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Gene: Mike…..Good post. We see Jesus as subordinate to God the Father, and that is correct, backed up by many scriptures and even the words of Jesus himself as you have quoted, Jodie and I have also. They spin off what is actually written and create their own teachings without true scripture support.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene
Thanks brother Balthrop. 😊
Hi Mike
IN THE BIGINING WAS THE WORD AND THE WORD WAS WITH THE GOD AND THE WORD WAS GOD
The same was in the beginning with God.
[3] All things were made BY HIM; and WITHOUT HIM was not any thing made that was made.Jesus KNOWING that the Father had given all things into his hands, AND that he was come FROM GOD, and went to God;(John 13:3)
FOR YOU MIKE, WHEN THE FATHER HAD GIVEN ALL THINGS INTO THE HANDS OF HIS SON ???
Carmel: Father, I want those you have given me to be with me
where I am,
MIKE, TELL JODI, WHERE JESUS WAS IN THAT MOMENT IN TIME…
He was on earth at the time, but talking about when his and our God returns him to heaven. Like this…
“Father, please give me back the glory I had before the world began, and make it so my apostles can also be where I am at that time so they can also see me in my true glory that I had before you sent me into the world as a human being for 30 years.”
In other words, “bring me back home, and bring these guys along so they can see how great it is there and how glorified I am there”.
Mike……Those words are not what scripture supports, you have added thought into them. Mike please notice Jesus never said “give me back” that is a assumption on your and others part, taken from the stand point of a “preexisting Jesus”, a position that no scripture supports. Jesus had “before him comming into his existence” a “prophesied ” glory, much like KING Cyrus had 200 years befor his birth on this earth also had. A prophesy with God is as if it is done, even though the fulfillment hasn’t yet happened. I think you already understand this? JESUS was and is the result of a PROPHESY OF GOD, being fulfilled, his person, his glory, his honor, all given him “before” his comming into his only existence. we also are prophesied to recieve the thing GOD, has in his forordained plan for all humanity. When that time comes to each of us we can all say exactly what Jesus said, about the Glory and Honor and all thing put under our feet, afforded us by our, and his heavenly FATHER.
Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene
Hi Mike,
YOU: “Father, please give me back the glory,
NO MIKE, JESUS, DESPITE HE CAME ON EARTH, HE NEVER LOST HIS ORIGINAL GLORY. HE NEVER LEFT HIS FATHER, HE IS ETERNAL AND ONE SUBSTANCE WITH THE FATHER! John3:13And no man hath ascended into heaven, but
he that descended from heaven,
the Son of man WHO IS in heaven. OK MIKE? HE REMAINED IN HEAVEN!
SIMPLY AS GOD CAN MULTIPLY, AND BILOCATE HIMSELF AS MUCH AS HE PLEASES!
YOU: He was on earth at the time,
John17:24 24 Father, I will
that where I am, they also whom thou hast given me may be with me:
(ACCORDING TO YOU ON EARTH) IT DOESN’T MAKE SENSE AT ALL!
Jesus WANTED the Father to make it possible for the apostles to be WITH HIM.
WHEN IN FACT THEY WERE WITH HIM. NOT ONLY THAT MIKE BUT A FEW MINUTES LATER,
THEY RAN AWAY, AND LEFT JESUS ON HIS OWN TO BE BUTCHERED!
SO THE FATHER IGNORED HIM. NO? Now to the next part!
that they may see my glory which
thou hast given me,
In the above Jesus already had this particular glory! SINCE IT IS WRITTEN IN THE PRESENT PERFECT! So let’s start again:
John17:24 Father, I will that where I am, (RIGHT NOW, AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME, ALREADY IN THIS PARTICULAR GLORY, IN HEAVEN, EVEN BEFORE THE WORLD WAS. AS MAN! John3:13And NO MAN hath ascended into heaven, but
HE (THE MAN) that descended from heaven, THE SON OF MAN, WHO IS IN HEAVEN) they also whom thou hast given me may be with me:
that they may see my glory which thou hast given me ( AS MAN, THE SON OF MAN, BEFORE THE WORLD WAS, ASSERTED HEREUNDER)
because thou hast loved me before the creation of the world.
Mike the entire process of the kingdom of the Son,
the kingdom of God, is accomplished already within the divinity of God, it simply is being implemented, and manifested physically! This is pinpointed out by Jesus in
Luke 14:28 For which of you, having a mind to build a tower, doth not first sit down and reckon the charges that are necessary, whether he have the wherewithal to finish it: 29Lest, after he hath laid the foundation and is not able to finish it, all that see it begin to mock him, 30Saying: This man began to build and was not able to finish. 31Or, what king, about to go to make war against another king, doth not first sit down and think whether he be able, with ten thousand, to meet him that, with twenty thousand, cometh against him? 32Or else, while the other is yet afar off, sending an embassy, he desireth conditions of peace.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Carmel: John 14: 16 And I will ask the Father: and he shall give you another Paraclete…
John 16:13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will teach you all truth… 14 He shall glorify me: because he shall receive of mine and shall shew it to you.
Carmel, is Jesus the servant of the Spirit of truth? I ask because you say the Father serves the Son by giving the Son things. So does Jesus then serve the Spirit of truth by giving it things?
Carmel: Mike the SON OF GOD IS
GODMAN on earth!
GOD THE SONNo. What does the word “OF” mean to you? For example, Solomon was the son OF David, right? Was Solomon “David the Son“? We and God’s spirit sons are all “sons of God”. Jesus was the firstborn, but remains a son OF God… not God Himself. In fact, Jesus is many things OF God…
Jesus was begotten BY God. (Psalm 2:7, John 3:16)
Jesus is a creation OF God. (Col 1:15, Rev 3:14)
Jesus is the Son OF God. (Matt 16:16)
Jesus is the Word/Spokesman OF God. (John 1:1, Rev 19:13)
Jesus is the Messiah/Christ/Anointed One OF God. (Luke 2:11, Acts 2:36)
Jesus is the sacrificial Lamb OF God. (John 1:29, Rev 7:10)
Jesus is the Holy one OF God. (Mark 1:24, John 6:69)
Jesus is a prophet OF God. (Luke 4:24, Acts 3:22)
Jesus is an angel/messenger OF God. (John 8:28, 12:49, Galatians 4:14, Revelation 22:16)
Jesus is the mediator BETWEEN God and men. (1 Tim 2:5)
Jesus is a Priest OF God. (Heb 5:10)
Jesus is a Servant OF God. (Acts 4:30)
Jesus OBEYS God. (John 8:29, 12:49)
Jesus WORSHIPS God. (John 4:22)
Jesus says his God is greater than him, and all. (John 14:28, 10:29)
Jesus says that our God is also his own God. (John 20:17, Rev 3:12)
Jesus distinguishes himself as someone OTHER THAN his God. (John 10:36, 17:3)
Jesus was sent BY God. (Gal 4:4)
Jesus sits at the right hand OF God. (Mark 16:19, Acts 2:33)
Jesus rules in the power, authority, and name OF God. (Micah 5:4, Matt 28:18)
Jesus will hand the reign of the Kingdom back to his own God. (1 Cor 15:24, 28)Mike: Yet they still called him God’s holy servant, right?
Carmel: WHERE MIKE? WHICH SCRIPTURE?
Twice in the prayer in Acts 4… the one you didn’t want to discuss openly with me. Remember I kept asking who the one they prayed to was?
Ed: Hi Gene,
(Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)
Jesus lineage explained
“Son of Man”: 25%; Mary’s mother’s lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36)
“Son of Man”: 25%: Mary’s father’s lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31)
“Son of God”: 50%: Jesus’ Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35)At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)!
At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14)Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…
……………….Mother……….Father
………………..Mary………HolySpirit
…………………50%…………50%
……………………\……………/
……………………..\………../
………………………..Jesus
………………………./…….\
……………………./…………\
…………………../…………….\
……….Son of Man…….Son of God
………..(Mark 6:3)……..(Luke 1:35)Well done, Eddy!
Jodi: TRUTH: Jesus was the Son of Man who received the Spirit, an Anointing, for the purpose to be sent out to set us at liberty.
FAKE NEWS: Jesus is God who needed to come down to earth and be a man to set us at liberty.
Agreed. Now just add the part where he existed with great glory before God created the world through him. 😉
Jodi: Hi Ed J,
Seems that scholars disagree on whether it’s YHWH or YHVH, and others who research say they don’t know which one is correct between the two. Some also believe the proper is YHUH. Recently I have been using YHWH though in the past I have used YHVH.
Please share what info you have, it would be much appreciated.
I was just reading a few articles myself, and think I might just start using Yah.
I hear a lot of people saying “YA HOO AH” these days. I usually say “Jehovah” or “Yahweh”.
Berean: FOR YOU MIKE, WHEN THE FATHER HAD GIVEN ALL THINGS INTO THE HANDS OF HIS SON ???
It’s not so much a matter of WHEN, but the fact that the Father GAVE so many things to His servant, Jesus. Who is greater… the one who sends or the one who was sent? Who is greater… the one who gives or the one who receives? Notice that Jesus doesn’t ever give his own God any power or authority, right? So if one is greater, then it stands to reason that the other is lesser. And that is the situation in a nutshell. The Father is greater than his son/servant/priest/messiah/prophet/lamb/word/angel Jesus. The Father is the Most High God OF gods. Jesus is one of the lesser gods his Father is the God OF.
Gene: Mike please notice Jesus never said “give me back” that is a assumption on your and others part…
Gene, when someone asks to be given something they HAD before… they’re asking for that thing to be given BACK to them. They’re asking for the RETURN of that thing they used to have, but don’t currently have. Why? Because if they currently had it, they wouldn’t be asking for it. And if it was never something they had in the first place, they wouldn’t ask for the thing that they HAD before. Cheers.
Carmel: NO MIKE, JESUS, DESPITE HE CAME ON EARTH, HE NEVER LOST HIS ORIGINAL GLORY
Then what is he asking his and our God for in John 17:5?
Carmel: John 17:24 24 Father, I will that where I am, they also whom thou hast given me may be with me:
(ACCORDING TO YOU ON EARTH) IT DOESN’T MAKE SENSE AT ALL!
Sure it does. Hey Carmel, next week I’ll be chilling in the south of Spain. It is my wish that you will also be where I am so you can chill with me.
See? It’s all in the “WILL BE” part.
- I WILL BE in location X in one year from now.
- I hope that you also WILL BE where I am one year from now.
Get it? The context implies that Jesus will be at a certain location IN THE FUTURE. And he’s praying to his God that his apostles can also be in that same spot IN THE FUTURE. And if his God answers his prayer, then IN THE FUTURE, his apostles will also be where HE IS.
Hi Mike,
YOU: Sure it does. Hey Carmel, next week I’ll be chilling in the south of Spain. It is my wish that you will also be where I am so you can chill with me.
POOR MIKE,
Again you put God in the same
BASKET OF YOUR OWN MENTALITY:
Unless you go to Spain Mike,
YOU WILL NEVER BE CHILLING!
JESUS ALREADY HAD THAT GLORY,
HE CAME TO EARTH FOR OUR SAKE,
HE NEVER NEEDED TO COME,
IN THE SAME WAY YOU HAVE TO GO TO SPAIN SO YOU CAN ENJOY YOUR
CHILLING
Read hereunder:
that they may see my glory which
thou hast given me,
In the above Jesus already had this particular glory! SINCE IT IS WRITTEN IN THE PRESENT PERFECT!
So let’s start again:
John17:24 Father, I will that where I am, (RIGHT NOW, AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME, ALREADY IN THIS PARTICULAR GLORY, IN HEAVEN, EVEN BEFORE THE WORLD WAS PHYSICALLY
AS MAN!
John3:13And NO MAN hath ascended into heaven, but
HE
(THE MAN)
that descended from heaven,
THE SON OF MAN, WHO IS IN HEAVEN) OK MIKE JESUS WAS A PHYSICAL BEING
A MAN BEFORE THE WORLD WAS, IN HIS GLORY WITH THE FATHER!
THE FACT THAT GOD CREATED THE MAN
IN HIS OWN IMAGE AND LIKENESS! THUS:
they also whom thou hast given me may be with me:
that they may see my glory which thou hast given me
( AS MAN, THE SON OF MAN, BEFORE THE WORLD WAS, ASSERTED HEREUNDER)
because thou hast loved me before the creation of the world.
POOR MIKE!
YOU CAN ONLY SEE UP TO YOUR CARNAL NOSE. WITH EVERY RESPECT!
READ ONE MORE TRUTH:
Isaiah 6:1 And I said: (ME) Woe is me, because I have held my peace;
because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people that hath unclean lips, (YOU ,MIKE, JODI, and GENE) and
I have seen with my eyes (IN SCRIPTURE)
the King the Lord of hosts.
OUR LORD GOD AND FATHER JESUS CHRIST ISAIAH 9:6
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Mike…….you said Jesus is many things “of” God, I completely agree with you and I believe Jodi does also. But remember scripture say “there is “one” God and “one” mediator between GOD and men, THE “MAN” Jesus Christ “. Now if we agree with scripture, then HE IS A “MAN, THEN he could not have “prexisted” his birth, why?, because “no man” has , and remember, he clearly said he was a “son “of”man” who is from the roots of King David. Now if he was the “offspring ” of KING David, then he could not have “prexisted” his birth the same way we also could not have prexisted our births either, even though we are the root and offspring of our father’s also, and yet can still be called “the Sons “of” God too.
Mike Satan Biggest plan and effort is and was to make Jesus out to be completely different then we are, the is exactly why the teachings of a preexisting “man GOD” was started by him in the very beginning of the true Church, through the false teachings of his servants, the GNOSTICS, 2THS2 IS SPEAKING OF THIS FALSE TEACHING which had infected the true church, and was taking root at the time of the apostles, Paul and John.
Read what I wrote on “2ths2. It will help clarify this to you.
But one thing I can say brother we do agree about most of what scripture say, and so does Jodi I believe.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene
Mike….No, when someone ask to be given something the had before, does not mean they are being given “back” Something, for instance an heir can say to his Father give me my inherentence I had with you, before he ever actually received it. In fact we can also say the same thing as Jesus said , “Father give us the glory and honor we had with you, before the world ever existed”. our Glory and Honor , already exists with God the Father reserved in heaven for us all. See our point Mike?
Peace and love to you and yours. ………..gene
Carmel…..It’s not “poor Mike, it’s “poor Carmel”, who has been blinded and can’t see or understand our clearly written scriptures. Mike has way more understanding of scriptures then you do Carmel. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours. …….gene
to all deny divinity of Christ
Jesus is the ONLY BEGOTTEN(not created like say Mike) SON OF GOD. HE EXISTED BEFORE THE WORLD WAS.
I know it by its revelation: THE HOLY BIBLE
JOHN 8
Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.
[22] Then said the Jews, Will he kill himself? because he saith, Whither I go, ye cannot come.
[23] And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
[24] I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
[25] Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.Hi Mike,
YOU: No. What does the word “OF” mean to you? For example, Solomon was the son OF David, right? Was Solomon
“David the Son“?
Herod is the son of Herod the great
Herod the Son.
Do you know why? Simple; AS THEY BOTH HAVE THE SAME NAME, LIKEWISE
JESUS IS ALSO GOD
Whether you want to believe it or not!
According to scripture, Jesus was A CARPENTER!
THE SON OF THE ONLY CARPENTER IN NAZARETH.
HE WAS CARPENTER THE SON,
DO YOU WANT MORE MIKE,EXAMPLES?
1John 5:20 And we know that the on of God is come.
And he hath given us understanding that we may know
the true God and may be in
his true Son.
This is the true God and life eternal.
(JESUS CHRIST)
Ephesians 4:1 I therefore, a prisoner in the Lord, (JESUS CHRIST) beseech you that you walk worthy of the vocation in which you are called: 2With all humility and mildness, with patience, supporting one another in charity. 3Careful to keep
the unity of the Spirit (IN JESUS CHRIST) in the bond of peace. 4One body and one Spirit: ( OF JESUS CHRIST) as you are called in one hope of your calling. 5One Lord, (JESUS CHRIST) one faith, one baptism.
6One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in us all.
7But to every one of us is given grace, according to the measure of the giving of Christ. NOT OF THE GIVING OF THE FATHER!
Philippians 2:11 And that every tongue should confess that
the Lord Jesus Christ is in the glory of God the Father.
JESUS IS GOD AND FATHER
John 20:17 But go to my brethren and say to them:
I ascend to (THE GLORY OF) my Father and to your Father, to (THE GLORY OF) my God and to your God.
I ASCEND TO
MY PARTICULAR UNIQUE FATHER IN FLESH, AS MAN, and
YOUR PARTICULAR UNIQUE FATHER IN FLESH AS WOMAN! since Adam is dead,
TO MY PARTICULAR UNIQUE GOD IN FLESH AS MAN, and
YOUR PARTICULAR UNIQUE GOD IN FLESH AS WOMAN. since Satan’s FLESH,
the god of this world is dead.
We and God’s spirit sons are all “sons of God”.
WRONG Mike, YOU ARE MILES AWAY FROM JESUS’REDEMPTION!
THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE MIKE ARE
ALL CHILDREN OF GOD IN FLESH,
ON JESUS’ RESURRECTION
THE MAN BORN AGAIN John3:3, EMBODIED with the entire human race, purchased by Jesus’ blood, NOT THE FATHER’S, BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD THE FATHER AND HUMANITY! HIS CHILDREN IN CHRIST!
1 Peter 1Blessed be
THE(PARTICULAR UNIQUE ) God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
who according to his great mercy (CHRIST MERCY) hath regenerated us unto a lively hope, by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead: 4Unto an inheritance, incorruptible, and undefiled and that cannot fade, reserved in heaven for you, 5Who, by the power of God, are kept by faith unto salvation, ready to be revealed in the last time.
THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE Mike, ARE
ONE SUBSTANCE WITH GOD IN
JESUS CHRIST
THE NEW JERUSALEM FURNISHED BY
GOD THE FATHER! ON THE LAST DAY OF THE LORD!
DO YOU KNOW WHY OUR GLORIFIED BODY IS FURNISHED BY THE FATHER? 1Corinthians 15:38But God giveth it a body as he will: and to every seed its proper body.
Simple: AS HE FURNISHED JESUS’ FLESH BODY, THE PURE RANSOM,
GOD THE FATHER HIMSELF PAID THE DEBT DUE TO SATAN
ONCE ADAM REJECTED
GOD’S WILL, AND USED SATAN’S ASSET SIN.
Thus only GOD HIMSELF COULD PAY THE RANSOM TO RESTORE BACK
HIS WILL!
YOUR WILL BE DONE ON EARTH AS IT IS IN HEAVEN!
Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which
THE HOLY GHOST hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased
WITH HIS OWN BLOOD.
OK Mike? THE HOLY GHOST PAID BY HIS OWN BLOOD!
YOU: Jesus was the firstborn,
NOT JUST SAYS THE ABOVE TITLE MIKE BUT
EXPLAIN SPECIFICALLY HOW JESUS WAS THE FIRSTBORN!
YOU: but remains a son OF God… not God Himself.
NO MIKE NOT GOD HIMSELF
THE SON OF GOD
GOD THE SON
NO ONE KNOWS
WHAT GOD IS!
ONLY IN THE EMBODIMENT AND PERSONALITY OF
JESUS CHRIST GOD IS REVEALED!
YOU: In fact, Jesus is many things OF God…
JESUS IS THE
TOTALITY OF GOD
THE HIGHEST SPIRIT OF GOD ONLY IN
JESUS CHRIST
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
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