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Gene,
The parable of the rich man’s message was that there was those that would not even believe the truth if Jesus was raised from the death, much less if a ghost of a man suffering in Sheol was to tell them. The message was also hidden from his disciples until later as they seem to have no idea that he would sacrifice himself to rescue the world from sin. After the fact they understood it.
The background is two men that rested with their fathers in Sheol. It is old concept that is testified earlier in Scripture when kings are said to rest with their fathers but not be buried with them.
Kerwin…..if you believe people are still alive after they die, then how does this scriptue fit your beliefs. You have never answered this.
Psa 146:4…..HIS BREATH GO FORTH, HE RETURNS TO HIS EARTH, IN THAT DAY, HIS “THOUGHTS” PERISH. Now tell us how a soul is still alive and still thinking after he or she dies If his thought “PARISH”
Ecc 3:18……I said in my heart cncerning the estate of the sons of men, that GOD MIGHT MANIFEST them, and that they might see that they themselves ARE “BEASTS”.19, BECAUSE THAT WHICH BEFALLS THE SONS OF MEN BEFALLS BEASTS; EVEN ONE THING BEFALLS THEM: as one dies SO DIES THE OTHER; yea the have all ONE BREATH; so that a man has “NO” PREEMINENCE ABOVE A BEAST: BECAUSE “ALL” IS VANITY.20, ALL GO UNTO ONE PLACE; ALL ARE FROM THE DUST, AND ALL RETURN TO DUST AGAIN. WHO KNOWS THE SPIRIT OF MAN GOES UPWARD , AND THE SPIRIT OF THE BEAST GOES DOWNWARD TO THE EARTH?
Job 4:20……THEY ARE DESTORYED FROM MORNING TO EVENING: THEY “PARISH” FOREVER WITHOUT REGUARDING IT. 21, DO NOT THEIR EXCELLENCY WHICH IS IN THEM GO AWAY? THEY DIE EVEN WITHOUT WISDOM.
JOB 34:14-15…. IF HE SET HIS HEART UPON MAN, IF HE GATHER UNTO HIMSELF “HIS SPIRIT” AND “HIS BREATH”; 15, “ALL FLESH” SHALL “PARISH” TOGETHER, AND MAN SHALL TURN AGAIN UNTO “DUST”.
Where is a contined existing soul mentioned there infact the word soul is not even mentioned seperately there, why?, because all those thing together are what makes up a “living soul”, a living human being Is a living and a dead human being is a dead soul.
How does that fit you still alive and still thinking in the grave senerio fit?
Here is a answer to the parable of the rich man and poor man, it is written in psm 49:1-20 read it and see how it fits.
Kerwin, that parable does not even say if the rich man was any more a sinner then the poor man was, it is simply about the amount of suffering experience in this life, one suffered more and then will suffer less, while the other suffered less and then suffers more in the future. That parable has nothing to do with who is a better person or more of a sinner. It just relates to us, that suffering is needfull in our existence, now or in the future, further more, the word “SOUL” IS NOT EVEN MENTIONED THERE, YOU ARE ADDING THAT, because you believe a person soul is still alive after he dies, a presuposed position you have never proven yet from any scripture to me.
Show us a single scripture that specifically say a man is still alive after he dies, or his soul aart from his body is still alive after death. You have not posted any so far that says that. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ………….gene
Nick…..How about salt mixed with the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, is that palatable enough For you?
peace and love to you and yours. ………….gene
Nick…… HOW DOES YOUR WORD RATE, SEENING YOU SAY “MY” WORDS, even though i quote scriptures word for word, which means they are not “my” words at all. I believe it is your words you produce without scripture support that is comming from the accusitory spirit working in you, is what you should be more worried about, instead of going around serving it’s influence. Mouthing off saying things derogatory toward me and not producing any scriptural support only shows your true arrogant nature.
Look i don’t mind being proven wrong,but just saying i am and producing notany scripture support fo saying that, and not acknowledging scripture i post only show us you haven’t a clue what you are saying, or yoy would have some scripture support. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ……………..gene
Hi GB,
Imagine if everyone decided they were being taught by God and then proceeded to teach from their vain imaginations.
mystery babylon
Gene,
Just because you quote a passage of the Writings does not mean the conclusions you draw from the passage is correct. If Nick does not agree with you then anything anything argument you base on it will be flawed according to that belief. The same is true with any reasonable persons.
Gene,
For example I do not agree with the conclusion you draw from Genesis 2:7 that the human soul is the sum of the human body being combined with the breath of God. Instead I believe the new human soul comes into existence when the human body and the breath of God combine. I then point out that other passages of the Writings disagree with your conclusion but they do not disagree with mine.
Kerwin…….THEM PRODUCE THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAY THAT, I PRODUCE THAT GIVES ME MY UNDERSTANDING, WHY NOT PRODUCE A SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WHAT YOU ARE SAYING. If SCRIPTURE SAYS GOD TOOK DUST AND MADE A MAN AND BREATH INTO HIM THE BREATH INTO HIS NOSTRILS THE BREATH OF LIFE AND “THEN THE “MAN” BECAME A “LIVING” SOUL. NOW WHEN IT SAY “MAN” THAT HAS TO MEAN THE “COMPLETE” BEING, NOT JUST PART OF HIM RIGHT?
Thats like Nick, saying the seven spirits of GOD are seven angels, and i guess he believes these seven angels are in the Lamb of GOD somehow ALSO. He accuse others of being false teachers, but he is even worse then those he gose about accusing, he comes off as a wannabe teacher, but lacks true understanding of scriptures, he accuses but produces not scripture support for his accusations just trash talk from his accusitory spirit working in him. We are told to reject unreasonable men, you can never come to any accord with such. IMO
Look kerwin, you can disagree with me all you want i have no problem with that , i know i do not have “all” knowledge and understanding at this time and probably will never have it all, i just do the best i can with what i understand scriptures to say. All i ask you or anyone else is to post SPECIFIC scripturial support for what they are saying. I try to post scriptures that agree with what i understand them to say. Nick goes beyond disagreement, he not only lies about what people say, he proceeds with character assassination also. He is not here to edify anyone but himself. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ………………..gene
Hi GB,
You wish to know whether you are being taught by God?
If you are you will see in your teaching the same consistency God has always shown in His Word.
If you see new concepts such as spirit is intellect your teacher is not God.
Hi GB,
Since your teachings do not come from scripture , do not align with scripture and are inconsistent with scripture then you can be sure that they are not of the Spirit of God.
Then which source drives you to boldly offer these ideas in competition with the Holy Spirit?
They are novel, unique and bizarre.
Could they be from a GNOSTIC source?
Nick……..THE WORD GNOSTIC IS NOT A BAD WORD, as you assume, it’s what that group taught about JESUS BEING A GOD, Preexisting and comming from the pelora of GODS THAT WAS WRONG. HAVE YOU EVER HEARD ME SAY ANY OF THAT. AGAIN YOUR FALSE ACCUSITORY SPIRIT SURFACES. Do me a favor go look up the GREEK WORD “UNDERTANDING”, and post it here for us all to see. I have already posted the complete scripture with the GREEK meaning of the word. Tell US “O” WISE ONE, IF IT DONSN’T SAY “CONCRETELY”; INTELLECT ?
YOUR FALSE BELIEF THAT GOD’S SPIRITS IS NOT HIS INTELLECT HE GIVES US ONLY SHOWS YOUR LACK OF THE TRUTH YOURSELF. What do you think the spirit of truth is, it gives us the “intellect” to “percieve” the truth.
WHAT DO YOU THINK JESUS MEANT WHEN HE SAID “KNOW YOU NOT THAT YOU SHALL ALL BE TAGHT BY GOD”. BEING TAUGHT IS THE TRANSFERANCE OF ONES INTELLECT TO ANOTHER THAT IS WHAT ALL TREACHER DO. God the Father renews our minds and that is changing our thinking, which is the way we see thing, which is our renewed intellects
You cannot seperate intellegence from the SPIRIT OF GOD, THAT IS THE SAMETHING AS SAYING GOD IS STUPID AND HAS NO UNDERSTANDING. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours. ………….gene
Gene,
.THEM PRODUCE THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAY THAT, I PRODUCE THAT GIVES ME MY UNDERSTANDING, WHY NOT PRODUCE A SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WHAT YOU ARE SAYING.
Genesis 2:7 states what I am saying but it is vague enough that it also supports what you are claiming. I have used other passages to point out your flaw but you do not believe they do. I do not see much use of going over them again as you take your own word as the word of God. I have determined that by several different conversations I have had with you. You already know that Scripture declares that Rachel’s soul was departing her body as she lay dying. If just reading that one passage does not convince you that your teaching is a deception then I cannot think of anything I can do that will convince you.
If SCRIPTURE SAYS GOD TOOK DUST AND MADE A MAN AND BREATH INTO HIM THE BREATH INTO HIS NOSTRILS THE BREATH OF LIFE AND “THEN THE “MAN” BECAME A “LIVING” SOUL. NOW WHEN IT SAY “MAN” THAT HAS TO MEAN THE “COMPLETE” BEING, NOT JUST PART OF HIM RIGHT?
The passage tells us that man existed before God gave him the gift of the breath of life. He was a man made of earth.
As an aside, I now see where it is possible that man was a non-living soul before God breathed life into him. I can even see where other passages might hint at that. It seems like a complicated possibility so I am avoiding it unless more support comes along.
Returning to the main conversation, the bottom line is that the soul is departing as a person is dying and consciousness is fading. It does not stop existing but instead goes somewhere. Scripture teaches us it goes to Sheol and lies with its ancestors.
Gene,
YOUR FALSE BELIEF THAT GOD’S SPIRITS IS NOT HIS INTELLECT HE GIVES US ONLY SHOWS YOUR LACK OF THE TRUTH YOURSELF. What do you think the spirit of truth is, it gives us the “intellect” to “percieve” the truth.
Here is another example when you make your words the word of God and refuse to back of them no matter how irrational the words are.
I have no idea what you believe intellect means but it does not fit the Spirit of God which is the hand of God and not his brain. He uses his own Spirit as an agent to do his works just like we use our hands and feet and other parts of our bodies to do the work assigned to it by our brain.
I know you started this mistaken idea from the words ” The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life” (John 6:63) and then went on a wild goose chase by based on the premise that a person’s intellect is in their words. I assure you that my intellect is from my soul with my brain as the tool it uses to reveal itself to the world. The closest sound premise to the unsound one you chose to us is that is that my thoughts conceive and give birth to my words.
You words are “What do you think the spirit of truth is, it gives us the “intellect” to “percieve” the truth” which is speaking of needing intelligence to perceive the truth while Scripture teach use we need a spiritual, aka godly, mindset and viewpoint to perceive the truth.
Even then, I do not claim God Spirit is his viewpoint and his mindset because I know those are fruits of his Spirit and there are other fruits as well.
You need more practice in not touching those things that are unclean.
Kerwin……You frst need to understand what a soul really is, before you start to expound on it IMO.
You may not truly believe what JESUS “CLEARLY” SAID, WHEN HE SAID, THE WORDS HE WAS SPEAKING TO US “ARE” LIFE “AND” “ARE” SPIRIT. I realize you do not truly UNDERSTAND “ARE”, or you would understand what i was saying . Words “ARE” thoughts written down or spoken, they EXPRESS WHAT WE THINK AND WHAT WE THINK IS WHO WE “ARE” ,(so a man thinks so he is) WORDS THAT COME OUT FROM US “ARE” EXPRESSIONS OF THE SPIRIT LIFE WHO WE “ARE”. SO YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT A WORD IS FIRST AND SEE IT IS LIFE AND SPIRIT. OR YOU CAN JUST BELIEVE WHAT JESUS SAID.
Just as spirit “is” life, life “is” spirit, WORDS ARE EXPRESSIONS OF OUR SPECIFIC “INTELLECTS” WHICH “ARE” SPIRIT AND “ARE” LIFE THAT IS “IN” OUR BODIES.
KERWIN LOOK UP THE WORD “ARE” AND SEE WHAT YOU COME UP WITH, AND THEN APPLY THAT TO WHAT JESUS SAID.
peace and love to you and yours. ………………..gene
Hi GB
Kerwin……You frst need to understand what a soul really is, before you start to expound on it IMO.
You may not truly believe what JESUS “CLEARLY” SAID, WHEN HE SAID, THE WORDS HE WAS SPEAKING TO US “ARE” LIFE “AND” “ARE” SPIRIT. I realize you do not truly UNDERSTAND “ARE”, or you would understand what i was saying . Words “ARE” thoughts written down or spoken, they EXPRESS WHAT WE THINK AND WHAT WE THINK IS WHO WE “ARE” ,
{HE WAS SPEAKING OF HIS OWN SPIRIT FILLED WORDS BUT YOU APPLY THIS TO ALL MEN=FALSE ASSUMPTION
}(so a man thinks so he is[MAN’S IDEA]
) WORDS THAT COME OUT FROM US “ARE” EXPRESSIONS OF THE SPIRIT LIFE WHO WE “ARE”. SO YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT A WORD IS FIRST AND SEE IT IS LIFE AND SPIRIT. OR YOU CAN JUST BELIEVE WHAT JESUS SAID.
{SAME FALSE ASSUMPTION]
Just as spirit “is” life, life “is” spirit, WORDS ARE EXPRESSIONS OF OUR SPECIFIC “INTELLECTS” WHICH “ARE” SPIRIT AND “ARE” LIFE THAT IS “IN” OUR BODIES.
[YOUR OWN OPINION]
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