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Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 06 2013,01:52) Marty, Your point is a distraction.
Consider that the spokesman for the King of Abyssinia was called Kal Hatze – which means “the word of the king”.
This doesn't mean that the word “word” all of a sudden starts meaning “spokesman for a king”. The word “word” still continued to mean “spoken words”, or whatever.
So the claim is not that the word “logos” MEANS “pre-existent Christ”. It still means “word”. But as God's main spokesman, Christ has the TITLE “the Word of God”.
And that SPOKESMAN pre-existed his time on earth.
Your claim is the equivalent of saying Kal Hatze could not be “the word of the king” because “word” means “word” – and not “spokesman for the king”.
It is a non-point.
Hi Mike:Well if you are saying that “the Word” in John 1 pertains to Jesus then I agree, but it does not mean that he pre-existed in some form of a pre-existent being prior to being born into this world as a living soul.
And so, I do not see what I have posted is a distraction. Understand the definition of the Word in Greek and Hebrew, and you will have the proper interpretation of John 1.
Love in Christ,
MartyMarty,
The definition of both the Hebrew and Greek words you listed is simply “word”. I understand that.
You say the Word “pertains to Jesus”. Please explain. How exactly does the Word who was with God in the beginning, and became flesh and dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son “pertain to” Jesus?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 06 2013,02:11) Marty, The definition of both the Hebrew and Greek words you listed is simply “word”. I understand that.
You say the Word “pertains to Jesus”. Please explain. How exactly does the Word who was with God in the beginning, and became flesh and dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son “pertain to” Jesus?
Hi Mike:How many scriptures in the OT, either prophetic or symbolic, relate to the coming of the Messiah, who we now know to be Jesus?
Is this the Word of God?
And where does John 1:1 state the Word (who) was with God in the beginning.
It states:
Quote
Jhn 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.There is no “who” in that scripture, is there?
Love in Christ,
MartyThere is a “HE was with God in the beginning”, right?
Now, please explain to me how the Word “pertains to” Jesus, but isn't really Jesus. Because what you've posted above doesn't explain anything to me about how you're understanding this “pertains to” stuff.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 02 2013,03:41) [/quote] kerwin,Oct. wrote:Quote Paul is teaching that Jesus Christ is all to believers and that Jesus Christ is in him. Kerwin,
YOU ARE WRONG, WRONG , AND WRONG! WITH EVERY RESPECT!
AND THE ABOVE IS A VERY, VERY POOR UNDERSTANDING FROM YOUR PART!
JESUS CHRIST IS ALL AND IN ALL
SO ACCORDING TO YOU HE IS REFERRING TO HIMSELF THAT CHRIST IS IN HIM AND ONLY TO THE BELIEVERS???
WHY THEREFORE THE WORDS :
IS ALL, AND IN ALL WERE USED ?
THE WORD ALL IS A VERY CLEAR WORD WHICH MEANS CHRIST IS THE ENTIRE EXISTENCE, AND IN THE ENTIRE EXISTENCE!
COLOSSIANS IS DIRECTED BOTH TO THE BELIEVERS AND TO THE UNBELIEVERS!
BOTH TO THE GENTILES AND TO THE JEWS! THEREFORE TO THE WHOLE WORLD, AND ALL IT’S SUBSTANCES, WHICH PURPOSELY AND GRADUALLY EVOLVED AND PRODUCED THE FIRST PERFECT MAN ADAM TRANSFORMED INTO THE FIRST EVER LIVING SOUL, BUT DIED THROUGH SIN,AND WHICH HAD TO BE ONCE AND FOR ALL RECREATED AGAIN BY THE UNIQUE PERFECT LIFE GIVING SPIRIT GODMAN , JESUS CHRIST!
PAUL WAS REFERRING TO THE NEW MAN WHO MUST BE MANIFESTED TOTALLY BY ALL MEN !
THIS FOR THE SIMPLE REASON THAT PAUL'S RESPONSIBILITY WAS TO ESTABLISH THE SOUL CONCEPT WITHIN THE CHURCH, AND ALL SOULS NO MATTER WHO AND WHAT,WERE CHRIST'S SUBSTANCE!
OBVIOUSLY HE WAS TALKING TO THE CHRISTIANS!
BUT PAUL MADE IT CLEAR THAT, AS A SPIRIT, JESUS CHRIST , HAD REMOVED SATAN'S SPIRIT FROM WITHIN THE ENTIRE PROCESS OF THE HUMAN SOUL, LOST DUE TO ADAM SIN, AND OFFICIALLY ESTABLISHED HIMSELF AS THE OWNER OF ALL SOULS HIS SUBSTANCE, NO MATTER WHO, AND WHAT!
NOT ONLY THAT
BUT BECAME ALSO THE PROPRIETOR OF THE FLESH AND BLOOD BODY, LUCIFER'S, SINCE HE GLORIFIED IT THROUGH THE POURING OF HIS OWN PURE SPIRIT OF HIS BLOOD AND DEATH ON THE CROSS!
GOD SAID:
Leviticus 17: Because THE LIFE OF THE FLESH IS IN THE BLOOD: and I have given it to you, that you may make atonement with it upon the altar for your SOULS, and the blood may be for an expiation of the SOUL .
SO NOW MAN IS THE PROPERTY OF GOD THROUGHOUT, BOTH BODY AND SOUL! DUE TO THE FACT THAT JESUS CHRIST, THE WORD THE TRIUNE, MEDIATOR GOD,CREATED ALL BECAME FLESH, DIED FOR ALL, REDEEMED ALL, AND OWNS ALL! NOT ONLY FOR PAUL, AND BELIEVERS!
SO CHRIST IS ALL AND IN ALL FROM CONCEPTION!
THEREFORE CHRIST IS THE SUPREME OWNER OF ALL WHATEVER IS CREATED! SINCE IT IS CREATED FOR THE SAKE OF MAN! JESUS CHRIST!
SO YOU ARE WELL MISTAKEN!
READ:
Colossians 1:16 For IN HIM were ALL THINGS CREATED in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: ALL THINGS WERE CREATED BY HIM AND IN HIM.
17And he is before all, and by him (HIS SPIRIT, THE WORD,) ALL THINGS CONSIST.
JESUS ALSO CONFIRMED IN:
John 8:36 If therefore the son (CHRIST) shall make you free, you shall be free indeed.
NOTICE FREE INDEED SO WHETHER A SOUL BELIEVE IN CHRIST OR NOT, SHE IS STILL REDEEMED, FOR THE SIMPLE REASON THAT SATAN LOST THE AUTOMATIC OWNERSHIP OF ALL SOULS ON THE CROSS!
JESUS CHRIST WAS THE RANSOM!
READ THE TRUTH THAT YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF:
John 1: 9That was the true light, which enlighteneth every man that cometh into this world’
OK? CLEAR, IT SAYS: WHICH ENLIGHTEN EVERYMAN THAT COMETH INTO THIS WORLD! SO FROM BIRTH ALL SOULS ARE OFFICIALLY CHRIST’S! BUT STILL FREE, TO LIVE THE WAY THEY WANT! AND AFTER DEATH THEY SHALL FACE CHRIST AS THE OWNER OF ALL SOULS AND HE DECIDES WHAT WOULD HAPPEN TO THEM!
NOT ONE SOUL GOES STRAIGHT TO HELL ANY MORE, LIKE WHAT HAPPENED BEFORE REDEMPTION!
IT HAS TO AND MUST BE SO!
IN ORDER TO TOPPLE SATAN’S OWN PROCEDURE ESTABLISHED IN THE BLOOD THROUGH ADAM SIN!
1 John 3:8 He that commmitteth sin is of the devil: for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose, the Son of God APPEARED that HE MIGHT DESTROY THE WORKS OF THE DEVIL!
SO I AM AFRAID YOU HAVE TO GO BACK AND READ MY POST AGAIN IN ORDER TO REFLECT AND COMMENT ACCORDINGLY
Peace and love in Jesus christ
Charles
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 06 2013,12:09) There is a “HE was with God in the beginning”, right? Now, please explain to me how the Word “pertains to” Jesus, but isn't really Jesus. Because what you've posted above doesn't explain anything to me about how you're understanding this “pertains to” stuff.
Hi Mike:Most of the translations do translate verse 2 as “He” was with …, some translate “the same was with God…, and according to the definition, it would be translated as “this was with God”, and so, it depends who you believe.
But Jesus was with God in the beginning as someone who would be manifest to the world at a particular point in time, but he did not exist as a living soul.
It was God's plan that he would be conceived in the womb of the virgin Mary from the beginning.
I don't know what you don't understand about the Word of God were the sayings of God. These sayings are prophetic relative to His sending forth the Messiah which we now know to be Jesus.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (942767 @ Oct. 07 2013,06:31) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 06 2013,12:09) There is a “HE was with God in the beginning”, right? Now, please explain to me how the Word “pertains to” Jesus, but isn't really Jesus. Because what you've posted above doesn't explain anything to me about how you're understanding this “pertains to” stuff.
Hi Mike:Most of the translations do translate verse 2 as “He” was with …, some translate “the same was with God…, and according to the definition, it would be translated as “this was with God”, and so, it depends who you believe.
But Jesus was with God in the beginning as someone who would be manifest to the world at a particular point in time, but he did not exist as a living soul.
It was God's plan that he would be conceived in the womb of the virgin Mary from the beginning.
I don't know what you don't understand about the Word of God were the sayings of God. These sayings are prophetic relative to His sending forth the Messiah which we now know to be Jesus.
Love in Christ,
Marty
Is it possible for Jehovah to bring out *His Word*
as an image of himself,and created all things
through him?wakeup.
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 06 2013,13:31) Hi Mike: Most of the translations do translate verse 2 as “He” was with …, some translate “the same was with God…, and according to the definition, it would be translated as “this was with God”, and so, it depends who you believe.
Marty,In the Greek, the pronoun (He) was written in the masculine form. Not only that, but when this Word became flesh and dwelled on earth, he did so with the glory of God's only begotten Son – not God's only begotten “daughter”, or “thing”.
So “HE” is what was written by John, and “HE” is what was meant by John.
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 06 2013,13:31) But Jesus was with God in the beginning as someone who would be manifest to the world at a particular point in time………..
Mystery Babylon, Marty. What you want to say is that God had determined the life and role Jesus would someday fulfill from the beginning, but Jesus himself didn't actually exist until conceived in the womb of Mary.But in order to fit your unscriptural view into the wording of John 1, you must confusingly say “Jesus was with God in the beginning” – when you don't really mean such a thing.
Nothing but Mystery Babylon. Jesus either WAS with God in the beginning, or he WASN'T. You believe he WASN'T – so don't go trying to use the Kerwin-like language of confusion to PRETEND you're aligned with the scriptures by saying he WAS – when you really believe he WASN'T.
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 06 2013,13:31) It was God's plan that he would be conceived in the womb of the virgin Mary from the beginning.
I don't deny that at all. Our difference is that I believe Jesus was an existing being at the time God devised this plan, and you don't. But we agree that it was foretold long before it happened that the Messiah would come from the tribe of Judah, be a branch of David's tree, and be born of a human woman.Quote (942767 @ Oct. 06 2013,13:31) I don't know what you don't understand about the Word of God were the sayings of God.
Okay, now we're getting nearer to clearer.1. Are you telling me that a SAYING of God was both with God and was God in the beginning?
2. Are you telling me that a SAYING of God actually became a flesh and blood man, who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten?
3. Are you telling me that it is a SAYING of God who will ride a white horse and do battle against Satan and his hordes?
Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 07 2013,08:25) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 07 2013,06:31) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 06 2013,12:09) There is a “HE was with God in the beginning”, right? Now, please explain to me how the Word “pertains to” Jesus, but isn't really Jesus. Because what you've posted above doesn't explain anything to me about how you're understanding this “pertains to” stuff.
Hi Mike:Most of the translations do translate verse 2 as “He” was with …, some translate “the same was with God…, and according to the definition, it would be translated as “this was with God”, and so, it depends who you believe.
But Jesus was with God in the beginning as someone who would be manifest to the world at a particular point in time, but he did not exist as a living soul.
It was God's plan that he would be conceived in the womb of the virgin Mary from the beginning.
I don't know what you don't understand about the Word of God were the sayings of God. These sayings are prophetic relative to His sending forth the Messiah which we now know to be Jesus.
Love in Christ,
Marty
Is it possible for Jehovah to bring out *His Word*
as an image of himself,and created all things
through him?wakeup.
Hi Wakeup:I will just post a couple of scriptures and let you decide if that is the way that it was.
Quote
Hebrews1God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,(God spake by the prophets, is this God's Word?)
Hbr 1:2
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;(He spoke to humanity through his Son in this last days, is this God's Word?) (And it was by this Son that God created the world)
Hbr 1:3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Quote
Hbr 5:7Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;
Hbr 5:8
Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
Hbr 5:9
And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Jesus speaking to Phillip:
Quote
Jhn 14:9Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
Jhn 14:10
Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
There are other scriptures to which we could refer, but this should be enough to answer your question.
Love in Christ,
MartyHi Mike:
I said, that it was God's plan for Jesus to be conceived by the Holy Ghost from the beginning, and you said
Quote
I don't deny that at all. Our difference is that I believe Jesus was an existing being at the time God devised this plan, and you don't. But we agree that it was foretold long before it happened that the Messiah would come from the tribe of Judah, be a branch of David's tree, and be born of a human woman.I know that this is where we differ, and so now, all you have to do is present the scriptures that say that Jesus existed as a sentient person from the beginning, and I will be convinced.
You say:
Quote
Mystery Babylon, Marty. What you want to say is that God had determined the life and role Jesus would someday fulfill from the beginning, but Jesus himself didn't actually exist until conceived in the womb of Mary.But in order to fit your unscriptural view into the wording of John 1, you must confusingly say “Jesus was with God in the beginning” – when you don't really mean such a thing.
Nothing but Mystery Babylon. Jesus either WAS with God in the beginning, or he WASN'T. You believe he WASN'T – so don't go trying to use the Kerwin-like language of confusion to PRETEND you're aligned with the scriptures by saying he WAS – when you really believe he WASN'T.
I will answer this by scripture:
Quote
1Pe 1:18Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
1Pe 1:19
But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
1Pe 1:20
Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
And you say and ask:
Quote
Okay, now we're getting nearer to clearer.1. Are you telling me that a SAYING of God was both with God and was God in the beginning?
2. Are you telling me that a SAYING of God actually became a flesh and blood man, who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten?
3. Are you telling me that it is a SAYING of God who will ride a white horse and do battle against Satan and his hordes?
What I am saying that the prophecy pertaining to the Messiah whom we now know to be Jesus became a reality when Jesus was born into this world, and it is through his word that God has revealed to humanity that He is a spirit of love. This is God: “For God so loved the world that he gave His Only Begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved”.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (kerwin @ Oct. 04 2013,18:32) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 04 2013,09:04) kerwin,
read rev 19.13
Jammin,I read it and understand it for by that time the word had been made flesh and Jesus had received the name that was above every other name for many years.
kerwin im asking you
who is the Word in rev 19.13|?Carmel,
I am sorry but I do not have the time to answer your long post.
Quote COLOSSIANS IS DIRECTED BOTH TO THE BELIEVERS AND TO THE UNBELIEVERS! Colossians 1:1-2
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother, 2 to the saints and faithful brethren in Christ which are at Colosse: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
It is clear you are the one that is “WRONG, WRONG , AND WRONG! WITH EVERY RESPECT” as your words disagree with the words of Scripture.
Quote PAUL WAS REFERRING TO THE NEW MAN WHO MUST BE MANIFESTED TOTALLY BY ALL MEN ! You have already made a clearly flawed claim and this contradicts the idea that those that do the things of the flesh will not inherit the reign of God.
Galatians 5:19-21
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Your chose not to show any evidence to support your claim.
Quote BUT PAUL MADE IT CLEAR THAT, AS A SPIRIT, JESUS CHRIST , HAD REMOVED SATAN'S SPIRIT FROM WITHIN THE ENTIRE PROCESS OF THE HUMAN SOUL, LOST DUE TO ADAM SIN, AND OFFICIALLY ESTABLISHED HIMSELF AS THE OWNER OF ALL SOULS HIS SUBSTANCE, NO MATTER WHO, AND WHAT! You do not even sound clear on that you are putting down on paper. Maybe the run on sentence is what makes it so confusing sounding. I am going to try to gain more clarity by breaking it down into individual thoughts.
Quote BUT PAUL MADE IT CLEAR THAT JESUS CHRIST HAS REMOVED SATAN'S SPIRIT FROM WITHIN THE ENTIRE PROCESS OF THE HUMAN SOUL… I have no clue what this means as I have never heard it from Scripture. I do know that mankind is a slave of Satan; bound to him by their natural spirit. I also know that those that receive the Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ and live by it are set free from that bondage. Is that what you are trying to say?
You have a logical and and so you have to establish both parts of the sentence are true for the statement to be true. I don't see that you have even established the first part is true.
Quote (jammin @ Oct. 07 2013,07:51) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 04 2013,18:32) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 04 2013,09:04) kerwin,
read rev 19.13
Jammin,I read it and understand it for by that time the word had been made flesh and Jesus had received the name that was above every other name for many years.
kerwin im asking you
who is the Word in rev 19.13|?
Jammin,I assume that you are able to use reason and so figure out that I am saying Jesus is called by the name of the word at the time Revelations 19:13 speaks of and also point out that according to Scripture he has been called that since the word was made flesh.
To rephrase myself Revelations 19:113 is speaking of a time where Jesus is called by the name of the word; a time after the word was made flesh.
You have given no reliable evidence that Jesus was called by the name of the word previous to the time the word was made flesh. That is where we are and we have been for a while.
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 06 2013,19:01) Quote (mikeboll @ 64)
Okay, now we're getting nearer to clearer.1. Are you telling me that a SAYING of God was both with God and was God in the beginning?
2. Are you telling me that a SAYING of God actually became a flesh and blood man, who dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten?
3. Are you telling me that it is a SAYING of God who will ride a white horse and do battle against Satan and his hordes?
What I am saying that the prophecy pertaining to the Messiah whom we now know to be Jesus became a reality when Jesus was born into this world, and it is through his word that God has revealed to humanity that He is a spirit of love. This is God: “For God so loved the world that he gave His Only Begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved”.
I want YES or NO answers to all three, Marty.Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 07 2013,18:40) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 07 2013,07:51) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 04 2013,18:32) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 04 2013,09:04) kerwin,
read rev 19.13
Jammin,I read it and understand it for by that time the word had been made flesh and Jesus had received the name that was above every other name for many years.
kerwin im asking you
who is the Word in rev 19.13|?
Jammin,I assume that you are able to use reason and so figure out that I am saying Jesus is called by the name of the word at the time Revelations 19:13 speaks of and also point out that according to Scripture he has been called that since the word was made flesh.
To rephrase myself Revelations 19:113 is speaking of a time where Jesus is called by the name of the word; a time after the word was made flesh.
You have given no reliable evidence that Jesus was called by the name of the word previous to the time the word was made flesh. That is where we are and we have been for a while.
do not explain kerwin. i jusr want an answer.
who is the Word in rev 19.13? is that jesus or no?Quote (jammin @ Oct. 08 2013,09:25) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 07 2013,18:40) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 07 2013,07:51) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 04 2013,18:32) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 04 2013,09:04) kerwin,
read rev 19.13
Jammin,I read it and understand it for by that time the word had been made flesh and Jesus had received the name that was above every other name for many years.
kerwin im asking you
who is the Word in rev 19.13|?
Jammin,I assume that you are able to use reason and so figure out that I am saying Jesus is called by the name of the word at the time Revelations 19:13 speaks of and also point out that according to Scripture he has been called that since the word was made flesh.
To rephrase myself Revelations 19:113 is speaking of a time where Jesus is called by the name of the word; a time after the word was made flesh.
You have given no reliable evidence that Jesus was called by the name of the word previous to the time the word was made flesh. That is where we are and we have been for a while.
do not explain kerwin. i jusr want an answer.
who is the Word in rev 19.13? is that jesus or no?
Jammin,I am tired of answering that question because you do not like my answer and the one I have been giving will not change. I also am waiting for the evidence that Jesus was called by the name of the Word before his flesh came to exist.
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 07 2013,11:16) Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 07 2013,08:25) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 07 2013,06:31) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 06 2013,12:09) There is a “HE was with God in the beginning”, right? Now, please explain to me how the Word “pertains to” Jesus, but isn't really Jesus. Because what you've posted above doesn't explain anything to me about how you're understanding this “pertains to” stuff.
Hi Mike:Most of the translations do translate verse 2 as “He” was with …, some translate “the same was with God…, and according to the definition, it would be translated as “this was with God”, and so, it depends who you believe.
But Jesus was with God in the beginning as someone who would be manifest to the world at a particular point in time, but he did not exist as a living soul.
It was God's plan that he would be conceived in the womb of the virgin Mary from the beginning.
I don't know what you don't understand about the Word of God were the sayings of God. These sayings are prophetic relative to His sending forth the Messiah which we now know to be Jesus.
Love in Christ,
Marty
Is it possible for Jehovah to bring out *His Word*
as an image of himself,and created all things
through him?wakeup.
Hi Wakeup:I will just post a couple of scriptures and let you decide if that is the way that it was.
Quote
Hebrews1God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,(God spake by the prophets, is this God's Word?)
Hbr 1:2
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;(He spoke to humanity through his Son in this last days, is this God's Word?) (And it was by this Son that God created the world)
Hbr 1:3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Quote
Hbr 5:7Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;
Hbr 5:8
Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
Hbr 5:9
And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Jesus speaking to Phillip:
Quote
Jhn 14:9Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
Jhn 14:10
Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
There are other scriptures to which we could refer, but this should be enough to answer your question.
Love in Christ,
Marty
Marty.God spoke in the past *TO* the prophets.
God in these last days spoke *through* the son.God called Ilijah:
Ilijah!! And he answered;here I am Lord.
God spoke *TO* Ilijah.Not through Ilijah.God does not speak *TO* Jesus;but *through* Jesus.
The prophets did not create anything;but can make things happen.
Jesus created all things: Without him was not anything made that was made.He was the *living* Word made flesh.
He is one of the: *US* in heaven. Let *US* make man in
our image.*US* is God and his image,another living being.Jehovah and his image,which is his own Word.
God could make the *stones* to glorify him.
God also could bring out His *living Word* and give him a form.What is so hard to believe this?
His breath is his word.(ps.33:6).
His breath was made flesh. Made to be seen,and touched.
The word of God taught the apostles;in a fleshly form.
Everytime God wants something said;the Words came out of Jesus mouth.He was *only man after* he was born.
He was spirit *before* he was born.
He was with God creating things.
They had glory together.
He was brought forth before the world was.There is only one God with his Word *inside* him.
The is *still* one God with his word *outside* him.
There is still one God with his Word outside him, with a form
.
There is still one God with *His Word* dwelling amongst men
No matter in what form or shape.Jehovah is *ONE* and his Word can be anywhere,any shape
or form. His Word was ones the tree of life in the garden.
God is a spirit; he can multiply into many if he wants to.
He could be a pillar of smoke.
He could be in heaven and on earth at the same time.AND HE HAS TRANSFORMED HIS LIVING WORD
INTO A MAN, AND SPOKE THROUGH HIM.
GOD ON EARTH.(BUT HIS IMAGE).wakeup.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 08 2013,14:33) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 08 2013,09:25) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 07 2013,18:40) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 07 2013,07:51) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 04 2013,18:32) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 04 2013,09:04) kerwin,
read rev 19.13
Jammin,I read it and understand it for by that time the word had been made flesh and Jesus had received the name that was above every other name for many years.
kerwin im asking you
who is the Word in rev 19.13|?
Jammin,I assume that you are able to use reason and so figure out that I am saying Jesus is called by the name of the word at the time Revelations 19:13 speaks of and also point out that according to Scripture he has been called that since the word was made flesh.
To rephrase myself Revelations 19:113 is speaking of a time where Jesus is called by the name of the word; a time after the word was made flesh.
You have given no reliable evidence that Jesus was called by the name of the word previous to the time the word was made flesh. That is where we are and we have been for a while.
do not explain kerwin. i jusr want an answer.
who is the Word in rev 19.13? is that jesus or no?
Jammin,I am tired of answering that question because you do not like my answer and the one I have been giving will not change. I also am waiting for the evidence that Jesus was called by the name of the Word before his flesh came to exist.
John 1:1Contemporary English Version (CEV)
The Word of Life1 In the beginning was the one
who is called the Word.
The Word was with God
and was truly God.14 The Word became
a human being
and lived here with us.
We saw his true glory,
the glory of the only Son
of the Father.
From him all the kindness
and all the truth of God
have come down to us.i answered your question. Jesus is called the Word before he became human.
now answer mine, who is the Word in rev 19.13?
1. jesus
2. kerwinchoose one boy
Quote (jammin @ Oct. 08 2013,12:43)
John 1:1Contemporary English Version (CEV)
The Word of Life1 In the beginning was the one
who is called the Word.
The Word was with God
and was truly God.14 The Word became
a human being
and lived here with us.
We saw his true glory,
the glory of the only Son
of the Father.
From him all the kindness
and all the truth of God
have come down to us.i answered your question. Jesus is called the Word before he became human.
now answer mine, who is the Word in rev 19.13?
1. jesus
2. kerwinchoose one boy
Jammin,This is what wikipedia states about the CEV:
Quote Moreover, the CEV often paraphrases in order to make the underlying point of a passage clear, rather than directly translating the wording. This introduces a greater chance of error due to bias than direct translation as the translator is interpreting their perception of the idea of the whole of what they are paraphrasing rather than just one word.
The sum of your claim is since the translators believe it must be translated and interpreted this way then it must be true.
My answer is that I do not find them creditable and I am asking for a creditable source to support your claim.
As far as I know, by the time Revelations 19:13 rolls around we both agree that Jesus is called by the name of the word. I have been telling you but you act as if we disagree. Our disagreement is when he was first called by the name of the word.
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