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Hi KW,
And you are the arbiter of credibility?
Older and fewer is more reliable than more recent and more common?
Nick,
I was not a translator for the NET or other versions that determined the later manuscripts were less creditable. There are other passages in the later manuscripts that are suspect as well which is why they change text types as more earlier manuscripts became available.
Nick,
Not really, but new information made change opinions.
It is certainly not wise to use a teaching that may have been inserted by unbelievers as evidence of anything.
To all……”BRETHERN YOU HAVE NO NEED OF A TEACHER FOR THE “SPIRIT” ITSELF TEACHES YOU “ALL” THINGS”.
Peace and love to you and yours. ………………gene
Hi GB,
Then why do you not listen?
Why do you offer your own silly ideas instead?
Jesus did not teach SPIRIT IS INTELLECT but you do. WHO are you?
Gene and Kerwin,
Gene… I know Jesus is called the Son of Man, and that he is. But he is also the Son of God… and he was raised from the dead and has changed to immortality, the firstborn from the dead. He now has all authority given to him in heaven and on earth. He listens to our prayers and does what we ask if it is in accordance to his will. He is more than just a mere man now Gene. Admit it.Kerwin,
No human being with the Spirit is a mere man.
So, in a way you are admitting Jesus is not a mere man. But we are not Jesus. He is the head of every man.
Nick……AND IF YOU WERE LISTENING YOU COULD HAVE EASLY UNSDERSTOOD, FACT IT, YOU HAVEN’T A CLUE WHAT JESUS TAUGHT ABOUT SPIRITS, OR AT LEAST YOU HAVE YET TO SAY IT. SO HOW CAN SOMEONE SO IGNORANT OF WHAT SPIRITS ARE AND DO MAKE ANY CLAIM OF KNOWING, YOU CAN BELIEVE SPURITS ARE IGNORANT AND LACK INTELLECT WHICH THEY CAN TRANSFER TO WHO EVER THEY ARE IN AS LONG AS YOU LIKE, BUT ACCORDIBG TO JESUS and SCRIPTURES THEY CAN CONTROL THE “MIND” OF A MAN AND THENSE HIM. THEY CAN RELATE INTELLEGENTLY TO OTHERS. Spirit is what controls a person, they are intellegent no matter what you think. They come in different types and kind and are clearly described that way in scriptures.
The only silly one here is you, that should be obvious to anyone who understands what spirits are and what they can do by changing and renewing our thinking our “MINDS” THENSE OUR THOUGHTS OUR INTELLECTS. ARE YOU SO IGNORANT YOU DON’T EVEN KNOW WHAT OUR MINDS ARE THAT THEY ARE THE SEAT OF OUR INTELLEGENCE. Your assumption of the word “spiritual meaning a man becoming a spirit “being” is false no scripture say that, your belief of JESUS BEING A SPIRIT BEING IS ALSO FALSE , AS WELL AS ANGELS BEING SPIRITS. Beliving that the seven spirits of GOD ARE ANGELS IS ANOTHER FALSE TEACHING OF YOUR ALSO. NO SCRIPTURE BACK YOU UP.
I don’t appricate being called silly expecially by the likes of you, an accuser of the brethern. You can only slander and accuse because of the spirit of the accuser working in you, and if that is not a type of “intellect” OF SPIRIT, i would like to know what it is then.
peace and love to you and yours. …………….gene
Miia……WE ALSO ARE CALLED SONS OD GOD, ANDWE ARE ALSO SON OF MAN, how does calling Jesus a son of God make him any different thenwe are?
Jesus is a prototype of us,we are called joint heirs with him, he has now all things under his feet , we aretold weshall alsobecrowned with glory and honor and “all” things willbe under our feet as well. It is there clearly written in the book OF HEBREWS , SO WHY DO YOU “SEPERATE YOURSELF FROM JESUS IDENITY AS A FELLOWHUMAN BEING?THE BIGGEST LIE EVER TOLD IS THAT JESUS WAS NOT A SIMPLY HUMAN BEING WHO GOD THE FATHER PERFECTED AND RAISED FROM THE DEAD TO ETERNAL LIFE. SATAN WANT’S TO DRIVE A WEDGE BETWEEN OUR EXACT IDENITY WITH JESUS, SO HE CREATED “THE DOCTRINE OF SEPERATION” that now works in those who do not love the truth and as a result, God has sent to them a deluding spirit in order for them to believe a “LIE”, and that lie is that JESUS WAS AND IS A GOD. 2 Ths 2.
Miia, you do not have to remain believing that LIE. REPENT AND LEARN TO SEE JESUS AS A MAN A HUMAN BEING , NOT A GOD, WHO GAVE HIMSELF FOR A SACRIFICE TO GOD FOR THE SINS OF HIS FELLOW HUMAN BROTHERS AND SISTERS . I TELL YOU Miia if you do not see Jesus this way you simply do not see the real Jesus. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ……………..gene
Miaa,
So, in a way you are admitting Jesus is not a mere man. But we are not Jesus. He is the head of every man.
Those that are fully mature are like both Jesus and God in true righteousness and holiness but they are not appointed emperor of all thing in heaven and on earth. Being emperor does not make him God.
It is not Jesus that gives us anything but rather as he says “whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.” (John 15:16 and John 16:23)
The only praying to Jesus in Scripture is Stephen but even that verse is translated differently by some. (Acts 7:59)
Acts 7:59Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.
He clearly spoke with him but there is no evidence he or anyone else prayed to him.
Miia,
It is an insult to call those that live mere men as you are accusing them of living by the flesh.
Nick,
Here is the passage that uses the term “mere me” so what do you think.
1 Corinthians 3:3New American Standard Bible (NASB)
3 for you are still fleshly. For since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking [a]like mere men?
Footnotes:1 Corinthians 3:3 Lit according to man
“SEPERATE YOURSELF FROM JESUS IDENITY AS A FELLOWHUMAN BEING?
GENE, I separate myself from Jesus’ identity because he is ABOVE US. WE PRAY TO HIM though you would not admit that even if it is clearly shown to you in scripture.
Don’t get me wrong – I view Jesus as a human just like us. But he is HIGHER THAN US.
SATAN WANT’S TO DRIVE A WEDGE BETWEEN OUR EXACT IDENITY WITH JESUS, SO HE CREATED “THE DOCTRINE OF SEPERATION” that now works in those who do not love the truth and as a result, God has sent to them a deluding spirit in order for them to believe a “LIE”, and that lie is that JESUS WAS AND IS A GOD. 2 Ths 2.
Rubbish!
He clearly spoke with him but there is no evidence he or anyone else prayed to him.
Kerwin,
What is talking to Jesus if not praying? He is in the spiritual realm.Hi Gene, I have heard your hypothesis on 2nd Thessalonians 2, but I believe (you are wrong).
2Thes.2
[1] Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our assembling to meet him, we beg you, brethren,
[2] not to be quickly shaken in mind or excited, either by spirit or by word, or by letter purporting to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.
[3] Let no one deceive you in any way; for that day will not come, unlessthe rebellion
comes first, and the man (not singular in the Greek) of lawlessness is revealed, the son of perdition,
[4] who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God.
[5] Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you this?
[6] And you know what is restraining him now so that he may be revealed in his time.
[7] For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way.
[8] And then the lawless one will be revealed, and the Lord Jesus will slay him with the breath of his mouth and destroy him by his appearing and his coming.
[9] The coming of the lawless one by the activity of Satan will be with all power and with pretended signs and wonders,
[10] and with all wicked deception for those who are to perish, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
[11] Therefore God sends upon them a strong delusion, to make them believe what is false,
[12] so that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.[13] But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.
[14] To this he called you through our gospel, so that you may obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
[15] So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.[16] Now may our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father, who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace,
[17] comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.Emphasis my own.
If you look at the Greek: MAN is lawless mankind as a whole (rather than a singular “man of sin”) I believe.
Miia,
Kerwin,
What is talking to Jesus if not praying? He is in the spiritual realm.He is in heaven which is a physical and spiritual realm just like earth but not subject to corruption. It is one or more other planes of existence. Angels have a physical existence as they can both eat and be touched though God often hides them from sight and they have been given many amazing powers by God. We will be like them so they also have a spiritual existence and so are not equivalent to plants, which are living and only physical creatures.
There is no “spiritual realm” mentioned in Scripture but the idea of a place where the reign of God faces the reign of Satan but that is not a realm where any angels, human, beasts or even not corporeal spirits enter though they are within in by the fruits of the Spirit and works of the flesh and our battles against temptation are fought within it.
The Gnostics have influenced Christian thought and inserted there own non corporeal heaven into Scripture.
Jesus is in heaven, even the highest level but that does not mean his subjects do not have access to him. Our words can be carried to him by a angel or the Spirit itself. He is human so it is no different than writing to a very power ruler one earth. An angel or the Spirit will most likely stand in for him.
You can petition Jesus as one would any king but you need to realize he is not God but only the chief servant of God. He will then petition God for you. If you pray to God in the name of Christ the same thing occurs.
If your words are an act of worship and not just a conversation between you and the emperor of all things in heaven and on earth then address it to God.
Nick…..Does not GOD INDWELL YOU AND ARE YOU NOT STILL A MAN? GOD INDWELLING AN HUMAN BEING DOES NOT CHNGE HIM FROM NOT STILL BEING A HUMAN BING. “GOD WAS IN THE MAN JESUS RECONCILING THE WORLD UNTO HIMSELF”. And again, “WE HAVE “ONE” GOD AND “ONE” MEDIATOR BETWEEN THAT “ONE” GOD AND “MAN”, “THE MAN” JESUS CHRIST.” And again Jesus said “when the “SON OF MAN RETURNS” will he find faith on the earth.” So JESUS sure though he would still be a man.
It seems you simply want to argue with what ever is said here, but give no scripture support for your own, show us a scripture that says JESUS IS NOT STILL A MAN.
peace and love to you and yours. ……………….gene
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