What does it mean that Jesus came in the flesh?

Participant

Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 03 2013,22:57)

Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 03 2013,15:58)

Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 03 2013,17:06)

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 03 2013,07:55)

Wakeup,

Like you, Mike is unable to satisfactory explain why spirits can eat and be touched when Jesus denied being one because he do both.

It is certainly not the only place your claim that Jesus is spirit falls short of the truth.

This is what I understand from all the gospels .

That is correct.
How can jesus appear to them in a spirit body?
1.they can not see spirits.
2.That also wont proof that it was *HIM* indeed,
the same Jesus crucified.

wakeup.

Quote

2.That also wont proof that it was *HIM* indeed,
the same Jesus crucified.

that is something you have to understand with your heart and not with your mind only,

their is enough scriptures in truth to that ,find them and believe ,just as the apostles did have too,

Yes, and Jesus went up to heaven to be seen by men.
To witness to the world that they have seen him ascend with their own eyes.
And also the coming,for every eye shall see him,
and they shall mourn,and tremble.
But his eyes will be like burning fire.

wakeup.

December 3, 2013 at 2:27 pm#363075

terraricca

Participant

Quote

Yes, and Jesus went up to heaven to be seen by men.

NO,not to be seen by men ,but to convince his followers that what he said so many times before he died was the truth in all respect ,

words only have power when they become fulfilled,

December 3, 2013 at 3:25 pm#363080

Participant

Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 04 2013,00:27)

Quote

Yes, and Jesus went up to heaven to be seen by men.

NO,not to be seen by men ,but to convince his followers that what he said so any times before he died was the truth in all respect ,

words only have power when they become fulfilled,

Hmm?

Over five hundred men saw him go up?

wakeup.

December 3, 2013 at 3:40 pm#363081

terraricca

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 03 2013,20:25)

Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 04 2013,00:27)

Quote

Yes, and Jesus went up to heaven to be seen by men.

NO,not to be seen by men ,but to convince his followers that what he said so any times before he died was the truth in all respect ,

words only have power when they become fulfilled,

Hmm?

Over five hundred men saw him go up?

wakeup.

yeah 500 beLievers

December 3, 2013 at 4:21 pm#363086

Participant

And to think flesh and blood can and will not, be in the Kingdom of God is pure garbage, What Jesus was saying is that the Body (flesh and blood) can not, “INHERIT” IT, in fact a flesh “BODY” can't “INHERIT” anything it is composed of matter, it is the Spirit in that Body which is the LIFE “IN” that body that “INHERITS” IT, but that does not mean the resurrected flesh and bone Body does not go into the Kingdom of God. In fact many scriptures show flesh and blood will be in the Kingdom of God.

Kerwin is right in this Wakeup. Do you guys really think God created all the Physical creation to just through away and have us become spirits beings and drift around in space unseen and unrecognized for ever?

All Spirits desires Bodies to Dwell in, even the Spirit of God does, or haven't you read The spirit “EARNESTLY” desires us and even demonic Spirit want our bodies to dwell in, Jesus cast many out of Peoples bodies, Spirit are not Bodies at all they desire them and are said By Jesus to go around in “ARID” Places looking for rest. God's the Fathers Body is his creation he lives vicariously in and through it, or haven't you read “that God may be “IN” all and “THROUGH” all and again You bodies “ARE” the temples of the Living GOD Spirits love bodies God has created and want to live and dwell in them.

Problem here is some people do not know what a Spirit is, they are not bodies of any kind, they dwell in bodies of all kinds, Just as it say For God give it (a spirit) a body of it's own, Just as he sees fit And those bodies can and will be in the Kingdom of GOD, many scriptures show it. Did not Jesus tell us to Pray “thy Kingdom Come thy will be done on earth as in heaven?

So do you really think when that happens everything on this earth will turn into invisible spirits? I don't think so, but then “MYSTERY” RELIGIONS teach a lot of things.

Jesus' body did not see corruption Just as scripture Prophesied it to happen, for thou will not leave my “SOUL” (Jesus' body) in hell (the grave) neither will thou suffer thine HOLY ONE to see Corruption. (decompose in the grave).

peace and love to you and yours……………………gene

December 3, 2013 at 5:07 pm#363094

Participant

Mike……..Your example of a Dirt Devil being a Spirit fits what i have been saying all along , but the Body is the dirt and the invisible force causing it is the Wind or in your example the spirit, but for it to be a dirt devil it takes Both a Force (spirit) and a Body the dirt. , and what we see is the Dirt (body) not the force causing it. So you example fit exactly with what I have been saying, and only proves you wrong. Bad choice of examples to try to prove you point that spirit “ARE” Bodies, if you ask me.

PS……..Still waiting for my answer to this scripture, 1 Cor 8:4…> we know that there is no idols in the world and that there is “NO” God but “ONE”. thought you would have figure some way around it by now, I am sure if you could have you would have by now. IMO

peace and lvoe to you and yours……………………….gene

December 4, 2013 at 12:21 am#363101

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 04 2013,02:21)

Wakeup………your applying things to scriptures that are not “Specifically” said , for instance you say the word Lucifer is a fallen Being, as many people do, but all of you fail to read what it actually says, If you will go back to the very Start where God told Ezekiel to take this “PROVERB” (a factious illustration) to the King of Babylon. The word “Lucifer” means rising star , much like we use the term for other things like a movie star or people increasing in power. God was sending a message to the King of Babylon , and nothing more, but false religion make it out to mean a description of Satan, when that is not at all what the message is about. Go look up the meaning of the word proverb a Strongs Concordance, Lucifer is not another name for :Ha-Satan:, that is mystery religion that has taught that IMO.
And to think flesh and blood can and will not, be in the Kingdom of God is pure garbage, What Jesus was saying is that the Body (flesh and blood) can not, “INHERIT” IT, in fact a flesh “BODY” can't “INHERIT” anything it is composed of matter, it is the Spirit in that Body which is the LIFE “IN” that body that “INHERITS” IT, but that does not mean the resurrected flesh and bone Body does not go into the Kingdom of God. In fact many scriptures show flesh and blood will be in the Kingdom of God.
Kerwin is right in this Wakeup. Do you guys really think God created all the Physical creation to just through away and have us become spirits beings and drift around in space unseen and unrecognized for ever?

So do you really think when that happens everything on this earth will turn into invisible spirits? I don't think so, but then “MYSTERY” RELIGIONS teach a lot of things.

peace and love to you and yours……………………gene

Gene B.

Quote

………your applying things to scriptures that are not “Specifically” said , for instance you say the word Lucifer is a fallen Being, as many people do, but all of you fail to read what it actually says, If you will go back to the very Start where God told Ezekiel to take this “PROVERB” (a factious illustration) to the King of Babylon. The word “Lucifer” means rising star , much like we use the term for other things like a movie star or people increasing in power. God was sending a message to the King of Babylon , and nothing more, but false religion make it out to mean a description of Satan, when that is not at all what the message is about. Go look up the meaning of the word proverb a Strongs Concordance, Lucifer is not another name for :Ha-Satan:, that is mystery religion that has taught that IMO.

Saying that lucifer is a rising star is contradictory.

1.HOW ART THOU **FALLEN** FROM HEAVEN O' LUCIFER?
2 KING NEB.OF BABYLON HAS NEVER COME FROM HEAVEN
3.FALSE TEACHINGS HAS PROPMOTED LUCIFER AS A RISING
STAR,NOT AS THE FATHER OF EVIL.(THE DEVIL).
4.ISAIAH 14:12.HOW ART THOU **FALLEN** FROM HEAVEN
O' LUCIFER,SON OF THE MORNING. (NOT MORNING
STAR).(NOT RISING STAR).(BUT FALLEN STAR).

Ezekiel 28:13 **Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God**; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.

1.LUCIFER WAS CREATED,NOT BORN.
2.HE WAS IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN.
3. KING NEB OF BABYLON HAS NOT BEEN IN EDEN
HE WAS NOT BORN.

Ezekiel 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

1.LUCIFER WAS THE ANOINTED CHERUB(UPPER CLASS
ANGEL).
2.KING NEB HAS NEVER BEEN IN HEAVEN THE HOLY
MOUNTAIN OF GOD.

Quote

1.FLESH AND BONE IS MADE OF THE DUST OF THE EARTH
AND IT SHALL RETURN TO THE EARTH.
2.THE FIRST ADAM IS MADE OF THE DUST OF THE EARTH.
THE SECOND ADAM IS MADE **A QUICKENING SPIRIT**.
3. John 6:53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I
say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man,
and **drink his blood**, ye have no life in you.
4. HERE IS BLOOD MENTIONED;AND WE ARE TO DRINK IT
TO HAVE LIFE.
5. HAVE YOU DRUNKEN HIS BLOOD?
6. HAVE YOU TASTED HIS FLESH,AND HIS BONES?
7.IS THERE A BUTCHER IN YOUR AREA GIVING OUT HIS
HOLY FLESH? SO YOU CAN EAT HIS FLESH AND DRINK
HIS BLOOD?
8.THIS IS ABOUT EATING HIS SPIRIT FLESH AND DRINKING
HIS SPIRIT BLOOD.

Quote

**All Spirits desires Bodies to Dwell in**, even the Spirit of God does, or haven't you read The spirit “EARNESTLY” desires us and even demonic Spirit want our bodies to dwell in, Jesus cast many out of Peoples bodies, Spirit are not Bodies at all they desire them and are said By Jesus to go around in “ARID” Places looking for rest. God's the Fathers Body is his creation he lives vicariously in and through it, or haven't you read “that God may be “IN” all and “THROUGH” all and again You bodies “ARE” the temples of the Living GOD Spirits love bodies God has created and want to live and dwell in them.

Problem here is some people do not know what a Spirit is, they are not bodies of any k
ind, they dwell in bodies of all kinds, Just as it say For God give it (a spirit) a body of it's

1.DOES GOD ALSO NEED A FLESH BODY TO DWELL IN?
2.EVIL SPIRIT HAVE NO BODIE TO DWELL IN.
3.FALLEN ANGELS HAVE A BODY MADE OF SPIRIT,NOT
FLESH.
4.THEY WERE NOT CREATED OUT OF THE DUST OF THE
EARTH.
5.FLESH CAN NOT SEE SPIRIT;BUT SPIRIT CAN SEE SPIRIT.
6. EVERY PERSON IS NOT POSSESSED BY SOME SPIRIT.
7.EVERY PERSON HAS HIS OWN SPIRIT.
8.YOU HAVE *THE SPIRIT* OF SEEKING,BUT SATAN HAS LED
YOU THROUGH A DIFFERENT PATH,BECAUSE YOU DID
NOT EAT THE FLESH OF CHRIST,BUT SOME OTHER FLESH.

You must have been reading those new books.
They are inspired by satan; For I can see;all seems to be the opposite.We must be careful what bible and books we read,
for satan is the deceiver and he has his spirit in all of them.
HE IS NOT THE MORNING RISING STAR,BUT A FALLEN STAR.

wakeup.

December 4, 2013 at 1:14 am#363106

kerwin

Participant

Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 03 2013,12:06)

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 03 2013,07:55)

Wakeup,

Like you, Mike is unable to satisfactory explain why spirits can eat and be touched when Jesus denied being one because he do both.

It is certainly not the only place your claim that Jesus is spirit falls short of the truth.

This is what I understand from all the gospels .

Yes, they thought Jesus was a ghost. A ghost is a type of spirit and Jesus instead of using the Koine Greek word for ghost used the one for spirit. So was he acting on things that were true of all spirits or just of ghosts? I believe it was all spirits.

Another thing we know is that Jesus was resurrected with a body of flesh and bone. His resurrection is the archetype of the final resurrection. Why do you think we are no raised like him?

December 4, 2013 at 5:09 pm#363176

Participant

Wakeup……..You still failed as most do to read the beginning of what God told Isiah, and you never looked up the word “Proverb” also did you?

Isa 14:4…> That you shall take up this “PROVERB” (a parable or factious illustration) against the “KING OF BABYLON”, Not :Ha-Satan:. Now to the “ONLY” Place where the word “LUCIFER” is even used in scripture, Isa 14:12…> How are you fallen from heaven (high place) O “LUCIFER”, son of the Morning , how are you cut down to the ground, which did weaken the nations! ………,….., ….> (16) They that look upon you, consider you, saying, is this the “MAN” that made the earth tremble, that did shake kingdoms.

Seem scripture say your Lucifer (the morning star which is a rising star, called the sun) is a “MAN” according to “scripture” but i do understand “MYSTERY RELIGION” views it differently.

And tell us this could Adam and Eve , both Flesh and blood being LIVED for EVER, Yes or NO , God said the could have and with the Bodies they have, if the were to eat of the tree of live and “NEVER DIE” . Many lived almost 1000 years anyway even after they sinned.

Job 19 :26……> And though after my skin worms destroy “THIS” “BODY”, yet “IN MY FLESH” shall I see GOD.

Seen like Job looked for a resurrection of a Flesh Body>

Now lets see here, Jesus said he was raised with a body and was not a spirit, and no scripture shows any Morphing process from a flesh and bone person to a so-called Spirit “body”,taking place, and Job seem to think he would see God in a resurrected “FLESH” Body, and God Shows us in the valley of dry bones that it is a “flesh and bone” resurrection for the “WHOLE” house of Israel. So what do you people do with that in your “MYSTERY RELIGIOUS” conceptions do you simple through it out of your bible as if it does not exist and just go on in ignorance?

It's up to you Wakeup, if you want to stay in those false teaching, if you do you will continue to blind your own self and not seriously start to seek the truth. And as far us thinking is some new age teachings we believe in, that is false.

It is the past and present distortions of the truth brought on by false religion which started over a thousand years ago that you people are hanging on to is the problem. Like the word Lucifer, being Satan, like being changed into a s-call spirit body, which is no where written in scriptures, like preexistence of Jesus and the Trinitarian teaching and many others also. To me it's kind of Like an old friend of my used to say, “they do not know if they are a foot or horseback”, I still love you all anyway.

peace and love to you and yours……………….gene

December 6, 2013 at 12:05 am#363244

Blocked

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 02 2013,19:55)

Wakeup,

Like you, Mike is unable to satisfactory explain why spirits can eat and be touched when Jesus denied being one because he do both.

Kerwin,

Jesus said spirits do not have flesh and bones. He didn't say they can't eat, nor did he say they can't be touched.

That is in your mind, which therefore leaves me no sensible reason to “satisfactorily explain” away something you made up in the first place.

December 6, 2013 at 12:08 am#363245

Blocked

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 02 2013,20:22)

Mike,

A spirit has no body. It is a ghost.

Hmmmm…………

But the disciples, upon SEEING Jesus, thought they were seeing a spirit/ghost, right? How do you explain that they thought he was a ghost when they were clearly seeing a man with a BODY?

If spirits don't have bodies, then why would the disciples see a BODIED person in front of them, and think it was a spirit?

December 6, 2013 at 12:09 am#363246

kerwin

Participant

Mike,

As I said your answer is not satisfactory.

Ghosts cannot eat or be touched and that is the kind of spirit the disciples thought Jesus. Some translations even say ghost instead of the more literal translation of spirit.

December 6, 2013 at 12:12 am#363247

kerwin

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 06 2013,05:08)

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 02 2013,20:22)

Mike,

A spirit has no body. It is a ghost.

Hmmmm…………

But the disciples, upon SEEING Jesus, thought they were seeing a spirit/ghost, right? How do you explain that they thought he was a ghost when they were clearly seeing a man with a BODY?

If spirits don't have bodies, then why would the disciples see a BODIED person in front of them, and think it was a spirit?

Mike,

It is a visual effect without a physical body. It is not the first time the disciples thought Jesus was a ghost.

December 6, 2013 at 12:23 am#363249

Blocked

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 02 2013,20:33)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 03 2013,05:25)

1. Is it your understanding that BODIES have souls of their own?

Mike,

It is my understanding that since the original Hebrew versions of Scripture state that the animal soul is in the blood then in some way the soul is in the blood.

So you're saying that Jesus no longer has a soul at all, since the soul is in the blood, and Jesus now consists of only flesh and bone, but not blood?

Our Lord and King doesn't have a soul?

From my reading today:
Job 11:20 NET
“But the eyes of the wicked fail, and escape eludes them; their one hope is to breathe their last.”

The actual Hebrew says, their one hope is the breathing out of the soul.

Does that mean we breathe out all of our blood when we die?

Also consider:
Matthew 10:28 King James Version
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

1 Thessalonians 5:23 King James Version
And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Both of these teachings seem to indicate that the soul is something OTHER THAN the body. And that means bodies don't HAVE souls, Kerwin. And it is hard for me to believe we will all be soul-less after the resurrection.

Also, bodies don't have spirits of their own. Bodies themselves are not “spiritual”, in the sense that the body itself decides whether or not to follow the path of righteousness.

So if Paul is teaching that the natural BODY will be destroyed, and we will receive a new, spiritual BODY – then he is obviously talking about the MATERIAL of which those bodies are comprised. The former is comprised of natural stuff, like the dust of the earth….. and the latter will be comprised of spiritual stuff – like spirit.

December 6, 2013 at 12:29 am#363251

Blocked

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 05 2013,17:12)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 06 2013,05:08)

Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 02 2013,20:22)

Mike,

A spirit has no body. It is a ghost.

Hmmmm…………

But the disciples, upon SEEING Jesus, thought they were seeing a spirit/ghost, right? How do you explain that they thought he was a ghost when they were clearly seeing a man with a BODY?

If spirits don't have bodies, then why would the disciples see a BODIED person in front of them, and think it was a spirit?

Mike,

It is a visual effect without a physical body.

A visual effect, huh? Kerwin, how exactly do you KNOW all this stuff about the spirit realm? Are you secretly a ghost who doesn't have a body?

Listen closely: The disciples saw a man WITH A BODY. Yet they thought they were seeing a spirit.

Apparently, the disciples weren't ghosts like you, and weren't aware ghosts don't have bodies.

Kerwin, you have lost this point on SO MANY levels it isn't even funny anymore. Go talk to someone else about it for a while. I have no more interest in dealing with your willful ignorance on this matter.

December 6, 2013 at 12:31 am#363253

Blocked

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 03 2013,09:21)

Do you guys really think God created all the Physical creation to just through away and have us become spirits beings and drift around in space unseen and unrecognized for ever?

Where did Satan say he had been when God asked him in Job 1 and 2?

December 6, 2013 at 12:32 am#363254

Blocked

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 03 2013,10:07)

PS……..Still waiting for my answer to this scripture, 1 Cor 8:4…> we know that there is no idols in the world and that there is “NO” God but “ONE”. thought you would have figure some way around it by now, I am sure if you could have you would have by now. IMO

Gene,

Who is the “Son” that is called “O God” in Hebrews 1:8?

December 6, 2013 at 4:11 pm#363279

Participant

Mike ……..That Son is Jesus the one who GOD was “IN” You have never believed God was “TRULY in Jesus doing the “WORKS” have you Mike? Where ever God presences is He is there, Jesus has the fullness of God DWELLING, “IN” Him AS Thomas came to recognize when he said My lord (adoni) “AND”my God. Two being Present in One body , which God calls his temples. or don't you recall Paul saying that, know you not, that you “BODIES” are the “TEMPLES” of the Living GOD.

As i have said you have no idea what a Spirit really is and all Spirits want Physical Bodies to Dwell “IN” , without a body a spirit is considered naked, That is why it says concerning Jesus a “BODY” I have prepared for you, and again, God gives “IT” (a spirit) a “BODY” just as he pleases, a “BODY” of It's (a spirit) “OWN”.

Again as i have said before you have no idea what a spirit is and that is your down fall, a Spirit is the living force “IN a BODY, and Not the BODY itself, or we would have a body within a body right> according to you thinking that is, and if a Spirit was a BODY, why would God even create a body out of the dust any way, common sense should tell you that.

Your own example of a dirt devil should also give you a clue, because the force (the wind) is not a Body it is the dust that makes up the body of a dust devil, the force (i.e. the spirit) is causing the dust devil to exist. A spirit without a body go about in “ARID” or (dry places) looking for REST, why is that seeing, according to you, it is has a body of it own, why seek a BODY to Dwell in the first place, seeing it's “spirit body” is superior and much better?

Mike you have never put it together That God who is a Spirit lives variously in and through his creation have you? When Jesus said the FATHER “IN” me HE DOES the work he was not LYING> The fullness of God was dwelling in “BODILY” Form, “in Jesus”, and it is that same GOD who is a Spirit who will build his Kingdom through Jesus and the Saints, that same God who is “IN” Jesus is the God that will cause Jesus enemies to become his foot stool in the Millennial reign of Jesus and the Saints on this earth as PHYSICAL FLESH BEINGS.

Now if you understand that then you have your answer to your supposedly unanswered question. Of why it say they Throne O God is an everlasting Kingdom, because it will, be even when Jesus turns it over to God the father, and becomes “subject” to it, Just as all creation will be. If you understood the future Kingdom is God own Personal Woke in Jesus and Jesus without GOD being “IN” him could never have built it in the first place, then you can easily understand why it say that and still not mean Jesus himself was a God himself. Mike you simply do not understand what a Spirit “IS”, it is Not a Body of any kind never was , never will be either. Spirits are what is “IN” Bodies. Nothing complicated about that. IMO

Now going on, what does this say < we know that there is no idol in the world, and that there is "NO" God but "ONE". i see you are still dodging that bullet, right Mike?

peace and love to you and yours……………………………………..gene

December 7, 2013 at 1:50 am#363300