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Hi WU,
They shall soar as with eagles wings
They shall run and not get weary. run and not faint
is 40Nick.
The Word of God:
God thinks first: then His Words come out.
His Word as a whole was given a living form/shape.
God is a spirit;He can come in any form as He please.We humans;can not hear His voice.
God spoke to the prophets through His living Word.
God spoke to the apostles and jews through His living Word *made flesh*; named Jesus.The living Word will come again as,THE WORD OF GOD.
There is non else,but God; and **HIS OWN WORD**.
*His own speech*.
The HS is in God's Word.
The Father communed with His Son
by thought; not vocally. God thinks and Jesus speaks.What is truth?
What comes out of the mouth of God IS TRUTH.
And the *truth* will set you free.wakeup.
Quote No Charles…………… If I was going to tell you that God is granting me “eternal life”, do you suppose I could say it this way: Hey Charles! God said He was going to grant me Jesus! ?
Mike,
IN ADDITION TO MY POST REGARDING THE ABOVE I WANTED TO POST THIS SCRIPTURE!
2 Timothy 1:9 Who hath delivered US GAVE US ETERNAL LIFE and called us by his holy calling, BY, AND IN THE WORD not according to our works,
BUT ACCORDING TO HIS OWN PURPOSE AND GRACE, WHICH WAS GIVEN US IN CHRIST JESUS BEFORE THE TIMES OF THE WORLD
SO I REPEAT:
GOD GRANTED YOU JESUS, OBVIOUS NOT AS A REDEEMER HUMAN BEING ONLY! BUT AS
THE WORD THE ETERNAL LIFE GIVING SPIRIT FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD REV13:8 TO MAINTAIN ETERNAL LIFE WITHIN YOU TILL YOU ARE REDEEMED, NO MATTER HOW MANY MILLIONS OF YEARS IT WOULD TAKE!
NOW MY QUESTION:
DO YOU BELIEVE THAT THE WORD IS IN YOU, SINCE
BEFORE THE TIMES OF THE WORLD?
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (carmel @ Mar. 15 2014,14:57) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 16 2014,06:37) Satan was originally created with “JESUS”, but God will soon destroy him. Mike,
SATANA WITHIN HIM HAS THE WORD THE ETERNAL LIFE, OTHERWISE HE WON'T EXIST!
Charles,I don't even know what you're talking about anymore. Let's just suffice to say that Jesus being metaphorically called “the eternal life that was with the Father” does not mean the being of Jesus Christ is literally the abstract notion of eternal life itself.
He is a being through whom we can gain eternal life. He is not eternal life itself.
Quote (jammin @ Mar. 15 2014,16:56) …..it is very clear that your question number 1 refers to the father and not the son.
My question refers to the “God” John mentioned. John didn't say “Father” or “nature”, jammin. John only said “God”. If the Word was with God, then the Word couldn't possibly be God.Let me do it the Trinitarian way: ……the Word was with the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, and the Word was the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
How does that work for you? Don't you believe that “God” consists of all three? So when John says “God”, then it must mean all three, right? If John didn't MEAN all three of them, then he wouldn't have said “God”. If he only meant “the Father person of the Godhead”, then he would have SAID “the Father person of the Godhead”.
If the word “God” automatically includes all three persons, then EVERY TIME someone says “God”, it includes all three persons. You can't just read “God and Jesus”, and pretend that this time, “God” only refers to the Father. If “God” means all three, then it ALWAYS means all three.
Besides, how do you and Wallace come to your conclusion that the “God” the Word was with was “the Father”? Couldn't it have been “the Holy Spirit person of the Godhead”? Couldn't it have been the Holy Spirit and the Father?
So how do you know that the “God” in part b was only the Father? Where was your Holy Spirit God at the time? Why isn't that person of the Godhead mentioned in 1:1?
See? You guys have many issues with your doctrine.
Quote (jammin @ Mar. 15 2014,16:56) also, your reference told that they have the same nature. 1956 The Wuest Expanded Translation reads: “In the beginning the Word was existing. And the Word was in fellowship with God the Father. And the Word was as to His essence absolute deity”
I have no problem with that understanding. Of course, the author of it obviously added his own words and understanding into what John actually wrote, but I agree that Jesus, as the second most powerful being in existence, is clearly “absolute deity”. He is a god just like his own Father and God is a god.I also have no problem with the translation that says, “what God was, the Word was”. Because after all, what was God? A powerful spirit being, right? The Word was also a powerful spirit being.
At least now you know there have been MANY people who have translated 1:1c as “and the Word was a god”. It's not just the NWT – although they're the only ones who receive all the false accusations.
I once saw a list online that showed over 100 different translations through the years that had “and the Word was a god”. I don't know where I saw it, or if I could find it again.
So the next time you want to slam the “a god” translation, then slam THE TRANSLATION ITSELF. Don't make it personal about the NWT, because they are just one of MANY who have “a god” in John 1:1.
Quote (jammin @ Mar. 15 2014,17:01) kerwin, if you say you have the nature of God, then you should be almighty, eternal, you are everywhere, all knowing, etc.
go back to school boy
That's like saying if you have human nature, then you should automatically be a mighty warrior like David or Goliath.Or that you should automatically be taken up to heaven in a whirlwind like Elijah – just because you and Elijah shared a human nature.
Solomon was said to have “known all things” concerning the earth. He had human nature. Does that mean that EVERYBODY who has human nature “knows all things”? Of course not.
You need to think these things out, jammin.
Quote (jammin @ Mar. 15 2014,17:35) kerwin and mike, if you accept that you have the nature of God, then you will become almighty, all powerful, all knowing, unique, omnipresence etc someday. hahahhaha
what a funny doctrine you have
jammin,God's nature includes “eternal”. We will share that part of His nature. God's nature includes “spirit being”. We will also share that part of God's nature. God's nature includes “divine”. We will also share that part of God's nature.
But like I showed you in my last post, being a “divine, eternal spirit being” will not EQUATE us with the most powerful and wise “divine, eternal spirit being” – just like sharing a nature with King David doesn't mean we are all mighty warriors, anointed with the Spirit, and kings of a nation.
Will you tell me that I don't share David's human nature just because I'm not as powerful or wise as he was?
If not, then you can't tell me I won't share God's nature just because I won't be as powerful and wise as God is.
Quote Carmel……..Could Adam and Eve also say they proceeded and came forth from GOD? Did that make them DEVINE? Please answer this question as yes or NO , now how about Satan could he also say that he come forth and proceed from GOD?, is he DEVINE also?
Gene,
WE AS HUMANS, MAKE CHILDREN SO THEY COME FORTH FROM US!
WE ALSO AS HUMANS MAKE STATUES,HOUSES, AND ALL THE REST! SO THEY ALSO COME FORTH FROM US
WE ALSO MAKE ALL SORTS OF CORRUPTION, FORNICATIONS, MURDERS, AND SO ON SO
EVEN THESE COME FORTH FROM US
AREN'T ALL OF THE ABOVE RELATED TO ITS RESPECTIVE DIFFERENT STATE, ACT, CONDITION AND SO ON WHEN THEY CAME FORTH FROM US?
CAN YOU COMPARE IN ANY WAY OUR CHILDREN WHICH CAME FORTH FROM US, WITH ALL WHAT I MENTIONED ABOVE? SINCE ONLY OUR CHILDREN WERE IN OUR BOSOM!
WITH THE SAME ARGUMENT:
CAN YOU COMPARE IN ANYWAY JESUS, THAT NOT ONLY HIM WAS IN THE BOSOM OF THE FATHER, BUT HE CONFIRMED HIMSELF THAT ALTHOUGH HE WAS A SON OF MAN, A HUMAN BEING HE WAS IN ALL THINGS OPPOSITE TO US! INCLUDING BOTH HIS BIRTH AND HIS DEATH!
SATANA, WAS LUCIFER, AND HE WAS THE FIRST WHO WAS CREATED, DIRECTLY BY GOD HIMSELF,HE WAS THE FIRST EMBODIMENT OF GOD,
THEN THROUGH HIM AND BY HIM GOD CREATED ALL, BOTH THE HEAVENS AND THE EARTH!
LUCIFER WAS NEVER A DIVINE BEING SINCE HE WAS CREATED!
BUT THE ONLY DIVINE BEING LUCIFER HAD WAS THE WORD THE TRIUNE MEDIATOR CREATOR GOD WITHIN HIM TO MAINTAIN HIS ETERNAL LIFE IN ORDER FOR GOD TO MAKE HIM PERFECT AGAIN,EVEN IF IT TAKES ENDLESS TIME!
THE FACT THAT WE, THE EX REBELLIOUS ANGELS, ALSO HAVE THE WORD ETERNALLY WITHIN US TILL WE REACH PERFECTION!
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
mikeboll64,Mar. wrote:[/quote]
Quote He is a being through whom we can gain eternal life. He is not eternal life itself. Mike,
DO YOU ACCEPT THAT JESUS IS
THE ETERNAL LIFE GIVING SPIRIT?
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 15 2014,21:18) Hi,
There is no evidence that the Word was a separate divine being before being made flesh.
But it is a popular idea
These are the things we know:1. The Word was with God in the beginning.
2. The Word became flesh and dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son.
Nobody argues against these two points, because nobody CAN argue against them.
So all we have to do is focus on #2. We only need to ask ourselves WHO is the ONLY one to ever have dwelled as a flesh being on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son. And there is only ONE answer to that question.
If “God Almighty Himself” is NOT the one who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son, then the Word was NOT “God Almighty Himself”.
If “The Holy Spirit” is NOT the one who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son, then the Word was NOT “The Holy Spirit”.
If “An Abstract Attribute of God” is NOT the one who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son, then the Word was NOT “An Abstract Attribute of God”.
If “A Literal Word Spoken From God's Mouth” is NOT the one who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son, then the Word was NOT “A Literal Word Spoken From God's Mouth”.
On the other hand, if “Jesus” WAS the one who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son, then the Word WAS “Jesus”.
Now, if that easy and logical explanation is not enough for those of you who have PERSONAL WISHES for Jesus to have been nothing but a regular old man like the rest of us, you need only compare the OTHER things John said about “the Word” in the first chapter of his gospel, and see if those same things are said elsewhere in scripture about anyone in particular. Read on, because I've already done the work for you:
The italicized words below are things said about “the Word” in John 1. The scriptures listed in parenthesis identify some of the places in scripture where those same exact things are said about Jesus.
1. And the Word was a god: (Is 9:6, Heb 1:8-9, etc.)
2. He was with God in the beginning: (John 17:5)
3. All things were made through him: (Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6, Heb 1:2)
4. In him was life, and that life was the light of men: (John 5:26, John 8:12)
5. The light shines in the darkness: (Matthew 4:16; John 3:19; 2 Corinthians 4:6)
6. John the Baptist came as a witness to testify concerning that light: (John 1:29-34; 3:26; 5:32-36)
7. The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world: (Isaiah 42:6-7; John 3:19, 9:5, 12:35-36, 46; Luke 1:78-79)
8. Though he was in the world, the world did not recognize him: (Isaiah 53:3, John 4:10, Acts 13:27, John 12:37-38, 1 John 3:1)
9. He came to that which was his own: (Col 1:16; Matt 11:27; John 3:35, 13:3, 16:15; Eph 1:10; Heb 1:2)
10. but his own did not receive him: (Luke 9:53; John 5:43; Acts 13:46)
11. to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God: (Acts 4:12; John 3:14-16; Gal 3:26; Heb 2:10; Eph 1:5)
12. The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us: (1 John 1:1-2, 4:2; Phil 2:6-7; Rom 8:3; Gal 4:4-5)
13. We have seen his glory, the glory of the only begotten: (John 1:18, 3:16-18; 1 John 4:9)
14. who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.: (John 1:16, 14:6; Luke 2:40; Romans 1:5)
15. John testified concerning him.: (Mark 1:7-8; John 1:32, 34; John 3:26; John 5:32-33; John 10:41)
16. He cried out, saying, “This is the one I spoke about when I said, ‘He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.’”: (John 1:29-30; John 3:28,30; Micah 5:2; Acts 19:4)
And if that is STILL not enough for you diehards, then pay close attention to the following verses from John 1:
16 Out of his fullness we have all received grace in place of grace already given.
17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
Up until verse 16, “Jesus” had not been mentioned by name. The subject of verses 1-16 was “the Word”. But in verse 17, we can see John clearly transition from calling this subject “the Word” to calling the same subject “Jesus”.
Verse 16 tells us that we received grace through “the Word”. And verse 17 tells us that the grace we received came through “Jesus Christ”.
So if all that other stuff is too much for you to handle, then keep focusing on the transition between verses 16 and 17. This is the point when John begins to call “the Word” he has been talking about “Jesus Christ”.
Quote (carmel @ Mar. 16 2014,11:07) mikeboll64,Mar. wrote:[/quote]
Quote He is a being through whom we can gain eternal life. He is not eternal life itself. Mike,
DO YOU ACCEPT THAT JESUS IS
THE ETERNAL LIFE GIVING SPIRIT?
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Charles,The Father Jehovah, the ONLY God we are to worship and serve as our God, granted Jesus to have eternal life in him. This does not mean that the Father is literally “eternal life itself”.
After being granted that eternal life from his own God Jehovah, Jesus was given the authority and right to grant that eternal life to any of us that he chooses. Again, this does not mean that Jesus is literally “eternal life itself”.
Nick, jammin, Gene, and all:
We all seem to agree that the “God” in John 1:1b (the Word was with “God”) is “the Father”.
But is the “God” in 1:1c (the Word was “God”) also “the Father”?
YES or NO?
Hi MB,
The Holy Spirit is the finger of God lk 11.20
The Father is wherever His Spirit is.God was in the anointed Jesus
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 16 2014,23:26) Nick, jammin, Gene, and all: We all seem to agree that the “God” in John 1:1b (the Word was with “God”) is “the Father”.
But is the “God” in 1:1c (the Word was “God”) also “the Father”?
YES or NO?
Mike,If John 1:1 was translated even more literally than it is then it would go “the word is with the god and the word is god”. Even without the capitalization it is clear “the god” is Jehovah but the missing “the” tells us the word is god(divine) in nature. If John wanted to make the point the word was the God he would have simply added “the” in John 1:1c.
John 1:1-2
Jubilee Bible 2000 (JUB)1 ¶ In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with the God.So the answer is no.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 16 2014,09:18) Hi,
There is no evidence that the Word was a separate divine being before being made flesh.
But it is a popular idea
Nick,I agree that those that are too used to the false teachings of either trinitarians and their decendant teaching have not yet fremm from thee lies and deceptions of those teaching. Until they do they will continue to put what they were taught by mere men into the letter of God's word. The thing is that each of us is to watch ourselves less we are doing the same.
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