@Lightenup,

Did you actually read the Proverb? In verse 3 it says “she cries out:” and what is she proclaiming? EVERYTHING AFTER THAT!! Grammar is your friend. Don’t forget to look out for those pesky quotation marks as she is continuing to “cry out.”

Guess again!

The Son was born/begotten before the creation of the depths and mountains. A bir…

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@Lightenup,

Now begin reading from verse one; who is speaking throughout the entire chapter? Are you paying attention to the quotation marks? Apparently you didn’t read what I wrote on this chapter a few posts back.

Also, why are you starting toward the end of the chapter? I’ll ask again, do you begin reading a novel in the middle? If not, wh…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

Once again, what you are sighting is “polluted”; it is not based in the Tanakh. I do not base anything on the interpretive minds of man; to site Philo as an authoritative source falls flat; he was a GREEK PHILOSOPHER who happened to be Jewish…big whoop! To site this Jew or that Jew because they believed this or that, is it true Jud…[Read more]

@lightenup,

We’re going in circles.

Philo was a Jewish Greek philosopher (Hellenized Jew) and if that is your proof for wisdom being divine and the creator of the world, you need to find another source as his perspective is from Greek philosophy and NOT Judaism.

You then site a book (Sirach) that is not in any biblical translation as p…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

That’s an interesting interpretation of Prov 8:22-31; except there is more to this chapter than nine verses. Does believing something make it truth or do you believe what you believe because it fits your religious beliefs?

To understand these nine verses, one MUST start at the beginning of the chapter. Do you start in the middle of a…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

What is this being, according to your understanding of the Hebrew Scriptures?

There’s your misunderstanding, wisdom is not a “being”; wisdom is a characteristic. Wisdom is a gift from G-d given to mankind before G-d created everything, as Solomon writes. Wisdom in this chapter is personified and given man like qualities; does this…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

Please explain the point you’re trying to make concerning Proverbs 8. Make a statement or ask the question.

@Lightenup,

Please don’t try to psychoanalyze me…it won’t end well 🙂

The “crux” has nothing to do with creation (although what I understand today is opposite of chrisitanity); the “crux” is the christian church lied to me for 40 years and I have only recently come to realize it. My journey started with asking my pastor questions to the poin…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

Your second set of “if you can’t prove the opposite, your wrong and I’m right” childish arguments.

Where does the Tanakh say the Messiah must come from Solomon specifically?

II Sam 7:12 and I Chron 28:7 are the two passages I already gave you; unless you don’t understand the “birds and the bees.” Every person up to Solomon was c…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

Your response is bewildering! You can’t support what you believe so you’re going to use reverse arguments to support it; because to doesn’t say it’s not there, it is?!??? A pastor tried this on me once; we’re adults, not grade-schoolers on a playground. Either you can support what you believe or you can’t; if you can’t, why do you…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

When God says He will make Solomon’s dynasty “permanent,” He does not mean an endless biological chain of Solomon’s sons ruling on earth.

OBVIOUSLY!!!! Jecohiah had his kingship removed and the line of kings ended. Read Hosea 3:4-5 where G-d tells Israel they would be without a king until the end of days (that’s a good one for a lat…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

Proverbs 30:4 is a riddle about the identity of a divine figure.

How did I know you were going to say it’s a riddle! Why do you believe it’s a riddle? What if there isn’t anything mysterious about the passage at all and it’s just Solomon using wisdom to express the power of G-d that no man possesses, no matter the level of power o…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

You didn’t answer this question:

So what does G-d mean when he says of Solomon “I will make his dynasty permanent” or “I will grant to his dynasty permanent rule over Israel”?

Who’s dynasty will be made permanent and who made the promise?

@Lightenup,

1. “God sent His Son” — Tanakh foundation

The Tanakh repeatedly speaks of a divine figure sent by God who is distinct from God yet shares His nature.

– Prov 30:4 — “What is His name, and what is His Son’s name, if you know?”

Explain how Prov 30:4 is a reference for God sending His Son; and how the Jesus is shown to be “a divine figur…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

My apologizes, I said things that you weren’t privy to in the past as you weren’t apart of those conversations. Most everything you just stated I have commented on. The only personal thing I asked was is it fear or stubbornness that keeps you where you are; nothing more, nothing less. If you feel this is a personal attack, it is not…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

God the Father sent His only begotten Son into the world as a bond servant, fully man while still remaining eternally divine, as the promised Messiah. Born of the seed of Abraham through Mary who married Joseph. The Messiah is sitting at the right hand of the Father who will put all His enemies under His feet.

You didn’t answer, is i…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

So what does G-d mean when he says of Solomon “I will make his dynasty permanent” or “I will grant to his dynasty permanent rule over Israel”?

@Lightenup,

Please re-read “He will build a house for my name, and I will make his dynasty permanent.” The one who built the Temple is the same whose dynasty will be permanent…it is speaking of Solomon and no other son.

Again it says, “He will build a temple to honor me; he will become my son, and I will become his father. I will grant to hi…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

1. “Messiah must come through Solomon, not Nathan.”
The Tanakh never states that requirement. The promises to David in 2 Samuel 7 and 1 Chronicles 22 establish a dynasty, not a single-branch requirement. Later prophets describe the future ruler as:
– “a shoot from the stump of Jesse” (Isa 11:1)
– “a righteous Branch for David” (Jer 2…

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@Lightenup,

Jesus is biologically the seed of David through Mary whose father provides the tribal lineage.

Now we’re going in circles and you’re parroting what you have been told is truth. You still haven’t explained how Mary can be used for lineage when her lineage is traced back to David thru Nathan and who did G-d say the Messiah was to be a…[Read more]