption: 31That, as it is written:
He that glorieth, may glory in the Lord.ME: Forcing our text to say what they absolutely do not say , is all you seem to be able to do.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Carmel you said…….>DID HE POSSESSED THE SEVEN SPIRITS OF GOD or
SEVEN ATTRIBUTES OF GOD
Isaiah 11:1 AND there shall come forth a rod out of the root of Jesse, and a flower shall rise up out of his root.
2And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him:
(1) the spirit of wisdom, and
(2) of understanding,
(3) the spirit of counsel, and
(4) of fortitude,
(5) the spirit of knowledge, and
(6) of godliness.
(7) 3 And he shall be filled with the spirit of the fear of the Lord.
ME……is that not what I said ? , “WISDOM” is a “ATTRIBUTE” OF God? wisdom is not a “person”, but an “Attribute” a person can have in him, it’s even see in the animals of this earth.
You trying to separate Jesus from the rest of humanity and turn him into a God, or as you say it a “GODMAN”, IS A LIE. Fabricated by, Satan himself.
Like I said, your pigeon is “2Ths2”. That will judge you at the return of Jesus , right from his very own lips. Along with the other 90% of “so-called “Christianity”. Because they as you have turned Jesus into your GOD, and you bow and worship him as such. You reward will be the same as theirs, unless you repent!.
peace and love to you and yours Carmel…………gene
@Gene,
Let’s say the meaning is “because of”; please find in the OT where the Messiah was to die “because of” the sins of mankind. Again, Paul did state “according to scripture”, this means it’s in the OT.
YOU: “Now just explain WHAT DARKNESS IS in the above scriptures, especially THE LAST ONE, please”
ME: Because you wanted me to focus on Daniel 2:22, that is all I will speak on: “He reveals the deep and the hidden things; he knows what is in the darkness, and the light dwells with him.”
As a spiritual understanding, Carmel minded person, with every respect, you have come to the conclusion that “darkness” in this passage is a title. Did you read this chapter? My guess is NO; had you read it you wouldn’t be making the claim.
This chapter begins with Nebuchadnezzar having a dream and doesn’t understand it. He calls his magicians, conjurers, sorcerers, and astrologers to interpret the dream; except he isn’t going to tell them what the dream was, they were to tell him the dream and interpret it. If they can’t, they will be put to death. The absurdity of this is obvious as it’s impossible to interpret a dream you haven’t heard. Since they can’t interpret the dream, they’re all killed and a decree goes out to kill all the “wise men” of Babylon. When they came to Daniel, he inquired why such a severe punishment. Once explained Daniel went before the king and asked for time and he would explain the dream. It was granted and in a vision the dream was revealed to him. It is after this revelation Daniel (verses 20-23) “blessed/praised the God of heaven.”
It is in this blessing where verse 22 falls where Daniel is praising God.
20 Daniel said, “Let his name, the name of God, be blessed throughout the ages,
for the wisdom and the power are his.
21 And he changes the times and the seasons,
and he deposes kings and he sets up kings;
he gives wisdom to wise men
and knowledge to men who know understanding.
22 He reveals the deep and the hidden things;
he knows what is in the darkness,
and the light dwells with him.
23 To you, O God of my ancestors,
I give thanks and I give praises,
for the wisdom and the power you gave to me,
and now you have made known to me
what we have asked from you,
for you have made known to us the matter of the king.”
To whom is Daniel calling “darkness” here? The passage is explicitly stating Daniel is speaking to God and it is God who “knows what is in the darkness” and “light dwells with” God. What can remain hidden from God? Can “darkness” hide anything from God’s eyes? What is difficult about this passage and how do you come up with “darkness” being a “title” here? The best one could come up with in this passage is “darkness” being an action and referring to the “dark” thoughts of men. Instead of always reading between the lines and being “Carmel minded”, just read the words; they are simple.
P.S. My explanation to one inquiry. Do you see why I made a blanket statement how none of what you wrote is supported by scripture? How can I address all of what you said without writing a short novel? This should have triggered you to prove what you said is scriptural, not deflect it back.
Still waiting for how Jesus, “according to scripture”, was to die for the sins of mankind.
Desire Truth………Have you ever thought that the nation of Israel, has also never done any of those things mentioned in Isa 53, we must establish who was Isaiah talking about in, Isa 53:2…”.and when “We” shall see him” ……..>who is the “we” mentioned there? If the we is Israel then the passage is not talking about Israel right? . also the term “WE” is also used in other chapters. In chapter 4 the term “OUR” is used several times also. So who is the “our” referring to? , if we tie the prophet Isaiah to the people of Israel, then that person in the prophesy could not be referring to Israel at all, right?. It has to be referring to someone else other than the Nation of Israel, if we conclude the “we and, the our” include Isaiah and his people Israel right?
Maybe that can help us get a better sense of who and what Isa 53: is talking about brother.
By the way, your post to Carmel was right on, I never seen a person that could screw up, twist, and abuse our scriptural text as good as he can.
peace and love to you and your Desire Truth……….gene
Whoever denies the Son, the same has not the Father. 1 John 2:23
Repent, for the sake of your soul!
@Danny,
Danny, Danny, Danny, you still haven’t answered the question of where it states in the OT the Messiah was to die for the sins of mankind. Tell me, what’s more important; your religion or truth? Before you go completely religious on me, I was where you are about a month or so ago; that is until I started verifying what I have been told was truth AND what was said to be “written” in scripture. The moment you begin that journey, will mark a new and eye opening day in your life.
Happy studying, if you dare…
The Lord of glory was predestined to be crucified for our sakes
The wicked will not understand. It is hidden from them.
No, we speak of the mysterious and hidden wisdom of God, which He destined for our glory before time began. None of the rulers of this age understood it. For if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. Rather, as it is written: “No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no heart has imagined, what God has prepared for those who love Him.”
Think @desiretruth
If it was written down in the format you are expecting, then the Kingdom of Darkness would have understood to not crucify the Lord which would have thwarted God’s plan of redemption. Instead, they foolishly took the bait and thought by killing the Lord that they would enjoy the spoils.
But those who are born of God will see and understand.
Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well.
God’s plan is still progressing. But not all want to be involved in that plan. But they are involved whether they like it or not. It’s up to us to play the part that leads to the Kingdom of Heaven. But not all shall enter.
Gene,
You: ME……is that not what I said ? , “WISDOM” is a “ATTRIBUTE” OF God?
Me: Read again:
THE SPIRIT OF WISDOM…….
WHAT IS A SPIRIT?
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spirit
spirit
1 of 2 noun1
: an animating or vital principle heldTO GIVE LIFE to physical organisms
2
: a supernatural BEING or ESSENCE:Acts 19:15 And the EVIL SPIRIT answered and said,
Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are ye? 16And the man
in whom the evil spirit
was leaped on them, and overcame them, and prevailed against them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.
1 Samuel 18:10 And it came to pass on the morrow, that
the evil spirit from God came upon Saul,
and he prophesied in the midst of the house: and David played with his hand, as at other times: and there was a javelin in Saul’s hand. 11And Saul cast the javelin; for he said, I will smite David even to the wall with it. And David avoided out of his presence twice.
John 15:26But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even
the Spirit of truth,
which proceedeth from the Father,
he shall testify of me:
John16:1 2I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. 13Howbeit when he,
the Spirit of truth,
is come, he will guide you into all truth:
for he shall not speak of HIMSELF;
but whatsoever HE SHALL HEAR,
that shall HE SPEAK:
and HE WILL SHOW you things to come.
14He shall glorify me:
for he shall receive of mine,
and shall show it unto you.
15All things that the Father hath are mine:
therefore said I,
that he shall take of mine,
and shall show it unto you.
The above SHOULD BE MORE THAN ENOUGH FOR YOU TO SEE and PERCEIVE
WHAT A S SPIRIT IS ENJOY!
I MEAN WITHOUT THE SPIRIT IN YOU, WHETHER IT IS GOOD OF GOD , OR EVIL
OF THE DEVIL,
YOU, AS A HUMAN IN FLESH AND BLOOD, WOULD NOT BE ALIVE!
You: wisdom is not a “person”, but an “Attribute” a person can have in him,
it’s even see in the animals of this earth.
Me: Are you saying that animals possess wisdom?
YES OR NO PLEASE!
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Hi, Desiretruth, and in this particular case, Gene,
You: Because you wanted me to focus on Daniel 2:22, that is all I will speak on:
“He reveals the deep and the hidden things;
WHO REVEALS?
You: he knows what is in the darkness,
WHO IS, AND WHAT IS HIDDEN IN THE ABOVE PARTICULAR DARKNESS?
You: and the light dwells with him.”
ATTENTION PLEASE:
WITH WHOM DWELLS THE LIGHT?
You: As a spiritual understanding,
Carmel minded person,
with every respect, you have come to the conclusion that
“darkness” in this passage is a title.
Did you read this chapter?
Me: MORE THAN YOU THINK!
I MUST KEEP ON REMINDING YOU THOUGH:
I LOOK AT THE SCRIPTURE FROM THE OTHER END OF THE ROPE,
UNFORTUNATELY, YOU ARE LOOKING AT, CARNAL,
THUS, BOTH OF US ARE PULLING IT IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION!
I MEAN FROM THE SPIRIT SIDE OF IT,
YOU FROM DARKNESS, and I FROM THE LIGHT!
THE WAY GOD SEES IT AND REVEALS HIS MESSAGE!
Proverb 16:2 All the ways of a man are clean in his own eyes;
but the LORD weigheth the spirits.
You: My guess is NO; had you read it you wouldn’t be making the claim.
I SIMPLY CONVINCED MYSELF MORE OF THE TRUTH!
THE TRUTH WHICH YOU
A CARNAL-MINDED PERSON, IS SIMPLY
BLIND OF!
WITH EVERY RESPECT!
1Corinthians 12:4 Now there are diversities of graces,
but the same Spirit;
5And there are diversities of ministries, but the same Lord; 6And there are diversities of operations, but the same God, who worketh all in all.
7And the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man unto profit.
8To one indeed, by the Spirit,
is given the word of wisdom:
and to another,
the word of knowledge, according to the same Spirit;
9To another, faith in the same spirit; to another, the grace of healing in one Spirit; 10To another, the working of miracles; to another, prophecy;
to another, the discerning of spirits;
to another, diverse kinds of tongues; to another, interpretation of speeches.
11But all these things one and the same Spirit worketh,
dividing to everyone according as he will.
Me: In relation to
FAITH IN OUR LORD GOD AND FATHER JESUS CHRIST!
OUR FIRST LOVE FOR THE SAKE OF
GOD THE FATHER!
John15:5 I am the vine; you the branches:
he that abideth in me, and I in him, the same beareth much fruit:
for without me you can do nothing.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Carmel you SAID THIS………. .> THE SPIRIT OF WISDOM…….
WHAT IS A SPIRIT?
Here is your answer very simply put just for you ok……….Spirit “IS” the “COGNICITI”, A PERSON or animal HAS, given them by God, it Leo’s who the person or thing is. WEATHER a “CLEAN OR UNCLEAN” person or thing.
You my friend seem to lack that ability, when it comes to our Scriptures, you are unable to put them together rightly. Which seems to be obvious to everyone here. But because God THE FATHER, exists there is hope for you and all, remember what Jesus said (not me, but I do agree) …….>“all things are possible with God”.
Peace and love to you and yours Carmel…………gene
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