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- mikeboll64,April wrote:
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Quote I worship the God OF Christ, jammin. Mike,
yes and you still have to worship him when you go to heaven!
BUT CHRIST DOES NOT WORSHIP HIS FATHER like he did when he was a man!
SINCE HE IS ONE GLORY WITH THE FATHER, UNITED AS
ALMIGHTY GOD IN SPIRIT AND FLESH, SOMETHING WHICH THE FATHER STILL HAVE TO ACHIEVE ON THE LAST DAY!
TO BE ALL IN ALL!
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
mikeboll64,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote what about this one:
IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO TELL US HOW YOU WORSHIP THIS SPIRIT GOD OF YOURS, AND IN THE SAME TIME, IN THE TRUTH
ALSO:
WHEN I PRAY TO JESUS I KNOW IN TRUTH THAT THE FATHER ACCEPTED MY PRAYERS.
BUT IF I PRAY TO THE FATHER ONLY I AM ALSO SURE THAT I WON'T BE SURE IF I AM IN THE TRUTH!
Peace and love in Jesus the only true God in flesh!
Charles
Quote (carmel @ April 06 2013,14:41) Gene, I SAID THAT JESUS DIDN'T DIE LIKE WE DO!
Scripture is clear about that!
Gene and I are still waiting for the scripture(s) that support your claim, Charles.Quote (carmel @ April 06 2013,15:25) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 06 2013,19:21) and I will also write on them my new name.
Mike,That scriptures is confirming that Jesus is UNITED AS ONE WITH GOD.
Actually Charles, Rev 3:12 makes it clear that Jesus and his God have different names. That's why he says he will write on us “the name of my God……… and ALSO my new name”.TWO names will be written on those who overcome, Charles. One of those two names will be the new name of Jesus. The other name will be the name of the God of Jesus.
Quote (carmel @ April 06 2013,15:25) NOW EXPLAIN THIS FOR ME: John 13:31 …………Now is the
SON OF MAN IS GLORIFIED, AND GOD IS GLORIFIED IN HIM.
Simple. This scripture clearly distinguishes “the Son of Man” as someone OTHER THAN “God”.We are to do all things to the glory of God, the Father. So if God glorifies one of His servants for any reason, God Himself is also glorified through that servant. God glorified His servant, Jesus Christ – and through that glorification of His servant, God Himself was also glorified.
Quote (carmel @ April 06 2013,15:33) BUT CHRIST DOES NOT WORSHIP HIS FATHER like he did when he was a man!
Do you have any scriptural support for that claim, Charles?It seems to me that while on earth, Jesus worshiped the one he also called “my God”, right?
Now that Jesus has been exalted by his God and our God, he still calls the Father “my God”, right?
So if he still calls Him “my God”, just like he did when he was on earth, what makes you think he doesn't still worship Him, just like he did when he was on earth?
Quote (carmel @ April 06 2013,15:39) WHEN I PRAY TO JESUS I KNOW IN TRUTH THAT THE FATHER ACCEPTED MY PRAYERS.
I don't pray to Jesus, Charles. Instead, I pray to the Father God through the one He appointed as mediator between us and our one true God.IE: I pray to God through His mediator, Jesus Christ. The Apostles did the same.
mikeboll64,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote I don't pray to Jesus, Charles. Instead, I pray to the Father God through[/b] the one He appointed as mediator between us and our one true God.
Mike,
WHO IS THIS ALMIGHTY, THE ONLY TRUE GOD THE FATHER THEN,YOU'VE BEEN SHOUTING SINCE HE IS USELESS ON IS OWN.
from the other hand:
WHO IS THIS SUPER MEDIATOR WHO IS IN FULL AUTHORITY AND WITHOUT HIM, YOUR ALMIGHTY THE ONLY TRUE GOD THE FATHER IS USELESS FOR US?
WHAT KIND OF AN ALMIGHTY GOD HE IS THEN TO REQUIRE SOMEBODY LESS THAN HIM IN ORDER TO BE EVEN MORE MIGHTY?
MADNESS, NONSENSE, STUPIDITY AND DARKNESS IN ITSELF
AN INCAPABLE ALMIGHTY GOD WHO CANNOT CHANGE HIS ATTRIBUTION THE WAY HE FEELS FIT IN ORDER TO BE ALSO A MEDIATOR HIMSELF FOR US?
AND IN THE SAME TIME:
ALL CREATION IS GOD'S MANIFESTATION, GOD HIMSELF VISIBLE,HIDDEN IN HIS UNFATHOMABLE VERSATILE SPIRITS.
THE FLESH COUNTS FOR NOTHING, MATERIAL COUNTS FOR NOTHING, THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE.
ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT IF YOU ARE HIDDEN IN A COSTUME
YOU ARE NOT MIKE? THE COSTUME COUNTS FOR NOTHING.
NO?IF I KNOW YOU, I STILL CALL YOU MIKE!
THE COSTUME COUNTS FOR NOTHING.NO?
ONLY THOSE WHO DOESN'T KNOW YOU WON'T CALL YOU MIKE,
LIKE YOU DON'T KNOW GOD IN JESUS
Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him, from the creation of the world, are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made; his eternal power also, and DIVINITY: so that they are INEXCUSABLE.
Isaiah 45:7 I (MYSELF)form the light, and create darkness, I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord (THE WORD MADE FLESH,JESUS) that do all these things.
45:14 …………..men of stature shall come over to thee, and shall be thins: they shall walk after thee, they shall go bound with manacles: and they shall worship thee, and shall make supplication to thee: only in thee (THE WORD MADE FLESH, JESUS) is God, and there is no God besides thee.
15 VERILY YOU ARE A HIDDEN GOD, the God of Israel the saviour.
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
mikeboll64,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote Gene and I are still waiting for the scripture(s) that support your claim, Charles. Mike,
Unless you are blind, you would accept these:
Hebrews 1:11 They shall perish,( die) but thou shalt continue: (living.)
PSALM 118:17 I shall not die, but live: and shall declare the works of the Lord
1:12:……………. and they shall be changed: but thou art the selfsame,……NO CHANGE,NO CORROSION IN JESUS, THEREFORE NOT DEATH AS OURS SINCE WE CORRODE, AND HE DIDN'T, HE REMAINED THE SELF SAME
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (carmel @ April 07 2013,02:41) Gene wrote:[/quote]
Quote ..Jesus said in Revelations, i was dead and am alive for evermore but you don't believe he was dead right? So i guess Jesus Lied to us then Right Gene,
I SAID THAT JESUS DIDN'T DIE LIKE WE DO!
NOT THAT HE DIDN'T DIE!
Scripture is clear about that!
Jesus is different from us,in every sense,although he was human!
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Charles,The fact Jesus' body did not corrupt in the grave does not mean he did not die as is common to man. One man's body is cremated and another's is cremated and yet both die as is common to man.
kerwin,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote The fact Jesus' body did not corrupt in the grave does not mean he did not die as is common to man. Kerwin.
CORRUPTION IS THE PROOF THAT THE BODY CHANGED.SO IT DIDN'T REMAIN THE SAME
Hebrews:1:12:……………. and they shall be changed: but thou art the selfsame,……NO CHANGE,NO CORROSION IN JESUS, THEREFORE NOT DEATH AS OURS.
now do you know that there are incorrupt bodies a particular one from the fourth century? do you mean that although that he is dead his body is like all the corrupted ones.
DEFINITELY NOT!SO HE DIDN'T DIE LIKE ALL THE REST SINCE HIS BODY IS IN EXISTENCE. IT PROVES THAT HIS SOUL LEFT HIS BODY ONLY.
THE SOUL AND THE BODY WERE ONLY SEPARATED WITHOUT DESTROYING OR CHANGING THE BODY. SO THE BODY IS NOT DEAD, BUT WITHOUT SPIRITUAL ENERGY.
LIKE A CAR WITHOUT A FUEL!
NOW JESUS WAS EVEN BETTER SINCE HE WAS THE WORD MADE FLESH, GOD IN FLESH,SUPERIOR TO DEATH!
NOW READ SCRIPTURE AND IT IS CLEAR THAT HE WAS DEAD IN THE BODY BUT HE CONTINUED TO LIVE IN THE SPIRITUAL PROCESS OF HIS BODY. THE SPIRITUALIZING PROCESS WAS PURPOSELY PROGRESSIVE NOT INSTANT OTHERWISE HE WOULD HAVE NEVER TASTED DEATH.
Hebrews 1:11 They shall perish,( die) but thou shalt continue: (living.)
PSALM 118:17 I shall not die, but live: and shall declare the works of the Lord
1:12:……………. and they shall be changed: but thou art the selfsame,……NO CHANGE,NO CORROSION IN JESUS, THEREFORE NOT THE SAME DEATH AS OURS
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (carmel @ April 08 2013,03:11) Quote (kerwin @ April 08 2013,06:41) Quote The fact Jesus' body did not corrupt in the grave does not mean he did not die as is common to man. Kerwin.
CORRUPTION IS THE PROOF THAT THE BODY CHANGED.SO IT DIDN'T REMAIN THE SAME
Hebrews:1:12:……………. and they shall be changed: but thou art the selfsame,……NO CHANGE,NO CORROSION IN JESUS, THEREFORE NOT DEATH AS OURS.
now do you know that there are incorrupt bodies a particular one from the fourth century? do you mean that although that he is dead his body is like all the corrupted ones.
DEFINITELY NOT!SO HE DIDN'T DIE LIKE ALL THE REST SINCE HIS BODY IS IN EXISTENCE. IT PROVES THAT HIS SOUL LEFT HIS BODY ONLY.
THE SOUL AND THE BODY WERE ONLY SEPARATED WITHOUT DESTROYING OR CHANGING THE BODY. SO THE BODY IS NOT DEAD, BUT WITHOUT SPIRITUAL ENERGY.
LIKE A CAR WITHOUT A FUEL!
NOW JESUS WAS EVEN BETTER SINCE HE WAS THE WORD MADE FLESH, GOD IN FLESH,SUPERIOR TO DEATH!
NOW READ SCRIPTURE AND IT IS CLEAR THAT HE WAS DEAD IN THE BODY BUT HE CONTINUED TO LIVE IN THE SPIRITUAL PROCESS OF HIS BODY. THE SPIRITUALIZING PROCESS WAS PURPOSELY PROGRESSIVE NOT INSTANT OTHERWISE HE WOULD HAVE NEVER TASTED DEATH.
Hebrews 1:11 They shall perish,( die) but thou shalt continue: (living.)
PSALM 118:17 I shall not die, but live: and shall declare the works of the Lord
1:12:……………. and they shall be changed: but thou art the selfsame,……NO CHANGE,NO CORROSION IN JESUS, THEREFORE NOT THE SAME DEATH AS OURS
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Charles,Corruption of the dead body occurs over a period of time and Jesus only laid in the grave about 36 hours. I know of a woman that lied dead longer than that without corruption. According to the Chinese authorities her body remained warm. She would have been buried or cremated except for local customs.
At 36 hours the rigor mortis of the the average body just starts to subside.
Quote About three hours after death, rigor mortis — a stiffening of muscles — sets in. Around 12 hours after death, the body will feel cool, and within 24 hours (depending on body fat and external temperatures), it will lose all internal heat in a process called algor mortis. The muscle tissue begins to lose its stiffness after about 36 hours, and within about 72 hours of dying, the body's rigor mortis will subside Jesus' body did not decay because he was not dead long enough.
Note: my Source
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 06 2013,17:27) Quote (jammin @ April 05 2013,21:58) i also believe that his father is his God. there is nothing wrong with that.
You believe that ONLY the Father is his God, right?
why did you cut my post?
have not you read the last part?ill post it again sunshine
i also believe that his father is his God. there is nothing wrong with that. but what you are saying is not the whole truth.i believe Jesus is my Lord and my God but you just believe that Christ is Lord and not God.
thomas said Jesus is his Lord and his God
sorry sunshine
jammin,
Answer the question, if you dare.
Do you believe that the Father ALONE is the God of Jesus? YES or NO?
(Don't bother posting anything to me until you post a “Yes” or “No” answer to that very simple question.)
Quote (carmel @ April 07 2013,10:09) Mike, WHO IS THIS ALMIGHTY, THE ONLY TRUE GOD THE FATHER THEN,YOU'VE BEEN SHOUTING SINCE HE IS USELESS ON IS OWN.
Jehovah God Almighty, the Father and Creator of all living things, is not “useless on His own”, Charles. I can't even believe you would utter those words.God often uses mediators. Sometimes He sends angels, other times prophets. Jesus, being both and angel and a prophet of his and our God, is no exception. He is one of the many mediators between man and God.
Quote (carmel @ April 07 2013,10:27) Mike, Unless you are blind, you would accept these:
Hebrews 1:11
They shall perish,( die) but thou shalt continue: (living.)
Charles,I don't believe Heb 1:10-12 to be about Jesus, because he is often in scripture distinguished as someone other than the One who created all things. But instead of getting into that right now, let's just assume it is about Jesus – for the purposes of this particular discussion.
There will be a new heavens, and a new earth, because the old ones will pass away, right? When those things do pass away, will Jesus pass away with them – or will he “continue on”?
Of course the latter is the correct answer. Jesus will continue on because Jesus can NO LONGER die again. Death NO LONGER has mastery over him. (But it did at one time, right?
)So, your first scripture doesn't say anything about Jesus the man dying a different kind of death than the rest of us die.
I will address your second scripture AFTER you start addressing some of MY points.
Charles, does Rev 3:12 clearly show that Jesus and his God have two different names? YES or NO?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 09 2013,12:27) jammin, Answer the question, if you dare.
Do you believe that the Father ALONE is the God of Jesus? YES or NO?
(Don't bother posting anything to me until you post a “Yes” or “No” answer to that very simple question.)
yes bec he has only one fatherhe has no two fathers.
what a silly question
ill post it again sunshine
i also believe that his father is his God. there is nothing wrong with that. but what you are saying is not the whole truth.i believe Jesus is my Lord and my God but you just believe that Christ is Lord and not God.
thomas said Jesus is his Lord and his God
sorry sunshine
kerwin,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote Jesus' body did not decay because he was not dead long enough. Kerwin,
All what you posted is IRRELEVANT to my post.
You never commented anything regarding the scriptures which I posted.
Regarding the above statement, Jesus' body changed.ALTHOUGH DECAY WAS NOT EVIDENTLY ACTIVE YET!
Once a person is dead ,
IT IS DEFINITELY IN A DIFFERENT STATE THEN WHEN HE WAS ALIVE. NEVER MIND THE DECAY.
JESUS' BODY NEVER CHANGED AT ALL. HE REMAINED ALIVE IN THE STATE HE WAS IN!ALTHOUGH HIS BODY WAS EVIDENTLY DEAD FOR ALL THOSE WHO WERE PRESENT.
JESUS'BODY WAS IN ITS SPIRITUAL PROCESS.
IT WAS BEING TRANSFORMED INTO A SPIRITUAL FLESH BODY!
SO SINCE ACCORDING TO YOU THE DECAY PROCESS WAS NOT YET EFFECTED,ALTHOUGH AS I SAID,
HE DEFINITELY SEEMED THAT HE WAS NOT IN THE SAME STATE LIKE WHEN HE WAS STILL ALIVE,
IT STRENGTHENED MY POINT THAT SINCE,ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURES, HE CONTINUED IN THE SAME STATE,THEREFORE:
HE CONTINUED IN HIS ORIGINAL STATE OF THE SPIRITUAL PROCESS .
THEREFORE HE WAS NOT DEAD LIKE WE DO
MORE TO COME!
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote Jehovah God Almighty, the Father and Creator of all living things, is not “useless on His own”, Charles. I can't even believe you would utter those words. Mike,
I know what I SAID, but you simply made it sounds that I meant ALMIGHTY GOD IS USELESS
But the truth is Mike
THAT YOU ARE PROCLAIMING THAT ALMIGHTY GOD IS USELESS
SINCE ACCORDING TO YOU HE IS NOT CAPABLE TO TRANSFORM HIMSELF AS MEDIATOR IN ORDER TO ACCEPT US, AND ALSO BELIEVE THAT GOD NEED A CREATURE INFERIOR TO HIM IN ORDER TO
BECOME EVEN MORE GLORIFIED,MORE POWERFUL,
AND TO ESTABLISH HIMSELF AS THE TRUE GOD!
SO WHETHER YOU READ IT OR NOT IT IS HERE AGAIN PERHAPS YOU ANSWER SOME OF WHAT I POSTED.
SINCE YOU CONSIDER YOURSELF A MASTER OF FILTHY, CORRUPTED WORLDLY WISDOM!
from the other hand:
WHO IS THIS SUPER MEDIATOR WHO IS IN FULL AUTHORITY AND WITHOUT HIM, YOUR ALMIGHTY THE ONLY TRUE GOD THE FATHER IS USELESS FOR US?
WHAT KIND OF AN ALMIGHTY GOD HE IS THEN TO REQUIRE SOMEBODY LESS THAN HIM IN ORDER TO BE EVEN MORE MIGHTY?
MADNESS, NONSENSE, STUPIDITY AND DARKNESS IN ITSELF
AN INCAPABLE ALMIGHTY GOD WHO CANNOT CHANGE HIS ATTRIBUTION THE WAY HE FEELS FIT IN ORDER TO BE ALSO A MEDIATOR HIMSELF FOR US?
AND IN THE SAME TIME:
ALL CREATION IS GOD'S MANIFESTATION, GOD HIMSELF VISIBLE,HIDDEN IN HIS UNFATHOMABLE VERSATILE SPIRITS.
THE FLESH COUNTS FOR NOTHING, MATERIAL COUNTS FOR NOTHING, THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE.
ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT IF YOU ARE HIDDEN IN A COSTUME
YOU ARE NOT MIKE? THE COSTUME COUNTS FOR NOTHING.
NO?IF I KNOW YOU, I STILL CALL YOU MIKE!
THE COSTUME COUNTS FOR NOTHING.NO?
ONLY THOSE WHO DOESN'T KNOW YOU WON'T CALL YOU MIKE,
LIKE YOU DON'T KNOW GOD IN JESUS
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote So, your first scripture doesn't say anything about Jesus the man dying a different kind of death than the rest of us die. Mike,
the word die IS PURPOSELY NOT SPECIFIED.
SO ONLY WHO IS IN THE TRUTH, AND TO WHOM THE SON OF MAN WANTS TO REVEAL IT,WOULD SEE IT!
Scriptures stated in many ways regarding Jesus' kind of death,but purposely in a paradoxical way! like JESUS WAS!
and the word die is a complex one regarding Jesus.
SINCE JESUS WAS BOTH A SON OF MAN, AND A SON OF GOD SO! PARADOXICAL!
JESUS WAS NOT LIKE US OF THE WORLD ONLY, JUST MAN,
HE WAS FROM HEAVEN!
THEREFORE HE HAD TO DIE ONLY IN ONE STATE WHICH WAS THAT OF SON OF MAN
BUT IN THE SAME TIME NOT AS SON OF GOD SO PARADOXICAL!
SO IF YOU REFLECT YOU WOULD REALIZE THIS.
HUMANS COULD ONLY SEE WHAT HAPPENED CARNALLY,
THEY COULD NEVER SEE WHAT HAPPENED SPIRITUALLY.
WHICH AS I SAID SINCE HE WAS PARADOXICAL,HE MUST NOT DIE SPIRITUALLY!
ONLY SATAN DIED ON THE CROSS! WHICH WAS MANIFESTED IN JESUS' BODY,BUT IT WAS NOT DEAD IN THE TRUTH BECAUSE THE SPIRIT OF THE SON OF GOD,DID HIS PART IN JESUS FLESH BODY,THEREFORE TOOK OVER AND CONTINUED THE SPIRITUAL PROCESS, WHICH JESUS AS MAN STARTED WHEN HE WAS STILL ALIVE IN THE LAST SUPPER!
NOW: SCRIPTURE MUST STATES THE SPIRITUAL ACHIEVEMENTS IN A LITERALLY HIDDEN WAY,AND THE CARNAL ACHIEVEMENTS IN A LITERALLY VISIBLE WAY.
AND YOU UNFORTUNATELY ARE NOT READY TO ASK IN THE TRUTH THE HOLY SPIRIT TO REVEAL IT TO YOU BECAUSE YOU DO NOT BELIEVE THAT HE CAN HEAR YOU,
AND ALSO YOU ARE NOT HUMBLE ENOUGH TO DO THIS, YOU ARE PROUD OF YOURSELF,YOU RELY ON WORLDLY WISDOM! AND THAT IS THE WORST THING WHICH YOU MUST NOT DO REGARDING GOD'S WISDOM!
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
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