The Holy Spirit, a separate person, essence of God, or force?

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,08:59)

Hi WJ, So neat. But so wrong

NH

Really?

Which one of the scriptures are wrong?

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
The scriptures are truth.
But you seem to think Jesus and his Father are not in us AS the Spirit.

So you add up three when two are in us AS the ONE SPIRIT of God through Christ.

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
We fellowship with the Father and the Son.
1Jn1
3That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

We fellowship in the Spirit with them
2 Corinthians 13:14
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,09:42)

Hi WJ, The scriptures are truth. But you seem to think Jesus and his Father are not in us AS the Spirit. So you add up three when two are in us AS the ONE SPIRIT of God through Christ.

NH

So then you are saying the ( parakletos) in John 16:13-15 is the Father and Yeshua?

Jn 16:13
Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

How do you get the Father and Yeshua is the Holy Spirit spoken of in these passages?

Now you say the One Spirit that is in us is the Father and Yeshua.

Yet you say that “no Person” lives in you for God is not a person. Yet Yeshua is a person who you say is the same Spirit as the Father, yet he is a mere man.

What confusion!

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
PERSON does not appear in scripture in realtionship to God.
It is added by the trinity doctrine to bolster some leaks.

God is in heaven.
His Spirit given to us in Christ manifests Him and His Son here.
The Amazing Spirit is described in language that confuses some but you should not make the Spirit a person.

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
For the sake of maintaining our fellowship with God and His Son in the Spirit we do nor dare add to scripture.

2Jn
9Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

You told us to forget the trinity.
You should abhor such additions like trinity too.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,09:53)

Hi WJ, We fellowship with the Father and the Son. 1Jn1 3That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. We fellowship in the Spirit with them 2 Corinthians 13:14 May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.

NH

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. 2 Cor 13:14

Do you see the “and” NH? It is not in.

It lines up with this…

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Matt 28:19

Yeshua didnt say in the name of the Father and the Son, did he?

And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, ( parakletos) , that he may abide with you for ever; John 14:16

So what does “Another” mean to you?

Go ahead turn your ears and eyes or get out the whiteout.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:41)

Hi WJ, For the sake of maintaining our fellowship with God and His Son in the Spirit we do nor dare add to scripture. 2Jn 9Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.   You told us to forget the trinity. You should abhor such additions like trinity too.

NH

You twist my words again.

I said “forget the trinity” only to show you that trinity or not the scriptures I give you speak of three.

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
You should commune in the Spirit of God if you are in Christ.
Eph2
13But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

14For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

17And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

18For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
Jesus was an advocate for his brothers while on earth.
After his resurrection he asked the Father to send the Spirit to be an advocate for them.

[Worshipping Jesus]

NH

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:22)

Hi WJ, PERSON does not appear in scripture in realtionship to God. It is added by the trinity doctrine to bolster some leaks.

But you say Jesus is a man and not God, yet you say he is One Spirit with God and he lives in you. So a person does live in you right?

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:22)

God is in heaven. His Spirit given to us in Christ manifests Him and His Son here. The Amazing Spirit is described in language that confuses some but you should not make the Spirit a person.

No it confuses you because you reject certain scriptures that clearly show the Holy Spirit is not the Father or the Son. Yet you say that he is the Father and the Son and only 2 the Father and the Son lives in you.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:51)

Hi WJ, Jesus was an advocate for his brothers while on earth. After his resurrection he asked the Father to send the Spirit to be an advocate for them.

NH

Yea, and?

So Jesus is not our advocate now? So Jesus doesnt live in us now?

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 17 2008,10:57)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:51) Hi WJ, Jesus was an advocate for his brothers while on earth. After his resurrection he asked the Father to send the Spirit to be an advocate for them. NH Yea, and? So Jesus is not our advocate now? So Jesus doesnt live in us now?

NH

Or are you saying the Father is the “Advocate”?

[Worshipping Jesus]

NH

I am done going in circles with you on this subject. You have obviously rejected certain scriptures that clearly show the Holy Spirit is not the personal Spirit of the Father.

Gotta go. Later my friend.

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
The Spirit in Christ is as the finger of God.

Your only aim seems to be to muddy the water that the children of God drink from
so that you can add your magic gnostic trinity potion
but such additions are poison to us.

[NickHassan]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 17 2008,10:55)

NH Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:22) Hi WJ, PERSON does not appear in scripture in realtionship to God. It is added by the trinity doctrine to bolster some leaks.   But you say Jesus is a man and not God, yet you say he is One Spirit with God and he lives in you. So a person does live in you right? Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:22) God is in heaven. His Spirit given to us in Christ manifests Him and His Son here. The Amazing Spirit is described in language that confuses some but you should not make the Spirit a person. No it confuses you because you reject certain scriptures that clearly show the Holy Spirit is not the Father or the Son. Yet you say that he is the Father and the Son and only 2 the Father and the Son lives in you.

Hi WJ,
God unites us in Christ by His Spirit.

Matthew 10:20
For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

[NickHassan]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 17 2008,10:57)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:51) Hi WJ, Jesus was an advocate for his brothers while on earth. After his resurrection he asked the Father to send the Spirit to be an advocate for them. NH Yea, and? So Jesus is not our advocate now? So Jesus doesnt live in us now?

Hi WJ,
Did you not know Christ lives in us?

Colossians 1:27
To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

Then what is your hope?

[NickHassan]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 17 2008,10:59)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 17 2008,10:57) Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2008,10:51) Hi WJ, Jesus was an advocate for his brothers while on earth. After his resurrection he asked the Father to send the Spirit to be an advocate for them. NH Yea, and? So Jesus is not our advocate now? So Jesus doesnt live in us now? NH Or are you saying the Father is the “Advocate”?

Hi WJ,
You keep having difficulty grasping the amazing nature of the Spirit of God and trying to fit that Spirit in boxes made by men.Is that wise?

Does your hand help and serve you?

The Spirit of God is as the finger of God
[cf Lk11 with Mt 12]

[gollamudi]

Quote (Lightenup @ June 17 2008,06:55)

Quote (Not3in1 @ June 16 2008,12:35) Quote (Lightenup @ June 17 2008,01:48) I believe that each man has been given their own personal spirit that they are born with.  It has been given to them by God and not their parents. What has convinced you of this?   Thanks, Mandy Hi Mandy, Check out these passages: Ecclesiastes 12:1-7 1 Remember also your Creator in the days of your youth, before * * the evil days come and the years draw near when you will say, “I have no delight in them”; 2 before * * the sun and the light, the moon and the stars are darkened, and clouds return after the rain; 3 in the day that the watchmen of the house tremble, and mighty men stoop, the grinding ones stand idle because they are few, and those who look through windows grow dim; 4 and the doors on the street are shut as the sound of the grinding mill is low, and one will arise at the sound of the bird, and all the daughters of song will sing softly. 5 Furthermore, men are afraid of a high place and of terrors on the road; the almond tree blossoms, the grasshopper drags himself along, and the caperberry is ineffective. For man goes to his eternal home while mourners go about in the street. 6 Remember Him before * * the silver cord is broken and the golden bowl is crushed, the pitcher by the well is shattered and the wheel at the cistern is crushed; 7 then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it. Isaiah 42:5-12 5 Thus says God the LORD, Who created the heavens and stretched them out, Who spread out the earth and its offspring, Who gives breath to the people on it And spirit to those who walk in it, 6 “I am the LORD, I have called you in righteousness, I will also hold you by the hand and watch over you, And I will appoint you as a covenant to the people, As a light to the nations, 7 To open blind eyes, To bring out prisoners from the dungeon And those who dwell in darkness from the prison *. 8 “I am the LORD, that is My name; I will not give My glory to another, Nor My praise to graven images. 9 “Behold, the former things have come to pass, Now I declare new things; Before they spring forth I proclaim them to you.” 10 Sing to the LORD a new song, Sing His praise from the end of the earth! You who go down to the sea, and all that is in it. You islands, and those who dwell on them. 11 Let the wilderness and its cities lift up their voices, The settlements where Kedar inhabits. Let the inhabitants of Sela sing aloud, Let them shout for joy from the tops of the mountains. 12 Let them give glory to the LORD And declare His praise in the coastlands. Zechariah 12:1-8 1 The burden of the word of the LORD concerning Israel. Thus declares the LORD who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him, What do you think? Kathi

Hi LU,
I agree with as far as God is the giver of all spirits.
You say our life is passed on to us from our parents and spirit is given by God.
My question is whether life is independent from spirit?
Some where it is mentioned “body without spirit is dead” so where is the question of life without the spirit?
See the debate going between Nick and WJ.
Take care
Adam

[NickHassan]

Hi GM,
Jas 2
26For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Some would try to separate God from His own Spirit as another person.
But the Spirit proceeds from God

John 15:26
“When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me,

Of course the Son is different.
He PROCEEDED forth and CAME FROM God.

John 8:42
Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God, for I have not even come on My own initiative, but He sent Me.

[Author]

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