The Holy Spirit, a separate person, essence of God, or force?

[NickHassan]

Hi GB,
Some seem to be strongwilled or selfwilled persons.
Controlled by self will they are less easily controlled from without or within would you agree?

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 09 2008,08:57)

WJ…..Show me (ONE) FREE WILL choice you Have made then. Let talk about that one FREE WILL Choice. Remember to be (FREE) means to be Free of any influences, or its not Free. FREE Will…..a human will acting spontaneously, or without external compulsion, pressure, or influence.                 b.. power of the human will (denied by determinists and predestinarians) to choose, either without any motive, or from motives created by the will itself. WJ……can you say you choose, either without any motive, or from no motives created by the will itself, then you do have a (FREE) WILL even though no one else does. And you have disproved Scientist and Psychologist  and Socrates Himself  even though no one has been able to disprove it since 500 BC when Socrates discovered and expounded it. So congratulations are in order for all “Religionest” who have disproved all Science and psychologist and Socrates and all great scholars for the last 2500 years. who say there is no effect with out something causing it to happen. Please give us one example of that if you can.

GB

You can play with words all day if you like.

But I freely choose to disagree with you.

I freely choose to follow the Holy Spirit and his guidance not because I am forced to but because I choose to against the influence of my flesh that desires sin.

I freely choose to deny my self and take up my cross and follow him.

Your theology is “God does it all”.

I excercise my free will to disagree with your influence and your false doctrine.

I submit myself to God and resist the devil.

WJ

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
Yes we should not preach any sort of armchair salvation.

[gollamudi]

A lot of deviation from the topic “the Holy Spirit”.
If you want to discuss “free will” you are free to do it on “free will” topic.
Thanks to all
Adam

[Anonymous]

The Holy Spirit is as important to the God head as the other 2.  He has no name as he is a spirit and has no physcial body that requires a name. You can not see him as Moses looked on god face to face or Jesus was visible to all in the body. I have heard the “small still voice” of the spirit  and no gift of god may be experienced by man unless by the spirit. This means visions, Dreaming Dreams, Healings, Gift of translation, Gift of Faith, and on and on …Gift of tongues etc.
Without the Spirit, the Day of Pentecost would not of happened. The diciples would not of Spoken in tongues unless by the Spirit, who gave them this gift of Tongues and was Present to share it with them. No man, disciple or not my use a gift of god without the spirit. So Holy Spirit is his name. And beware the important you  neglect to place at his feet. If you wish a Heathly enternity read all you can about the Holy Spirit and see the Marvels this un-named Spirit does for us all daily!Sorry to be Sharp but you dare Sin the worst Sin in “Denying the Spirit”

[NickHassan]

Hi and welcome k8,
So you do not believe the Holy Spirit is God's Spirit?
We know that God is Spirit.

John 4:24
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Matthew 3:16
And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

Matthew 12:28
But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

John 3:34
For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

Acts 2:17
And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Does scripture teach that God's Spirit is another person from Him or proceeds from Him?

John 15:26
“When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me,

The traditions of men are not reliable sources of truth.

[Anonymous]

The comforter or Holy Spirit is 3rd part of trinity. “The Father, Son and Holy Spirit” He is separate but common to the other 2 in desire and goals to the Father and son.

John 14:26 seems clear on the division of the Trinity

26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

[NickHassan]

Hi K8,
What trinity?
Is God separate from His Spirit?
Is Jesus not the Son of the Living God?

[Anonymous]

Sorry my mistake Nick
Trinity or Holy Trinity was used in same terms as Godhead, ie. Father, Son and Holy spirit. Not sure where I got that from?
I would say both Father and the Son have bodies and spirits and can Separate them at will as Christ did on the Cross. The Holy Ghost is a separate being, in Godhead, without a body.

[NickHassan]

Hi K8,
The Spirit of God is a separate being from God?
Is it written?

Rather it is written that our relationship with our spirit is similar to God's with His.

1Cor2
11For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

[Anonymous]

Matt. 28: 19
 19 ¶ Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

[NickHassan]

Hi K8,
Was that in the manuscripts or added?

[Anonymous]

Not sure of your last Manuscripts or added question? It was Mathew:28:19 of King James version.

Here is another to ponder as you say

1 Jn. 5: 7

 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Not sure if more in favour of your view or mine but of interest?
I think one in purpose but not of same Spirit?

[NickHassan]

Hi K8,
That too was added.
I will bring up the thread

So the two most depended on scriptures to give any scriptural support to the trinity are not valid.

[Anonymous]

I don't fully understand your logic. Are you saying the King James Version of Bible is unacceptable reference for Scriptures?
What are your sources for such?

[NickHassan]

Hi k8,
All the bibles are deficient in some way and none is perfect especially with regard to the NT. The OT was carefully treated and apart from substituting LORD for YHWH for reasons of respect it is reliable.

All the sections of the NT are a result of man's choice of manuscript and error is in that choice. Some are translated poorly in places. Some have words added in a couple of places.

Again some problems can arise with the choice of books for the canon and many feel Enoch should be among them as it is quoted in Jude. Some books have not been accepted in the past but now are, and vice versa.

God has allowed these challenges to be set before us lest men rely on intellect and logic instead of the Spirit. We have to seek the wisdom of God and research the origins and meanings of words to try to overcome these difficulties. Still they are relatively few and can be known.

[Anonymous]

Source Making Mathew 28:17 an invalid Passage in King James Version of Bible?
   
   I have heard of Marginal notes from an earlier translation being added to next versions text without sources being noted.  I also aggree there is no one perfect Bible.
   But what is your source, for saying Mathew 28:17 is in error? What and who says that this passage is wrong? I would like to look up future descrepencies Myself! Is there an reliable Bible reference and who wrote it?

[Anonymous]

Nick final question is even your own asked Partially in reverse

Quote:

Hi K8,
The Spirit of God is a separate being from God?
Is it written?

Rather it is written that our relationship with our spirit is similar to God's with His.

1Cor2
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

I repeat your own  scripteral reference in part.

“Even so the things of GOD knoweth no MAN”

So why ask? on the  Holy Spirit when no Man Knoweth?
Can we aggree then there can be no correct answer that a MAN can give to answer this Question on the Holy Spirit?
Think this may be nice way to end this thread? Unless someone other than a Man wishes to answer? Have we anyone from Alpha Centuri visiting in the off season?

[NickHassan]

Hi K8,
Bishop Eusebius said he had an original copy of Matthew in his library-since destroyed by the Romans. He quoted Mt 29 as reading “IN MY NAME”-which fits with how the apostles baptised.

If you are a son of God equipped by the Spirit of God you should be learning of the things of God.

[Anonymous]

Thanks Nick

For info on Mathew. Doesn't total seem to Fit with Me for reason I can't state at present? (Re: Baptize in Christs name only.) I see some logic  but as you say My spirit is not settled by such methods?

Second you seem to answer my question “If a MAN should seek to understand GOD when no MAN Knoweth?”

I can say I have Sought understanding and GOD has been more than merciful and Given me more enlightment than I truly asked for! And here still I found that GOD is infinite and beyond our understanding. He has show me a bit, that just all the more Mystifies even me more in his Abilities. You uncover one layer of understanding only to find another lacking and so on. It is truly Beyond our minds abilities to even start to comprehend and there is Joy in that.
Thanks for the Exchange KimBa8

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