Home Questions & Answers Did Jesus Christ exist before his birth on Earth? Page 1,015

Did Jesus Christ exist before his birth on Earth?

, , Questions & Answers, , , , , 25,944
Baby Jesus

It seems that most who call themselves Christian belong to one of two camps. Jesus is either God or a mere created man. This debate has been raging since the days of Athanasius of Alexandria and Arius.

What the does the Bible say? Well it is quite clear on who Jesus is and his origin. Let’s take a look at what is written.

Scripture says the Word became flesh and dwelt among us and when Jesus returns, his name is called ‘The Word of God’.  (John 1 & Revelation 19:13)

It says that God created all things through THE WORD and nothing was created without him. (John 1:3)

It says that the universe was created through THE SON and he is before all things. (Colossians 1:15-17)

It says that all things were created through JESUS CHRIST. (Hebrews 2:9)

This is what the Bible says about Jesus Christ, the son of the living God, the one named: ‘The Word of God’ who was with God in the beginning.

He emptied himself, took upon himself our nature, was obedient to his God and our God, died for our sins as it is written, and is now in the glory he had with the Father before the cosmos.

Jesus is not God in the flesh, rather the Word who became flesh and dwelt among us. He was with God in the beginning. He was the first to be with God.

Viewing 20 posts - 20,281 through 20,300 (of 25,945 total)
123…1,0141,0151,016…1,2961,2971,298
  • Author
    Posts
  • April 24, 2020 at 8:18 am#863301
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Mike,

    YOU: Which Lord?  There are tons of them.  Were they praying to Jesus?  He’s a Lord.  Beelzebub?  He’s also a Lord.  Jehovah?  He’s a Lord too.  Which one were they praying to in Acts 4?  What’s his name?

    ME: Acts 4

    24 When they heard this, they raised their voices together in prayer to God

    . “Sovereign Lord,” they said,

    Isn’t that enough Mike?

    what else do you require from Acts 4:24 to justify

    YOUR POINT?

    Tell me. I am waiting!

    Peace and Love in Jesus Christ

    April 24, 2020 at 8:34 am#863302
    Berean
    Participant

    Jodi

    you

    “Our unity of faith is to believe that Jesus is the seed of David and is a Son of God as a perfect man, according to God’s anointing Spirit, which he received as promised upon his resurrection from the dead. This was promised by our ONE GOD, the Father, before the world even began revealed by the prophets and also given to us by Paul.”

    Me

    Jesus is certainely  a person who has had a perfect life on earth…and much more

    BUT about his identity He is not “a son of God as a perfect man” as you say …

    HE IS THE MESSIAH THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD

    Mathew 16

    16] And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
    [17] And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

    Romains8

    For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

    Colossians 2

    Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
    [9] For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

     

     

     

    April 24, 2020 at 8:44 am#863303
    Berean
    Participant

    Gene

    you

    Derean…..No one is arguing that point, yes Jesus is before all things, except for His God and our God, his Father and our Father. I quoted that scripture directly that says that. You present Jesus as GOD himself, no scripture says that, those are the concepts of false trinitarian religion, that infected the true church ,   from the “GNOSTIC’S “…

     

    me

    you say : “No one is arguing that point, yes Jesus is before all things, except for His God and our God, his Father and our Father.”

     

    IF YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS FEFORE ALL THINGS, THEN YOU BELIEVE HE PRE EXISTED AND WAS WITH THE FATHER IN THE BIGINNING…

    WHAT DO YOU WANT TO SAY :”except for His God and our God, his Father and our Father.”

     

     And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

     Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

    April 24, 2020 at 9:31 am#863310
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Mike,

    YOU:Yes, our and Jesus’ God has certainly given his servant

    Jesus a ton of power and authority. 

    It doesn’t go down into your stomach Mike,

    THAT JESUS CHRIST IS RIGHT NOW

    THE SUPREME RULER OVER THE ENTIRE 

    EXISTENCE

    NOT A SERVANT ANYMORE BUT

     GOD the son,

    Galatians 4:7 Therefore, now he is not a servant, but a son. 

    OUR LORD GOD AND FATHER JESUS CHRIST.

    Ephesians 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in us all.

    Isaiah 9:6For a CHILD IS BORN to us, and a son is given to us, and the government is upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor,

    God the Mighty, the Father of the world to come, the Prince of Peace.

    John 15:4 Abide in me: and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abide in the vine, so neither can you, unless you abide in me. 5I am the vine: you the branches. He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same beareth much fruit:

    for without Me you can do nothing.

    6If anyone abides not in me, he shall be cast forth as a branch and shall wither: and

    they shall gather him up and cast him into the fire: and he burneth.

     

    NO MIKE NOT

    A TON OF POWER AND AUTHORITY READ:

    John17:10 And all my things are thine, and thine are mine:

    and I am glorified 

    IN THEM

    ALL MY THINGS (REGARDING THE PHYSICAL/FLESH) ARE YOURS, AND 
    ALL YOURS( REGARDING THE SPIRIT) ARE MINE,

    Attention Mike:

    AND I AM GLORIFIED IN THEM.
    OK MIKE? 

    ONLY JESUS IS GLORIFIED IN 

    BOTH SPIRIT and FLESH! 

    in a unique embodiment.
    not the Father.

    On the last day of the Lord

    God the Father, SPIRIT HIDDEN,

    WOULD MAKE USE OF THIS EMBODIMENT,

    “THE WORD” THE SON OF MAN, eternally

    ALL IN ALL. AS JESUS CHRIST

    IN THE MEANTIME THE SON

    not the servant

    JESUS CHRIST IS THE MASTER OF THE UNIVERSES

    Both spirit and flesh.

    Matthew 28:17 And seeing him they adored: but some doubted. 18And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying:

    All power is given to me in heaven and in earth.

    NOT A TON OF POWER.

    CREATED ANEW BY JESUS, ON HIS DEATH, AND

    THE FATHER OF IT.

    Hebrews 1:8But to the Son:

    Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever:

    a sceptre of JUSTICE is

    the sceptre of thy kingdom. (THE KINGDOM OF THE SON, MIKE!)

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

    April 24, 2020 at 10:36 am#863312
    Lightenup
    Participant

    Jodi and Gene,

    Do you think that Jesus walked in the Spirit or was he made to walk in the Spirit? 

     

    April 24, 2020 at 11:30 am#863313
    Jodi
    Participant

    Hi Berean,

    YOU:

    Jesus is certainely  a person who has had a perfect life on earth…and much more

    BUT about his identity He is not “a son of God as a perfect man” as you say …

    ME:

    Eph 4: 3 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

    Berean I DEFINE CHRIST directly by Jesus’s own words. He tells you WHEN he was anointed, WHEN he was SENT, and WHAT the purpose was for his sending. The anointing equates to him being the ONLY MORTAL MAN to have been begotten by our ONE GOD, the Father’s Spirit not by measure.

    YOU: HE IS THE MESSIAH THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD

    Mathew 16

    16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
    17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

    ME: Berean READ who Jesus says he is leading up to verse 16,

    13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying,

    Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? 14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets. 15 He saith unto them,But whom say ye that I am? 16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. 17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

    JESUS, the Son of Man, IS the Christ, the Son of the living God.

    Jesus didn’t just say, “whom do men say that I am”, he said “whom do men say that I the Son of Man am“ before they started declaring that which they might have believed he was, he wanted to firmly establish that which he most certainly was, A SON OF MAN. 

    2 Peter 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. 17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, WHEN there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

    Berean, it is clearly given unto you. The eyewitnesses MADE KNOWN that the COMING of our Lord Jesus Christ was WHEN HE RECEIVED from God HONOR and GLORY, when the Spirit descended and abode upon him at the river Jordan, WHEN they heard the voice of God declare that THIS is His beloved Son. Jesus tells you that the Spirit was upon him, an anointing, and then he is SENT to set us at liberty. Without the Spirit, without the anointing and the sending, there is NO SON that is SENT for the world to believe in!

    YOU: Romains 8

    For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

    ME: Berean, this is very important 

    Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

    The son of Jesse that was to be anointed and sent, receive of the Spirit, be the only one to receive the glory of YHWH, is said to have been CALLED TO RIGHTEOUSNESS, YHWH would HOLD HIS HAND and KEEP HIM.  Berean, he was going to keep him from sin, so that he could fulfill the covenant, so that he could be for a LIGHT. The Son of Man was in the likeness of sinful flesh in that he had weak flesh that could tempt him. We read of his weakness when he asked God to “take this cup” from him.

    Jesus overcame the temptation of the flesh because God was holding his hand every step of the way, as you are told the one called to righteousness would have God directing all his ways. Jesus was thus able to overcome the fear of death, which unto all other men as we are told that fear has kept us in bondage. Jesus broke that bondage and condemn sin in the flesh.

    YOU: Colossians 2

    Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.   [9] For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    ME: YES in CHRIST dwelleth all the fulness, God was ALL in him, as God has promised that God will be ALL IN ALL. 

    In Jesus’s dwelt all the Godhead. He received the Spirit of Wisdom, Council and Might, Knowledge and Fear of the LORD. As said, Jesus speaks the words of God as he received the Spirit NOT BY MEASURE. 

    How on earth do you blind yourself to where you cannot see and equate, that the one mortal man who has the Spirit not by measure IS he who thus would be the one where all the fullness of the Godhead dwells in him bodily?

    You don’t want to apply that God promised to give the Son of Jesse His glory. You don’t want to apply that eyewitnesses tell you that they saw Jesus RECEIVE GLORY and HONOR WHEN God called Jesus His beloved Son exactly upon the Spirit coming to dwell in his body without measure. You don’t want to apply that is when Jesus himself says that he was sent, and he called the Spirit that dwelt in him an anointing. You don’t want to apply that Jesus tells you that he is a SON OF MAN COME to save that which was lost.

    April 25, 2020 at 3:13 am#863326
    Berean
    Participant

     

    Jodi

    You

    Jesus didn’t just say, “whom do men say that I am”, he said “whom do men say that I the Son of Man am“ before they started declaring that which they might have believed he was, he wanted to firmly establish that which he most certainly was, A SON OF MAN. 

    Me

    JESUS WAS AND IS THE OWN SON OF GOD AND TO SHOW US TO BECOME A SON OF GOD , HE BECAME A SON OF MAN;

    THAT IS WHY HE SAY OF HIMSELF THAT HE IS  THE SON OF MAN.

    When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?

    I    THE    SON   OF   MAN…  AND NOT A SON A MAN.

    Jesus was crucified by the Jewish leaders because they
    did not want to BELIEVE that HE WAS THE OWN SON OF GOD
    come down from heaven to the world to save the world.

    HE WAS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD AND HE TOOK UPON HIM OUR HUMANITY.

    Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
    [7] But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: (Philippians 2)

     

    April 25, 2020 at 3:20 am#863328
    Berean
    Participant

    Jodi

    Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
    [33] The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

     

     

    April 25, 2020 at 5:59 am#863331
    Jodi
    Participant

    Hi LU,

    YOU:Christians all over the world see this passage as referring to the Son being born/begotten/brought forth. This happened before creation.

    ME: To denote that portion of the chapter to the Son, is to IGNORE the first half of the passage and also that of Proverbs 3 along with other clear passages. 

    One does not have truth when they fully IGNORE scripture and don’t apply context, as well as other passages, but instead just see things how they want to see, such is the blind leading the blind.

    FIRST ACKNOWLEDGE ISAIAH 11, 

    1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: 2 And the Spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the Spirit of wisdom and understanding, the Spirit of counsel and might, the Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD; 3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:

    The Spirit of the LORD IS WISDOM, IS UNDERSTANDING, IS KNOWLEDGE. Jesus is a MAN upon whom those things were GIVEN unto him. 

    Proverbs 3:

    12 For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth. 13 Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding. 14 For the merchandise of it is better than the merchandise of silver, and the gain thereof than fine gold. 15 She is more precious than rubies: and all the things thou canst desire are not to be compared unto her. 16 Length of days is in her right hand; and in her left hand riches and honour. 17 Her ways are ways of pleasantness, and all her paths are peace. 18 She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.

    19 The LORD by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens. 20 By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew. 21 My son, let not them depart from thine eyes: keep sound wisdom and discretion: 22 So shall they be life unto thy soul, and grace to thy neck. 23 Then shalt thou walk in thy way safely, and thy foot shall not stumble.

    Proverbs 8:

    1 Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice? 2 She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths. 3 She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors. 4 Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice isto the sons of man. 5 O ye simple, understand wisdom: and, ye fools, be ye of an understanding heart. 6 Hear; for I will speak of excellent things; and the opening of my lips shall be right things. 7 For my mouth shall speak truth; and wickedness is an abomination to my lips. 8 All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.

    LU, don’t forget that this LORD said that He would raise up a prophet from among brethren and HE would put HIS words into the prophets mouth, and those who would not hear him speak the LORD’S words in the LORD’S name, would be destroyed. This prophet IS a Son of Man. Don’t forget that Jesus said he was TAUGHT by his Father. And of course don’t forget this Son of Man RECEIVED the Spirit of Wisdom, Understanding and Knowledge from the LORD.

    9 They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge. 10 Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold. 11 For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it. 12 I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions. 13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate. 14 Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength. 15 By me kings reign, and princes decree justice. 16 By me princes rule, and nobles, even all the judges of the earth. 17 I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me. 18 Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness. 19 My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver. 20 I lead in the way of righteousness, in the midst of the paths of judgment:

    LU, don’t forget the son of Jesse was to be CALLED to righteousness where the LORD would direct all his ways, and the LORD would ordain this man to judge the quick and the dead, not by his own eyes and ears. Also don’t forget that you are told by Paul that we are JOINT HEIRS with Christ being promised to be HEIRS of the LORD, and the LORD told the prophet Ezekiel that He would put HIS SPIRIT upon us and cause us to follow in all His ways. 

    21 That I may cause those that love me to inherit substance; and I will fill their treasures. 22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. 23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. 24 When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water. 25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: 26 While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world. 27 When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth.

    RECALL and APPLY Proverbs 3,

    19 The LORD BY WISDOM hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens. 20 By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew.

    The LORD brought forth His Wisdom and His understanding in order to create the fountains with water, the mountains and hills, the earth and fields, and the lights in heaven of the day and of the night.

    April 25, 2020 at 6:55 am#863332
    Jodi
    Participant

    Hi Berean,

    YOU:

    JESUS WAS AND IS THE OWN SON OF GOD AND TO SHOW US TO BECOME A SON OF GOD , HE BECAME A SON OF MAN;

    ME: You are giving me your theology not scripture. 

    YOU: “to show us to become a Son of God, he became a Son of Man”

    Berean, prophecy was for a Son of Man to come who the LORD would rest His Spirit upon him and send him out into the world TO set us at liberty. This prophecy became true in the Son of Man Jesus, of whom he says himself that he is the Son of Man who has come to save that which was lost. This same Son of Man is returning in our Father’s glory to judge and reward every man according to his works.

    Everything I just said IS SCRIPTURE, not my personal theology of which is what you stand behind. 

    What Jesus tells us Berean, is that those who do the will of his God and our God, his Father and our Father, are his brothers and sisters. 

    Berean, Jesus didn’t TEACH AT ALL THAT WHICH YOU SAY. 

    He taught that he could do nothing of himself and gave all glory to God. 

    Matthew 20:23 And he saith unto them,Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father.

    Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

    Acts 2:32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses. 33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

    Acts 13:33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee. 34 And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead, now no more to return to corruption, he said on this wise, I will give you the sure mercies of David.

    born -Gennao,  born, begotten

    John 3:5 Jesus answered,Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

    born -Gennao,  born, begotten

    Ezekiel 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. 28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God. 

    Jesus is a Son of God ACCORDING to the SPIRIT of our heavenly Father, and we likewise are Sons ACCORDING to the SPIRIT of our heavenly Father. Such is what Paul was speaking of when he said that the Spirit is a witness to our spirit that we are children of God, and that those that are LED by the Spirit are the Sons of God, and that we are joint heirs with Christ in being glorified together with him being an heir of God.

     

     

    April 25, 2020 at 8:25 am#863334
    Berean
    Participant

    Jodi

    You

    Jesus didn’t just say, “whom do men say that I am”, he said “whom do men say that I the Son of Man am“ before they started declaring that which they might have believed he was, he wanted to firmly establish that which he most certainly was, A SON OF MAN.

    Me

    JESUS WAS AND IS THE OWN SON OF GOD AND TO SHOW US TO BECOME A SON OF GOD , HE BECAME A SON OF MAN;

    THAT IS WHY HE SAY OF HIMSELF THAT HE IS  THE SON OF MAN.

    When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?

    I    THE    SON   OF   MAN…  AND NOT A SON A MAN.

    Jesus was crucified by the Jewish leaders because they
    did not want to BELIEVE that HE WAS THE OWN SON OF GOD
    come down from heaven to the world to save the world.

    HE WAS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD AND HE TOOK UPON HIM OUR HUMANITY.

    Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
    [7] But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: (Philippians 2)

     

    April 25, 2020 at 8:58 am#863337
    Berean
    Participant

    Jodi

    The Jews believed that Jesus was a son of man, but they did not believe that he was God’s own Son, nor THE Son of man…
    Matthew 13
    … 54Having gone to his homeland, he was teaching in the synagogue, so that those who heard him were amazed and said: Where does this wisdom and these miracles come from? 55Isn’t he the carpenter’s son? is it not Marie who is his mother? Aren’t Jacques, Joseph, Simon and Jude his brothers? 56and not his sisters all of us? Where do all these things come from? …
    John 6:42
    And they said, Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, the one whose father and mother we know? How then does he say: I came down from heaven?

    Wouldn’t you also be in the same case as most of the Jews in the time of Jesus who refused Christ his divine filiality even though they had seen his specials works ???

     

    Then cried Jesus in the temple as he taught, saying, Ye both know me, and YE KNOW WHENCE I AM: and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, WHOM YE KNOW NOT .

    the

     But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, THE SON OF GOD ; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

    April 25, 2020 at 12:19 pm#863344
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Mike,

     

    April 25, 2020 at 12:23 pm#863345
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Mike,

    YOU: No, Jesus is not any particular literal word that God speaks, or has spoken.  He has as one of his many titles “The Word of God” because he is God’s main spokesman.

    ME: Yes Mike, Jesus is

    THE ACTUAL LITERAL WORD SPOKEN OF GOD:

    THE PHYSICAL ASPECT OF CREATION, male and female.

    Now be aware that

    THE HOLY GHOST IS THE ACTUAL VOICE OF GOD:

    THE SOUL ASPECT OF CREATION.

    THE SOUL OF THE CHURCH. While

    “THE WORD” is

    THE BODY OF THE CHURCH

    These two spirit ELEMENTS belong to

    GOD THE SON.

    the Fact that IT IS THE KINGDOM OF THE SON. In the same way, we have

    THE SOUL, an attribute of the Holy Ghost, and

    THE FLESH, an attribute of “THE WORD” as His brethren!

    THE FACT GOD ALL-KNOWING,

     AS JESUS, BECAME HUMAN LIKE US!

    EMANUEL: GOD WITH US

    YOU: He had this title when he was with God in the beginning,

    PRECISELY! 

    Now IN FULL HUMILITY:  let’s go right

    DEEP into the process of “THE WORD”

    THE BEGINNING.

    God, once HE created the first-ever creature, God’s masterpiece ever, manifested  LOVE, WISDOM, and POWER, apart from God’s virtues of which charity and humility are most prominent.  This creature was ON HIS OWN AS THE BEGINNING. THE CARRIER OF GOD,

    by whom God lived as a being, as GOD IS NOT A BEING but

    A STATE OF LOVE.

    God on His/Her own, filled the entire existence in full darkness, thus He commenced creation when through the big bang from the CORE of pitch darkness emanated endless luminous spirits, by which spirits THE ENTIRE INFINITE EXISTENCE WAS LIT, and Lucifer was created as

    THE CARRIER OF LIGHT, THE PHYSICAL LIGHT, THE PRIMORDIAL LIGHT.

    THE FIRST MORNING STAR, (JESUS ON MOUT TABOR!!) He was all by himself AS THE BEGINNING, but in the truth

    He was not!

    SIMPLY AS HE DIDN’T POSSESS LIFE IN HIMSELF, BUT HIS LIFE WAS PRECISELY

    “THE WORD” THE SON OF MAN TO BE,

    THE SPIRITUAL LIGHT, WISDOM,

    WHO WAS IN LUCIFER’S HEART.

    John 1:1 In the beginning(LUCIFER) was “THE WORD”.

    A HEART ETERNALLY SHARED BETWEEN THIS CREATURE, THE PHYSICAL CREATION OF LIGHT AND GOD EMBODIED IN “THE WORD” The first-ever MARRIAGE!

    THE SON OF MAN TO BE.

    THE HEART OF THE KINGDOM OF THE SON.

    OUTSIDE OF GOD.

    ONE SUBSTANCE and DISTINCT  SUBJECT to Lucifer’s free will, with ONE DIVINE/CREATURE HEART. Unfortunately though became the first heart of stone, and resulted in the first divorce.

    Now “THE WORD” Jesus, the Son of Man to be, was/is also the only SPIRIT/MEDIATOR between God and Lucifer and eventually through him, the entire creatures no matter what and who, simply as whatever created out of

    THOSE ENDLESS SPIRITS EMANATED FROM GOD 

    MUST RETURN BACK TO GOD, THANKS TO “THE WORD” the Son of Man to be.

    PLUS ALSO  GLORIFIED NO MATTER HOW EVIL AND IMPERFECT A CREATURE COULD BECOME, AS GOD

    IS LOVE, and as LOVE HE NEVER DESTROYS TOTALLY THE CREATURES BUT TRANSFORMED THEM INTO OTHER PHYSICAL CREATURES IN ORDER TO RETURN TO GOD,

    WHILE THE SPIRIT REMAINS THE SAME. REFLECT Mike:

    before you were born:

    you were  AN INFINITESIMAL SPECK IN EVERY CREATURE, THEN ALL THESE SPECKS OF CREATURES,

    BY “THE WORD” OF GOD, 

    JESUS, THE SON OF MAN TO BE, BURIED IN THESE SPECKS AS LIFE,

    THE BEGINNING OF EVERY CREATURE IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, FOR THE SAKE OF TRUTH AND UNDERSTANDING!

    YOU

    WERE ACCUMULATED INTO ONE 

    SOUL/BODY

    THE SOUL IN THE MAN’S SPERM, THE HOLY GHOST

    THE FLESH IN THE WOMAN’S OVUM, “THE WORD”

    KEEP IN MIND WHAT I WROTE ABOVE THAT

    THE HOLY GHOST, AND “THE WORD” in this case are both ATTRIBUTED TO 

    THE SON, SIMPLY FOR HIS KINGDOM!

    NOW IN THE CORE OF ALL THIS AS AN INFINITESIMAL SPIRIT, BURIED, AND HIDDEN 

    LIKE A TREASURE IN THE FIELD ( IN THE SON) 

    THERE WAS GOD THE FATHER

    Now ATTENTION MIKE:

    in order for this process to be possible,

    God simply engrafted AS YOU CONVINCLY SAYS: HIS SERVANT!

    His Son, as a spirit/mediator ATTACHED

    ONE SUBSTANCE directly  FROM THE BEGINNING Lucifer OUR ORIGINAL SPIRIT, THE LOST SHEEP!

    Simply: PROTECTS, SHIELDS, and SEPARATES; Hebrews 4:12

    both the creatures from God’s destruction and also God from being contaminated with the least evil intentions from creatures, as God, in a mode to say is allergic to sin, plus that in this PROCESS 

    GOD GIVES CREATURES TOTAL FREE WILL. AS MUCH AS GOD HAS. Even to the extent to become God’s enemies.

    NOW HERE COMES TO THE MOST STUNNING PROCESS FROM“THE WORD” the Son of Man to be FROM THE VERY BEGINNING in Lucifer

    “THE WORD” the Son of Man to be,

    TALKS and COMMUNICATES WITH CREATURES ALL THE TIME, FROM THE BEGINNING IN LUCIFER.

    John8:24 Therefore I said to you that you shall die in your sins. For if you believe not that I am he, ( IN YOU HEART SINCE YOU WERE ANGELS) you shall die in your sin.( WHEN YOU REBELLED)  25They said therefore to him: Who art thou? Jesus said to them:

    THE BEGINNING,  who also speak unto you. (AS MAN)

    Jesus performed the most crucial task when He carried

    ALL UNTO Him BOTH GOOD AND EVIL

    Both for the love of God and creatures, and Jesus as a SPIRIT, automatically, in this vital and crucial position GIVES

    ETERNAL LIFE, TO CREATURES,  as the Father never destroys creatures, simply as HE WOULD COMMIT A SUICIDE, KILLING ALSO

    HIS SERVANT/GOD!

    HIS OWN WORD without which nothing could ever be created

    the Father is not in the position to achieve this 

    crucial work for GOD’S KINGDOM, the fact that it is 

    THE KINGDOM OF THE SON! ALSO HE

    REDEEMS ALL creatures, but first and FOREMOST HE

    PERFECTS  ALL creatures, Both SOULS and FLESH, in HIMSELF. All this asserted in

    John4:34Jesus saith to them: My meat is to do the will of him that sent me,

    that I may perfect his work.35 Do not you say: There are yet four months, and then the harvest cometh?

    Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes, and see the countries. For they are white already to harvest.

    36And he that reapeth (THE HOLY GHOST) receiveth wages and gathereth fruit unto life everlasting: that both he that soweth(“THE WORD”) and he that reapeth(THE HOLY GHOST)  may rejoice together. (ON THE CROSS)

    37For in this is the saying true: That

    it is one man that soweth, and it is another that reapeth. (both attributes of

    the son of God, THE SOULand THE FLESH ) 

    First HE PERFECTS ALL on His baptism, by which He baptized the entire  SOULS by

     WATER AND THE HOLY GHOST, John3:5

    Where He established FOR THE FIRST TIME His own brethren in

    ALL IN HIMSELF in relation to SOULS, and then on His death on the cross

    He destroyed His own body as a ransom IN EXCHANGE  FOR the human race, satanic up to that moment in time through Adam sin. Simply

    to own as well His own brethren in relation to THE FLESH

    ALL ON His resurrection THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE IN HIM!

    by His own SPIRIT, originally slain like a lamb from the beginning of the world, Rev.13:8

    But ALIVE on Jesus’death, by which death THE HOLY GHOST GLORIFIED IN JESUS’FFLESH, BOTH BECAME ONE SPIRIT, AS

    GODMAN IN

    JESUS CHRIST, by whom

    AS GODMAN ON EARTH. Jesus’ dead body came back to life!

    HE RAISED HIMSELF!

    THE MAN BORN AGAIN John3:3 Thus God the Father by

    “THE WORD” Jesus, the Son of Man, established

    HIS OWN CHILDREN IN ONE SAME GOD,

    ONE SAME  FATHER,

    ONE SAME BLOOD

    IN ONE SAME SPIRIT. THE SPIRIT OF THE SON

    LORD GOD AND FATHER  FOR THE WORLD TO COME Isaiah 9:6

    JESUS CHRIST.

    1Peter1:3Blessed be

    THE God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,

    who according to his great mercy hath regenerated us unto a lively hope, by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead: 4Unto an inheritance, incorruptible, and undefiled and that cannot fade, reserved in heaven for you, 5Who, by the power of God, are kept by faith unto salvation, ready to be revealed in the last time.

    THE EMBODIMENT OF 

    GOD ALMIGHTY TO BE

    ALL IN ALL ON THE LAST DAY OF

    THE LORD JESUS CHRIST

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

     

    April 25, 2020 at 2:02 pm#863348
    Jodi
    Participant

    Hi LU,

    YOU:

    Jodi and Gene,

    Do you think that Jesus walked in the Spirit or was he made to walk in the Spirit?

    ME: Jesus we are told was baptized in water, and then the Spirit descended upon him, called an anointing, and we are told in prophecy that he would be called to righteousness where upon that calling YHWH would direct all his ways. YHWH cleanses man with water and gives His Spirit unto man so that he may walk in His ways. 

    Isaiah 42:5 Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

    45:12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded. 13 I have raised him up in righteousness, and I will direct all his ways: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives..

    Ezekiel 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

    April 25, 2020 at 3:12 pm#863349
    Jodi
    Participant

    Hi Berean,

    I like your boldness and colors you used in your last post!

    However, I will say that the content of what you posted and your accusation I see as quite deceptive, twisted and foolish.

    Yes indeed Jesus came to his own and many of his own rejected him.

    YOU:

    The Jews believed that Jesus was a son of man, but they did not believe that he was God’s own Son, nor THE Son of man…

    Matthew 13: 54 And when he was come into his own country, he taught them in their synagogue, insomuch that they were astonished, and said, Whence hath this man this wisdom, and these mighty works? 55 Is not this the carpenter’s son? is not his mother called Mary? and his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas? 56 And his sisters, are they not all with us? Whence then hath this man all these things?

    ME: and the next verse says.…….

    57 And they were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A PROPHET is not without honor, save in his own country, and in his own house. 58 And he did not many mighty works there because of their unbelief.

    Berean, the problem of Jesus’s OWN PEOPLE, was that many did not believe that Jesus was the PROPHET that Moses spoke about who would come. 

    YOU: John 6:42 And they said, Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, the one whose father and mother we know? How then does he say: I came down from heaven?

    ME: We have the same problem in John 6 as in Matthew 13, we see non believers.

    In John 6 prior to verse 42, we however do see some did believe the truth, that Jesus was the prophet that was to come.

    14 Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world. 15 When Jesus therefore perceived that they would come and take him by force, to make him a king, he departed again into a mountain himself alone.

    Berean, the people who believed Jesus IN TRUTH, they believed he was ONE FROM AMONG BRETHREN whom God raised up to be a prophet, where God would put His words in his mouth and those who would not believe in this human raised up from among them to be God’s prophet, would be destroyed. They also saw him as the TRUE PROPHESIED KING, A SON OF MAN, the son of David that God promised He would be a Father to and set him up as an eternal king giving him the throne of his father David. 

    TRUE BELIEVERS BELIEVED that Jesus could do nothing of himself, he did not send himself, they believed that their God sent them the prophet of HIS WORD from long ago,  they saw Jesus as God’s WORD MADE TRUE IN THE FLESH.  He CAME to them being FROM GOD/thus they saw him as SENT DOWN FROM HEAVEN.

    YOU: Wouldn’t you also be in the same case as most of the Jews in the time of Jesus who refused Christ his divine filiality even though they had seen his specials works ???

    ME: Berean, you totally neglect the fact that Jesus said he could do nothing of himself, and that he said he had God’s Spirit come upon him, an anointing, for the purpose to be sent out to perform signs and miracles and speak the gospel.

    The greatness of Jesus was that God’s Spirit was dwelling in a Son of Man unto a full measure, we are told that Jesus received the Spirit not by measure in order to speak God’s word. We are told that God would raise up a prophet among brethren to whom He would put His words in his mouth. By God’s word upon him he could perform miracles of healing. 

    Berean you seem incapable of apply scriptures together that literally goes hand in hand.

    The scriptures you give where you are trying to say that people were in error because they did not believe that Jesus was God sent from heaven, actually tell you directly that their error was in them not believing that the son of Joseph and Mary, the man who was a mere carpenter, was the great prophet spoken in prophecy. 

    The people REFUSED Jesus as the PROPHET of God’s word, raised up from among brethren. I DO NOT REFUSE.

     

     

    April 26, 2020 at 3:25 am#863366
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Mike:  Okay, but I want to know if the original One consisted of two individual entities.  You used the word “their”, which made me think you believe there were two sentient minds in the original One.  Is that what you think?  Or was the original One a single entity/mind?

    LU:  Oh who can fathom…from the One mind came both. Jesus is the wisdom of God.

    Wait a minute… are you saying that the cell splitting scenario you’re pushing doesn’t stand up to scrutiny?

    If you say The One had two minds from eternity, then the split would result in a Father and Son – each with a mixture of both minds.  We’d have two individual entities with split personalities.

    If you say The One had only one mind, then the split would result in a Father and Son – each with the same identical mind.  Or worse yet, it would amount to the original mind splitting into two individual minds – neither of which were eternal.  As if an unknown entity who was even greater than the Father performed an action to create the mind/entity of the Most High God Himself.  Of course that would mean that this original unknown entity also created the mind/entity of the Son too – and so we’re right back to where we started… accepting that the Son was originated by someone else.

    So while you sort that out, I’m still wanting to know about the prayer in Acts 4…

    Is the one the apostles were praying to the one who created the heavens, the earth, the sea, and everything in them?

    Is Jesus the one they were praying to?

    Each question only requires a yes or no answer.  How do you answer them?

    April 26, 2020 at 3:34 am#863367
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    To Jodi, Gene and anyone who thinks Jesus began his existence as a human being…

    John 17:5    How could Jesus ask God to glorify him with the glory he had with/from/of/alongside God before the world began?

     

    To Kathi, Berean, Carmel and anyone who thinks Jesus is the Most High God who created the heaven and the earth…

    Acts 4     The apostles prayed to the one who created the heaven, the earth, the sea, and everything in them.  Is Jesus the one they were praying to?

     

    If the doctrines to which you guys subscribe cannot even account for these two scriptures, then there is something wrong with those doctrines.  It’s disheartening to me, because I was all geared up to delve into a bunch of scriptures (one at a time of course) in order to find out if there’s any truth to either of these doctrines, and after putting only two scriptures out for discussion, the opposition seems to have disappeared.  Hmm…  🤔

    April 26, 2020 at 3:45 am#863368
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    LU:  The Father and the Son do nothing apart from each other.

    Wow, Kathi.  When I heard Carmel argue that point, I just figured he was very confused – because he also argues that God is our servant.  (I think he confuses “servant” with “benefactor”.)  But now YOU are also claiming that the Most High God would have no power to do anything if not for His Son?  Are you serious?

    April 26, 2020 at 3:51 am#863369
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Jodi: His God and my God, his Father and my Father’s name is YHWH.

    This is simple and clear.

    It doesn’t get much simpler or clearer than that. 👍

  • Author
    Posts
Viewing 20 posts - 20,281 through 20,300 (of 25,945 total)
123…1,0141,0151,016…1,2961,2971,298
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.

 

CREATE NEW TOPIC
POPULAR TOPICS
ACTIVE TOPICS
SITE SEARCH
SUPPORT US
REGISTER

Recent Replies

ALL REPLIES →

© 1999 - 2024 Heaven Net

Navigation

© 1999 - 2023 - Heaven Net
 Log in with Facebook
or

Log in with your credentials

or    

Forgot your details?

 Log in with Facebook
or

Create Account