@Keith
Hi Keith, thanks for joining me over here. Could you tell me a little about yourself like when you became a JW and anything you would like me to know about you? Do you live in the States?

Lightenup, I would be happy to discuss bible truth with you. You can start, ask a question please.

Desire truth–Jesus said the Israelite spiritual leaders father was the devil. It has not changed as long as they reject the Messiah.

THE COMING SUNDAY LAW
The Final Test Of Loyalty

Prophecy warns that the final crisis on earth will center around worship, obedience, and God’s authority. Revelation 13 describes a power that appears lamb-like at first, speaking the language of peace, liberty, morality, and unity, yet eventually exercises coercive authority and speaks “as a d…[Read more]

@Keith

Amen, Jesus is the Messiah! I set up a one-on-one discussion with you to discuss and share our beliefs. I’m not a JW but always like to discuss the distinctions. If interested, go to the discussion here: https://heavennet.net/forums/topic/lightenup-keith-discussion/#post-948050

Hope to see you there,

Lightenup (LU)

@Lightenup,

Everything you posted is from a christian perspective; what about the Jewish? Again, it is their scripture; wouldn’t they be the authority on what it says?

@Keith

Hoping to discuss your JW beliefs here.

0 doubt in all creation, Jesus IS the Messiah. He told those spiritual leaders back in his day-Your Father is the devil-Why? Because they were apostatized, They listened to Law( but added to many burdens along with those laws) their hearts were haughty, not humble as should have been.

For anyone following this exchange, I want to offer a brief summary so the main point doesn’t get lost in the back‑and‑forth.

The Tanakh presents a consistent pattern for God’s chosen figures: suffering or rejection first, followed by vindication and restoration. This pattern appears in Joseph, Moses, David, the Servant in Isaiah, and the pierced…[Read more]

@DesireTruth

Below is a simple comparison of what the Tanakh says the Messiah must do, and how Jesus either fulfilled it already or is said to fulfill it in the future. This avoids going in circles and keeps everything text‑anchored.

Messianic Expectation (Tanakh) / Jesus in NT / Messianic Age Fulfillment

Born from David (Jer 23:5; 2 Sam 7…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

WOW! Where do I begin with this salad bar of christianity?

You’re demanding that the Messiah fulfill every *end‑time* prophecy in His first appearance, but the Tanakh never says that. Not once. You invented that rule.

And the Tanakh DOESN’T say the Messiah was to come twice; however, your response will be, “but it doesn’t say he wo…[Read more]

Desire truth.   There are still some prophecy’s that Jesus will fulfill at the proper time. It will not go undone.

Few have seen the prophecy in Daniel 4 fulfilled over 100 years ago=Rev6:2–He receives his crown. The prophecy was 2520 days after the last king sat on the throne. But using a year for a day in that prophecy one gets 2520 years it t…[Read more]

Jesus is the Messiah. Gods son. God sent him( John 3:16)= God did not come down here.

@DesireTruth

You’ve made it very clear who you believe the Messiah is *not*.
So let me ask the obvious question you’ve avoided:

Who do you believe the Messiah is?

Not “what the Messiah will do.”
Not “why Jesus isn’t the Messiah.”
Not “what Christianity gets wrong.”
I’m asking for a name.

According to your own reading of the Tanakh:

• Who is t…[Read more]

@DesireTruth

1. ISAIAH 53
If the servant is Israel, then explain why the servant is righteous (53:11) when Israel is repeatedly called sinful (Isa 1:4; 48:8). Explain why the servant suffers for the sins of others (53:5–6) when Israel suffers for its own sins (Isa 40:2). Explain why the servant dies (53:8–9) when Israel never dies. Explain why…[Read more]

@DesireTruth

Calling Proverbs 8 “just poetry” doesn’t erase what the text actually says. Hebrew poetry uses personification to reveal truth, not to hide it. And the truth in Proverbs 8 is that Wisdom is portrayed as a real, pre‑creation figure distinct from God in role and relationship.

If Wisdom “is God,” then explain why the text says:
– “YH…[Read more]

@DesireTruth

You’re demanding that the Messiah fulfill every *end‑time* prophecy in His first appearance, but the Tanakh never says that. Not once. You invented that rule.

The Tanakh’s actual pattern is always the same:
first suffering/rejection,
then exaltation,
then worldwide restoration.

This is Joseph, Moses, David, the Servant in Isaia…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

1. Isaiah 53

Who is speaking where in this soliloquy? One must begin reading at the end of chapter 52, this is where this last “servant song” begins (why was it cut where it was…hmmm). Who is the servant (begin reading in chapter 41)? It’s not the Jesus!! Verse 10 is a tricky one to apply to the Jesus; unless of course one belie…[Read more]

@Lightenup,

Proverbs 8 is poetry; quit making it what it isn’t. It’s wisdom personified, given human like qualities (calls, speaks, loves, hates, walks, gives, rejoices, and is “brought forth”), and that’s it! Of course wisdom was there “with” G-d before creation and “saw” everything come to be; wisdom IS G-d and not something separate from HIM…[Read more]