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martain this has nothing to do with John Calvin, if your going to accuse me of Calvinism please explain how this fits Calvinism. John Calvin believed in eternal punishment and other things like the trinity non of which i believe in. If your going to lable me you need to at least get the facts right. The word of God was what i was quoting not the murder John Calvin. All false teachers use the word of God to Justify their teachings but they twist it like your doing saying I am a Calvinest. Much like WJ, you cant answer the straight forward scriptures put forth so you to, devert by labeling people as Calvinest or something else. I have call WJ a trinitarian because he admit's he is. If you can't stay with subject matter and ansewr the Scripture i have put forth, why not just say out of the subject then.
If your so sure there is “FREE WILL” then produce Scripture to Show it, calling me a Calvinest is simply a lie. Just answer the reasoning i have set forth, if you can and if not why not stay out of the subject altogether.
IMO…………………….gene
Chipwhite…….What you said is true it what the meanning of “Free Will” is, the meannig as i understand it is to excorsize your Will, without (ANY) causeality what so ever. Because if there was a reason you chose something then there was a cause and it was not the excercising of (FREE WILL) at all. I believe God causes all things to work for the good of them that love him and are called acording to His (WILL).
When God said he knows the end from the beginning and says my purposses will stand and He is the potter and we are the clay Doesen't that make Him the cause for things to come about even in our lives. Unless the Lord drect my thinking i could never find the right path to walk in. For we are (HIS) workmenship (Created)[thats the cause] unto good works.Hope this helped explain what “Free Will” really means and no where in scripture is the word [free will] mentioned.
chip……..peace to you and yours…………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 28 2008,04:57) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 26 2008,18:17) I don’t even know where to start. For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, [ye are] God's building. (1 Cor 3:9)
God draws us by his Spirit, but we freely choose if we want to follow the Spirit’s leading. We work together with God.
If what you are saying is true, then why is God letting me continue in the Trinitarian view, since you say it is an evil doctrine?
You say,
“You are a product of your thinking and what you think was placed their, the cause and the effect is the way you are.”
Did I not “Freely choose” what was placed in my thinking? I have heard enough of your thinking, if it was God then why hasn’t he changed my thinking to be like yours?
So are you saying that now you have the truth and he has changed your thinking then you never sin?
If God is the cause of us being totally like Christ then why hasn’t the effect happened?
Why would God wait?
Could it be that he is waiting on us to “choose” to open the door and let him in?
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, (Free choice), I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. (Rev 3:20)
WJ……You again distort and ver off what i am saying.let's take some of you statements and examine them even though you do not do that with what i am saying and quoting.
You said……> For we are laborourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, [ye are ] God's building. (1 Cor 3:9).
well then was it our own ” Free Will's ” that caused that or God's Grace (God's influence on us that caused that to happen) where is Free will here. “For He (God) works in us both to (WILL) and do HIS GOOD PLEASURE, thats how it's done, has nothing to do with our “FREE” Will's.
You say….> God draws us by his Spirit, which is true, then you add somthing which is not scriptural, (but we freely choose if we want to follow the Spirits leading), where is that at in scripture, it's not there it's unscriptual triniatarian idology . If God draws us (the actual word for draw is drag) then thats the cause and the effect is whats produces. Not Free Will mentioned here. You have again just simply inserted it into the text, as you do with other issues.
You said….If what you are saying is true, then why is God letting me continue in the Trinitarian view, since you say it is an evil doctrine.
This is simple to explain Jesus said, “they have ears to hear but hear not, eyes to see but see not”. Many are called (BUT) only a few choosn. God is not actively trying to save all man kind at this time. If He is he would be a big failure wouldn't He. Don't kid yourself theres only a very few who truly have the Spirit of truth in them, other wise there wouldn't be so much confusion in relgion would there.you said….> Did i not “Freely Choose” what was placed in my thinking? I have heard enough of your thinking, if it was God then why hasn't he changed my thinking to be like yours?
Answer no you did not “FREELY CHOOSE” anything, the (I GOD) in you want's it that way. It says the man of sin sits in the temple of God showing Himself as GOD. Are we not the temples of God, so then if we are, then who rules in your temple is it you by your supossed (FREE WILL) or is it GOD who (RULES) if God rules then He is the cause of what you do.
Still no “Free Will” here.You said…..> So are you saying that now you have the truth and he has changed your thinking then you never sin?
Answer…> Paul said with my mind i serve the laws of God, but with my body the the law of sin and death and went on to say O wretched man that i am who can deliver me from this body of death. Do you think the apostle Paul didn't sin because he had God's Spirit in Him. Pure foolishness, and again you are misrepersent what i am saying. You have so long devert subject matter you can't help it.
You said ….> If God is the cause of us being totally like Christ then why hasn't the effect happened?.
If God isn't the cause then who is, in your case it's your own so called (FREE WILL) . Then you are your own salvation you don't need God for anything you Perfecly capably of saving your self. You are indeed an (I GOD) a self savior.
But if God is in you He will be molding you into becomming like Jesus Christ. Doesn't it say until we grow up into the full stature of Christ, so it show's a process and we should be becomming more like Christ all the time.You said …Could it be that he is wating on us to “choose” to open the door and let his in?.
answer…> NO, all who are truly called will open the door, because God will (CAUSE) it to happen, didn't Jesus tell the deciples they didn't choose him, but he chose them. God caused that to happen by the revelation of truth in there minds, and they naturally did what the Spirit was causeing them to do.
The Doctrine of ” FREE WILL” is one of the biggest LIES ever taught in Christdom.
IMO…………..WJ, peace to you and yours…………..gene
GBYou say…
Quote
Many are called (BUT) only a few choosn. God is not actively trying to save all man kind at this time. If He is he would be a big failure wouldn't He. Don't kid yourself theres only a very few who truly have the Spirit of truth in them, other wise there wouldn't be so much confusion in relgion would there.And so I presume that everyone who dosnt accept you poor exegisis on “Free will” doesnt have the Spirit of truth in them.
But of course you are one of the few that do?
Sorry GB I have to agree with martian on this one, your doctine on this is as far out there as “martians” name.
Tell me if there is free will in this…
And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.
For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (mark 8:34-36)And you say the Trinitarian view is heretical?
You say…
Quote
Answer…> Paul said with my mind i serve the laws of God, but with my body the the law of sin and death and went on to say O wretched man that i am who can deliver me from this body of death. Do you think the apostle Paul didn't sin because he had God's Spirit in Him. Pure foolishness, and
again you are misrepersent what i am saying. You have so long devert subject matter you can't help it.So the Spirit of God was not powerful enough in Paul to cause him not to sin?
So in other words GB, as long as a Christian has the Spirit of God in them, when they sin the devil made them do it, right?
So they can watch all the porn they want because they have no free will.
This belief of yours is as off as this topic is in this thread.
Blessings. But no thanks.
Hi Gene,
I fully agree with your views my brother. Regarding free will in the context of choices you may better explain to all. God is the potter and we are vesseles made of clay. We don't have any free will like the potter. We should be humble to the maker so that he may mould us according to his wish and plan. He gives us choices or alternatives to choose like he had given to Adam in the garden of eden. But they are again controlled by him only. I can not choose my birth to be a rich or poor. The path is kept before me by the maker. I have to choose it by knowing the consequences whether good or evil. There is nothing like free will here as you have already explained.Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 28 2008,11:13) martain this has nothing to do with John Calvin, if your going to accuse me of Calvinism please explain how this fits Calvinism. John Calvin believed in eternal punishment and other things like the trinity non of which i believe in. If your going to lable me you need to at least get the facts right. The word of God was what i was quoting not the murder John Calvin. All false teachers use the word of God to Justify their teachings but they twist it like your doing saying I am a Calvinest. Much like WJ, you cant answer the straight forward scriptures put forth so you to, devert by labeling people as Calvinest or something else. I have call WJ a trinitarian because he admit's he is. If you can't stay with subject matter and ansewr the Scripture i have put forth, why not just say out of the subject then. If your so sure there is “FREE WILL” then produce Scripture to Show it, calling me a Calvinest is simply a lie. Just answer the reasoning i have set forth, if you can and if not why not stay out of the subject altogether.
IMO…………………….gene
Is it not true that you believe all will be saved regardless of their lives? This is vry much like Calvinism except that you do not believe in two predestined destinations but one. You also refuse free will which is exactly like Calvinism.Secondly scripture is not the finale determining factor as you so eloquently put it. As yopu said false teachers twist scriptures to fit their doctrine. And what makes you any different? And I do not need to defeat your so called scripture. All I need do is point out the absurdity of your conclussions, which I have already done.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 28 2008,17:22) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 28 2008,04:57) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 26 2008,18:17) I don’t even know where to start. For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, [ye are] God's building. (1 Cor 3:9)
God draws us by his Spirit, but we freely choose if we want to follow the Spirit’s leading. We work together with God.
If what you are saying is true, then why is God letting me continue in the Trinitarian view, since you say it is an evil doctrine?
You say,
“You are a product of your thinking and what you think was placed their, the cause and the effect is the way you are.”
Did I not “Freely choose” what was placed in my thinking? I have heard enough of your thinking, if it was God then why hasn’t he changed my thinking to be like yours?
So are you saying that now you have the truth and he has changed your thinking then you never sin?
If God is the cause of us being totally like Christ then why hasn’t the effect happened?
Why would God wait?
Could it be that he is waiting on us to “choose” to open the door and let him in?
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, (Free choice), I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. (Rev 3:20)
WJ……You again distort and ver off what i am saying.let's take some of you statements and examine them even though you do not do that with what i am saying and quoting.
You said……> For we are laborourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, [ye are ] God's building. (1 Cor 3:9).
well then was it our own ” Free Will's ” that caused that or God's Grace (God's influence on us that caused that to happen) where is Free will here. “For He (God) works in us both to (WILL) and do HIS GOOD PLEASURE, thats how it's done, has nothing to do with our “FREE” Will's.
You say….> God draws us by his Spirit, which is true, then you add somthing which is not scriptural, (but we freely choose if we want to follow the Spirits leading), where is that at in scripture, it's not there it's unscriptual triniatarian idology . If God draws us (the actual word for draw is drag) then thats the cause and the effect is whats produces. Not Free Will mentioned here. You have again just simply inserted it into the text, as you do with other issues.
You said….If what you are saying is true, then why is God letting me continue in the Trinitarian view, since you say it is an evil doctrine.
This is simple to explain Jesus said, “they have ears to hear but hear not, eyes to see but see not”. Many are called (BUT) only a few choosn. God is not actively trying to save all man kind at this time. If He is he would be a big failure wouldn't He. Don't kid yourself theres only a very few who truly have the Spirit of truth in them, other wise there wouldn't be so much confusion in relgion would there.you said….> Did i not “Freely Choose” what was placed in my thinking? I have heard enough of your thinking, if it was God then why hasn't he changed my thinking to be like yours?
Answer no you did not “FREELY CHOOSE” anything, the (I GOD) in you want's it that way. It says the man of sin sits in the temple of God showing Himself as GOD. Are we not the temples of God, so then if we are, then who rules in your temple is it you by your supossed (FREE WILL) or is it GOD who (RULES) if God rules then He is the cause of what you do.
Still no “Free Will” here.You said…..> So are you saying that now you have the truth and he has changed your thinking then you never sin?
Answer…> Paul said with my mind i serve the laws of God, but with my body the the law of sin and death and went on to say O wretched man that i am who can deliver me from this body of death. Do you think the apostle Paul didn't sin because he had God's Spirit in Him. Pure foolishness, and again you are misrepersent what i am saying. You have so long devert subject matter you can't help it.
You said ….> If God is the cause of us being totally like Christ then why hasn't the effect happened?.
If God isn't the cause then who is, in your case it's your own so called (FREE WILL) . Then you are your own salvation you don't need God for anything you Perfecly capably of saving your self. You are indeed an (I GOD) a self savior.
But if God is in you He will be molding you into becomming like Jesus Christ. Doesn't it say until we grow up into the full stature of Christ, so it show's a process and we should be becomming more like Christ all the time.You said …Could it be that he is wating on us to “choose” to open the door and let his in?.
answer…> NO, all who are truly called will open the door, because God will (CAUSE) it to happen, didn't Jesus tell the deciples they didn't choose him, but he chose them. God caused that to happen by the revelation of truth in there minds, and they naturally did what the Spirit was causeing them to do.
The Doctrine of ” FREE WILL” is one of the biggest LIES ever taught in Christdom.
IMO…………..WJ, peace to you and yours…………..gene
GBYou say…
Quote
Many are called (BUT) only a few choosn. God is not actively trying to save all man kind at this time. If He is he would be a big failure wouldn't He. Don't kid yourself theres only a very few who truly have the Spirit of truth in them, other wise there wouldn't be so much confusion in relgion would there.And so I presume that everyone who dosnt accept you poor exegisis on “Free will” doesnt have the Spirit of truth in them.
But of course you are one of the few that do?
Sorry GB I have to agree with martian on this one, your doctine on this is as far out there as “martians” name.
Tell me if there is free will in this…
And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.
For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (mark 8:34-36)And you say the Trinitarian view is heretical?
You say…
Quote
Answer…> Paul said with my mind i serve the laws of God,
but with my body the the law of sin and death and went on to say O wretched man that i am who can deliver me from this body of death. Do you think the apostle Paul didn't sin because he had God's Spirit in Him. Pure foolishness, and again you are misrepersent what i am saying. You have so long devert subject matter you can't help it.So the Spirit of God was not powerful enough in Paul to cause him not to sin?
So in other words GB, as long as a Christian has the Spirit of God in them, when they sin the devil made them do it, right?
So they can watch all the porn they want because they have no free will.
This belief of yours is as off as this topic is in this thread.
Blessings. But no thanks.
Yes indeed — This is the Trinity thread.WJ I posted something on the HS. I would like your take on it if we can get away from this oher stuff.
Gene,
If you want me to discuss this with you then start another thread or find one that is about this subject.Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 28 2008,17:22) Tell me if there is free will in this… And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.
For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? (mark 8:34-36)And you say the Trinitarian view is heretical?
WJ……Do you see the word (FREE WILL) in what you are quoting. Your assumining that it's Free will, but Jesus said (NO) man (can) COME unless the Father Drag Him. So can't you see your are inserting things into the scriptures that arn't their. Why doin't you try to put the scriptures i have qouted you into your trinitarian idology of so called (FREE WILL) which apears no where in scripture.Why can't you see that the idea of FREE Will makes the person responsible for their own salvation, and if they can save themselves by their (FREE WILL) then they don't neeed God do they because they are a God unto themselves.
But again you refuse to directly answer posted scriptures and post another then insert things into them that arn't actually said.
I have posted lot's of scriptures supporting what i am saying, but because of your pride you refuse to acknowlege them or even comment on them. But then again thats what trinitarians do they Just simply change focuse to devert dealing with the truth. Show me the words (FREE WILL) and you might have a leg to stand on. If not then who's supporting herrtical doctrines me or you.
When Jesus Said whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me and ect. dose not even address the issue of FREE WILL at all. Because the only one that will follow Jesus is the ones GOD is draging to Him. as
many scriptures i have quoted show.But again you insert inference where it is not there, but nothing new this is what you have always did and proberly will continue to untill you see that is what you do.
So no matter what we decuss you simply gandy dance around subject matter by not directly taking scriptures give and descussing them.
Sorry WJ just the way i see it………………….gene
martin…. your acqusations of me being a Calvinist is a pure lie, i do not support Calvin at all, nor ever have. If John Calvin said there is no Free Will i would agree with him on that one thing, but to say i am a Calvinest is a pure LIE, You have used that as an excuse to not directly confront the issue of (FREE WILL) because you have no scriptural support on the subject, so you resort to name calling like you did with Stu and Kejonn.
IMO………………..gene
gollamudi……..as long as you believe that it's God doing his work in you and causeing you to respond to him in obedience, you have it right, ” For He (God) workes in us to (WILL) and do of His good pleasure. So if it God working in us then it's God causing our choices and He Gets all the credit for it. The word GRACE means, God influencing us, and it says we are saved by GRACE. It's all God's work and we are (HIS) workmanship, created unto good works. If you hold on the these thing you will not fail.
Peace and love to you and yours…………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 29 2008,03:14) martin…. your acqusations of me being a Calvinist is a pure lie, i do not support Calvin at all, nor ever have. If John Calvin said there is no Free Will i would agree with him on that one thing, but to say i am a Calvinest is a pure LIE, You have used that as an excuse to not directly confront the issue of (FREE WILL) because you have no scriptural support on the subject, so you resort to name calling like you did with Stu and Kejonn. IMO………………..gene
You mean you do not know that Cavin beieved in predestination and eiminating the free will? Then how do you know that you are not following the teachings of Calvin.Your assumptions are as false as your interpretations of Scripture. You asume that I cannot counter your arguments. I choose to not block this thread on the Trinity with this silly stuff. It may be your pet doctrine but it is not the subject of this thread. I even offered to discuss the matter if you would start a new thread.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 29 2008,03:14) martin…. your acqusations of me being a Calvinist is a pure lie, i do not support Calvin at all, nor ever have. If John Calvin said there is no Free Will i would agree with him on that one thing, but to say i am a Calvinest is a pure LIE, You have used that as an excuse to not directly confront the issue of (FREE WILL) because you have no scriptural support on the subject, so you resort to name calling like you did with Stu and Kejonn. IMO………………..gene
I will go so far as to say that there is influence on us from both sides of Good and Bad. However, influence does not necessarily determine the outcome of a person’s path.
From the very beginning God has made man accountable for their own actions.
Gen 4
6Then the LORD said to Cain, “Why are you angry? And why has your countenance fallen?
7″If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it.”The Hebrew word translated “master” in this verse is MShL and means literally to “rule” as in take dominion over something or someone. God is telling Cain that he is to take dominion over the temptation of sin crouching at the door.
Deuteronomy 6:5?” You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.
Here is an example of our modern western culture still using a concrete object to express an abstract idea. We often associate the heart with emotions such as love and kindness as in “He has a good heart”. This is also true with the Hebrews who saw the heart as the seat of emotion. But unlike us they also saw the heart as the seat of thought whereas we see the brain as the seat of thought. To the ancient Hebrews the heart was the mind including all thoughts including emotions. When we are told to love God with all our heart (Deut 6:5) it is not speaking of an emotional love but to keep our emotions and all our thoughts working for him. Why “work” if it is all programmed and predetermined.
The first picture in this Hebrew word is a shepherd staff and represents authority as the shepherd has authority over his flock. The second letter is the picture of the floor plan of the nomadic tent and represents the idea of being inside as the family resides within the tent. When combined they mean “the authority within”.
Authority to do what? If it is all programmed and predetermined, we do not need any authority.God was pleased that Solomon asked for “Wisdom”. Why?
The Hebrew verb Mkx (hhakham) is usually translated as wise. But, the word wise is an abstract (Greek thought) and we will need to take a closer look at this word to find its original concrete (Hebrew thought) meaning. In order to do this we will begin by looking at the parent root Mx (hham) or as it would appear in its original pictographic script. The first letter, , is a picture of a tent wall and represents the idea of separating. The second letter, , is a picture of water. Combined these mean “separate water.” The picture represented by these two words is the process of making cheese (curds) from milk by separating out the water (called whey). The noun hamx (hhemah) is derived from this parent root and means “curds.”By placing the consonant k (kh) in the middle of the parent root the adopted root Mkx (hhakham) is formed. While translated as wise the more appropriate meaning is the ability to separate out or distinguish between good and bad. The noun hmkx (hhakhmah) is derived from this adopted root and is usually translated as wisdom but in the sense of craftsmanship such as seen in Exodus 28:3; “(KJV) And I have filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom (translated as ability in the RSV), and in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship.” A craftsman is one who is able to distinguish between good work and bad work or, one who is “wise.”
Why would Solomon need wisdom if he had no ability to choose between good and bad? If his decisions were just a matter of programming or predetermination then it made no difference if he were wise or not.One major problem with your no choice doctrine is that it eliminates real faith. Faith requires an action on the part of those that have faith.
Behold, he whose soul is not upright in him shall fail, but the righteous shall live by his faith. (Habakkuk 2:4 – ASV)??What does it mean to have “faith” from an Hebraic perspective? In our western minds faith is a mental exercise in knowing that someone or something exists or will act. For instance, if we say “I have faith in God” we are saying “I know that God exists and do what he says he will do”.??
This, of course seems to be the type of faith that you believe in. A mental abstract concept that assumes God will do all and there is no requirement on man’s part to work with God.The Hebrew word for faith is
?? (emunah – Strong's #530) and is an action oriented word meaning “support”. This is important because the Western concept of faith places the action on the one you have faith in, such as “faith in God”. But, the Hebrew word ?? places the action on the one who “supports God”. It is not knowing that God will act, but rather I will do what I can to support God. This idea of support for the word emunah can be seen in Exodus 17:12.??But Moses' hands grew weary; so they took a stone and put it under him, and he sat upon it, and Aaron and Hur held up his hands, one on one side, and the other on the other side; so his hands were steady (emunah)until the going down of the sun.??It is the support/emunah of Aaron and Hur that held of Moses' arms, not the support/emunah of Moses. When we say “I have faith in God”, we should be thinking “I will do what I can to support God”.
That is as much as I will go into detail on this silliness. If you want more discussion I sugest you get off the Trinity board and do it elsewhere.There is a thread on free will here.
https://heavennet.net/cgi-bin….nd+willTim
one final comment martian on free will, if man free will chooses his out come then why does did God say (I) will take out the of them the stoney Heart and Give them a Heart of Flesh (Soft Heart). Why does God have to do it if we can do it on our own with out so called free wills. And why does it say the Carnel mind is enimity against God and is not subject to the laws of God neither indeed can be. So wouldn't that make it impossible for (FREE WILL) to work then. I will not comment no longer on this subject here. If you wish to continue please go the the thread Tim posted.
thanks ………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ April 29 2008,16:17) one final comment martian on free will, if man free will chooses his out come then why does did God say (I) will take out the of them the stoney Heart and Give them a Heart of Flesh (Soft Heart). Why does God have to do it if we can do it on our own with out so called free wills. And why does it say the Carnel mind is enimity against God and is not subject to the laws of God neither indeed can be. So wouldn't that make it impossible for (FREE WILL) to work then. I will not comment no longer on this subject here. If you wish to continue please go the the thread Tim posted. thanks ………..gene
What does the context say?
The context is about the people of Israel returning from being scattered. When they arrive in Israel they are given an action to do. (verse 18) Then God gives them a new heart. However those that remain going after the “detestable things” God will bring their conduct down on their heads. (verse 21) The people do an action (good or bad) and God reacts.17″Therefore say, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, “I will gather you from the peoples and assemble you out of the countries among which you have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel.”'
18″When they come there, they will remove all its detestable things and all its abominations from it.
19″And I will give them one heart, and put a new spirit within them And I will take the heart of stone out of their flesh and give them a heart of flesh,
20that they may walk in My statutes and keep My ordinances and do them Then they will be My people, and I shall be their God.
21″But as for those whose hearts go after their detestable things and abominations, I will bring their conduct down on their heads,” declares the Lord GOD.Furthermore there is more truth in the translation back to Hebrew in verse 19.
Spirit in this verse means refreshing19″And I will give them one heart, and put a new refreshing within them And I will take the heart of stone out of their flesh and give them a heart of flesh,
The receiving of the new refreshing and the new heart was contingent upon them removing all the detestable things from the land.
Amazing revelation. Jesus ws literally an Eagle before His ministry on Earth. He changed into a man and then back to an Eagle after His resurrection. We will also become Eagles when He comes for us.
Here is Jesus in the OT leading them out of Egypt
Exodus 19:4?' You yourselves have seen what I did to the Egyptians, and how I bore you on eagles' wings, and brought you to Myself.
Thisone clearly depicts Jesus as an Eagle
Isaiah 40:31?Yet those who wait for the LORDWill gain new strength;They will mount up with wings like eagles,
Here is Jesus doing battle for Israel
Jeremiah 48:40?For thus says the LORD:”Behold, one will fly swiftly like an eagleAnd spread out his wings against Moab.
Here is a prophecy about the Eagle ministry to the saints in the NT.
Deuteronomy 32:11?” Like an eagle that stirs up its nest,That hovers over its young, He spread His wings and caught them,He carried them on His pinions.
Here is Jesus and His conection to the vine.
Ezekiel 17:7?”But there was another great eagle with great wings and much plumage; and behold, this vine bent its roots toward him and sent out its branches toward him from the beds where it was planted, that he might water it.
Hre is Jesus being changed into a man for his earthly ministry as the lion of the tribe of Judah.
Daniel 7:4?”The first was like a lion and had the wings of an eagle. I kept looking until its wings were plucked, and it was lifted up from the ground and made to stand on two feet like a man; a human mind also was given to it.
Here Jesus gives us wings so that we can be like him in the end when He becomes an Eagle again.
Revelation 12:14?But the two wings of the great eagle were given to the woman, so that she could fly into the wilderness to her place, where she was nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent.
After all it does say we will meet Him in the air. We have to able to fly for that right? Didn’t the disciples seem Him ascend into the clouds?
1 Thessalonians 4:17?Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.
Of course I made all of this up and used no proper principles to check to see if my interpretations were correct. I did not read context or study the words in original languages. I did not discern between figurative and literal. I did not ascertain if it had any functional purpose. I just looked up the word eagle and started pulling out scriptures containing that word. How do you like my doctrine. It has as much credibility as many posted on this board for they do not follow any principles either.
That was absolutely brilliant, with perfect sarcasm and comedy you posted something absurd enough everyone will get your point. GOOD JOB!!!! You made your point in a parable like way, kudos. (I appreciate good sarcasm done tastefully not maliciously.) I thought it was hillarious even if some of my posts mean it applied to me(ha ha). God bless martian.
Quote (TimothyVI @ April 30 2008,11:06) Ah shoot! Was that sarcasm?
I was getting all excited about being able to fly like an eagle.
Tim
That was sarcasm. Tim
Quote (TimothyVI @ April 30 2008,11:07) Quote (TimothyVI @ April 30 2008,11:06) Ah shoot! Was that sarcasm?
I was getting all excited about being able to fly like an eagle. Tim
That was sarcasm. Tim
Who was being sarcastic? I also beleive that Elvis is the reincarnated Jesus. And Elvis still lives on (though I believe he has moved to Watahoochie Mississippi where Oprah comes to visit with her friends from the spaceship.
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