JOHN 1:1 who is the WORD?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 18 2012,09:46)

I do not see the unity of believer's as one WITH Them but one AS They are…all in one name, or as one AS being IN Them. Do you know of one of these 'unity' statements that says we are one WITH them?

Well of course YOU don't see it, Kathi. You are blinded by your desire for Jesus to be a second Almighty God, and so naturally you will understand one use of “one” in one way, and the other use of “one” in a totally different way – because that is the way you WANT to see it.

But truthfully, there is no secret, hidden difference between Jesus being “one” with his God, and the disciples also being “one” with their God and His servant Jesus Christ.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 14 2012,13:59)

Mike, I think Paul is not using the word 'God' in vs. 6 as a name but as a description of a nature. In vs. 9 he uses it as a name of a particular person, God the Father……………….

Before jumping to verse 9, let's discuss the second “God” in verse 6, okay?

To whom or what does that “God” refer?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 13 2012,14:50)

In Jeremiah God is refering to Jesus as HIMSELF.

Charles,

Exodus 7
15 Go to Pharaoh in the morning as he goes out to the water. Wait on the bank of the Nile to meet him, and take in your hand the staff that was changed into a snake.

17 This is what the Lord says: By this you will know that I am the Lord: With the staff that is in my hand I will strike the water of the Nile, and it will be changed into blood.

Whose hand was the staff actually in? Moses' hand, right? How then does Jehovah say the staff was in HIS hand? And who actually struck the Nile with that staff? Moses, right? How then does Jehovah say HE will strike the Nile?

Charles, will you use the wording of this passage to claim that Moses is Jehovah as well? Or do you only make these illogical conclusions when it comes to Jesus?

Please give me your explanation of why the staff was in the hand of Moses, but Jehovah said the staff was in HIS hand.

[terraricca]

kathi

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This does not make Him less powerful than the Lamb, it just makes Him not qualified as one who had to overcome the temptation to sin and be slain. There are many things that the Lamb did that the Father did not do and many things that the Father does that the Lamb did not do. That only speaks to their different roles, not to their equality in nature. They are both equally theos in nature.

God is equal to no one,this his a fact, all others are of his creation ,this is not a contest of who can do what ,but of Gods will ,who,when and were ,why this is so thats Gods arragement not men's ,if God make it known to men that's because it should been known by him at the apropriate time ,how God make it known his for the purpose of restricting access and so make it only known to those he chose ,

Glory his a shared comodity ;like Christ is his father GLORY the disciples of Christ are his GLORY the GLORY of the disciples are the results of their preachings ,and so we become as true believers in THEIR MESSAGE PART OF THEIR GLORY ,,

BUT ALL GLORY BELONGS TO GOD BECAUSE HE AD MADED TO BE THAT WAY.

[Lightenup]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 18 2012,11:11)

Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 18 2012,09:46) I do not see the unity of believer's as one WITH Them but one AS They are…all in one name,  or as one AS being IN Them. Do you know of one of these 'unity' statements that says we are one WITH them? Well of course YOU don't see it, Kathi.  You are blinded by your desire for Jesus to be a second Almighty God, and so naturally you will understand one use of “one” in one way, and the other use of “one” in a totally different way – because that is the way you WANT to see it. But truthfully, there is no secret, hidden difference between Jesus being “one” with his God, and the disciples also being “one” with their God and His servant Jesus Christ.

Mike,

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Do you know of one of these 'unity' statements that says we are one WITH them?

I don't see it because it isn't there. If you think it is there, show me the scripture that says believer's are one WITH them, with 'with' being the required word. If you can't find that, then you can't use that we are one WITH them, with any scriptural basis.

[Lightenup]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 18 2012,11:39)

kathi Quote This does not make Him less powerful than the Lamb, it just makes Him not qualified as one who had to overcome the temptation to sin and be slain. There are many things that the Lamb did that the Father did not do and many things that the Father does that the Lamb did not do. That only speaks to their different roles, not to their equality in nature. They are both equally theos in nature. God is equal to no one,this his a fact, all others are of his creation ,this is not a contest of who can do what ,but of Gods will ,who,when and were ,why this is so thats Gods arragement not men's ,if God make it known to men that's because it should been known by him at the apropriate time ,how God make it known his for the purpose of restricting access and so make it only known to those he chose , Glory his a shared comodity ;like Christ is his father GLORY the disciples of Christ are his GLORY the GLORY of the disciples are the results of their preachings ,and so we become as true believers in THEIR MESSAGE PART OF THEIR GLORY ,, BUT ALL GLORY BELONGS TO GOD BECAUSE HE AD MADED TO BE THAT WAY.

You are wrong Pierre. Heb 1:3 does say that one is just like the other.

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 18 2012,10:41)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 17 2012,01:38) Hi Lu, Im going to have to pull a “Mike” on you. Rev 5 makes no mention that the “Father” couldn't open the seal. Oops.  Seems like Dennison beat me to the punch on that one.  (I answer these posts AS I read them, from earliest to latest.  Sometimes I answer before seeing someone else has already said the same thing.)

Its all good Mike
seriously though you guys already gave me a headache, i have to attempt to catch up.

[terraricca]

Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 18 2012,22:47)

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 18 2012,11:39) kathi Quote This does not make Him less powerful than the Lamb, it just makes Him not qualified as one who had to overcome the temptation to sin and be slain. There are many things that the Lamb did that the Father did not do and many things that the Father does that the Lamb did not do. That only speaks to their different roles, not to their equality in nature. They are both equally theos in nature. God is equal to no one,this his a fact, all others are of his creation ,this is not a contest of who can do what ,but of Gods will ,who,when and were ,why this is so thats Gods arragement not men's ,if God make it known to men that's because it should been known by him at the apropriate time ,how God make it known his for the purpose of restricting access and so make it only known to those he chose , Glory his a shared comodity ;like Christ is his father GLORY the disciples of Christ are his GLORY the GLORY of the disciples are the results of their preachings ,and so we become as true believers in THEIR MESSAGE PART OF THEIR GLORY ,, BUT ALL GLORY BELONGS TO GOD BECAUSE HE AD MADED TO BE THAT WAY. You are wrong Pierre. Heb 1:3 does say that one is just like the other.

kathi

Heb 1:3 The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
Heb 1:4 So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.

Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Heb 1:4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

NOW SINS WHEN IS ;the brightness of his glory AND THE ; the express image of his person; MAKES THE SON EQUAL TO THE FATHER ??

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 18 2012,20:05)

Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 18 2012,06:44) This does not make Him less powerful than the Lamb, it just makes Him not qualified as one who had to overcome the temptation to sin and be slain. There are many things that the Lamb did that the Father did not do and many things that the Father does that the Lamb did not do. That only speaks to their different roles, not to their equality in nature. They are both equally theos in nature. That sounds a lot better than what it seemed like you were saying before. Perhaps Dennison and I misunderstood you before, but it seemed as if you were saying Jesus was more capable than his own God at certain things. But I agree that if the qualifications have to do with being tempted and overcoming that temptation, then Jesus is qualified and his God is not, for God cannot even be tempted in the first place.

Mike,

With all curiousity,
What do you mean by Jesus being tempted?
For example.

Do you mean, Jesus had a desire to sin, but didn't?

or something else?

[carmel]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 18 2012,16:30)

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 15 2012,00:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 15 2012,04:00) All things were created by God alone…………… THROUGH His holy Servant Jesus Christ. Mike, PERFECT: YOU HAVE JUST ADMITTED THAT JESUS IS GOD. ALL THINGS WERE CREATED BY GOD ALONE!!! THEN YOU ADMIT: THROUGH JESUS CHRIST!!! SO NOT ALONE!!! OR SINCE THERE'S THE WORD “ALONE” AND ALSO “THROUGH JESUS CHRIST” IT IS A PROOF THAT JESUS IS ALSO GOD!!! Hmmm……………… I believe God created Cain ALONE too, right?  Yet He did that THROUGH Eve, right? Apparently Eve is also God then?

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I believe God created Cain ALONE too, right?  Yet He did that THROUGH Eve, right?

Mike,

YUO CAN BELIEVE WHATEVER YOU WANT!!

But Cain was not created!!

Cain was born like you and me!!

ONLY ADAM  AND IN A WAY EVE WERE CREATED!!

peace and love in Jesus

Charles

[carmel]

mikeboll64,Oct. wrote:

[/quote]

Quote

But either way, the points I made above are valid.  If God was IN Jesus' soul, then it proves that Jesus was someone OTHER THAN the God who was IN his soul.

Mike,

Where could the Spirit of the Father have abided other then within Jesus' soul???

Scripture is clear that the fullness of the GODHEAD was in JESUS!!

So the Father's Spirit was in Jesus' soul.

Also Jesus had to be in all things like His brethren.

So since we have a spirit within our souls,

JESUS HAD THE SPIRIT OF THE FATHER IN HIS SOUL.

The only difference was that JESUS WAS THE FRUIT OF A GENUINE SPIRIT SUBSTANCE OF GOD'S SPIRIT WHICH CONCEIVED MARY.

PURPOSELY FOR THE FATHER TO ABIDE WITHIN,

NOTHING LESS WAS POSSIBLE TO CARRY THE FATHER'S SPIRIT THEN AN EQUAL SPIRIT.

WE FROM THE OTHER HAND ARE THE GENUINE SUBSTANCE OF LUCIFER  EX EVIL CREATURES.

GOD CONNOT ABIDE IN US ECXEPT THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT.

AND THAT IS ONLY AFTER JESUS ERADICATED SATAN'S SPIRIT FROM OUR SOULS.

AND IF A PERSON IS READY TO ABANDON TOTALLY THE WORLD AND LIVE THE GOSPEL IN THE TRUTH, THEN YES GOD BOTH IN THE SON AND THE FATHER ,SINCE THEY ARE UNITED AS ONE

TRUE GOD,AND JESUS CHRIST

WILL ABIDE IN HIM.

John 14:23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

AS THE TRUE GOD, AND JESUS CHRIST.

NOTICE:

JESUS SAID :

WE WILL COME UNTO HIM,AND MAKE OUR ABODE WITH HIM!!

HE DIDN'T SAY I WILL COME.OR MY FATHER WILL COME,

BUT WE WILL COME.

THIS IS A PROOF THAT BOTH THE FATHER AND THE SON ARE REALLY ONE  AS ALWAYS, BUT WHERE BEFORE WERE ONLY SPIRITS, NOW THEY ARE BOTH SPIRIT AND FLESH, BUT THROUGH JESUS CHRIST.

Peace and love in Jesus

Charles

[carmel]

Mike,

In addition to the last post:

DO YOU BELEIVE THAT THE SPIRIT OF THE FATHER WAS IN JESUS SOUL???

YES OR NO???

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 18 2012,10:46)

I don't see it because it isn't there. If you think it is there, show me the scripture that says believer's are one WITH them, with 'with' being the required word. If you can't find that, then you can't use that we are one WITH them, with any scriptural basis.

You'll grasp at any ole straw you can, won't you?

Don't the words “one AS WE ARE ONE” indicate that the disciples will be one with God and His servant Jesus AS the servant Jesus is one with his own God?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 18 2012,13:29)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 18 2012,16:30) Quote (carmel @ Oct. 15 2012,00:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 15 2012,04:00) All things were created by God alone…………… THROUGH His holy Servant Jesus Christ. Mike, PERFECT: YOU HAVE JUST ADMITTED THAT JESUS IS GOD. ALL THINGS WERE CREATED BY GOD ALONE!!! THEN YOU ADMIT: THROUGH JESUS CHRIST!!! SO NOT ALONE!!! OR SINCE THERE'S THE WORD “ALONE” AND ALSO “THROUGH JESUS CHRIST” IT IS A PROOF THAT JESUS IS ALSO GOD!!! Hmmm……………… I believe God created Cain ALONE too, right?  Yet He did that THROUGH Eve, right? Apparently Eve is also God then?   Quote I believe God created Cain ALONE too, right?  Yet He did that THROUGH Eve, right? Mike, YUO CAN BELIEVE WHATEVER YOU WANT!! But Cain was not created!!

Malachi 2:10 King James Version
Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us?

Perhaps you are truly NOT a creation of God, Charles. But make no mistake that Adam, Eve, Cain, Jesus, Gabriel, and the rest of us ARE.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 18 2012,14:16)

NOTICE: JESUS SAID : WE WILL COME UNTO HIM,AND MAKE OUR ABODE WITH HIM!! HE DIDN'T SAY I WILL COME.OR MY FATHER WILL COME, BUT WE WILL COME. THIS IS A PROOF THAT BOTH THE FATHER AND THE SON ARE REALLY ONE  AS ALWAYS……………

Why is that a proof, Charles?  If I say about me and my son, “WE will walk to the store later”, does it mean me and my son are the same entity?  Or does the word “WE” usually indicate TWO different entities?

How do you people do this stuff?  How can you look at a scripture where Jesus refers to himself and his God as “WE”, and conclude that the “WE” is really ONE entity?  

It truly baffles me to no end, Charles.

Charles, can you give me an example, BESIDES God and His servant Jesus Christ, where the word “WE” would make you conclude that only ONE entity is being spoken of?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 18 2012,14:19)

Mike, In addition to the last post: DO YOU BELEIVE THAT THE SPIRIT OF THE FATHER WAS IN JESUS SOUL??? YES OR NO???

Charles,

I cannot comment on that question. I don't know the answer, because the answer is not in any scripture.

[carmel]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 19 2012,07:36)

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 18 2012,13:29) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 18 2012,16:30) Quote (carmel @ Oct. 15 2012,00:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 15 2012,04:00) All things were created by God alone…………… THROUGH His holy Servant Jesus Christ. Mike, PERFECT: YOU HAVE JUST ADMITTED THAT JESUS IS GOD. ALL THINGS WERE CREATED BY GOD ALONE!!! THEN YOU ADMIT: THROUGH JESUS CHRIST!!! SO NOT ALONE!!! OR SINCE THERE'S THE WORD “ALONE” AND ALSO “THROUGH JESUS CHRIST” IT IS A PROOF THAT JESUS IS ALSO GOD!!! Hmmm……………… I believe God created Cain ALONE too, right?  Yet He did that THROUGH Eve, right? Apparently Eve is also God then?   Quote I believe God created Cain ALONE too, right?  Yet He did that THROUGH Eve, right? Mike, YUO CAN BELIEVE WHATEVER YOU WANT!! But Cain was not created!! Malachi 2:10 King James Version Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? Perhaps you are truly NOT a creation of God, Charles.  But make no mistake that Adam, Eve, Cain, Jesus, Gabriel, and the rest of us ARE.

Quote

Perhaps you are truly NOT a creation of God, Charles.  But make no mistake that Adam, Eve, Cain, Jesus, Gabriel, and the rest of us ARE.

Mike,

THERE'S ONLY ONE WAY TRAFFIC FOR YOU MIKE,

SIMPLY LITERALLY.

WE ALL ARE CREATED THROUGH ADAM. OK

NOT INDIVIDUALLY!!!

WE ARE BORN INDIVIDUALLY!!!

NOW DO YOU KNOW WHY WE ARE ALL CREATED IN ADAM???

ANSWER THIS MIKE!!!

Peace and love in Jesus

Charles

[mikeboll64]

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 18 2012,15:46)

WE ALL ARE CREATED THROUGH ADAM. OK

And does that make Adam the very God who created us through him?

Or does that line of reasoning only work when Jesus is the one in question?

Charles, I have posts that I have DUPLICATED for you today because you didn't answer them when I asked them a week ago. Why do you still refuse to answer them?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 18 2012,11:17)

…….you guys already gave me a headache, i have to attempt to catch up.

I know the feeling.  Lately, I haven't been able to log on as frequently as before.  It sucks logging on just to find out 17 more pages have been added since your last post.  

Have you read any of jammin's posts yet?  He reminds me of you when you joined.  

Even though I rarely agree with him on doctrine, he cracks me up something fierce – just like you do.  

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ Oct. 18 2012,05:57)

GOD is their nature. my example will always be you and your father. you are two in numbers but one in nature, HUMAN.

We are of one nature because we both belong to the same SPECIES: human being.

Like I said, you and Kathi are DESCRIBING God as a SPECIES, even though you don't come right out and SAY the word “SPECIES”.

[Author]

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