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To all;
Where does John 20:28 state Thomas was calling anyone anything? I do not perceive thee words “you are” as Peter included when confessing Jesus to be the Christ, the Son of God, Matthew 16:16.
Instead he replied to Jesus' words not to be faithless; but believing and some conclude it infers Thomas is calling Jesus “My Lord and my God”.
Is it wise to so add to what is written?
Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,16:09) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 06 2012,03:07) Quote (journey42 @ Aug. 05 2012,06:28) Quote (jammin @ Aug. 05 2012,15:38) God was manifest in the flesh.
Yes, this statement is true. No denying what the scripture says.
God was manifested in the flesh.
Hi journey,As usual, I have been enjoying your posts. Good stuff!
But you should know the truth that 1 Timothy 3:16 doesn't actually say “GOD was manifest in the flesh”.
You can read about it on NETNotes if you'd like. Just click on footnote #3 in the NET translation at the top of the page. (Note that NETNotes was produced by 25 TRINITARIAN scholars – who would like nothing more than for it to say “God”.)
Here is some of the information you can read on that link:
The Byzantine text along with a few other witnesses read θεός (“God”) for ὅς (“who”).Significantly, D* and virtually the entire Latin tradition read the neuter relative pronoun, ὅ (Jo, “which”), a reading that indirectly supports ὅς (who) since it could not easily have been generated if θεός (God) had been in the text. Thus, externally, there is no question as to what should be considered original: The Alexandrian and Western traditions are decidedly in favor of ὅς. Internally, the evidence is even stronger. What scribe would change θεός to ὅς intentionally?
It appears that sometime after the 2nd century the θεός reading came into existence, either via confusion with ὅς or as an intentional alteration to magnify Christ………..
Once it got in, this theologically rich reading was easily able to influence all the rest of the mss it came in contact with (including mss already written, such as א A C D). That this reading did not arise until after the 2nd century is evident from the Western reading, ὅ.
To argue that heretics tampered with the text here is self-defeating, for most of the Western fathers who quoted the verse with the relative pronoun were quite orthodox, strongly affirming the deity of Christ. They would have dearly loved such a reading as θεός. Further, had heretics introduced a variant to θεός, a far more natural choice would have been Χριστός (Cristos, “Christ”) or κύριος (kurios, “Lord”), since the text is self-evidently about Christ, but it is not self-evidently a proclamation of his deity.
The ms was ALTERED sometime after the 2nd century to say “GOD appeared in the flesh”. The earlier ms don't have the word “GOD”.
And if you go to the page I linked, you'll notice that of the 9 translations listed, only the KJV and the NKJV have the word “GOD” in that verse. The more recent translators, who had access to the older mss, have all translated as “HE appeared in the flesh”.
In other words, there was no writing by Paul that ever said “GOD appeared in the flesh”. There is no writing by Paul to say that, because God never did appear in the flesh. His Son did.
peace,
mike
Ura and Jammin Bible versions: “God appeared in the flesh… and died?…”Mike Bible versions: “The Son of God appeared in the flesh…”
Other Bible versions: The begotten Son of God, died….”
Ura and Jammin Bible versions: “God appeared in the flesh and died then raised by God from the dead?…”
Limjunus Bible versions:
Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,01:46) Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,01:04) Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,00:30) Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 05 2012,23:06) I will not deal with Jammin, any more except he will answer the existing questions of mine. He could not find the rightful answers, that's why he just ignore it. How come he has a gut to join with this discussion if he has not fully equip with the truth about God? Peace>
limjunus,i already answered your questions. in fact, your NLT did not support your illusion that Christ is not God. why?
let me post phil 2.6 of NLT
Philippians 2:6
New Living Translation (NLT)
6 Though he was God,
he did not think of equality with God
as something to cling to.Christ is God accrding to your favorite version NLT
you need to study hard and take more vitamins.
better luck next time boy
YOU DID NOT ANSWER JAMMIN, UP THIS TIME.1.) WHO SI THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD, JESUS CHRIST, THE BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD, OR HIS FATHER WHO HAD BEGOTTEN HIM?
2.) HOW MANY TRUE GOD YOU HATH RECOGNIZED?
I did not see your answers, where?
LOLsorry boy but your favorite version says that Christ is GOD
LOLstudy hard boy.
your stand is weak
Escaping …. limjunus,
im not escaping boy. but dont you have any common sense?? LOL
your favorite version contradict your belief that Christ is not GOD>
make more research before talking to me. you need to study hard boy LOL
Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,16:48) limjunus, im not escaping boy. but dont you have any common sense?? LOL
your favorite version contradict your belief that Christ is not GOD>
make more research before talking to me. you need to study hard boy LOL
The questions are very simple and clear. I did not ask what verses do you have that Jesus Christ is truly God?Another chance for you again:
1.) “WHO IS THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD, Jesus Christ, the begotten Son of God, or his Father who had begotten him?
2.) How many truly God you have recognized, only one or more?
Simple questions but very difficult for you to answer, because you really do not know which is the one and only true God, the Son or the Father?
As I told you before, I am not relying only with the Bible versions. There are more than 25,000 Bible versions around the world. I am relying and believing with the genuine truth about God. The real truth has no contradictions “boy” …. go and find the rightful answers to my questions and do not look for a ways and means to escape.
Peace.
[/B] John 20:31 King James Version (KJV)
“But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
27 She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world. (John 11:27 KJV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16 KJV)
verse 27 is a very self explanatory sentence and the rightful answer to the question of “Who is Jesus of Nazareth? …..” addressing the question,….. ' I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God,…”
verse 3:16 is also a very self explanatory sentence and it is not difficult to understand. “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,…”
verse 31 is also a very self explanatory sentences. “….that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
and the verse of 1 Timothy 2:5 is also a very self explanatory sentences and very easy to understand. ” For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; (KJV).
Truth & belief from the rightful understanding: “GOD MAN CHRIST JESUS MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus) Ref. 1 Tim. 2:5
Other beliefs: “GOD GOD Christ Jesus MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the God Christ Jesus) Ref. Jammin and other understanding.
Which is the right one?
Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,17:57) [/B] John 20:31 King James Version (KJV) “But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
27 She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world. (John 11:27 KJV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16 KJV)
verse 27 is a very self explanatory sentence and the rightful answer to the question of “Who is Jesus of Nazareth? …..” addressing the question,….. ' I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God,…”
verse 3:16 is also a very self explanatory sentence and it is not difficult to understand. “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,…”
verse 31 is also a very self explanatory sentences. “….that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
and the verse of 1 Timothy 2:5 is also a very self explanatory sentences and very easy to understand. ” For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; (KJV).
Truth & belief from the rightful understanding: “GOD MAN CHRIST JESUS MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus) Ref. 1 Tim. 2:5
Other beliefs: “GOD GOD Christ Jesus MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the God Christ Jesus) Ref. Jammin and other understanding.
Which is the right one?
and the verse of 1 Timothy 2:5 is also a very self explanatory sentences and very easy to understand. ” For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; (KJV).Truth & belief from the rightful understanding: “GOD MAN CHRIST JESUS MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus) Ref. 1 Tim. 2:5
Other beliefs: “GOD GOD Christ Jesus MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the God Christ Jesus) Ref. Jammin and other understanding.
Which is the right one?
The truth and the rightful understanding” Ref. 1 Timothy 1:17 King James Version (KJV)
17 Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.Other belief contrary to the truth and rightful understanding:”Now unto King eternal, the invisible, immortal and only wise God, Jesus Christ” (Jesus Christ is invisible, immortal and only wise God?) ref. Jammin and others with the same belief.
Wow… Jesus Christ, the only wise God, invisible and immortal? Whos is the flesh died in the cross???
Peace.
Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,17:08) Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,16:48) limjunus, im not escaping boy. but dont you have any common sense?? LOL
your favorite version contradict your belief that Christ is not GOD>
make more research before talking to me. you need to study hard boy LOL
The questions are very simple and clear. I did not ask what verses do you have that Jesus Christ is truly God?Another chance for you again:
1.) “WHO IS THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD, Jesus Christ, the begotten Son of God, or his Father who had begotten him?
2.) How many truly God you have recognized, only one or more?
Simple questions but very difficult for you to answer, because you really do not know which is the one and only true God, the Son or the Father?
As I told you before, I am not relying only with the Bible versions. There are more than 25,000 Bible versions around the world. I am relying and believing with the genuine truth about God. The real truth has no contradictions “boy” …. go and find the rightful answers to my questions and do not look for a ways and means to escape.
Peace.
i can talk to you boy but i think it is non sense bec your favorite version contradicts your belief. LOLyou are using NLT to prove that john 20.28 is not referring to Christ as God but the translators of the NLT believes that Christ is GOD! you can find this in phil 2.6, NLT says that he was GOD!
LOLyou have no common sense boy. you are lack of knowledge. before you use a version, make sure that you have enough knowledge using that version.
sorry boy but i think u must study hard before talking to me LOL
Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,20:22) Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,17:08) Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,16:48) limjunus, im not escaping boy. but dont you have any common sense?? LOL
your favorite version contradict your belief that Christ is not GOD>
make more research before talking to me. you need to study hard boy LOL
The questions are very simple and clear. I did not ask what verses do you have that Jesus Christ is truly God?Another chance for you again:
1.) “WHO IS THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD, Jesus Christ, the begotten Son of God, or his Father who had begotten him?
2.) How many truly God you have recognized, only one or more?
Simple questions but very difficult for you to answer, because you really do not know which is the one and only true God, the Son or the Father?
As I told you before, I am not relying only with the Bible versions. There are more than 25,000 Bible versions around the world. I am relying and believing with the genuine truth about God. The real truth has no contradictions “boy” …. go and find the rightful answers to my questions and do not look for a ways and means to escape.
Peace.
i can talk to you boy but i think it is non sense bec your favorite version contradicts your belief. LOLyou are using NLT to prove that john 20.28 is not referring to Christ as God but the translators of the NLT believes that Christ is GOD! you can find this in phil 2.6, NLT says that he was GOD!
LOLyou have no common sense boy. you are lack of knowledge. before you use a version, make sure that you have enough knowledge using that version.
sorry boy but i think u must study hard before talking to me LOL
NICE ALIBI? my favorite Bible version contradict my belief? It's another matter “boy”! …. why you can not answers my questions? … you are just circling the questions and can not able to answers it, … proving that you are incompetent with your stand and really do not know the essence of the questions.Peace.
Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,20:54) Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,20:22) Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,17:08) Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,16:48) limjunus, im not escaping boy. but dont you have any common sense?? LOL
your favorite version contradict your belief that Christ is not GOD>
make more research before talking to me. you need to study hard boy LOL
The questions are very simple and clear. I did not ask what verses do you have that Jesus Christ is truly God?Another chance for you again:
1.) “WHO IS THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD, Jesus Christ, the begotten Son of God, or his Father who had begotten him?
2.) How many truly God you have recognized, only one or more?
Simple questions but very difficult for you to answer, because you really do not know which is the one and only true God, the Son or the Father?
As I told you before, I am not relying only with the Bible versions. There are more than 25,000 Bible versions around the world. I am relying and believing with the genuine truth about God. The real truth has no contradictions “boy” …. go and find the rightful answers to my questions and do not look for a ways and means to escape.
Peace.
i can talk to you boy but i think it is non sense bec your favorite version contradicts your belief. LOLyou are using NLT to prove that john 20.28 is not referring to Christ as God but the translators of the NLT believes that Christ is GOD! you can find this in phil 2.6, NLT says that he was GOD!
LOLyou have no common sense boy. you are lack of knowledge. before you use a version, make sure that you have enough knowledge using that version.
sorry boy but i think u must study hard before talking to me LOL
NICE ALIBI? my favorite Bible version contradict my belief? It's another matter “boy”! …. why you can not answers my questions? … you are just circling the questions and can not able to answers it, … proving that you are incompetent with your stand and really do not know the essence of the questions.Peace.
I am not talking to you “boy”. I am asking you. ,…. you could not able to respond rightfully, because you really do not know what is the truth about it?
[/B] Jammin …HUH!?
Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,13:51) mike, you are making friends hahaha
journey,
in 1tim 3.16 using your favorite translation KJV., who is the GOD in 1 tim 3.16, father or son??
JamminI'm your friend too!
ok I'll look at it with my trusted KJV!
1Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.This is talking about Jesus Christ, the Son.
What's the confusion?limjunus,
have you forgotten that you used NLT to prove in john 20.28 that thomas is not saying directly the word God to Christ.
you concluded that Jesus is not God according to john 20.28 even though thomas said that to jesus.but your NLT contradicts your belief if you read phil 2.6 of NLT
it says that Christ was God.study hard boy.
do not put your own words in the bible. you are lack of knowledge. before talking to me make sure that you have enough knowledgeQuote Hi Charles, That is Romans 8:11.
Edj,
Who said it isn't???
But for God's Sake, WHAT 7,8,9,and 10 say??? in order for the Spirit to dwell in YOU EDJ???
READ AND REFLECT
Romans8:7 Because the wisdom of the flesh is an enemy to God;
WHAT IS THE WISDOM OF THE FLESH, WHICH IS YOURS EDJ?
for it is not subject to the law of God, neither can it be.
8 And they who are in the flesh, cannot please God.
AND YOU,with every respect,WHO ARE IN THE FLESH, CANNOT PLEASE GOD?
9 But you are not in the flesh, but in the spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.
SO ARE YOU READY TO DESTROY COMPLETELY YOUR FLESH,IN ORDER FOR THE SPIRIT OF GOD DWELLS IN YOU?
ALSO NOTICE THE ABOVE ONE SAYS “THE SPIRIT OF GOD”
AND HEREUNDER SAYS “THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST:
SO CHRIST IS GOD!!!
Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
SO IF YOU ARE NOT DEAD IN YOUR FLESH,YOU DON'T HAVE THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST,AND ALSO YOU ARE NOT HIS
10 And if Christ be in you, the body indeed is dead,
SO SINCE YOUR BODY IS NOT DEAD,CHRIST IS NOT IN YOU!!!
because of sin; but the spirit liveth, because of justification.
That would have been more sensible of you to explain HOW THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST WOULD DWELL IN A PERSON LIKE YOU AND ME!!! WITHOUT ERADICATE US COMPLETELY.
NON STOP SINNERS!!!
SLAVES TO THE FLESH!!!
SUBJECT TO EVERY FILTH WHICH THE FLESH INSTGATES!!!
ENJOY ALL PLEASURE WHICH THE FLESH MAKES US SUBJECT TO. NEVER MIND DESTROY IT!!!
REFLECT ON HEAVEN NET POSTS, AND YOU WILL KNOW WHO IS PARTICIPATING,EITHER THE FLESH,OR THE SPIRIT IN THE NAME OF JESUS!!!
SO MY QUESTION IS DO WE HAVE THE SAME SPIRIT,AND AMMOUNT OF SPIRIT WHICH JESUS OWNED IN HIM WHICH WAS OF GOD ALMIGHTY??
DEFINITELY NOT,AND DEFINITELY IT WOULD NEVER WOULD BE!!
peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (jammin @ Aug. 06 2012,22:10) therefore the son is God according to KJV
1tim 3.16
Jammin.Peter said '' THOU ART THE MESIAH THE SON OF GOD.
And Jesus said it is God that revealed that to you.
Are you disagreeing with this? yes you are.Because you say; NO JESUS IS GOD,NOT THE SON OF GOD.
wakeup.
Quote (jammin @ Aug. 05 2012,20:52) i answered already your question based on the bible
phil 2.6 is nature.
God is nature.
So YOUR interpretation of Phil 2:6 is, “Who, existing in the form of NATURE, did not consider equality…………..”?You think the word “God” there means “Nature”?
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2012,22:19) Mike, His is a large post; but others also are making long posts. All of these reduce my enjoyment.
Members,Please remember that we don't need to keep quoting the WHOLE discussion you are having with someone else. Quote only their most recent words that you are actually responding to.
Thanks
Quote (limjunus @ Aug. 06 2012,00:57) Other beliefs: “GOD GOD Christ Jesus MEN” (One God, one mediator between God and men, the God Christ Jesus) Ref. Jammin and other understanding. Which is the right one?
1 Corinthians 11:3
But I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.Some people seem to believe that God is the head of God.
The correct equation is: God > Christ > Man
If someone is teaching a different equation than that, then their teaching contradicts MANY scriptures – including the one posted above.
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