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Hi Jodi,
You: The message in Jude 1 is ALL about MEN who have sinned and their punishment. The chapter doesn’t go from talking about man, to then celestial messengers, to then man again. We have account of prophets who were said to be in God’s abode, but then spoke lies, and so God cast them out into darkness. Go read the book of Jeremiah, you even have these human messengers being compared to Sodom and Gomorrah just like in Jude. John the baptist was a PROPHET and he was also called a MESSENGER, likewise Paul was called a MESSENGER, but you think in Jude given the context and examples of men sinning and being punishment that the messengers are celestial messengers and not human ones? That is absurd, you are forcing the text to fit a fable.
Jude 1:6 (YLT) also, those who did not keep their own principality, but did leave their proper dwelling, to a judgment of a great day, in bonds everlasting, under darkness He hath kept,
Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Me:
NO! Where in the bible does it say that strange flesh alludes to animals.
American Standard Version
Jude 1:6 And (32. aggelos: angels, messengers) that kept not their own principality, but left their proper habitation, he hath kept in everlasting bonds under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.https://biblehub.com/jude/1-6.htm
All of the translations except YLT have angels instead of messengers. Yes, an aggelos can mean messenger, but it can and does mean an angel, which is a messenger and is used as such here.The gist of Jude is for the various kinds of sins that mimic what was happening in the days of Noah which will reoccur during these later days. And the main trust of the evil is the genetic modification that polluted all flesh on the planet. This is happening now.
Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. 27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
Me: Who was “they” that married wives? It had to be other than human males. By the way, animals don’t marry.
2 Peter 3:3 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, ALL THINGS continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
Me: “Strange flesh” pertains to flesh not created by God. There is nothing strange about animal flesh. There is a lot to be said about the angels that left their natural habitation of bodies and created bodies that were not in the realm of any kind of flesh that God had created. Why is it strange? It is because God himself is the creator of all legitimate flesh and not these angelic beings. These should not create their flesh. The false science of evolution teaches that things will evolve as they have from the being or big bang. Thus 2 Peter 3:3 is addressing evolution. In fact, Tran humanism is suppose to be an acceleration of this. Genetic modification is also in the realm the of creating strange flesh.
1 Cor 15:38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. 39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. 40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.
Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good.Me: God did not create any strange flesh. The mischief angels did. They were then polluting the human geno. Scientist are doing the same to the human race.
Ever heard of Agenda 21?
Hi Jodi,
Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. 27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; 28 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
Me: God initiated the destruction.
Matt 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.
Me: What was so terrible in the two above passages that would cause all flesh to be lost? What did Sodom have in common with the last days that would bring this on? Was it eating and drinking? Was it buying and selling or perhaps planting and building? These are ordinary functions of humanity. What was mentioned in Luke 17:27 that were not mentioned in verse 28? It is “marrying and giving in marriage”. This is what was happeneing in Genesis 6:
Genesis 6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.Me: The angles had the “strange flesh” that produced the giants when they co inhabited with woman. If these beings were human, Genesis 6 would have taken into the consideration the daughters of God also, it had not.
Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their FIRST ESTATE (746. arché: origin), but (620. apoleipó: abandoned) their own habitation (3613. oikétérion: abode, dwelling) , he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
2 Cor 5:2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house (3613. oikétérion: abode, dwelling) which is from heaven:
3613. oikétérion
Thayer’s Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 3613: οἰκητήριονοἰκητήριον, ὀικητηριου, τό (οἰκητήρ), a dwelling-place, habitation: Jude 1:6; of the body as the dwelling-place of the spirit, 2 Corinthians 5:2 (2 Macc. 11:2; 3Macc. 2:15; (Josephus, contra Apion 1, 20, 7); Euripides, Plutarch, Cebes () tab. 17).
Me: The angels in Jude 1:6 abandoned their bodies to take on new bodies which they had created. This is “strange flesh”.
https://medium.com/@farimagdalamaliakanagast/nephilim-what-in-the-world-happened-to-the-biblical-12-foot-plus-giants-fari-magdala-83c49f295768Jos 11:21 And at that time came Joshua, and cut off the Anakims (6062. Anaq: giants) from the mountains, from Hebron, from Debir, from Anab, and from all the mountains of Judah, and from all the mountains of Israel: Joshua destroyed them utterly with their cities. 22 There was none of the Anakims left in the land of the children of Israel: only in Gaza, in Gath, and in Ashdod, there remained.
https://biblehub.com/hebrew/6062.htm
Me: Like the flood in Genesis and the destruction in Sodom, the destruction of the Anakims was COMPLETE. These Anakims were nephulium giants.
Jude 1:6 (YLT) messengers also, those who did not keep their own principality, but did leave their proper dwelling, to a judgment of a great day, in bonds everlasting, under darkness He hath kept,
2 Peter 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
Me: The chains of darkness is not reserved for men.
Hi All,
Are you awake to what’s happening?
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Hi Jodi
You said: The bible teaches us that man sins from his own heart and imagination
Me: You neglect to see that in my post, the third enemy is the flesh which would cover most of what you said about our heart and imagination, the old man, the natural man.
But you neglect to see that the Devil temps us also. Wasn’t Jesus Christ tempted by the Devil, was that Christ’s heart and imagination? The world has a tendency to lead us into sin — evil companions, pleasures, fashions, opinions, and aims. Does the world do this? Be honest.
You said: Jesus called Peter a
Me: The Bible calls the Devil “the wicked one,” “the devil,” “a murderer,” “a liar, and the father of lies,” “an adversary” who seeks to devour, “that old serpent,” and “accuser of our brethren” (Matthew 13:19; Luke 4:33; John 8:44; 1Peter 5:8; Revelation 12:9-10
Matt. 19 When anyone hears the [a]word of the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart. This is the one on whom seed was sown beside the road.
Luke
If You are the Son of God, throw Yourself down from here; 10 for it is written,
‘He will command His angels concerning You to guard You,’
11 and,
‘On their hands they will bear You up,
So that You will not strike Your foot against a stone.’”12 And Jesus answered and said to him, “It is said, ‘You shall not put the Lord your God to the test.’”
13 When the devil had finished every temptation, he left Him until an opportune time.
1 Peter 5:8 Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.
Rev. 12:9,10 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole [a]world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
God bless.
Good Morning TC,
As I believe that YHWH alone exists with Powers and He fulfills that which He says, blessing and cursing bringing forth “ra”, darkness and death, and He uses His celestial messengers to carryout His will of both blessing and cursing, I don’t speak wickedly against His angels when they do bring forth “ra”, being adversarial to mankind, as they rightly oppose the faults in man and of man.
Jude 1:8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities. 9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee. 10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.
This passage is saying that people speak evil about dignities, they speak evil against angels who bring upon man God’s judgments, which is exactly what you are doing TC. The archangel Michael when contending with Balaam who was going to go and curse the body of Moses (Israel), this angel was rebuking this adversary against Israel according to the LORD. Man says however that such is not of the LORD, man speaks evil of those things which they know not, they say that it is not God rebuking man through faithful dignities but rather they say that angels do evil upon man because those angels themselves are wicked. Such deny God’s REBUKE.
Deuteronomy 28:20 The LORD shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me.
They have gone in the WAY of CAIN Jude says, 1:11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.
Balaam had it in his heart the reward of silver and gold from Balak if he cursed Israel as Balak wanted. CAIN’s offering was one that showed his own greed, he was rebuked by God and God warned him to control himself, but instead he murdered his brother and than lied to God about it.
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
CAIN is the father of lies, he was a murderer from the beginning, and he did so OF HIS OWN, and when you sin you are of your father, also doing that of your OWN desire.
Sin doesn’t come from outside wicked rebel spirits possessing your mind, influencing your mind.
Mark 7:20 And he said,That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: 23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.
There is the works of the flesh, man following his own desires, and in doing so he is like a natural brute beast, then there is the works of the Spirit that gives men self control over his desires.
Galatians 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. 17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
It is in our nature to want power and wealth, it secures one’s survival and provides pleasure to one’s heart’s desire. The OT shows many examples of God giving men wisdom, power and wealth, but these men did not honor God they turned and in their hearts declared themselves gods. They were in the heavens but because they did not honor God, He cast them down. Jesus was given wisdom and power above all measure of any man, after he hungered and could have easily made bread for himself from stones, he REBUKED the adversary, the same that was IN CAIN, he rebuked his OWN desire, he rebuked his own weak flesh.
Jesus warned,
24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
Why Paul said, 18 (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: 19 Whose end is destruction, whose god is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
Jeremiah 18:12 And they said, There is no hope: but we will walk after our own devices, and we will every one do the imagination of his evil heart.
We do not walk after the influence of an outside supernatural entity who is himself wicked, we DEFILE ourselves from within, from our OWN imaginations, and our OWN hearts. TC you are in complete denial of what the word IMAGINATION means. Other nations and their gods are the works of mans imagination, they did not have the wisdom of the coming forth of God’s creation, so they invented their own producing lies because of their ignorance. Man tries to makes sense of his world, he declares truth from his own imagination, and from their comes all sorts of theories and lies.
Angels who are in God’s presence which is what we desire, don’t FALL, otherwise our HOPE is in VEIN. One does not dwell in God’s literal abode and then are capable of sinning, if you are in God’s literal abode being in His presence you have been made pure.
Hi Jodi,
You: Angels who are in God’s presence which is what we desire, don’t FALL, otherwise our HOPE is in VEIN. One does not dwell in God’s literal abode and then are capable of sinning, if you are in God’s literal abode being in His presence you have been made pure.
Me:
Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a SHORT TIME. 13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.The devil was cast out of heaven unto the earth just before the second coming of Christ. This is way after the devil tempted A & E in the garden of Eden.
Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, 8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. 10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation,
Me: Again, the devil and his cohorts were cast out of heaven just before the second coming of Christ.
Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before YHWH, and Satan came also among them. 7 And the YHWH said unto SATAN, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Me: This is way after Eden. I guess you haven’t read the below link.
http://www.herealittletherealittle.net/index.cfm?page_name=Divine-Council
Dr. Michael Heiser Phd. ~ The Divine Council 101For the rest of what you just presented, I believe you are 100% wrong. I went over this, quoted the relevant scriptures and how they go together. Instead of bringing each CLUSTER of the scriptures I have shown to go together to explain a principle, you go over on a tangent and write what you believe is baseless. I do not wish to go over this with you again. Believe what you want.
TC…..So in your opinion all evil is fom a Devil ” being” but JESUS SAYS it comes from the heart of a man.
Jer 17:9…..”the heart is deceitful above “all” things, and desperately wicked: “
Pro 12:20……deceit is in the heart of them ,who imagine evil”
AS Jodi said, even Jesus said evil comes from the mans heart itself, and is know by the words he or she speaks because your words come forth from you heart (mind) . Many scriptures show how evil comes from man himself, and God brings evil on them who do evil, unless they repent. Trying to pass it off on someone else other then the person doing evil doing that evil, is like say God was wrong to have punished Isreal for their evil they did or us for the evil we do, you completely destory the judgement of God thinking that way. No you yourself are held accountable for the evil you do yourself. We Exist in an evil state but must with the help of God master it. So the we can (like Jesus did) overcome it.
as far as evil itself goes, it always existed, and I believe alway will, just as Good always existed and always will, why? Because it takes evil to explain good , and good explains evil. You have to have both to understand them, question is which one are we going to do .
Peace and love to you and yours. ……..gene
You: .So in your opinion all evil is fom a Devil ” being” but JESUS SAYS it comes from the heart of a man.
Jer 17:9…..”the heart is deceitful above “all” things, and desperately wicked: “
Pro 12:20……deceit is in the heart of them ,who imagine evil”
AS Jodi said, even Jesus said evil comes from the mans heart itself, and is know by the words he or she speaks because your words come forth from you heart (mind) . Many scriptures show how evil comes from man himself, and God brings evil on them who do evil, unless they repent. Trying to pass it off on someone else other then the person doing evil doing that evil, is like say God was wrong to have punished Isreal for their evil they did or us for the evil we do, you completely destory the judgement of God thinking that way. No you yourself are held accountable for the evil you do yourself. We Exist in an evil state but must with the help of God master it. So the we can (like Jesus did) overcome it.
as far as evil itself goes, it always existed, and I believe alway will, just as Good always existed and always will, why? Because it takes evil to explain good , and good explains evil. You have to have both to understand them, question is which one are we going to do .Me: So according to you, man is more deceitful and wicket than the devil. LOL Be real. The devil’s heart is in man. That causes him to sin. I explained that above. Adam and Eve did not have this evil element in them until they ate of the devil.
Evil did not always exist. There was no evil before sin came into the world. Show me the scriptures that say evil was always. Yes, evil was created for the purpose of contrasting good and evil. But it came later. The creation that God created in the beginning was “very good”. If evil was always, then sin was always also, which is not true.
Why do you always quote Jodi? Don’t you have a mind of your own. I guess not or you wouldn’t have made the statements that you just did.
Hi TC Excellent post. You said: Why do you always quote Jodi? Don’t you have a mind of your own. I guess not or You wouldn’t have made the statements that you just did. The Mind: ”the heart is deceitful above “all” things, and desperately wicked: “ God TC
Hi TC,
Trying to go back to some of your posts,
YOU: You address the Book of Enoch as an advocate of the worship of false God? None of Israelites worshiped these giants; in fact they were afraid of them?
ME: Israelites feared the giants, absolutely true, by doing such they moved God to anger. When the spies were sent and they saw the giants they lacked faith in God, such is quite amazing given the fact of the account of Exodus with all the signs and miracles God performed on their behalf. You would think that with all the cursing God brought upon Egypt there would be nothing to fear of these giants.
Israelites that went whoring after false gods INVENTED the book of Enoch. When you denote the POWERS that God alone says that He has over to another being, you create a false god. God’s celestial messengers that bring cursing to mankind do so through God’s powers, not their own. God holds wisdom, the bible says that God gave man wisdom of all workmanship, but the book of Enoch says that rebels against God did. Like I said you deny what the word imagination means. God gives man wisdom and then man takes that wisdom and uses it for his own selfish gain inventing through his own imagination ways to use that wisdom.
TC the word translated STRANGE in relation to flesh, means other flesh. If you weren’t so stuck in fables the passage should be obvious to you that it is talking about animals.
Jude 1:7 (YLT) as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them, in like manner to these, having given themselves to whoredom, and gone after other flesh, have been set before — an example, of fire age-during, justice suffering.
So angels have their own power to change themselves into a whole new creature, morphing themselves into some sort of body of flesh. You truly do believe in FALSE gods TC.
Hi TC,
YOU:The gist of Jude is for the various kinds of sins that mimic what was happening in the days of Noah which will reoccur during these later days. And the main trust of the evil is the genetic modification that polluted all flesh on the planet. This is happening now.
ME: NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT!
5 and to remind you I intend, you knowing once this, that the Lord, a people out of the land of Egypt having saved, again those who did not believe did destroy;
6 messengers also, those who did not keep their own principality, but did leave their proper dwelling, to a judgment of a great day, in bonds everlasting, under darkness He hath kept,7 as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them, in like manner to these, having given themselves to whoredom, and gone after other flesh, have been set before — an example, of fire age-during, justice suffering.
Jeremiah 23:11 For both prophet and priest are profane; yea, IN MY HOUSE have I found their wickedness, saith the LORD. 12 Wherefore their way shall be unto them as slippery ways in the darkness: they shall be driven on, and fall therein: for I will bring evil upon them, even the year of their visitation, saith the LORD. 13 And I have seen folly in the prophets of Samaria; they prophesied in Baal, and caused my people Israel to err. 14 I have seen also in the prophets of Jerusalem an horrible thing: they commit adultery, and walk in lies: they strengthen also the hands of evildoers, that none doth return from his wickedness: they are all of them unto me as Sodom, and the inhabitants thereof as Gomorrah. 15 Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts concerning the prophets; Behold, I will feed them with wormwood, and make them drink the water of gall: for from the prophets of Jerusalem is profaneness gone forth into all the land.
Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, repiners; according to their desires walking, and their mouth doth speak great swellings, giving admiration to persons for the sake of profit;17 and ye, beloved, remember ye the sayings spoken before by the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ:18 that they said to you, that in the last time there shall be scoffers, after their own desires of impieties going on,19 these are those setting themselves apart, NATURAL MEN, the Spirit not having.TC, as I said this entire chapter is talking about MEN, it even says so!! We are given examples of MEN’S wickedness from those coming out of Egypt, to Sodom and Gomorrah, to God’s prophets that turned their back on God, and those who spoke evil of angels denying that it was God’s rebuke upon man.Man is likened to a SNAKE when he LIES, a snake who by NATURE is BLIND and DEAF, who has NOT the Spirit of God but is utterly ignorant of God as all beasts are. Man walks according to his OWN desires.
You are WAY to BUSY believing in fables, that you lack ALL common sense, what you can view PLAINLY in the world around you, what you can see in the behavior of a toddler and thus should be able to recognize mankind’s faults that are according to his nature. Thus is EXACTLY what we are told in scripture. The bible speaks of many adversaries many slanderers, and they all follow in the way of CAIN, of their own desires. The old man is the same as the old serpent,
Coll 3:9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
Romans 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Ephesians 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; 23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness. 25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts (desires) of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
The enmity is the carnal mind, not because it can be influenced by invisible rebel wicked spirits, but because it is like a serpent where by it’s nature it is ignorant, it is DEAF and BLIND. Man, unlike a serpent however has an imagination where it thinks and reasons and can create it’s own truth, inventing fables and lies. When you take a creature that is BLIND and DEAF to God but has an imagination you wind up with what exactly Paul was speaking of, people who are by their nature children of wrath. Only God is good, man needs God’s Spirit, without it we are just an ignorant creature with an imagination that can invent our own way of doing things of which will never be functional it will only produce dysfunction without God’s Spirit.
The ignorant imagination of which is blind and deaf will bring forth sin, such is what happened to Adam and Eve. The ignorant imagination that must serve it’s flesh in order to live is destined to follow in the ways of Cain if it has not the Spirit of God.
TC…..IF GOOD AND EVIL DID NOT ALWAYS EXIST, then please tell us how anyone would know what good is, that like saying , up did not always exist , then how would we know what down is, or for that Matter, left verse right? Can’t you see it takes one to explain the other. The reason in the garden good and evil is mentioned as one tree, is because it takes both to understand the difference. Good shows us what evil is and evil shows what good is, Good and evil will always exist, but we must grow to master master evil, and do good. They represent what life consists of, without them both, we couldn’t know when we are doing one or the other.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……..gene
Jodi,and ALL
Jodi ,you said:
Sin doesn’t come from outside wicked rebel spirits possessing your mind, influencing your mind.
Then you brought up the scriptures hereunder,
Mark 7:20 And he said,That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: 23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.
You continued and said
There is the works of the flesh, man following his own desires, and in doing so he is like a natural brute beast, then there is the works of the Spirit that gives men self control over his desires.
Now read hereunder:
Ephesians 6:12 For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood; but against principalities and power, against the rulers of the world of this darkness, against the spirits of wickedness in the high places.
In the above, it is well clear that WE HUMANS ARE NOT WRESTLING AGAINST FLESH AND BLOOD.
BUT AGAINST THE EVIL SPIRITS.
Got it? Jesus redeemed humanity in the flesh. SINS WHICH COMES NATURALLY FROM WITHIN US RELATED TO THE FLESH, ARE ALL REDEEMED SINCE JESUS GAVE HIS OWN FLESH AS A RANSOM. This it doesn’t mean that we CONTINUE sin.
Jesus in Mark 7:20 made it clear what the human HEART WAS BEFORE REDEMPTION. Jesus INDIRECTLY referred to His FLESH BODY given as a ransom IN EXCHANGE FOR OURS. Thus,
HE MEANT THAT THROUGH THE SACRIFICE OF HIS FLESH BODY OUR SINS COMING FROM WITHIN
OUR HEART, SATAN’S ABODE BEFORE REDEMPTION, RELATED TO THE ANIMAL INSTINCT ARE ALL REDEEMED! SIMPLY AS JESUS CASTED OUT SATAN FROM OUR HEARTS FOREVER, AND HE OWNS OUR HEART. WELL DECLARED BY JESUS:
John8:34 Jesus answered them: Amen, amen I say unto you: that whosoever committeth sin, is
THE SERVANT OF SIN .35Now the servant abideth not in the house( HEART/SOUL) forever; but the son abideth FOREVER . 36If therefore the son shall make you free,
YOU SHALL BE FREE INDEED.
AS CLEAR AS CRYSTAL:
JESUS FREED US FROM ALL SINS OF THE FLESH FROM THE HEART, RELATED TO ANIMAL INSTINCT.
This is also mentioned by Jesus in
Matthew 12:32 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
Again, Jesus is clear in the above! He referred to the sin in relation to the FLESH, ANIMAL INSTINCT, symbolically THE SON OF MAN. and he made it clear that IT SHALL BE FORGIVEN. Through the sacrifice of His FLESH,
IN EXCHANGE FOR OURS.
God knew our CORRUPTED STATE IN THE FLESH WHICH IS SATANIC, AND IT WILL NEVER CHANGE, but He IN HIS UNFATHOMABLE MERCY, sent His Son in order to be the sacrificed and PURCHASE OUR FLESH AS IT IS:
SATANIC. PURIFIED BY HIS OWN BLOOD.
Now read AGAIN hereunder:
Ephesians 6:12 For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood;
ITS OVER AND DONE WITH,
THANKS TO JESUS! THUS OUR WRESTLING IS
against principalities and power, against the rulers of the world of this darkness,
AGAINST THE SPIRITS OF WICKEDNESS in the high places.
OUR FLESH BODY COMMENCES, THROUGH THE ANIMAL INSTINCT, the process of sin, we must REJECT IMMEDIATELY THE IMAGINATION, INTEREST, AND DESIRE otherwise, Satan and his demons like lions ATTACK AND THEY ARE ALLOWED BY JESUS TO DO THEIR WORK IN OUR MINDS.
OUR MINDS ARE 50/50 BETWEEN JESUS AND SATAN. Our body belongs to Satan, BUT OUR
HEART IS THE PROPERTY OF JESUS.
Jesus throughout His life between 13 and 30, DISSOLVED ALL SINS, ANNIHILATED
ALL THE ATTACKS FROM ALL THE EVIL SPIRITS HE WAS LOADED WITH, FROM THE AGE OF THIRTEEN, AND DESPITE HE WAS SINLESS, HE RECEIVED AND CARRIED ON HIM THROUGHOUT THE PROCESS OF CREATION,
SLAIN LIKE A LAMB FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE WORLD, for the sake of TRUTH, and REDEMPTION.
Now read and reflect on hereunder
Galatians 2:15 We by nature are Jews, and not of the Gentiles sinners. 16But knowing that man is not justified by the works of the law, (OF THE FLESH)but by the faith of Jesus Christ; ( OUR REDEEMER THROUGH HIS FLESH)we also believe in Christ Jesus, that we may be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: ( OF THE FLESH) because
BY THE WORKS OF THE LAW NO FLESH SHALL BE JUSTIFIED
17But if while we seek to be justified in Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners; is Christ then the minister of sin?
GOD FORBID
18For if I build up again the things which I have destroyed, I make myself a prevaricator.19For I, through the law, ( OF THE FLESH) am dead to the law, that I may live to God: with
Christ I am nailed to the cross. 20And I live, now not I;
but Christ liveth in me. And that I live now in the flesh:
I live in the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and delivered himself for me. 21I cast not away the grace of God.
For if justice be by the law,
THEN CHRIST DIED IN VAIN.
Matthew 12:32 but he that shall speak against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, nor in the world to come.
Jesus didn’t die for the sins against the Holy Ghost. Obvious these are sins NOT OF THE FLESH.
These are the sins against the SPIRIT. If a person has something in HIS HEART against his brother,
AGAINST JESUS, who is eternally in our heart, leaves in a way, OUR HEART, Satan automatically in a way, comes in, and unless a person FORGIVES his brother
HE WILL NOT BE FORGIVEN!
THAT PERSON COULD DIE WITH THE HATRED IN HIS HEART, and as Jesus said:
Amen I say to you, as long as you did it to one of these my least brethren, you did it to me.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Gene:
You: you as Edj, completely left out the FIFTH KINGDOM, of IRON AND CLAY. you treat it as if it were part of the fourth kingdom of just iron. Also you neglect to understand all the kingdoms mentioned by DANIEL come from the proceding kindom’s. Of BABLYON. ONE FLOWS INTO THE OTHER. There are five kingdoms mentioned there not just four as you assume.
Me:
Daniel 7:2 Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea. 3 And FOUR (not five) great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another. 4 The FIRST was like a LION, and had eagle’s wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man’s heart was given to it. 5 And behold another beast, a SECOND, like to a BEAR, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh. 6 After this I beheld, and lo another (THIRD), like a LEOPARD, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it. 7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a FOURTH beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns
Me: There are FOUR (not five) beasts or kingdoms here.
Dan 2:32 (FIRST) This image’s head was of fine gold, (SECOND) his breast and his arms of silver, (THIRD) his belly and his thighs of brass,
33 (FOURTH) His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay.There are FOUR earthly kingdom in Dan 7 and correspondly FOUR earthly kingdoms in Daniel 2. This means there are not five.
The rock that hit the beast on it’s feet is the kingdom of Christ. It is not part of the image in Dan 2 nor of any of beasts in Dan 7.The ten toes on the fourth beast in Daniel 7 correspond with the ten horns of Daniel 2. There are two legs and ten toes with iron in them. The third kingdom has two anatomical elements: belly and thighs. The fourth kingdom also has two anatomical elements: legs and feet.
Rev 13:2 And the (fourth) beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
Me: There are three beast mentioned here in Rev 13:2. It corresponds to the fourth kingdom (beast). The order here is leopard, bear, and lion. The order in Dan 7 is lion, bear and leopard. Thus all the characteristics of the three are inherit in the fourth. order does not matter in Rev 13:2.
Who are they? The symbol for Great Britain is the Lion. For Russia, it is the bear. Germany is the Leopard.
Gene:
You: ROME, WAS THE FOURTH KINGDOM, which was from the THIRD KINGDOM, of ALEXANDER THE GREAT, which was from the second KINGDOM OF DARIUS the Persian Kingdom which was from the first kingdom of, KING NEBUCHNASSER . today there is no part of the Roman Empire in existences at all, but all the world kingdoms that exist today, have the power of iron, but do not operate as one single kingdom. We are in the fifth kingdom of the prophecy of Daniel.
Me: NO! We are in the fourth earthly kingdom not completely yet. The fourth is the last kingdom as I have shown you. It will be here in the end times.
The rock (fifth world ruling kingdom) will soon appear, it is the world ruling kingdom of Jesus Christ and the Saint’s , that is the kingdom that strikes the whole image on it’s feet. The fourth kingdom includes all the characteristics of the first three.You: If you UNDERSTAND THIS then the Rev 17:10 will begin to make sense to you.
Me: The rock (Christ’s) kingdom is not part of the image. The fourth earthly kingdom endures until the end. Christ’s HEAVENLY kingdom then takes over. It is not the fifth kingdom of the image in Dan 2. There is only four EARTHLY kingdoms mentioned there.
The fourth kingdomGene:
You: Why do you think it does not say the kingdom of Babylon or the IMAGE WAS COMPLETELY DESTROYED? Because it was retained untill it reappears again AT THE END OF THE SIXTH KINGDOM ( thousand years) it is the seventh kingdom and a resurection of the Bablyonian empires, and the Eighth kingdom is part of it, but they only last for three and a half years, then comes the end, Jesus will turn over his kingdom to God. Just as it is written.
TC…… If you don’t understand that the fifth kingdom on this earth “is” the kingdom of iron and clay, there is no way you can understand the prophesy of Rev 17:10 .Me: Absolutely NOT. I showed it to you above.
Dan 2:34 Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. 35 Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth…44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.
Me: The image is completely destroyed when God sets up his kingdom at Christ’s second coming. It is only this kingdom that will stand from then on.
Armageddon happens at the beginning of the millennium, not also at the end of the thousand years. It does not happen twice.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. 17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; 18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great. 19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. 20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. 21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.
Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. 14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. 15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. 16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Me: These scripture show the only Armageddon—one time when Christ returns. There is not a second one at the end of the millennium. The word Armageddon only appears once.
Joel 1:15 Alas for the day! for the day (H3117) of the LORD is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.
1 Cor 1:8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day (G2250) of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Me: I feel “day’ should better be translated as “a period of time”.
TC……so when Daniel, said he saw UNTIL , the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, the gold. To you dosent represent five different kingdoms. So why does DANIEL LIST FIVE SEPERATE KINGDOMS THEN? Daniel clearly shows that the stone hits the image on the feet and toes of iron and clay. Not the two legs of Iron. (The Roman Empire), but the feet of iron and clay.
Your long confusing renditions are full of errors and misunderstandings of the truth.
TC this needs to be descussed in the right thread.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene
Hi All,
I have asked t8 to delete my last recent posts here. Please see “Rev 17:10 reveals the time of it’s taking place” for its transfer to the proper place.
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