Roo,I have never said that I thought begotten always meant a literal birth.

Keith,I'm not dishonest, I may be wrong but not dishonest.  My honesty is why I can't agree with you on some main themes.  I agree with you on some things and I have spoken that at times.I don't think you know that an Arian believes that the Son was created and created out of nothing that had existed before Him.  You know very well that I have ne…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Aug. 13 2010,03:03)I don't have an agenda here Lightenup, but Jesus is referred to as an angel, just as John is.Mark 11 The beginning of the gospel about Jesus Christ, the Son of God. 2 It is written in Isaiah the prophet:   “I will send my messenger ahead of you,      who will prepare your way”— 3 “a voice of one calling in the d…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 13 2010,05:24)Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 13 2010,00:01)Hi Shimmer,Your Posting the thoughts of others as well.If you agree with something someone else says,instead of importing their writing, absorb the points you agree with and re-word those points through 'your'filters; OK? Then we have something to discuss! Importingsomeone else's…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 13 2010,05:08)Lightenup, I answered your post, I'm not running away, only obeying what I was shown, please respect that.JustAskin, sorry, your alone in this, your choice to stay or not.ShimmerYou are now worried about obeying God but you weren't obeying when you posted your 'spiritual' inuendo to me because God had told you…[Read more]

Hello,I saw this tonight and thought I would like for JA to see it.Hebrews 2:5-9Quote 2:5 For he did not put the world to come, about which we are speaking, under the control of angels. 2:6 Instead someone testified somewhere:“What is man that you think of him or the son of man that you care for him?2:7 You made him lower than the angels for a l…[Read more]

Yes Mike that is the sight. I have really been enjoying reading about the earlier Christians in the pre-trinity era.

Mike,Good post! This really stood out to me:Quote 9. Moreover to anathematize “Before His generation He was not,” did not seem preposterous, in that it is confessed by all, that the Son of God was before the generation according to the fleshThat was quite a strong statement that it is confessed by ALL, that the Son of God was BEFORE the gen…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 12 2010,12:10)Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 12 2010,05:26)You forgot to mention me in your list too Ed,   Lightenup, I said I had respect for the Church Fathers but was put off by the way they were used here on this thread. I became so disturbed by this thread that I asked in prayer and I was shown to stay awayThen tonight after…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 12 2010,14:50)Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 12 2010,12:10)Have I been perverting God's word in your opinion?  Then show me what word that I have been perverting and defend your view-with scripture so we can discuss it, otherwise stop with the false inuendos for they are destructive.Wow!Isn't that the pot calling the…[Read more]

Keith,You have called me many things that I am not and I do not care to go through the threads but these are some that come to mind:DishonestArianPolytheistanti-trinitarianthat I insist that 'begotten' always means to be 'born'Kathi

Roo,I will forgive you and I can accept that you and WJ truly believe you are trinitarians and that our definitions of being a trinitarian are different. So I am sorry for using the word 'pretend.'Keith, I'm sorry for using the word 'pretend' in that post about 'pretending' to be trinitarians. We have different definitions of the term and I…[Read more]

Roo,your quote says:Quote Therefore, our Lord Jesus, as a created being, could not be God in the fullest sense. This author does not understand that God would not beget a foreign god (a created being) and therefore his conculsion is skewed. imo

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 11 2010,23:53)Hi Lightenup,This is the post I just prepared for Marty and I just read your post so I will address it to both of you.Marty,In the Born or begotten thread, theres more to what I said, They are saying God has a body with reproductive organs and everything, that God actually gave birth to God as another God who…[Read more]

t8,Roo is giving you proof of an apology to falsely accusing me of claiming a bisexual God and I am considering accepting that apology but will not be quick to do so given the fact that he has also accused me of many things which he has NOT given proof of nor apologized for.  I listed some of them for him and challenged him to confess and…[Read more]

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ Aug. 12 2010,09:19)Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 12 2010,21:26)You forgot to mention me in your list too Ed,   Lightenup, I said I had respect for the Church Fathers but was put off by the way they were used here on this thread. I became so disturbed by this thread that I asked in prayer and I was shown to stay awayThen tonight…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 12 2010,05:26)You forgot to mention me in your list too Ed,   Lightenup, I said I had respect for the Church Fathers but was put off by the way they were used here on this thread. I became so disturbed by this thread that I asked in prayer and I was shown to stay awayThen tonight after making some random post of some early…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 11 2010,08:14)Thanks Marty, I was getting pretty confused reading here tonight, over in the begotten thread, they saying all sorts of things, too complex for me, it was good to read your post back here, easy to understand,   Babylonia, right here !Do you believe then it is wrong to say God begat God, as in Jesus pre-existant…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 11 2010,17:00)Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 11 2010,07:27)I wouldn't dismiss the words of the early true disciples of Christ because they can explain the culture of the times and reflect general understandings of the words of their mentors with far more accuracy than we can.Kathi You say all this but yet you dismiss most…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 11 2010,16:49)All,This is all I have to say – on this thread.I used to be a big supporter of the Early Church Father's, Nick would say “The Apostasy started early” I would say “No that's not true Nick'.Reading here has completly put me off, there is so much anger, words have completly lost their meaning, Now I know how…[Read more]