Upon this rock, Jesus Christ built his Church

This topic contains 756 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  t8 5 months, 1 week ago.

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  • #800194
     942767 
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    Hi David:

    T8 has quoted many scriptures showing you that the “Trinity doctrine” is not scriptural, but if scripture will not convince you of your error then I doubt if I quoted others it would make any difference, since you like most Trinitarians are never going to admit that they have misunderstood the scriptures, but I have noticed that you never quote scriptures when you insist that you are right and that we who do not believe that doctrine are in error, and so, if you want to convince me that the “Trinity doctrine” is an orthodox doctrine, please quote the scriptures to support your allegation.  If I have misunderstood the scriptures, I want to be corrected.  I do not want to teach anything that God did not say.

    When Jesus was tempted in the wilderness by the devil, he replied with:

    “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God”

    And so, if it is not written, God did not say it, and if He did not say it I for one will never believe any doctrine that is not supported by scripture.

    Love in Christ,
    Marty

     

    #800251
     dL 
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    “And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but My Father which is in heaven. And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.” – Matthew 16:17-18

    You will never be able to see Scripture in a clear light while you continue to use it as a means of supporting and propagating your own pre-conceived ideas..period.

    True faith is built upon the revelation God gives through His Word – not the dead and deceitful interpretations of men, who seek to use truth as a means of promoting their own cult teachings..

    Consider the information you present on this site (to confound belief in the triune nature of God) – is it the teaching of flesh and blood..? or the inspired revelation that comes from the Father…??

    You prove time after time that it is nothing but the dead product of your own carnal reasoning…

    While the triune nature of God is clear to all Spirit-filled believers as the perfect Spirit-breathed truth of God Himself..

    But because of logical conclusions drawn from the study of dead creeds (and carefully selected verses) – you now have your own dead creed..

    That foolishly attempts to deny the actual revelation and reality of God..

    Which He Himself has revealed through His Living Word.

    #800252
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    So is trinity a revelation from the Word?

    It is not written anywhere.

     

    So do you not have TRUE FAITH?

    #800253
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    “While the triune nature of God is clear to all Spirit-filled believers as the perfect Spirit-breathed truth of God Himself”

    I know you claim to be Spirit led

    but who gave you authority to speak for others?

    At best you may speak for yourself but you seem to be a lone voice of rebellion.

     

    #800254
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    At best the trinity idea is based on supposed inferences that knitted together could lead the immature to their conclusion.

    It that the sort of rock you think the church is based on?

    #800255
     dL 
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    t8

    And this is life eternal, that they might know Thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent.” – John 17:3

    We all know that this is the selected verse you take to support and defend your contrived argument against the Trinity…

    Selected… because you do not compare it against other verses that clearly show His Deity..

    Like Jesus’ own statement – “Before Abraham was born, I AM.”

    or Hebrews, which declares – “But unto the Son He saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of Thy kingdom.”

    But instead you do want is typical of cult teaching – deny all verses that don’t happen to line up with your own specific interpretation..

    In quoting John 17:3  you ignore the context of it and use it as an overall base for your own selective doctrine..

    Scripture tells us that Jesus came from a place of Oneness and equality with the Father..

    Not to present Himself in His Deity

    But to become a man

    THIS is the context and setting for His prayer, in which He (as a man) defines the Father as the only true God..!!

    But even in this chosen verse, which you’ve construed for your own purpose..

    We clearly see the very thing you attempt to deny – the Oneness of Jesus with God – as God…!!!

    Is eternal life found in the Father alone..?

    Or in Father and Son together…??

    The simple truth is that you cannot have the Father alone without the Son or the Holy Spirit..!!!

    The Three are united as One – in what Scripture reveals as the ‘Godhead’

    Or what we know today as THE TRINITY.

     

    #800262
     NickHassan 
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    Hi Davidl,

    Your cult is based on ignorance and the attempts of men to try to develop ideas to surmount it.

    Having only natural minds they cannot grasp spiritual matters .

    #800263
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    You would need to add continual layers of contextual explanations if you just accept what YOU said

    -that the trinity idea sprang from men trying to oppose error

    -and go back to the divine source of truth.

    Thy word is truth.

    #800269
     dL 
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    You would need to add continual layers of contextual explanations if you just accept what YOU said

    No – but as YOU prove, you must add continual layers of carnal explanations if you deny what the Holy Spirit reveals.

    #800270
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    No need to continual doctrinal justifications if you just listen to the words of Jesus Christ.

    ”I go to my Father and your Father, my God and your God”

    simple

    #800277
     kerwin 
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    DavidL,

    Who or what is the rock the out assembly of Christ is based on?

    #800278
     kerwin 
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    Nick,

    Hi davidl,

    No need to continual doctrinal justifications if you just listen to the words of Jesus Christ.

    ”I go to my Father and your Father, my God and your God”

    simple

    David does not believe that and does not bother to attempt to use the “reasoning” that many Trinitarians use for not believing Jesus’ words.

    #800287
     dL 
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    You take certain verses that on there own make you think they deny the Deity of Christ – when in fact they simply don’t. The problem is with your understanding, which is obvious when you’re born again – but to the carnally minded..you think you see the whole picture, when in reality all you see is the tiny walls of the theological rut you’ve dug yourself into.

    #800292
     NickHassan 
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    Hi Davidl,

    For us there is one God

    For you-two or three?

    #800308
     dL 
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    Yawn…..yawn..

    Do you not yet know the Father and the Son
    in the One Holy Spirit?

    #800313
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    So two in one and not three?

    #800317
     942767 
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    Hi DavidL:

    Well, your allegation that the scriptures reveal that  God is triune in nature and that the “Trinity doctrine”  correct is simply not true.  I also am a Spirit filled believer, and have been studying the scriptures since 1980, and God has spoken to me in many ways since then, and has corrected me on several occasions,  and I have yet to see this revelation, and every morning as part of my routine prayer, I ask God to correct me if I am teaching anything that is not His Word or doing anything that is not His will.  He has not shown me that I am wrong in not believing your doctrine,

    Yes, God called the Son, God, but he also called the judges gods, not saying that our Lord is not greater that the judges.  We know that without his sacrifice, none of us would be Spirit filled believers.  Nevertheless, the scriptures state that he is a man, the last Adam, and we also are being conformed to his image.  He is the “express image of God’s person”, (Hebrews 1), image of not God’s person,  not God Himself also.   In other words, we have seen God’s character manifest through Jesus’  life of obedience to God our Father.  He said in John 14 that we who have seen him have seen the Father, but he stated that it was God doing the works through Him.  He obeyed God’s Word without sin even unto death on the cross.  Indeed he is “one with the Father, and we also if we are in him and obeying God’s  Word.

    This is what John 17 states in the following verses: Jesus prayed to God:

    20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

    21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

    22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

    23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

    And so, these scriptures show that we are “one in the spirit”. The scriptures also state that God is a spirit and that God is love. We have become that “last Adam through the Word of the Living God”.

    But enough is enough, you and the rest of so called Orthodox Christianity will be responsible to God for what you teach. John 12, these are the Words of our Lord to you and me, and to all.

    48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: THE WORD THAT I HAVE SPOKEN, the same shall judge him in the last day.

    49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.

    50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.
     

    #800321
     NickHassan 
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    Hi davidl,

    You admit having TWO DEITIES but cannot bring yourself to say you have THREE.

    What will your masters think?

    #800323
     942767 
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    Hi DavilL:

    As to the question relative to “on what rock was Jesus speaking that his church was to be founded”?

    Take a look at the following scriptures for your answer:

    Matthew 7:

    Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

    23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

    24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

    25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

    #800328
     dL 
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    The Three are One in Unity…Tri-Unity
    You simply cannot have the Father without the Son or the Holy Spirit..period.

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