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Hi T8,
Does God divide the living and the dead in Christ?
Are there divisions again such as there was between jew and gentile?
Do those who were dead in Christ have an advantage over those who were yet alive.
Would not their joy be the same?
Read my post again. It does not in any way deny the joy of meeting the Lord when we die whether that is through death or being alive at the end.
It also does not in any way deny the Day of the Lord.
What it questions is the statement, that the dead in Christ are not with Christ.
The ‘Dead in Christ’ if it were a descriptive would mean that they are dead and in Christ right?
In other words, sounds very similar to: ‘to be absent from the body and to be at home with the Lord’.
And if the dead in Christ are in Christ, then where is Christ now?
Hi t8,
If you are not now in fellowship with the Spirit of Christ you are none of his.
Meeting him clad in new bodies is another level of contact.
He is in heaven but he meets us in the air
And the Dead in Christ rise first, then we who are alive will meet them along with our Lord in the air.
t8,
You are misquoting the verse.If you look at 1 Thessalonians 3:16-17 then you will see the dead will rise from the grave and then together with those that had not died they would meet Jesus and his saints in the air as they descended.
Paul is speaking of the first resurrection and the gathering together of the saints at the beginning of the Messianic Age. Air travel at its best.
t8,
The resurrection of the dead and then their ascension with those whose flesh God preserved in order to meet the Lord of both groups in person reveals the dead were not among the holy ones that descended with him. In other words they were no more with him than the living. When both groups meet him then they are with him.
It sounds smother translating the verse this way but I do not know how the translators of this version obtained the word “this” out of the definite article. It may be something I do not know about Koine Greek but I do know it is a minority choice.
2 Corinthians 5:8
International Standard Version
We are confident, then, and would prefer to be away from this body and to live with the Lord.If he is correct then “this body” is referring to the mortal body and Paul is not teaching the Christians was to be dead in order to be with God but rather they want their new body in order to be closer to God.
Note: The title “the Lord: may instead refer to Jesus.
the dead in Christ will rise first.
How much earlier do they rise first? By a second? A minute? A day? or what Kerwin?
a part or portion of a larger amount which is divided among a number of people, or to which a number of people contribute.
So what actually Christ’s spirit OBVIOUS, Jesus when he was like all his brethren on earth did, obtained, and achieved, in order to have a share of all what he DID,OBTAINED AND ACHIEVED?”
Can you please explain what this means.
Nick,
I misswrote, so Read again please:SHARE means to have a part or portion of a larger amount which is divided among a number of people, or to which a number of people contribute.
So what actually Christ’s spirit OBVIOUS, Jesus when he was like all his brethren on earth,
did, obtained, and achieved,
in order FOR US
to have a SHARE of all what he
DID,OBTAINED AND ACHIEVED?”
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
t8,
The change occurs with both the dead and the living at the same time. When the bodies of the dead change from mortal to immortal they can no longer remain dead. It happens in a twinkling of an eye and the both the living and the dead ascend to meet Jesus Christ and the holy ones as they descend to start the Messianic Age.
That seems the story from some passages of Scripture but others seem to imply there is death and dying during the Messianic Age.
Is it that second idea you are going by?
Hi KW,
We are changed
The immortal is put on the mortal.
They are not the same old battered natural bodies we die in.
Does God divide the living and the dead in Christ?
The change occurs with both the dead and the living at the same time.
…the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air…
The dead rise first.
t8,
I cannot say whether it is or not since there is competing passages of Scripture. I favor the idea that for an age and age there is suffering in Gehenna but at the end of that the wicked are destroyed. Each of the age’s is an indeterminate amount of time. It is a Jewish belief that is supported by the relevant passages.
In any case God is a just and merciful God and if he chose to have someone suffer for eternity then there is a reason for it. I cannot see such a reason but my vision is limited.
If we are created in God’s image and were restored by His Spirit on Pentecost, and still do not grasp, understand, comprehend, imagine or reason, etc, how or why The Loving Lord Jesus would or could want to “torment” anything or everything, beast or man, forever, then perhaps there’s been some true meanings lost in the translations over thousands of the years. Him keeping Adam and us away from the “tree of Life” in the garden by angels to disallow our soul to “… live forever”(Gen 3.22-24) tells me that the soul will not go on forever except by being “…born again…” by The Holy Spirit that raised Emmanuel, the Lamb of God, the “Last Adam” from the grave. Ro 8.11. He did that FOR Adam and his race so that He could come and SAVE Adam’s race.
Had Adam and Eve eaten from the tree of Life in the sinful state they were in, THEN that soul would have lived in that death state forever and would not have been able to die or be destroyed or perish or been even able or have or see the need or desire to repent. God only know what the end would have been. Thank Him for those Cherubims He saw fit for His purposes to place there. Thanks for your comments.
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