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Hi Jodi, “You may not see Satan as an adversary to God but God has higher standards.”
This sort of statement Nick confirms that you are a complete waste of time, as you have not HEARD at all what I have repeated time and time again.”
At this point I don’t think it is necessary to respond to me as I won’t be responding to you anymore directly, this has become so ABSURD.
I will explain,
Anyone can see from my posts that I do in fact acknowledge that there are adversaries to God, I just don’t define them the same as you. I never once said that the dragon/ saw-tawn in Revlation is not an adversary to God. In fact I explained quite clearly how I thought he was. The carnal mind is at enmity against God. Jesus destroyed the enmity against God by overcoming man’s weak flesh, crucifying the old man, which is the same as the old serpent, and it is man that is called a serpent and a wild natural beast. Scripture tells us quite clearly that men deceive themselves and they deceive others. I also defined the heaven in Revelation 12 and gave scriptural examples, of which described men being adversaries to God.
Hi Jodi,
Yes if you are looking for folks to agree with your dogmas you should not start with me.
Instead block your ears and remain where you are.
Hi Jodi,
Overcoming the carnal nature when we are but flesh
and reference to the old man shows your ignorance of the nature of man as a vessel.
God knows Man is occupied territory and He asks the saved to differentiate the leadings of the new master from the old.
Did Pilate ask God’s permission? Was Palate serving himself or God?
Hi Jodi,
So Pilate was serving himself while satan was not? Do I got that right?
____________
God bless
Ed JGood Morning Ed J,
You said, “So Pilate was serving himself while satan was not? Do I got that right?”
As already mentioned the Hebrew word phonetically pronounced saw-tawn appears in the OT bible and is translated as adversary, accuser, and Satan. When I read saw-tawn in scripture I identify it according to the passage. People read the word Satan and they define it according to a doctrine, I do no such thing.
Saw-tawn does not in and of itself equal wickedness or one serving himself for wicked sake, THAT is a FACT, otherwise you would have to argue that God Himself is wicked because he is called saw-tawn.
Ed J,
The VERY FIRST use of the word saw-tawn in the OT is in regards to God being saw-tawn through His angel unto man.
Numbers 22:22 But God was angry because he was going, and the angel of the LORD took his stand in the way as an adversary against him. Now he was riding on his donkey and his two servants were with him…32 The angel of the LORD said to him, “Why have you struck your donkey these three times? Behold, I have come out as an adversary, because your way was contrary to me.
Job most certainly identifies his ADVERSARY as God.
The next example is of men-armies
I Samuel 29:4 But the commanders of the Philistines were angry with him, and the commanders of the Philistines said to him, “Make the man go back, that he may return to his place where * you have assigned him, and do not let him go down to battle with us, or in the battle he may become an adversary to us. For with what could this man make himself acceptable to his lord? Would it not be with the heads of these men?
The third example is also of men
2 Samuel 19:22 David then said, “What have I to do with you, O sons of Zeruiah, that you should this day be an adversary to me? Should any man be put to death in Israel today? For do I not know that I am king over Israel today?”
Fourth-men
1 Kings 5:2 Then Solomon sent word to Hiram, saying, 3 “You know that David my father was unable * to build a house for the name of the LORD his God because * of the wars which surrounded him, until the LORD put them under the soles of his feet. 4 “But now the LORD my God has given me rest on every side; there is neither adversary nor misfortune.
Fifth -This is where things get interesting, God raises up human adversaries against another man
I Kings 11:14 Then the LORD raised up an adversary to Solomon, Hadad the Edomite; he was of the royal line in Edom…23 God also raised up another adversary to him, Rezon the son of Eliada, who had fled from his lord Hadadezer king of Zobah….25 So he was an adversary to Israel all the days of Solomon, along with the evil that Hadad did; and he abhorred Israel and reigned over Aram.
So far we have seen saw-tawn in scripture 8 times, none of them equate to a fallen evil angel. Then we see the Satan translation first appear,
1 Chronicles 21:1 Then Satan stood up against Israel and moved David to number Israel. 2 So David said to Joab and to the princes of the people, “Go, number Israel from Beersheba even to Dan, and bring me word that I may know their number.”
The books of the OT up unto this point have discussed men and armies of men being adversaries to man, we have even seen that God raises up adversaries, and God himself through His angels are adversaries. An adversary provokes David to number his men. David feared men and their armies, we know he prayed a lot to God to protect him from his enemies. I am suppose to all of a sudden believe that the SAW-TAWN in 1 Chronicles is a fallen angel standing up against Israel and making David count the number of his men who drew sword? This is what mainstream Christian doctrine would like people to believe, that David’s mind had been possessed by a fallen angel and persuaded him to have a lack of faith in God.
Ed J, how do you identify the saw-tawn in Chronicles?
Ed J,
David feared MEN, he had many saw-tawns, and we see through the history in the bible leading up to Chronicles vast numbers of scriptures talking about men and armies being against Israel. I will spare you from listing all of them. Some of these adversaries God himself brought forth out of anger unto Israel.
Judges 3:12 Now the sons of Israel again did evil in the sight of the LORD . So the LORD strengthened Eglon the king of Moab against Israel, because they had done evil in the sight of the LORD.
Pslams 78:49 He cast upon them the fierceness of his anger, wrath, and indignation, and trouble, by sending evil angels among them.
The word evil translated in this passage in Hebrew is Ra,
Ra appears in the OT as-
bad 23, bad* 2, badly 1, deadly 1, defamed* 1, defames* 1, defect* 1, destroying 1, displease* 1, displeased 1, displeasing 1, distressing 1, evil 124, evil man 3, evil men 4, evil things 4, evildoer 1, evildoers* 1, evils 1, great 1, grievous 4, harm* 1, harmful 3, man 1, miserable 1, misfortune* 1, sad 4, selfish* 1, serious 1, severe 2, sore 2, threats* 1, treacherous 1, trouble* 1, troubled 1, ugly 6, unpleasant 1, what is evil 2, what was evil 5, which is evil 3, wicked 15, wicked women 1, wild 5, worst 1, wretched 1
The word Ra likewise does not in and of itself represent wickedness, as saw-tawn does not either, otherwise one would have to argue that God Himself is wicked.
Hi Jodi,
God is not an adversary in any of those verses.
Do you have any more?
The one called Satan is cast into the lake of fire in Rev.
Who is this?
After Chronicles the next time the word saw-tawn appears is in the book of Job.
Job 2: 4 Satan answered the LORD and said, “Skin for skin! Yes, all that a man has he will give for his life. 5 “However, put forth Your hand now, and touch his bone and his flesh; he will curse You to Your face.” 6 So the LORD said to Satan, “Behold, he is in your power, only spare his life.” 7 Then Satan went out from the presence of the LORD and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot to the crown of his head… 9 Then his wife said to him, “Do you still hold fast your integrity? Curse God and die!” 10 But he said to her, “You speak as one of the foolish women speaks. Shall we indeed accept good from God and not accept adversity?” In all this Job did not sin with his lips.
Job 12:9 “Who among all these does not know That the hand of the LORD has done this,
Job recognizes that this is in FACT the HAND of the LORD. Really how more clear can it be that the saw-tawn in Job is God’s angel?
2 Samuel 24: 15 So the LORD sent a pestilence upon Israel from the morning until the appointed time, and seventy thousand men of the people from Dan to Beersheba died. 16 When the angel stretched out his hand toward Jerusalem to destroy it, the LORD relented from the calamity and said to the angel who destroyed the people, “It is enough! Now relax your hand!”
Below is a list of scriptures, not all of them that talk about the hand of the Lord. We know according to scripture that God carries out His hand through the hands of His angels.
Exodus 9: 3 behold, the hand of the LORD will come with a very severe pestilence on your livestock which are in the field, on the horses, on the donkeys, on the camels, on the herds, and on the flocks.
Deuteronomy 2: 15 “Moreover the hand of the LORD was against them, to destroy them from within the camp until they all perished.
Judges 2: 15 Wherever they went, the hand of the LORD was against them for evil, as the LORD had spoken and as the LORD had sworn to them, so that they were severely distressed.
1 Samuel 5: 9 After they had brought it around, the hand of the LORD was against the city with very great confusion; and He smote the men of the city, both young and old, so that tumors broke out on them.
1 Samuel 12: 15 “If you will not listen to the voice of the LORD , but rebel against the command of the LORD , then the hand of the LORD will be against you, as it was against your fathers.
2 Samuel 24: 14 Then David said to Gad, “I am in great distress. Let us now fall into the hand of the LORD for His mercies are great, but do not let me fall into the hand of man.”
Isaiah 19: 16 In that day the Egyptians will become like women, and they will tremble and be in dread because of the waving of the hand of the LORD of hosts, which He is going to wave over them.
recall Pslams 78:49 He cast upon them the fierceness of his anger, wrath, and indignation, and trouble, by sending evil angels among them.
Good Morning Ed J,
You said, “So Pilate was serving himself while satan was not? Do I got that right?”
As already mentioned the Hebrew word phonetically pronounced saw-tawn appears in the OT bible and is translated as adversary, accuser, and Satan. When I read saw-tawn in scripture I identify it according to the passage. People read the word Satan and they define it according to a doctrine, I do no such thing.
Saw-tawn does not in and of itself equal wickedness or one serving himself for wicked sake, THAT is a FACT, otherwise you would have to argue that God Himself is wicked because he is called saw-tawn.
Hi Jodi,
Is that a “Yes”?
___________
God bless
Ed JEd J, how do you identify the saw-tawn in Chronicles?
Hi Jodi,
satan means adversary
___________
God bless
Ed JEd J, how do you identify the saw-tawn in Chronicles?
Hi Jodi,
There is no “W” sound in Hebrew
____________
God bless
Ed JEd J,
Well the answer would be a yes or a no depending on which saw-tawn (adversary) you are talking about. That was my whole point in going through verses where we see saw-tawn. I’m sorry you didn’t catch that. The adversary in the book of Job, I have already shown in detail to be the hand of God, so he wasn’t serving himself, he was serving God. I really feel like I explained that pretty well.
saw-tawn as I have said is the phonetic sound of the Hebrew word for adversary. It is NOT the written word in Hebrew which does not contain w’s. When you read saw-tawn, I certainly don’t give a “w” sound, do you? It is an “ah” sound.
The whole reason why I like to use saw-tawn, is because it is so darn close to the word Satan, now isn’t it? I hope it would make people think and realize something very fishy is going on. The Christian definition of Satan is not adversary, though is it? The main stream Christian definition of Satan is a fallen angel rebelling against God and trying to bring darkness and calamity among men, which is something God says HE ALONE only has the POWERS to do. The word Satan has no right to be in the bible, only adversary or accuser does.
The whole doctrine of fallen angels is from man’s own imagination coupled with pagan ideas. Worse then that it was created through self righteousness, men not believing that it could possibly be God inflicting them, it had to be wicked entities. And on top of that when you give God’s POWER that He ALONE says He has, to other entities, saying that they can do the SAME as He does, that they have like powers, you create a false god.
Ed J,
Who is the adversary in Chronicles? We know that the word Satan means adversary, but who do you think this adversary is, that is my question.
Nick…..What makes YOU THINK, it has not been reaveald? DO YOU DESPISE REAVEALED TRUTHS? WHY IS IT IF YOU PERSONALLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND SOMETHING, that somehow makes what someone else says as unrevealed to him, while it may be unreavealed to you, that in no way make it unreavealed to the person whom God may have reaveled it too, now does? , IS YOUR MEASURING STICK OF WHAT IS TRUE, based on what you “ONLY” understand? Bad form Nick, the spirit of God gives different gifts to us all Nick, yours may be one thing, while someone else another. Now if you find fault with what is said then you should express exactly the fault you see in what has been said.
It makes no difference to me Nick, i have always said what i believe has been shown me by God, and will as long as i draw breath, God the Father knows i am not out to decieve anyone, or to draw men after me, but hope what has been given me will edify all the brothers and sisters in God our Father and Jesus also.
Peace and love to you and yours. …….gene
Hi Jodi,
The seed of the serpent is those who, knowingly or unknowingly, serve Satan in the domain of darkness.
The seed of the woman is the children of true Jerusalem.Rev 12
Hi,
The vessel in the garden was a serpent. And it was cursed for allowing Satan to use it.
The contents of the vessel was Satan who entered him just as he entered Judas in Jn 13.27
Ed J,
(1)Who is the adversary in Chronicles?
(2)We know that the word Satan means adversary, but who do you think this adversary is, that is my question.Hi Jodi,
1) I assume it is the same adversary found throughout the bible
2) Lucifer (Isaiah 14, Ezekiel 28, Revelation 12, Psalm 109 ect.)____________
God bless
Ed J
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