JOHN 1:1 who is the WORD?

[GeneBalthrop]

Proclaimer…….Don’t you think it’s about time for you to think about all the other scriptures that might be showing you, some of your assumptions about who JESUS IS, MIGHT BE WRONG?
Desire Truth, has ask you for backup scriptures and scripture explaining your understanding when taking all the other scriptures that deal with who Jesus really is in consideration,  even scriptures in the Old Testament .

Scriptures like Jodi and I have been showing you over the years.  At least acknowledge them and tell us what they mean to you. To not acknowledge them and deal with them only shows your unwillingness to engage in honest dialogue Proclaimer.

peace and love to you and yours Proclaimer……gene

[Jodi]

Hi Berean,

YOU:

WRONG

You twist the scriptures

Jesus did pre-exist, otherwise he would not have said to the incredulous Jews:

BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS  I AM

JOHN THE BAPTIST ALSO ACKNOWLEDGED THAT JESUS WAS BEFORE HIM:

John 1:30

[30] This is   he  of whom I said, After me cometh  a man  which is preferred before me:  for he was before me.

ME: 

Berean, can you address that people indeed witnessed Jesus, in flesh and bones, had ENTERED INTO HIS GLORY upon him rising from the dead?

You say that a pre-existing god who was in the form of God emptied himself to become a human being, might I assume that you believe that this god then went back to his previous form to which you consider to be his glory?

If my assumption is correct how then do you explain the fact that Jesus is STILL A HUMAN, a SON OF MAN? How do you explain that it is YHVH’s Spirit upon this man where the world is then judged? How do you explain, Acts 2: 30 “Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;”

Berean, remember, 1 Chronicles 17, where God had promised David a son who God would become a Father to, where God would not take His mercy away from him, God would settle him into His Kingdom forever and Psalms 89, that you seem to just want to sweep under the rug as if it doesn’t exist, God would make him into His firstborn Son and make him higher than all the kings.

Berean, remember, Acts 17, “24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands; 25 Neither is worshipped with men’s hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;..31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

The God who made the world and all things therein, the God who gives life and breath and all things gave the man Jesus life and breath again, He gave him His promised Spirit where he is a Son of God being led by that Spirit. Our Creator ordained this man giving him authority to judge the world, He’s giving him an eternal throne of his father David.

Do you not see how when you say that, no it was Jesus who was our Creator, that is a direct lie? In Acts 17 there is a Creator who created all things and it is He that brings forth life, Jesus is a man given life by the Creator of all things.  Our Creator raised him from the dead and He ordained him to judge the world and we know that he judges NOT BY his own eyes and ears, but through the righteousness of our Creator’s Spirit that is upon him. You deny the very glory our Creator has given to the man Jesus and you turn him instead into a false image.

You quote scriptures Berean interpreting them WITHOUT the biblical truth that our God has made VERY CLEAR, God DECLARED THE END FROM THE BEGINNING and the WORD of that END is a man who has God’s Spirit upon him fulfilling all of God’s will, a man who establishes God’s Eternal Kingdom, God’s PURPOSE. Without this man therefore nothing would have been made that was made, such makes him both the root and offspring of David, for without God’s plan which is centered around this man as he is the foundation, David would not have even existed. Without this man that was of God from the beginning to fulfill God’s purpose, that which God had intended even before the earth and man were created, there would have been no Abraham, no Isaac, no Jacob and no tribe of Judah either. Abraham rejoiced to see Jesus’s day and that day is the WORD that God had declared from the beginning, a man fulfilling all of God’s will.

You gave John 1:30 which is another prime example of you interpreting scripture WITHOUT apply simple biblical truth!

John 1:23 He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Isaiah.

Berean, what else did the prophet Isaiah speak of to which John would have known and why John would then say, “29 Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. 30 This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred (ginomai, to become, to be made) before (in my sight, in my presence) me: for he was before (protos, first in rank) me?”… “32 John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.”

Isaiah 11, 42 and 61 all speak of the Spirit coming to abode in the son of David. This occurred in the presence of John, he saw before his very eyes God’s Word being made true in the flesh, he saw a man being begotten of God’s Spirit, he saw the promised Christ being manifested. Through the Spirit Jesus had received without measure Isaiah also said that this was a glory that our Creator would give no other. Through the Spirit aboding in him he was given great authority, even over the Sabbath, John had no such authority. Through the Spirit he sets man at liberty from their sins and because he went to his death offering himself as the Lamb without spot, God raised him from the dead giving him a reward where he is also appointed to divide the reward with others. The anointed Jesus is ranked above John where Jesus has been appointed to give John his reward and where Jesus rules over him through God’s Spirit that is upon him. 

Isaiah 53:12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

No doubt that John who quoted Isaiah also knew of Isaiah’s words of chapter 46, which teaches us that from the beginning one man was to be above all fulfilling all of God’s will, God’s very purpose for having created all things in the first place, He did it by reason of and for this man.

John did not teach that Jesus existed before him, he taught that Jesus is the man of God’s WORD spoken by the prophets, that Jesus is before John and before all as the promised king of kings and lord of lords which God declared from the beginning. 

Berean, you give scriptures for your proof but you interpret them without applying certain clear biblical truths given from other scriptures. You apply scriptures to your belief instead of having a belief that is based on applying scripture with scripture.

[Berean]

@ Jodi

You apply scriptures to your belief instead of having a belief that is based on applying scripture with scripture.

Me

WRONG

YOU ARE GREATLY WRONG about the true origin of Christ.
As far as I’m concerned I didn’t need a ton of verses to understand that Jesus came from the HEAVEN WHERE HE WAS WITH THE FATHER, SINCE HE SAID SO HIMSELF.
IT’S EASY AS HELLO TO UNDERSTAND.

SO PLEASE DON’T WASTE YOUR TIME MAKING A LONG SPEECH ON THIS SUBJECT, IT IS UNNECESSARY. YOU WON’T CONVINCE ME. OTHERS BUT NOT ME.
SO HERE, WE HAVE IT THERE.

🙏

[Berean]

Gene

Show that you’re honest by answering the question I asked you.
I’M STILL WAITING.

THANKS

[GeneBalthrop]

Berean……It would make no difference what I told from scriptures, just as it makes no difference what Desire Truth,  and Jodi tell you,   you are simply not of the truth, nor is the Church you attend either.
And please don’t tell me about “honesty” , you and Carmel Are two of the most dishonest people here.  Why don’t you deal with “the scriptures, we quote over and over to you,  why do you ignore them and divert to the scriptures you can force the text to say and mean what you want them to, while ignoring all together the other scriptures that gives the true meanings, even to the texts you try so hard to corrupt .

Berean , you,  Carmel , an Proclaimer,  are simply unable to put all the scriptures “together” to get the real truth.,  jus that simple.  We, Jodi, and I and Desire Truth, are able to drive truth from the “SUM” OF THE SCRIPTURES,  you people are not able to, and because you don’t truly love the truth,  “God has sent you a deluding spirit, in order for you to believe the “LIE”. 2THS2. 

Peace and love to you and your Berean……..gene

[Jodi]

Good Morning Berean,

You certainly aren’t doing a good job at proving your belief to be true, I can give you that!

Me previously: Berean, can you address that people indeed witnessed Jesus, in flesh and bones, had ENTERED INTO HIS GLORY upon him rising from the dead?

So you refuse to explain a verse from Luke 24?

You don’t have to answer of course but I will continue on to expose the nonsense.

First thoughts waking up this morning,

You believe that an only begotten son was in the form of God but he left that glory behind when he was transformed into a human. 

Should I apologize Berean for thinking through what you believe and comparing it to scripture? The audacity that I have in asking you to explain passages that I see don’t align at all with your belief and don’t at all align with how you interpret other scriptures. I am just totally out of line I guess!

If Jesus left his glory behind to become a human, why is he then STILL A HUMAN?

Acts 7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God, 56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

Berean, God had promised to take an existing son of David and make him into His firstborn and to settle him into His house. Stephen was filled with the Holy Spirit where he saw God’s Word had been made true, he saw a son of David having been settled into God’s House.  Stephen saw the GLORY of God and that of a man sitting at God’s right hand.  The people upon hearing Stephen stopped their ears and ran to him and stoned him to death. You likewise stop your ears.

 

[Berean]

Gene

You show me by what you say that you are wrong on this specific point in debate on this thread.

WHO IS THE WORD?

IN THE BIGINNING WAS THE WORD,
AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD,
AND THE WORD WAS GOD.

….

AND THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH….

THIS IS THE SIMPLE TRUTH…

IN THE BEGINNING THE SON WAS WITH THE FATHER.

THIS IS THE PURE AND SIMPLE TRUTH.

[Berean]

@ Jodi

You

You believe that an only begotten son was in the form of God but he left that glory behind when he was transformed into a human. 

Me

No, I believe THE ONLY  BEGOTTEN SON….

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

According to John 3:16, how many begotten sons like His Son God has?

Answer: ONLY ONE

You

was in the form of God…

Me

Yes I believe THAT

AND John Say : and “THE WORD” WAS GOD ”

Am I inventing?

You

but he left that glory behind when he was transformed into a human. 

 

Me

In Phi.2 it IS WRITTEN :

…thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 

In my words: He considered it would be “robbery” to remain “equal to God”

[7] But made himself of no reputation, 

and 👉took upon him the form of a servant👈, 👉and was made in the likeness of men:👈

Angels have the ability to appear like men although they are not men BUT THE SON OF GOD WHO WAS IN THE FORM OF GOD AND WHO WAS GOD (in essence, nature) TOOK UPON HIM OUR HUMAN FORM.( will retain for all eternity) WHILE RETAINING HIS DIVINE IDENTITY AND HIS DIVINE NATURE.
THIS IS THE MYSTERY OF PIETY THE INCARNATION OF THE SON OF GOD

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: 👉God was manifest in the flesh, 👈justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, 👉received up into glory.👈

And so, he was not transformed into a human, BUT “HE TOOK UPON HIMSELF” THE FORM OF A SERVANT BY BEING MADE “LIKE MEN”
exactly 👉”and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:”👈

THE FOLLOWING

And 👉being found in fashion as a man👈,

he humbled himself,

and became obedient unto death,

even the death of the cross.

Amen!

To be continued

if God want

🙏

 

 

 

 

 

[GeneBalthrop]

Berean ……LET’S let Jesus, answer your question with his own words OK? ,…….“the words I am telling you are “NOT”  “MY”, “WORDS”, but the words of him that set me”.

Common sense should tell you ,If Jesus said those words were not “HIS WORDS”,  but the words of someone else, then how could he be “THE WORD”?

This might also help you understand, even though Jodi has quoted to you and others many, many times.

John 3:34…….” For he whom God has sent, speaks the words of God, because God gives NOT the SPIRIT BY MEASURE,  unto him”.

Whose words? his words,  or God’s words, is he speaking?,  so tell us again how Jesus “himself” is the word of God,  “himself”.

Jesus speaks God the Fathers words to us , not his own words.
But it’s plain,  you don’t believe Jesus nor what he says do you? your twisted view of John 1:1 has screw up you thinking.   Repent Berean

peace and love to you and yours……..gene

 

[Berean]

Gene

This is not the question that I asked you first and that I expected an answer from you. But since you come back to who is “THE WORD”, I answer you on it.

You quote John 3:34

[34] For him whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

This verse goes more like this:
Since Jesus speaks “the words of God like no other on earth, THAT IS JUST WHY JOHN CALLS IT” THE WORD OF GOD (Rev.19:13)

Jesus is called “THE WORD OF GOD” BECAUSE HE SPEAKS THE WORDS OF GOD WITH THE FULLNESS OF THE SPIRIT.

TO BE CONTINUED

I put you my previous question, copied pasted

Gene

You

Luke 7:2…..”When you pray, say, “OUR” FATHER, which art in heaven, Hollowed be “Thy” name. “THY” KINGDOM come, “THY” will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.

 

Me

OUR” FATHER, which art 👉 in heaven,

Now Jesus said (NOT me):

👉For I came down from heaven👈, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
[39] And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

What is “the HEAVEN” where is the Father where JESUS comes from? PLEASE….

🙏

[Jodi]

Hi Berean,

To add to what Gene has said,

Let’s think about what our Heavenly Father spoke through Jesus in John 6:63 It is the Spirit that quickeneth (make alive); the flesh profiteth nothing: THE WORDS that I speak unto you, THEY ARE SPIRIT, and they are life.

1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; 2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, WHICH WAS WITH THE FATHER, and was manifested unto us.

These two passages teach us directly that in the beginning was THE WORD of life and THE WORD was with God our Father and THE WORD is the SPIRIT OF GOD, which IS GOD.

You deny this clear given truth and create a doctrine of total deception.

Furthermore, God’s word spoken by the prophet Isaiah was that a man would receive God’s Spirit for the purpose that he speak God’s WORD where those who believe in that word are saved and that he would set us free from our sins so that we could obtain Eternal Life. Isaiah 42 tells us that this was glory that our Creator had promised NO OTHER. Isaiah 46 tells us this was God’s plan from the beginning. 

It is a biblical fact that this WORD became true in the flesh of Jesus of Nazareth, the Spirit came to abode in Jesus, the Spirit of Wisdom, Understanding, Council and Might, and Knowledge making Jesus FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH where the people beheld his glory as he spoke God’s words and did God’s works.  Jesus having God’s Spirit come to dwell in you without measure is exactly being begotten by God and Jesus was the ONLY mortal man to have received this GLORY. 

Berean, biblical fact is that in the beginning was THE WORD of life, it was WITH God and it IS God and also in the beginning was THE WORD of God calling one man to fulfill THE WORD of life. The later was MADE TRUE IN THE FLESH in Jesus at the river Jordan and the first was MADE TRUE IN THE FLESH when Jesus was raised from the dead and was promised to not be able to die anymore, which 1 John 1 directly teaches us.

[Jodi]

Berean,

Could you answer some questions?

When the Spirit came to abode in Jesus where we are told that he left the river Jordan having been filled with the Spirit, is that NOT God’s word spoken by the prophet Isaiah having been made true in the flesh?

Did the people behold the glory of Jesus as he spoke the TRUTH through having been filled with the Spirit, filled with Wisdom, Understanding and Knowledge?

Jesus was the ONLY mortal man to have God’s Spirit come to ABODE IN him WITHOUT MEASURE, correct?…and is this then THE GLORY that God had promised to no other in Isaiah 42?

Berean, how is it that the people beheld THE GLORY of the only begotten Son when you say that this Son had emptied himself of his glory when he became a human?

Did God NOT promise to take a son of David and make him into His own Son and settle him into His kingdom?

Did Jesus NOT say that a man must be born of water and of the Spirit to enter into God’s kingdom?

 

 

[Berean]

@ Jodi

Let’s think about what our Heavenly Father spoke through Jesus in John 6:63 It is the Spirit that quickeneth (make alive); the flesh profiteth nothing: THE WORDS that I speak unto you, THEY ARE SPIRIT, and they are life.

1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; 2 (For the life was manifest, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, WHICH WAS WITH THE FATHER, and was manifest unto us.

These two passages teach us directly that in the beginning was THE WORD of life and THE WORD was with God our Father and THE WORD is the SPIRIT OF GOD, which IS GOD.

You deny this clear given truth and create a doctrine of total deception.

Me

…..”that eternal life, WHICH WAS WITH THE FATHER”

IS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD IN WHOM THERE IS LIFE( John 1:4 👉 In him( Jesus) was life; and the life was the light of men.

Jesus said: I AM👉 THE WAY, 👉THE TRUTH AND 👉THE LIFE👈

🙏

[DesireTruth]

Isa 9:6 was quoted during one of our conversations (page 1204, #943359), not entirely sure what the point of the comment is or really the direction they were going; but they did say to “concentrate” on Isa 9:6, so I did. The following is the verse in a few translations:

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. (KJV)

6 For vnto vs a child is borne, vnto vs a Sonne is giuen, and the gouernment shalbe vpon his shoulder: and his name shalbe called, Wonderfull, Counseller, The mightie God, The euerlasting Father, The Prince of peace. (KJV 1611)

6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us;And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. (NAS)

6 Because for us a child is born, and to us a son is given, whose government is on his own shoulder; and his name is called The Messenger of Great Counsel. For I will bring peace on the rulers and health for him. (Septuagint 1954)

Compare the Septuagint to the other translations; quite the contrast…

We are taught this verse is a prophesy concerning the Messiah and some will use it to “prove” Jesus is God (“Mighty God”); however, is this verse ever quoted in its entirety by anyone in the new testament? Not once. So the first century writers didn’t believe this was a prophecy pointing to the Messiah. Yet we are taught to believe the verse is Messianic in nature. Have we actually studied this verse, do we know what the previous five verses are about, what the previous chapters are talking about, or what the next chapters are saying? What events are taking place surrounding Isa 9:6? Most will have no idea, but will still claim this verse is pointing to Jesus.

I will be focusing on the future tenses of the verb clauses in verse 6, starting with “is born/will be born”; if we believe this is a reference to Jesus, we can safely say this IS in the future tense as he isn’t here in this moment. There is a huge HOWEVER, when going back to the Hebrew, the word “yulad” is used and means “were, was, has been” born, placing the phrase in the past tense. Can anyone explain how/why “yulad”, a past tense verb, is being used as future tense in Isaiah and only here?

Next phrase “is given/will be given”; the Hebrew word here is “nitan”, and mean “was” given. Again a past tense verb being used in the future tense.

Next phrase “shall be upon/will rest on”; the Hebrew is “wat-tə-hî” (sorry can only find pronunciation, not fluent in Hebrew and study tools aren’t perfect), when looking at the word in an interlinear the word translates to “was.” Again a past tense!

The final phrase is “shall be called/is called”; the Hebrew is “wayiqra”, and means “was called”.

The way this verse should really read is:

“For unto us a child was born, unto us a son was given: and the government was upon his shoulder: and his name was called Wonderful, Counselor, the mighty God, the everlasting Father, the Prince of Peace.”

Why was this passage made to appear to point to a future person in our modern translations, when the Hebrew is referring to a past person? This is an egregious manipulation of scripture; but who would know or catch this when the old testament is treated as a lesser book. So who is being referenced in this passage?

I think one of the main points that stands out when reading Isa 9:6 are the names given to this son, we are taught this is a reference to Jesus and the one name that stands out above them all is “Mighty God”. Jewish names have a meaning and Hezekiah means “Yah Strengthens.” When looking at his name it is broken into two parts, the first part comes from the word “hazaq” and means “to be or become strong.” The second part is “Yah” an abbreviation of Yahweh(God). When these two parts are combined we have “strong God” or if we use the synonym of “strong” we can get “mighty God.” Fascinating!

Hezekiah was king of Judah when Isaiah was a prophet and “He (Hezekiah) trusted in the LORD God of Israel; in this regard there was none like him among the kings of Judah either before or after. He was loyal to the LORD and did not abandon him. He obeyed the commandments which the LORD had given to Moses. The LORD was with him; he succeeded in all his endeavors.” (II Kings 18:5-7) to learn more about him and what was happening in Judah read II Kings 18-20; II Chron 29-32; Isa 36-39. After reading the chapters, I will leave you with this question; who is being described in Isa 9:6 – Hezekiah or Jesus?

[Berean]

@desiretruth

gleaned from:

https://www.ministrymagazine.org/archive/1958/07/the-name-of-jesus

You can read everything else.
I didn’t just skim it.

“The LXX reads “His name is called the Messenger of great counsel.”—The Sep­tuagint Version of the Old Testament With an English Translation (S. Bagster SC Sons, London, 1844). This text was re­garded as Messianic by the ancient rabbis. We read: “His name shall be called from of old, Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, He who lives forever, the Anointed One [or Messiahr—J. F. STENNING, Tar-gum of Isaiah, p. 32.”

🙏

[DesireTruth]

@ Berean,

The Septuagint passage was all you gleaned from what I wrote?!!??!?!?? I did go look at your link and to be honest, I got about half way thru and gave up as it’s from a false doctrinal, trinitarian perspective. I thought you didn’t believe in the trinity; the faith you follow does.

Either you didn’t read all I wrote or you are ignoring it. The main point of what I wrote was to say Isa 9:6 has been manipulated to make it looking to a future person when it was written to refer to a past person. Did you bother to read the chapters cited in II Kings, II Chron, or Isaiah? You sarcastically said Gene, Jodi, or I should “teach”, but to be taught you have to be teachable and want to learn. You however want to push your religion and if there is anything outside it, it’s false.

Still waiting for my questions to be answered…

[Berean]

@ desire Truth

As I told you, I only skimmed the article.
The Adventist church I belong to became Trinitarian during the 19th century, but the pioneers were not, and it is with their views that I am most in agreement.

That said, in relation to your presentation, I do not subscribe to the Septuagint. For me this Bible is not reliable.
As you know I trust the KING JAMES more.
If you had read the book: the war of the bibles, you would understand why.
Although the author is Trinitarian, I find this book very enlightening.

To be continued

[Berean]

@ desire Truth

You

We are taught this verse is a prophesy concerning the Messiah and some will use it to “prove” Jesus is God (“Mighty God”); however, is this verse ever quoted in its entirety by anyone in the new testament? Not once. So the first century writers didn’t believe this was a prophecy pointing to the Messiah. Yet we are taught to believe the verse is Messianic in nature.

Me

 

“For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there will be 👉no end👈, on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness from this time forth and forevermore”.Is. 9:6-7

This prophecy is echoed in the angel Gabriel’s announcement to Mary that she will become pregnant and give birth to a child who “will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. 👉And the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David👈, and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end” (Luke 1:32-33)

Isaiah 9:6,7 may not be quoted in the NT, but the latter as in Luke 1:32,33 gives us enough readability to make the connection with Isaiah 9 Don’t you think so?

Hezekiah cannot be the one prophesied in Isaiah 9:6,7 because the text says in verse 7(end)

<span style=”color: #3366ff;”>Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice 👉from henceforth even for ever.</span>👈

Did King Hezekiah fulfill the end of verse 7:
👉from henceforth even for ever.👈?

ONLY JESUS CHRIST DO IT

Again

Of the increase of his government and peace there will be 👉no end👈, on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness from this time forth and forevermore”.Is. 9:7

…And the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end” (Luke 1:32-33)

To bé continued

 

 

 

[GeneBalthrop]

Berean you said………..>You quote John 3:34

[34] For him whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

This verse goes more like this:
Since Jesus speaks “the words of God like no other on earth, THAT IS JUST WHY JOHN CALLS IT” THE WORD OF GOD (Rev.19:13)

Berean , I am not arguing the point that Jesus spoke “GOD the FATHERS WORDS TO US”

I HAVE NEVER ARGUED AGAINST THAT, what I am saying is, Jesus speaking GOD the Father’s words to us, does not make him, “himself “, the word of God”. , no more then MOSES or any of the prophets who spoke GOD the Fathers words to us “were themselves the word of God either. 

Bottom line is your corrupt teaching and belief of JOHN 1:1  , that Jesus himself is the word of God,  “HIMSELF,” and therefore is GOD,  IS A FALSE  TEACHING. 

I have given you direct quotes right out of Jesus’ own mouth that proves Jesus himself denied the words he spoke to us were “HIS”, by him saying they were,  “NOT HIS WORDS”  he was telling us.
You either believe him or not.  You say, you believe Jesus, but in reality you are denying him by denying what he says. IMO

Peace and love to you and yours……….gene

 

 

[Berean]

Gene

In the Bible in Revelation 19:13 WE read:

And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood:👉 and his name is called The Word of God.👈

 

Who IS called “THE WORD OF GOD”

JESUS CHRIST, THE SON OF GOD.

 

you still haven’t answered my other question:
FATHER IN HEAVEN
THE CHRIST WHO COMES FROM THE HEAVEN
WHAT IS THE HEAVEN FOR YOU “GENE”?

🙏

 

[Author]

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