Firstborn of/over all creation

This topic contains 3,675 replies, has 33 voices, and was last updated by  Jodi 1 month, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #829854
     Jodi 
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    Anthony’s scriptures with mine added

    Colossians 2:9 ESV

    For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily,

    In him is the man of the seed of David

    1 Corinthians 11: 7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.

    2 Corinthians 4: 4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

    Ephesians 4:13 till we may all come to the unity of the faith and of the recognition of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to a measure of stature of the fulness of the Christ,

    John 1:1 ESV

    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

    Titus 1: 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

    In the beginning was the word of eternal life, and the word was with God, as it is something He can give to others, and the word was God because God is life. He gives through the anointing of His Spirit, because His Spirit is truth and life.

    1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

    Romans 8: 10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

    Revelation 5:14 ESV

    And the four living creatures said, “Amen!” and the elders fell down and worshiped.

    John 20: 17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

    1 Corinthians 15: 27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith* all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. 28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

    John 8: 28 Then said Jesus unto them,When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

    Revelation 1: 1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John

    John 20:28 ESV
    Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!”

    Acts 2: 35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool. 36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

    John 10: 33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we do not stone thee, but for evil speaking, and because thou, being a man, dost make thyself God. 34 Jesus answered them,`Is it not having been written in your law: I said, ye are gods? 35 if them he did call gods unto whom the word of God came, (and the Writing is not able to be broken,) 36 of him whom the Father did sanctify, and send to the world, do ye say — Thou speakest evil, because I said, Son of God I am?

    John 10:38 ESV

    But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father.”

    John 17: 21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

    Hebrews 1:8 ESV

    But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom.

    John 10: 33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we do not stone thee, but for evil speaking, and because thou, being a man, dost make thyself God. 34 Jesus answered them,`Is it not having been written in your law: I said, ye are gods? 35 if them he did call gods unto whom the word of God came, (and the Writing is not able to be broken,) 36 of him whom the Father did sanctify, and send to the world, do ye say — Thou speakest evil, because I said, Son of God I am?

    2 Samuel 7: 12 And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom. 13 He shall build a house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever. 14 I will be his father, and he shall be my son.

     

    Titus 2:13 ESV

    Waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,

    John 10: 33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we do not stone thee, but for evil speaking, and because thou, being a man, dost make thyself God. 34 Jesus answered them,`Is it not having been written in your law: I said, ye are gods? 35 if them he did call gods unto whom the word of God came, (and the Writing is not able to be broken,) 36 of him whom the Father did sanctify, and send to the world, do ye say — Thou speakest evil, because I said, Son of God I am?

    Matthew 25: 31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

    Acts 7: 56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

    Revelation 14: 14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

    Matthew 9: 6 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,)Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house.

    Matthew 13: 41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

    Matthew 16: 27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works

    Matthew 16: 28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

    Matthew 19: 28 And Jesus said unto them,Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

    Matthew 20: 28 Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many

    Matthew 24: 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

    More to come!

    #829861
     NickHassan 
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    Hi Anthony,

    Yes the fullness of deity is in the Lord Jesus.

    God is in him…….but he is not God.

    God can be in you to will and to do also.(phil)

     

    #829862
     Anthony 
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    Hi  jodi Nick and Gene

    You seem to be like Gnostic Christians they believe in The Baptism and Adoption of Jesus . God adopted Him at Jesus  baptism. 

    You must have a hard time with some of the teaching of Paul’s and him going to the gentiles.

     

    #829863
     Anthony 
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    Also like Jewish Christian, the law of the old testament is still for us, and not the law of The Lord Jesus Christ.

    #829864
     Anthony 
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    For one Nick I really don’t believe in the trinity. I believe  it like this there is only one God, Jesus is alittle lower then God that came out of the Father God before the foundation of the world. and the Holy Spirit is the power and energy of the Father, and Jesus has the same Spirit from the Father, it is the Spirit of the Father. We only have a fore- taste a down payment we will have the fullness of the Spirit after the resurrection.

    #829865
     Anthony 
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    Hi Jodi you like the ESV translation it seems to be about the only one you use. You should do a study on ESV. Did you know that they leave out whole scripture and parts of other ones. I’ll show you a couple examples.

    Let’s see how the ESV stacks up.(Matthew 18:11 NKJV) For the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost.(Matthew 18:11 ESV) deleted

    Notice the ESV jumps straight from v10 to v12. Did you know they omitted verse 11?(Revelation 11:17 NKJV) saying: We give You thanks, O Lord God Almighty, The One who is and who was and who is to come, Because You have taken Your great power and reigned.(Revelation 11:17 ESV) saying: “We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty, who is and who was and who is to come, for you have taken your great power and begun to reign.

    Whoops. They omitted the “who is to come” part.        In Him Anthony.

    #829866
     Anthony 
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    Jodi  It seems the ESV follows Westcott and Hort and their edited text. I think you need to look in to this k. Bye

    #829867
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Anthony. ..Do you even know what the teachings of the Gnostic’s were. They are nothing like what we believe, infact they are almost exactly what you and LU believe.

    THEY preached Jesus as a God, who preexisted his birth on this earth, they also, as you believe he came from the plora of the gods, was sent to earth to straighten out things here, they did not believe that Jesus was an actual human being, but was a GOD, so he did not need to be anointed with the spirit of God, because he was already a GOD, they preached he was only desguised as a man. YOU AS WELL AS LU also do not believe he was a ordinary man either do you?

    They were the orignial ANTICHRISTS, THAT WAS INFECTING THE CHURCH AT THE TIME OF Paul, and JOHN, THEY WERE IN THE CHURCH, but left starting there own form of christianity, a religion that did not believe Jesus “need to be” anointed with the spirit, because he was already a GOD, hence the term “ANTICHRIST” which the apostle John termed concerning them. They as you and Lu, did not believe JESUS WAS A ORDINARY HUMAN BEING EXACTLY LIKE WE ARE.

    The word antichrist does not mean someone against Jesus, AS FALSE CHRISTANITY TEACHES, because the Gnostics did believe in Jesus , but they were anti-baptizm of Jesus, another words anti-christo’s which means against the Christo’s or anointing of Jesus. I believe you also do not truly believe Jesus “HAD TO BE” anointed, inorder to become the CHRIST, DO YOU?

    SO YOU AND LU ARE GNOSTIC’S IN YOUR THINKING AND THEREFORE ARE ANTICHRIST’S.

    ANTHONY WHY HAVE YOU AND LU, NOT COMMITED ON THE LAST POST I POSTED TO YOU BOTH, ABOUT JESUS EXACT IDENITY TO US, GO BACK AND READ IT AND GIVE US YOUR FEED BACK. Most christains will just ignore it, as you and LU, have done, WHY IS THAT? GO BACK AND READ IT, LETS TALK ABOUT IT, EVEN THOUGH IT SHATTERS YOUR FALSE ASUMPTIONS OF JESUS our lord (adoni, a human ruler) being different then we are.

    Peace and love to you and yours. …..gene

    #829869
     Anthony 
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    Gene you don’t believe that they didn’t believe that Jesus was adopted at His baptism by Father God I don’t believe that Gene. but you seem to do.

     

    #829870
     Anthony 
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    So you do read history Gene. Do you or don’t you?

    #829871
     Anthony 
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    Earlier Jewish Christian, did believe that Gene. (was adopted by the Farther) at His baptism. They both had alot of thing i don’t agree with. Gene wow you read history! I know what they believe.

    #829872
     Anthony 
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    It show a man how easy it is to believe in wrong teaching we need to search these things but it’s not that people believe everything they read, but how they believed doesn’t mean they where right about all things that’s where we have to make a choice if they were or wasn’t. Yes Gene we need to check out the start of christian and follow it all the way up to the present. they were our for-fathers of the gospel.we need to try to keep the word as close to the original as we kind too. Watch new translation they too need to be check out. K bye.

    #829873
     Anthony 
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    Hi

    Nineteenth century occult mystic Fenton Hort is perhaps best known for his part in the work of the corrupt bible revision committee of 1881. Speaking on the subject of creating a new eclectic New Testament text Hort stated:

    “At present very many orthodox but rational men are being unawares acted upon by influences which will assuredly bear good fruit in due time, if the process is allowed to go on quietly;” (Life and letters of Fenton John Anthony Hort, Vol. 1, 1896, p. 400).

    #829874
     Anthony 
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    Hi

    Nineteenth century occult mystic Fenton Hort is perhaps best known for his part in the work of the corrupt bible revision committee of 1881. Speaking on the subject of creating a new eclectic New Testament text Hort stated:

    “At present very many orthodox but rational men are being unawares acted upon by influences which will assuredly bear good fruit in due time, if the process is allowed to go on quietly;” (Life and letters of Fenton John Anthony Hort, Vol. 1, 1896, p. 400). Why I can’t I accept ESV tranltransl they take away from the word .

    #829875
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Anothny….Here is just some of what Gnostic’s taugh, you speak as if you know there teachings, ok lets see.

    1….Jesus was a GOD, was who sent from the PLORA of the GOD’S………………………..do you?
    2….Jesus was only desguised as a human. But really was not just a human………………do you?
    3….They did not believe Jesus came into his “existence” as “just” a real human being…..do you?
    4….They taught Jesus did not need to be anointed by God, because he was born with it…..do you?

    Seems you have more in common with the Gnostic’s then you think. And as for knowing the history of the Gnostic’s and what they taught , i would wager i have studied them and what they taught more by far then you have.

    Lu has completely bought into their “Lie’ and you arn’t that far from her either IMO. Were telling you the truth here it’s time you start to listen before it’s to late Anthony, if not already.

    Peace and love to you and yours. …….gene

    #829876
     Anthony 
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    Gene . Gnostic Christians and others, were all adoptionists. In accordance with the first hundred years of Christian belief and with the oldest manuscripts of the Bible, Jesus was born in a normal way like the rest of us, to his parents, Joseph and Mary, from the line of David as prophesized (Matt. 1:1,9:27Luke 1:32John 7:41-3Acts 13:232 Tim. 2:8Rev. 5:5 and 22:16). Jesus kept God’s laws so well that on his baptism, God adopted him as his son. You believe like that Gene that’s what your telling me.

    #829877
     Anthony 
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    Gene

    Theodotus of Byzantium was the most prominent adherent to this error.

    Adoptionism is an error concerning Christ that first appeared in the first and second century. Those who held it denied the preexistence of Christ and, therefore, Adoptionists taught that Jesus was tested by God,and after passing this test and upon His baptism, He was granted supernatural powers by God and adopted  the Son.

     

    #829878
     NickHassan 
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    Hi LU,

    Jn 14.1

    Let not your heart be troubled.

    Believe in God, believe also in me.

     

    Jesus Christ is not God but he is the way to God.

    No one comes to the Father except by him.

    Those who have the son have life.

    #829879
     NickHassan 
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    Hi Anthony,

    Jesus of Nazareth has a mother.

    Does the preexistent one you call Jesus have a mother?

    The Son of Mary had flesh derived in part from his mother. What of the one you offer?

    Was he conceived?

    #829881
     Jodi 
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    Good Morning Anthony,

    You said, “common logic has to come in to this all. One of my thoughts is this. For Jesus to be just a man, He would had to be born by Joseph and Mary but he wasn’t. If He had been born just with 50% of Mary’s DNA the(xx) Gene. And God done the other half with(yx) Gene. Jesus wouldn’t be without spot of sin. he would be blemish with sin. If it was all of God DNA that would have been a super miracle with the Virgin Mary that would make more sense to me. Being a virgin has nothing to with with out sin. that has to do with not having sex. God bless something to think about.”

    You’re DENYING a FEW clear scriptures here, please try and EXPLAIN how these can fit with your THOUGHTS from above,

    This is Paul talking about HUMANS,

    1 John 3: 9 every one who hath been begotten of God, sin he doth not, because his seed in him doth remain, and he is not able to sin, because of God he hath been begotten.

    10 In this manifest are the children of God..23 and this is His command, that we may believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and may love one another, even as He did give command to us.

    Psalms 2:4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. 5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure. 6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion. 7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; THIS DAY HAVE I BEGOTTEN THEE. 

    There is not a scripture about a person needing to be conceived in a womb having GOD DNA in order to be without spot or blemish.

    Scripture tells us precisely that a HUMAN must be begotten with God’s Holy Spirit, born of water and of the Spirit.  Scripture tells us precisely WHEN Jesus was begotten with the Holy Spirit and it was NOT at his birth.

    Anthony what would have been the purpose of the baptism of Jesus then? Jesus said after his baptism,  “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,”

    You deny Jesus’s words of which he said after his baptism.

    John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. Jesus was a MAN and he is still called the son of man and we are told that God appointed him as king of kings over His Kingdom, which was a promise given to the prophets.  

    His baptism with the Holy Spirit is what made him walk in the path of God and kept him without sin, not having been born with God’s DNA.

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