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Hi Mike,
YOU: Genesis 1:1-2 says the world was formed from water. Big Science says that the world was formed from dust.
ME: The world in Genesis 1:1 was formed out of nothing, to be precise by the endless spirits themselves who by God’s word formed whatever God pronounced.
Job 38:7When the morning stars praised me together, and ALL the sons of God made a joyful MELODY?
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Proclaimer: But if you are referring to a the eruption being real but satelites being fake, then your delusion is still right up there in the stratosphere.
I showed you that in a minute or so (using the simple editor that came with my laptop), I could not only place the volcano on a globe earth – but a globe earth that was in the process of being struck by a huge asteroid. The point was to show you that just because you see an image of a ball earth doesn’t mean the image is a real photograph – and therefore doesn’t prove that we live on a ball.
Next thing I know, you’re implying that I don’t think Australia exists, that I don’t think the volcanic eruption was real, and that I don’t think Phoenix (WHERE I LIVE!) exists. What the heck? 🤔
What if NASA was to educate you on how those images of the globe earth are produced? This is only a 2 minute excerpt of the interview with NASA artist Rob Simmons – who created the iconic “Blue Marble” that used to be the wallpaper on all of the Apple iPhones. He explains that the image of the earth is actually photoshopped from multiple aerial images that are stitched together into a globe with computer software (see the 2:09 mark).
Understand now? Just because you saw Simmons’ 2012 Blue Marble on an iPhone doesn’t mean you were seeing an actual PHOTOGRAPH of the earth. Likewise, just because you see an aerial image of a volcano combined with a bunch of other aerial images of the earth (all stitched together into a ball with computer software) doesn’t mean you were seeing an actual PHOTOGRAPH of a ball earth during the time of a volcanic eruption any more than me pasting the aerial image of the volcano onto an artist’s rendering of an asteroid hitting a ball earth means that I was showing you an actual PHOTOGRAPH of such an event.
Proclaimer: Earth in scripture often means land as it is used in context often with water.
We read the following about the flood for example:
And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated.
Clearly this is talking about land.
Thank you so much for FINALLY addressing (albeit not actually answering) my simple question. Unfortunately, so far it seems as if you are trying to make the case that the words, “In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth” refer to God creating land. I’m pretty sure that those words don’t mean, “In the beginning, God created the heaven and the LAND PART OF the earth“. I’m fairly certain that they refer to God creating the ENTIRE heaven and the ENTIRE earth. And I’m quite convinced that the case you (and Gene) are trying to make in an attempt to have BIG SCIENCE agree with the Bible is solidly refuted by Peter…
2 Peter 3:5… But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water.
To me, the words of Peter combined with the words of Gen 1:1-2 indicate that the heaven and the earth were at one time nothing but water. I understand that Gen says later that God made dry land appear, but we can take this two ways. We can assume that the dry land was there from the beginning, covered with water… or we can assume that God spoke this dry land into existence just like He spoke the vegetation and animals and stars and everything else into existence. I think the scriptural evidence points to the latter, but am willing to entertain your (and Gene’s) notion that the dry land was created along with the water that made up the heaven and the earth.
Assuming that your idea is correct, does the Biblical account of earth align with the account told by BIG SCIENCE? For decades we’ve been told that the earth was formed from a swirling cloud of dust and gas, and that water was delivered to the earth much later by icy comets. Now it should be clear to anyone that this decades old BIG SCIENCE account doesn’t align with the Biblical account, right?
So one of these accounts is true, and one of them is not true, right? Which of the two accounts is true? That is my question that you STILL haven’t directly answered. Please answer the question – both you and Gene. Thanks.
Proclaimer: Further, it seems that even NASA is coming to the understanding that an ancient earth may not have had any land at all.
New research suggests ancient Earth was a water world, with little to no land in sight. And that could have major implications for the origin and evolution of life.
While modern Earth’s surface is about 70 percent water-covered, the new research indicates that our planet was a true ocean world… https://astronomy.com/news/2020/03/ancient-earth-may-have-been-a-water-world-without-any-dry-land
A water world does sound a lot like the opening verses in Genesis.
Wait a minute… so after trying to make a case that the words “God created the heaven and the earth” refer to God creating the land part of the earth, you are now making the case that Genesis 1:1-2 are describing a water world after all? And this is because you found a BIG SCIENCE article that purports to prove many decades worth of other BIG SCIENCE articles wrong? Did you notice that this article bases it’s claims on rocks? Did you know that I was reading another recent NASA article just last week that said we KNOW that the earth was formed from a swirling cloud of dust because of rocks? 😅
Your water world article was published less than a year ago. The following NASA article was published 17 days ago…
https://www.space.com/19175-how-was-earth-formed.html
From the article…
Approximately 4.6 billion years ago, our solar system was just a cloud of dust and gas known as a solar nebula…
With the sun beginning to form, the remaining material started to clump up. Small particles drew together, bound by the force of gravity, into larger particles…
Earth’s rocky core formed first, with heavy elements colliding and binding together…
While the population of comets and asteroids passing through the inner solar system is sparse today, they were more abundant when the planets and sun were young. Collisions between these cosmic bodies likely deposited much of the water on Earth’s surface.
So within a single year, we have BIG SCIENCE telling us that the earth was formed from a swirling cloud of dust – with the earth’s rocky core forming first… AND that the earth began as a water world with little to no land in sight.
Now, you have the choice to accept the water world account as the truth, and claim that BIG SCIENCE and the Bible agree… but to do that, you’ll have to acknowledge that BIG SCIENCE was 100% WRONG for the previous 6 decades, and that BIG SCIENCE is also WRONG in the article I linked from 17 days ago.
And if that is the case, you need to admit that BIG SCIENCE (which is currently touting AT LEAST two completely OPPOSITE ideas for the formation of the earth) doesn’t actually KNOW how the earth formed.
So what’s it going to be, Proclaimer? Will you accept the Bible’s water world account as the truth because of one NASA publication – while acknowledging that the same BIG SCIENCE that you tout as “knowledge increasing in the latter days” has been 100% WRONG about the formation of the earth for the past 60-70 years?
I was hoping you’d accept the water world account because it’s the account that GOD gave us – regardless of the many contradictory accounts that BIG SCIENCE has been giving us as fast as they can imagine them. Apparently, that’s not going to happen because it seems you will only believe Biblical accounts IF you can find BIG SCIENCE accounts that – with enough scriptural gymnastics – you can force-fit into the Bible.
And that, my friend, is the very purpose of this exercise. So if you (and Gene) would be so kind to answer my question (Which account is the truth: Biblical water world or BIG SCIENCE dust cloud?), we can move forward with the exercise. There is a LOT more to come. 😉
Gene: Mike……The land was under the waters, God caused the land to appear by collecting and freezing the waters at the polar caps and the land which was under the waters appeared , just as , Gen 1;9 indicates.
We could also understand God making the dry ground appear as God CREATING dry ground out of nothing – like He did with plants and animals and most other things, right?
Understanding it your way would fit with the scriptures that speak about the foundations of the earth – if we assume that those foundations are made of rock. I think it’s the Targum that says the pillars of heaven are made of wind though, so maybe the pillars of the earth are made of water. Who knows?
I assume your answer to my question is that the Bible has the true account of the formation of the earth (surface originally fully covered by water), and that NASA’s account (molten magma formed from a swirling cloud of space dust – water appearing much later) is the untrue account. Am I understanding you correctly?
Gene: There is not one scripture that say God created earth “from” , water Mike…
2 Peter 3:5… But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water.
Mike: Genesis 1:1-2 says the world was formed from water. Big Science says that the world was formed from dust.
Carmel: The world in Genesis 1:1 was formed out of nothing, to be precise by the endless spirits themselves who by God’s word formed whatever God pronounced.
Job 38:7When the morning stars praised me together, and ALL the sons of God made a joyful MELODY?
Hi Carmel,
Job 38:7 doesn’t say the morning stars and the sons of God MADE the earth. It says they sang and shouted for joy when GOD made the earth. But I agree that God made the heaven and the earth ex nihilo (out of nothing).
Right on the heels of the UK and the Czech Republic ending all Covid masks, vaxxes and lockdowns…
The charade is almost over. May God bless those who stood strong against the tyranny – and also those who caved out of ignorance and fear.
I’ve transcribed this speech given to the Dutch parliament… https://t.me/WeTheMedia/47658
In 2010, the Rockefeller Foundation, one of the most influential NGOs in the world, developed scenarios for the future of technology and international development… this report [that I’m holding]. In this report, the Rockefeller Foundation describes the Lock Step scenario. This describes an impending global pandemic and its aftermath. According to this scenario – and I have it here with me – the Chinese would start with “mandatory quarantines for all citizens and an immediate and almost hermetically sealed closure of all borders”.
National leaders from across the world would reinforce their power with laws, regulations, and restrictions. From mask mandates to body temperature checks at the entrances of train stations, airplanes, buildings. It’s all in here.
But it does not stop at that. According to the Lock Step scenario, there is a great deal more that awaits us. “Even after the pandemic was over”, write the researchers, “the authoritarian control and surveillance of citizens and their activities remained and was even intensified.”
In this report from 2010, they even hinted at “climate lockdowns”, exactly what they’re beginning to talk about right now. And now I quote, “To protect themselves from problems that became ever more global – from pandemics and transnational terrorism to climate crises and increasing poverty – leaders from across the world seized more and more power.”
The report also foresaw how people would react to these measures, regrettably. Just like now, when people cheer as they are vaccinated, post pictures of their jabs on social media (it’s all in this report), and beg for a Covid passport, (all anticipated by the writers of the Lock Step scenario), the idea of a more controlled world would gain widespread acceptance among the populace. “Citizens willingly gave up a part of their sovereignty – and their privacy – in exchange for more ‘safety’ and stability. Citizens were more tolerant, and even eager to be subjected to even more top-down management and supervision. National leaders had more freedom to bestow order in the ways that they saw fit.”
That this would lead to a digital passport was something they had foreseen. In 2010, the Rockefeller Foundation could not entirely anticipate the current technological advance, but even then they already thought that the tightened surveillance would lead to a “biometric ID for all citizens”. Currently, this is already being integrated into our passports.
It would take thirteen years for the pubic, according to the Rockefeller Foundation, to become fed up with the amount of control and the absurd power-fantasies of the rulers. I hope that the Rockefeller Foundation is proven wrong on that account. All of their predictions have come true, but I really hope they’re wrong on this account. I hope that there will be a moment that we wake up – that we will realize that this is a collective psychosis; that the lockdown of the entire country – half the world – for a year and a half because of a flu variety is insane; and that walking around with those silly, useless masks is insanity. That we conform ourselves to those completely senseless distancing rules;, that we see that our businesses, our social lives have been destroyed; and that we have held back effective primary medicines as Ivermectin – only to give those experimental injections the status of “approved vaccine” as soon as we could.
We now ramble on about how “the infections are decreasing”, while the exact same thing happened last year – like it does every year. And it will happen again as autumn arrives and new infections occur. And now we pretend that it happens because of Covid 19, all the while the thing we used to call “the flu” has completely disappeared.
But most importantly, I hope that we realize that with all the hysteria about this Chinese flu as a pretext, an entire infrastructure has been built… an infrastructure that can be used again at any moment due to any occurrence. Lockdowns, masks, social distancing, no more traveling, no handshakes, ridiculous experimental jabs… this Covid phase has been a practice to train obedience.
Our Parliament and the Rutte regime have passed this training with grace. Congratulations. Klaus Schwab will be proud of you. The globalist plans can be carried out – and the next step towards mass surveillance and total control can be taken.
Okay, moving right along – the next words in the Bible are…
Genesis 1:3-5… And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. And God saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness He called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.
According to the Bible, light was created after the earth already existed. According to BIG SCIENCE, light was in existence billions of years before the earth existed.
Since these two accounts contradict each other, which one of them is the true account that we should believe?
Hi Mike,
I’m back :).
you said: But I agree that God made the heaven and the earth ex nihilo (out of nothing).
I would say that God made the heaven and the earth out of water and particles in the water. That’s how I understand it anyway.
LU
Mike……where does it say God created things out of nothing at? , everything that exists is made up of elements, from the atomic table. Water is made up of H2O, that is 1 part hydrogen and 2 parts oxygen. Water is made by combining these two elements, which creates a tremendous explosion in the process of being made, like for instance the “hydrogen bomb “, whose after effect is pure water, that’s the water vapor cloud, you see when a hydrogen atom is uniting with oxygen atoms. Can you even imagine what and explosion it took to make all the water on this earth? But as for all other things that appear in our earth they are also made FROM the atomic elements combined in different ways that form them. Everything we see is made from unseen atomic structures, if you want to get down to, there actual make ups. Everything including us also. Can be broken down to the elements that existed before we ever came into being.
All visible elements are made up of atoms combined in different ways. The periodical table , explains them.
Now the first cause of all this I believe was God who I believe brought it all into existence, how he did it, who knows, but the Big Bang theory seem to fit regarding the Universe, a blast from a center point that is still expanding from it’s start till now, seems reasonable, but who know for sure how God did it?, but knowledge has greatly increased over the past hundred years . But saying God made earth out of water, doesn’t work for me, because the elements that make up water are not the same elements that make up earth, rocks, soil etc. they have complete different atomic structures. IMOPeace and love to you and yours Mike……..gene
LU: Hi Mike,
I’m back :).
Glad to see it. What are your thoughts on Covid? Miia started this thread asking if the jabs are the sign of the beast. (Proclaimer had to change the title so he wouldn’t get shadow-banned by Google – as Big Tech is censoring anything Covid/vax related that even questions the MSM/Corporate narrative.)
LU: you said: But I agree that God made the heaven and the earth ex nihilo (out of nothing).
I would say that God made the heaven and the earth out of water and particles in the water. That’s how I understand it anyway.
Yes, God made them out of water – but where did the water come from? Who made that water? And from what was it made?
The scriptures don’t go into details about whether this was standard H2O, or if it contained particles. But I’m curious about your answer to the overall question: The Bible says that the earth began as water. BIG SCIENCE says the earth began as molten magma derived from space dust. Which one is the true account of the earth’s beginnings?
Gene: Mike……where does it say God created things out of nothing at?
All over the scriptures, Gene – starting with Genesis 1. For example…
Genesis 1:3… And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.
See? At first there wasn’t light. Then God SAID/SPOKE, “Let there BE light”. Then there WAS light. See also…
Psalm 33:6-9… By the word of the LORD the heavens were made, and by the breath of his mouth all their host… For he spoke, and it came to be; he commanded, and it stood firm.
Romans 4:17… he calls into existence the things that do not exist.
Hebrews 11:3… By faith we understand that the world was created by the word of God…
Gene: …everything that exists is made up of elements, from the atomic table.
But who made those elements? And what were they made from?
Gene: Now the first cause of all this I believe was God who I believe brought it all into existence…
We agree that God was the first cause of everything that currently exists. But as I see it, you really only have two choices:
1. The elements have existed along with God from eternity – and God manipulated them into our current world.
2. God created the elements.And if it is the latter (which is supported by scriptures that say God created all things), then you have to decide what God created them out of. If you say God created them out of even smaller things, you have to decide whether those smaller things have existed from eternity, or if God created them. And so on, and so on.
Eventually you get to the very FIRST things God created, and the only option is that God created those things out of nothing – because there was nothing except for God at that point.
Gene: …how he did it, who knows, but the Big Bang theory seem to fit regarding the Universe, a blast from a center point that is still expanding from it’s start till now, seems reasonable, but who know for sure how God did it?
The Big Bang Idea (it’s by no means a scientific theory) posits that there was no God, Gene. In fact, the very reason for that silly idea is to convince gullible people that it is possible for a finely tuned world and highly complicated creatures to come into existence by random chance – no Creator needed.
This is the problem for you and Proclaimer. You want to seem “smart” by aligning yourselves with BIG SCIENCE, and then try to force-fit the BIG SCIENCE fantasies back into the scriptures. You want both the idea of a benevolent Creator and the ideas of godless men who work daily to convince the world that people who believe in a Creator are idiots. And you only want to merge the former with the latter because you’ve been duped into believing there is scientific evidence to support the latter. I assure you that there isn’t.
As for your claim that nobody knows how God did it – that is precisely what this exercise is for. We are TOLD in the words of scripture how God did it. I repeat…
Genesis 1:3… And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.
That’s how God did it, Gene. He spoke the words, “Let there BE light”, and there WAS light.
So we know how the Bible says light came into existence – and we know that the Bible says it came into existence AFTER God created the heaven and the earth, right?
We also know that BIG SCIENCE says that light came into existence 10 billion years BEFORE the earth came into existence, right?
I’m asking YOU right now: Which of those accounts is the truth of the matter? Which of them should we believe?
What is your answer, sir?
Gene: But saying God made earth out of water, doesn’t work for me, because the elements that make up water are not the same elements that make up earth, rocks, soil etc. they have complete different atomic structures. IMO
It “doesn’t work for you”? I’m not the one saying it, Gene. God is the one who said it. The only question is whether you believe the word of God over the word of flawed men and what does or doesn’t work for you – or the other way around. Which is it? Is truth based on what works for you? Or on what God actually said?
I’ve gotten into the habit of copying every single post before hitting the “Submit” button, because way too many times I’ve spent an hour writing a complicated response, only to find out that your site had logged me out during the course of that hour. And then all that work is gone forever, and I have to start over.
But even copying each post has a drawback, because when I log back in and paste it, I have to go through the entire thing and re-add the colors, the italics, the bold and underlines, the quotes, etc.
I request that you put my account on INFINITY LOG IN mode – so that your site NEVER again logs me off randomly. If the day comes that I want to log myself off of Heaven Net, I will do so manually. Thanks.
As I side note, every time that I do log back into your site, Chrome pops up a warning that my passwords have been compromised. I have only ever gotten this warning from Heaven Net. What’s up with that?
Hi to all
John.1
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
[2] The same was in the beginning with God.
[3] All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.COLOSSIANS
Who( Jesus) is 👉 the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
[16] For
👇
by him (Jesus)were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
[17] And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.🙏 GOD BLESS
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