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Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,10:19) Genisis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Princess.It took so long because it took so long for mankind to repopulate.example: It took 430 yrs for for God, before he took the hebrews out of egypt,because it took 430 yrs for them to reach 2million.(approx).
wakeup.
Quote (Stu @ Nov. 11 2012,00:28) Quote (princess @ Nov. 10 2012,23:55) Quote (Stu @ Nov. 10 2012,18:30) Quote (2besee @ Nov. 10 2012,16:09) I will also add that I believe that God's power can heal us, and the power descends onto the heart.
Is that also how this god killed Uzzah? By descending power onto his heart?Stuart
Stuart,As I think about it more, you must be a great helper to someone, supporter of sort and feel that Uzzah may or could be you. A great supporter doing the act only out of love only in the end to be struck down for your good works.
Just a hunch.Uzzah story would most likely be the teaching don't rely on yourself to make it work rely on God, he has a plan for your life and when you try to do it yourself it will only cause death. Most assured if you were the author of this story the outcome would have been different.
Or the teaching would be humanity cannot help god, god can only help humanity.
It is the best I have for you.
Thank you for your kind attempts.I have a plan for my life, as we all do, and although it doesn't revolve around fantasy stories of Imaginary Beings, were this all to be true then part of my purpose would be to bring this monstrous sadist god to justice.
Of course I would insist on a fair trial for it, something it never afforded Uzzah or any of the other 24,000,000 fellow humans that people claim it has slaughtered.
Stuart
Stu.Gravity is there for our benefit,for without it we can not perform.
But gravity has it strict laws;if you break that law you can be in great danger or even death.
Gravity does not have mercy, if the law is broken.You can break the law by jumping of a cliff,but the consequences will be horrible,you will be splattered all over the place.Any one,small or great.
Now will you call gravity a sadistic evil law??
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,10:31) Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,10:19) Genisis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Princess.It took so long because it took so long for mankind to repopulate.example: It took 430 yrs for for God, before he took the hebrews out of egypt,because it took 430 yrs for them to reach 2million.(approx).
wakeup.
2million?Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,01:30) 2besee, I was not addressing martyrdom, it was gods. But you do bring up a good point, Jesus like his father before him, expected others to be sacrificed also.
My conclusion was correct then, you also have a touch of trinity belief by what I can see.
I would not call taking Sabbath and the dietary laws faith, you don't practice something for so long without walking away without some form of knowledge. One day off without any work spending monies ect…is healthly for the human body and family.
I praciced the dietary laws for so long I felt no reason to change them.My favorite and what I try to live by is be innocent as a dove, but wiser then a serpent.
Princess, Trinitarian? No.
I do NOT believe that God 'consists of three or two persons combined as one God' I am probably more Arian.
I believe that God is one, as in, the Father God almighty creator of heaven and earth and I believe that that God has a son named Jesus which is translated Emanuel – God with us, and that this means that all is through the spirit which was in the man Christ the Messiah, the anointed one, and that this spirit which was in Him which is the Holy Spirit from God was then sent to be with all believers who believe in him who have also become the children of God. So, while the resurrected man Jesus is in heaven (with his own spirit), the spirit is here, which was also in him.Of course, I may have worded that wrong or have some misunderstanding as I am only human, and I am not well versed in some areas. I don't believe that anyone can have the truth absolutely and perhaps if they did then they would not be the ones trying to show the world their truth they would most likely be in some isolated place apart from the world so we would never know.
I do not believe in forcing my opinions down peoples throat nor condemning anyone for what they believe. I think that we are all on a journey and are at different stages on the journey.
As to Paul, I believe that he was in parts inspired by the spirit, and I do not doubt many things which he says, actually many things which he says I hold close to my belief – however, as Peter said, there are many things which he says which the unstable twist (to their own destruction) especially regarding sin. So, rather than imply the wrong things and overly analyze everything he says as if it is ALL inspired, I also see Paul as a man no different than any of us. So I hold some things he said as close and other things at a distance.
SO, Trinitarian, NO, I get quite upset when people say that Jesus is all that you need, as if God never existed, and I always say “What about God”. Oh… 'Which God'?…. God the Father, the Almighty. The only true God, alone.
Quote I quess lost could be compared to confused, and that would be due to Paul. To this day I would rather seen his head on a platter then John's but I did not write the story. I have been there too, confusion is usually caused by other people.
Do you think that it was Paul or others using Paul's words?
Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,03:04) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,02:36) Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,00:16) Continuing saga, Quote Humankind has been under the influence of satan since then.
And lived in sin against God all the way,and became worse and worse, so that even the angels went down and defile them selves with the flesh and went into the women; and created the giants.(modifying the human race,and also the animals.(gen6).Were these the same 33% of the angels that were cast down with Satan, or some of the good angels that stayed with God?
Quote God had to destroy his creation because of all the corruption,and God caused a flood upon the earth,only 8 uncontaminated souls were saved in the ark. Whew! God messed up when he created Lucifer and he messed up when he created human kind, can't seem to get it right can he?
Every time God messes up he throws out, or destroys his creation. You would think that he could just make it right.Tim
Timothy .The war in heaven happened just after the resurrection,and those angels were cast down into the earth.(rev12:7-9).
The angels that left their estate and went down and defiled themselves with womenbefore the flood are 200 chief angels; and they are still locked up today.(rev 9:2. 14).
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,
If Satan, the serpent , was cast down after the resurrection,
then how was he there in Eden?This must be another one of those contradictions that are not a contradiction?
Or were you wrong about the serpent being Satan?
Tim
Timothy.You obviously did not read my answers thoroughly.
The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.Adam and Eve still innocent, and lucifer the serpent was there to tempt them.And cain and seth muliplied,The angels sinned ,they went down to corrupt mankind.Then the great flood was about 1650 after the garden.
Then Noah and his 3sons muliplied,and populated the earth once more.
The serpent also called the dragon, or satan was cast out of heaven soon after Jesus resurrection,and that is in the year 33ad.
The serpent is NOT called lucifer anymore,but satan ,dragon,
The assyrian, gog,the father of lies,the devil.wakeup.
Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,05:19) Genisis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Pwere do you got that info ,curious
Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 11 2012,10:48) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,10:31) Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,10:19) Genisis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Princess.It took so long because it took so long for mankind to repopulate.example: It took 430 yrs for for God, before he took the hebrews out of egypt,because it took 430 yrs for them to reach 2million.(approx).
wakeup.
2million?
EDJ.Exodus 12:37 And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about *SIX HUNDRED THOUSAND* on foot that were men, beside children.
This is besides the women and children.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,10:45) Quote (Stu @ Nov. 11 2012,00:28) Quote (princess @ Nov. 10 2012,23:55) Quote (Stu @ Nov. 10 2012,18:30) Quote (2besee @ Nov. 10 2012,16:09) I will also add that I believe that God's power can heal us, and the power descends onto the heart.
Is that also how this god killed Uzzah? By descending power onto his heart?Stuart
Stuart,As I think about it more, you must be a great helper to someone, supporter of sort and feel that Uzzah may or could be you. A great supporter doing the act only out of love only in the end to be struck down for your good works.
Just a hunch.Uzzah story would most likely be the teaching don't rely on yourself to make it work rely on God, he has a plan for your life and when you try to do it yourself it will only cause death. Most assured if you were the author of this story the outcome would have been different.
Or the teaching would be humanity cannot help god, god can only help humanity.
It is the best I have for you.
Thank you for your kind attempts.I have a plan for my life, as we all do, and although it doesn't revolve around fantasy stories of Imaginary Beings, were this all to be true then part of my purpose would be to bring this monstrous sadist god to justice.
Of course I would insist on a fair trial for it, something it never afforded Uzzah or any of the other 24,000,000 fellow humans that people claim it has slaughtered.
Stuart
Stu.Gravity is there for our benefit,for without it we can not perform.
But gravity has it strict laws;if you break that law you can be in great danger or even death.
Gravity does not have mercy, if the law is broken.You can break the law by jumping of a cliff,but the consequences will be horrible,you will be splattered all over the place.Any one,small or great.
Now will you call gravity a sadistic evil law??
wakeup.
You portray gravity as having some kind of brain that has intent. It doesn't.But I guess when you believe in a moronic fantasy story of gods and demons running the universe then everything, including the walls of your room, are out to get you.
I can only remind you of Douglas Adams's mockery of that kind of bizarre view of things:
“Being surprised at the fact that the universe is fine tuned for life
is akin to a puddle being surprised at how well it fits its hole“Stuart
Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.
There has never been a time of only two humans existing.Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Nov. 11 2012,18:39) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.
There has never been a time of only two humans existing.Stuart
Stu.What about two chimps?
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,19:24) Quote (Stu @ Nov. 11 2012,18:39) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.
There has never been a time of only two humans existing.Stuart
Stu.What about two chimps?
wakeup.
You're telling the fantasy stories. What about them?Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Nov. 11 2012,15:39) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.
There has never been a time of only two humans existing.Stuart
Really… could you please explain how “humans” magically appeared then? I assume you must believe that one day their apes, then en-mass the next day they were human?Wm
Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,03:04) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,02:36) Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,00:16) Continuing saga, Quote Humankind has been under the influence of satan since then.
And lived in sin against God all the way,and became worse and worse, so that even the angels went down and defile them selves with the flesh and went into the women; and created the giants.(modifying the human race,and also the animals.(gen6).Were these the same 33% of the angels that were cast down with Satan, or some of the good angels that stayed with God?
Quote God had to destroy his creation because of all the corruption,and God caused a flood upon the earth,only 8 uncontaminated souls were saved in the ark. Whew! God messed up when he created Lucifer and he messed up when he created human kind, can't seem to get it right can he?
Every time God messes up he throws out, or destroys his creation. You would think that he could just make it right.Tim
Timothy .The war in heaven happened just after the resurrection,and those angels were cast down into the earth.(rev12:7-9).
The angels that left their estate and went down and defiled themselves with womenbefore the flood are 200 chief angels; and they are still locked up today.(rev 9:2. 14).
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,
If Satan, the serpent , was cast down after the resurrection,
then how was he there in Eden?This must be another one of those contradictions that are not a contradiction?
Or were you wrong about the serpent being Satan?
Tim
Timothy.You obviously did not read my answers thoroughly.
The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.Adam and Eve still innocent, and lucifer the serpent was there to tempt them.And cain and seth muliplied,The angels sinned ,they went down to corrupt mankind.Then the great flood was about 1650 after the garden.
Then Noah and his 3sons muliplied,and populated the earth once more.
The serpent also called the dragon, or satan was cast out of heaven soon after Jesus resurrection,and that is in the year 33ad.
The serpent is NOT called lucifer anymore,but satan ,dragon,
The assyrian, gog,the father of lies,the devil.wakeup.
No wakeup,
you obviously didn't read my question thouroughly.
“If Satan, the serpent , was cast down after the resurrection,
then how was he there in Eden?” the beginning of mankind.It is a simple question. Satan wasn't satan until thousands of years after the beginning of mankind. After all, he wasn'[t cast down until after he rebelled against God, which you said was after the resurrection.
Can you answer that one question without going into your entire chronology of life on earth again?
Tim
Quote (seekingtruth @ Nov. 11 2012,21:53) Quote (Stu @ Nov. 11 2012,15:39) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.
There has never been a time of only two humans existing.Stuart
Really… could you please explain how “humans” magically appeared then? I assume you must believe that one day their apes, then en-mass the next day they were human?Wm
Humans didn't appear by magic.You identify the problem yourself. There is no one day when an ancestor species becomes the descendent species, and biologists will give times that differ by 10,000s of years for the change of species name. That is the nature of evolution, it is mostly a very slow, gradual change, a continuum. The assignment of species names is the arbitrary aspect of it. You can follow this continuous line throughout millions of years of history, but there is another version of it, called ring species. Instead of the change happening over time, the changes happen geographically. The standard example is of the Larus gulls around the arctic circle. The various gulls are able to breed one with the other as you move round the arctic until you get back to Europe where the gulls on the ends of the chain are unable to breed. At what point do you say the change happened from one species to another? It's not really a relevant question.
The diagram here on shows the immediate past human ancestor species. As you can see, we have imposed names on the lineage, but it isn't a matter of waking up one morning a different species. It remains that there never was fewer than 1000 humans at any one time, even when our ancestors' numbers were at their lowest and most vulnerable.
Stuart
TimothyVI,Nov. wrote:[/quote]
Quote No wakeup,
you obviously didn't read my question thouroughly.
“If Satan, the serpent , was cast down after the resurrection,
then how was he there in Eden?” the beginning of mankind.It is a simple question. Satan wasn't satan until thousands of years after the beginning of mankind. After all, he wasn'[t cast down until after he rebelled against God, which you said was after the resurrection.
Can you answer that one question without going into your entire chronology of life on earth again?
Tim
Job 2:1 Again, there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the Lord.
Job 2:2 And the Lord said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And, Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.Obviously, Satan was free to roam between heaven and earth. But there came a day when he was not permitted to enter heaven again.
This part happens after the child was caught up unto God (resurrection);
Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels.
Rev 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.And his angels were free to dwell in heaven, or earth, but they chose earth, so they could have their fun here with man (deceive)
Jude 1:6 And the the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgement of the great day.
These ones left their first estate by choice.
Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,10:31) Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,10:19) Genesis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Princess.It took so long because it took so long for mankind to repopulate.example: It took 430 yrs for for God, before he took the hebrews out of egypt,because it took 430 yrs for them to reach 2million.(approx).
wakeup.
Hello Wake up,I know you post a lot on the forum and at times conversations can become a bit to keep up with.
So to reflect my statement. Why did it take so long till the serpent was named the devil and satan (another subject itself)?
Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,21:56) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,11:09) Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,03:04) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,02:36) Quote (TimothyVI @ Nov. 11 2012,00:16) Continuing saga, Quote Humankind has been under the influence of satan since then.
And lived in sin against God all the way,and became worse and worse, so that even the angels went down and defile them selves with the flesh and went into the women; and created the giants.(modifying the human race,and also the animals.(gen6).Were these the same 33% of the angels that were cast down with Satan, or some of the good angels that stayed with God?
Quote God had to destroy his creation because of all the corruption,and God caused a flood upon the earth,only 8 uncontaminated souls were saved in the ark. Whew! God messed up when he created Lucifer and he messed up when he created human kind, can't seem to get it right can he?
Every time God messes up he throws out, or destroys his creation. You would think that he could just make it right.Tim
Timothy .The war in heaven happened just after the resurrection,and those angels were cast down into the earth.(rev12:7-9).
The angels that left their estate and went down and defiled themselves with womenbefore the flood are 200 chief angels; and they are still locked up today.(rev 9:2. 14).
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,
If Satan, the serpent , was cast down after the resurrection,
then how was he there in Eden?This must be another one of those contradictions that are not a contradiction?
Or were you wrong about the serpent being Satan?
Tim
Timothy.You obviously did not read my answers thoroughly.
The garden of eden was the beginning of mankind.Adam and Eve still innocent, and lucifer the serpent was there to tempt them.And cain and seth muliplied,The angels sinned ,they went down to corrupt mankind.Then the great flood was about 1650 after the garden.
Then Noah and his 3sons muliplied,and populated the earth once more.
The serpent also called the dragon, or satan was cast out of heaven soon after Jesus resurrection,and that is in the year 33ad.
The serpent is NOT called lucifer anymore,but satan ,dragon,
The assyrian, gog,the father of lies,the devil.wakeup.
No wakeup,
you obviously didn't read my question thouroughly.
“If Satan, the serpent , was cast down after the resurrection,
then how was he there in Eden?” the beginning of mankind.It is a simple question. Satan wasn't satan until thousands of years after the beginning of mankind. After all, he wasn'[t cast down until after he rebelled against God, which you said was after the resurrection.
Can you answer that one question without going into your entire chronology of life on earth again?
Tim
Timothy.Lucifer bacame satan in the garden,after he tempted Eve.
Satan continued in heaven and also on earth,he was still free to go about his way.
But after the resurrection,he was cast out of heaven.
Only the earth is his domain.wakeup.
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 11 2012,16:07) Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,05:19) Genisis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Pwere do you got that info ,curious
T,You can google the bible timeline and do some research on the matter. Interesting things happen when you place the books in the order that they were written.
Enjoy!
Quote (princess @ Nov. 12 2012,02:13) Quote (Wakeup @ Nov. 11 2012,10:31) Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,10:19) Genesis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Princess.It took so long because it took so long for mankind to repopulate.example: It took 430 yrs for for God, before he took the hebrews out of egypt,because it took 430 yrs for them to reach 2million.(approx).
wakeup.
Hello Wake up,I know you post a lot on the forum and at times conversations can become a bit to keep up with.
So to reflect my statement. Why did it take so long till the serpent was named the devil and satan (another subject itself)?
Hi Princess.Lucifer became satan(the rebeller) in the garden.
And from then on he was given many names.He was free to roam around heaven and earth untill after the
resurrection,that is when he was cast out of heaven.Jesus was simply cleaning out heaven.
wakeup.
Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,21:16) Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 11 2012,16:07) Quote (princess @ Nov. 11 2012,05:19) Genisis was written in 3924 BCE, Revelations 200CE(earliest known fragment), one would think why it took so long for that to come about. Just saying.
Pwere do you got that info ,curious
T,You can google the bible timeline and do some research on the matter. Interesting things happen when you place the books in the order that they were written.
Enjoy!
Pso it is not Moses that as written the book of Genesis
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