- This topic has 18,301 replies, 269 voices, and was last updated 1 year, 5 months ago by
.
- Posts
martian……Amen brother……Jesus only preexisted in the (PLAN) and Will of God, untill he was actually born. Peter said it plainly he was ordained before the world, (BUT) was manifested in our time. Preexistenest and Trinitarians are all in the same boat, there beliefs support each others theology.
peace to you and yours……….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 29 2008,02:51) martian……Amen brother……Jesus only preexisted in the (PLAN) and Will of God, untill he was actually born. Peter said it plainly he was ordained before the world, (BUT) was manifested in our time. Preexistenest and Trinitarians are all in the same boat, there beliefs support each others theology. peace to you and yours……….gene
Yes — That plan and will or as I like to say “the motives and intentions of God” was expertly described by John in the first chapter of his gospel. the logos is the blueprint and Jesus is the completed building. He is the temple to house the presence/spirit of God. We too are temples ordained unto the same purpose.Quote (martian @ Feb. 29 2008,01:37) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 28 2008,12:10) Hi martian,
Christ Human? yes.
No we receive the gift of life through the first Adam.
So you are saying that Christ and the rest of humanity ar different?
I know you will say that Christ is completely human. this is the same illogical answer given by those that believe in the dual nature of Christ.To this point I have seen no one willing to step up and tell me what form did Christ take in His preexistance? Was He conscious and an animated being? Was He aware of what was gong on around him? Did He build memories of that time? What happened to those experiances and memories when He was born of Mary. Did some little green men from Mars wipe His memory?
Yu have yet to tell me what purpose it serves to have Jesus preexist. I suspect it is because you needed to make up something to cover the tracks of your othr mess of original sin theory. One lie covering another.You banter around the word “function” as a punch line because you have not a clue as to the reality of good teaching. You actually think that all this “knowledge” in your cranium really makes the difference in your walk. Without experiancial understanding and without a living functional gospel you are just a computer bank. God judges by the heart and not the head. To you teaching/doctrine is more of a debate subject then a real working gospel that changes lives. You think that because you have figured out something in your head (right or wrong) that you have somehow attained it. Because of this you miss out.
Hi Martian,
Was the child in the manger an educated being , aware of his history?
No he was just like all of us, helpless, at square one, and with no knowledge or advantage.
He spoke of the detail his origins only after his anointing at the Jordan.
He was in the form of God before he was sent as Phil 2 tells us. He was the monogenes son who was sent into the world, a world made through him.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 29 2008,05:32) Quote (martian @ Feb. 29 2008,01:37) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 28 2008,12:10) Hi martian,
Christ Human? yes.
No we receive the gift of life through the first Adam.
So you are saying that Christ and the rest of humanity ar different?
I know you will say that Christ is completely human. this is the same illogical answer given by those that believe in the dual nature of Christ.To this point I have seen no one willing to step up and tell me what form did Christ take in His preexistance? Was He conscious and an animated being? Was He aware of what was gong on around him? Did He build memories of that time? What happened to those experiances and memories when He was born of Mary. Did some little green men from Mars wipe His memory?
Yu have yet to tell me what purpose it serves to have Jesus preexist. I suspect it is because you needed to make up something to cover the tracks of your othr mess of original sin theory. One lie covering another.You banter around the word “function” as a punch line because you have not a clue as to the reality of good teaching. You actually think that all this “knowledge” in your cranium really makes the difference in your walk. Without experiancial understanding and without a living functional gospel you are just a computer bank. God judges by the heart and not the head. To you teaching/doctrine is more of a debate subject then a real working gospel that changes lives. You think that because you have figured out something in your head (right or wrong) that you have somehow attained it. Because of this you miss out.
Hi Martian,
Was the child in the manger an educated being , aware of his history?
No he was just like all of us, helpless, at square one, and with no knowledge or advantage.
He spoke of the detail his origins only after his anointing at the Jordan.
He was in the form of God before he was sent as Phil 2 tells us. He was the monogenes son who was sent into the world, a world made through him.
Quit dodging the questions. What happened to the existance of Jesus before He was born. What ws the form of God that he lived in?I have alreay explained Phil 2. Get over it.
Hi Martian,
He was in the form of God.
The firstborn son among the other sons of God before the world was created.Hi martian,
God was not alone when earth and man were formed.
Genesis is a late addition to the works of God.
God's heavenly kingdom was already established.Ps 89
Psalm 89
1I will sing of the mercies of the LORD for ever: with my mouth will I make known thy faithfulness to all generations.2For I have said, Mercy shall be built up for ever: thy faithfulness shalt thou establish in the very heavens.
3I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant,
4Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations. Selah.
5And the heavens shall praise thy wonders, O LORD: thy faithfulness also in the congregation of the saints.
6For who in the heaven can be compared unto the LORD? who among the sons of the mighty can be likened unto the LORD?
7God is greatly to be feared in the assembly of the saints, and to be had in reverence of all them that are about him.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 29 2008,07:29) Hi Martian,
He was in the form of God.
The firstborn son among the other sons of God before the world was created.
What does that mean. Not some abstract philosophy but in reality.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 29 2008,07:45) Hi martian,
God was not alone when earth and man were formed.
Genesis is a late addition to the works of God.
God's heavenly kingdom was already established.Ps 89
Psalm 89
1I will sing of the mercies of the LORD for ever: with my mouth will I make known thy faithfulness to all generations.2For I have said, Mercy shall be built up for ever: thy faithfulness shalt thou establish in the very heavens.
3I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant,
4Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations. Selah.
5And the heavens shall praise thy wonders, O LORD: thy faithfulness also in the congregation of the saints.
6For who in the heaven can be compared unto the LORD? who among the sons of the mighty can be likened unto the LORD?
7God is greatly to be feared in the assembly of the saints, and to be had in reverence of all them that are about him.
What does this verse have to do with anything?
I want to konw what made up Christ befoer He was born to Mary. Was He a conscious being. Did He have the ability to think, to remember, to interact with the world around him?Stop avoiding the question.
Hi martian,
We worship one God, The Father.
But Scripture calls other heavenly beings gods.They are the sons spoken of in Ps 89
Psalm 82:1
God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.Psalm 86:8
Among the gods there is none like unto thee, O Lord; neither are there any works like unto thy works.Psalm 95:3
For the LORD is a great God, and a great King above all gods.Psalm 96:4
For the LORD is great, and greatly to be praised: he is to be feared above all gods.Psalm 97:7
Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.Psalm 97:9
For thou, LORD, art high above all the earth: thou art exalted far above all gods.Psalm 135:5
For I know that the LORD is great, and that our Lord is above all gods.Psalm 136:2
O give thanks unto the God of gods: for his mercy endureth for ever.Psalm 138:1
I will praise thee with my whole heart: before the gods will I sing praise unto thee.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 29 2008,08:39) Hi martian,
We worship one God, The Father.
But Scripture calls other heavenly beings gods.They are the sons spoken of in Ps 89
Psalm 82:1
God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.Psalm 86:8
Among the gods there is none like unto thee, O Lord; neither are there any works like unto thy works.Psalm 95:3
For the LORD is a great God, and a great King above all gods.Psalm 96:4
For the LORD is great, and greatly to be praised: he is to be feared above all gods.Psalm 97:7
Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.Psalm 97:9
For thou, LORD, art high above all the earth: thou art exalted far above all gods.Psalm 135:5
For I know that the LORD is great, and that our Lord is above all gods.Psalm 136:2
O give thanks unto the God of gods: for his mercy endureth for ever.Psalm 138:1
I will praise thee with my whole heart: before the gods will I sing praise unto thee.
None of these scriptures clearly say tht Christ was among the “holy ones” in heaven. That is your assumption based on a preconcieved ideas of doctrine. You are using the same tactics the Trinitarians use to prove their doctrine.You have also refused to answer the question. What was Christ like prior to his birth to Mary. Was He conscious of his surroundings and able to be a thinking creature? Did he build memories of that time? You say Christ was just like us afer his conception, what happened to those things having to do with Christ prior to his conception.
martian……..Nick or anyone else cant answer you because they doin't know, it's like you say it's their assumptions based on a preconcieved idology. Preexistinest and Trinitarians are in the same boat and used the same unprovable teachings.
IMO….peace to you and yours………gene
Hi martian,
He was man, just like us.
No infant has any memories and he was no different.
In heaven he was the likeness of God, a spirit being, the firstborn of the sons of God.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 01 2008,05:19) Hi martian,
He was man, just like us.
No infant has any memories and he was no different.
In heaven he was the likeness of God, a spirit being, the firstborn of the sons of God.
So this likeness of God, This spirit being, this firstborn of the sons of God was not a conscious being? He was not alive? Did H give up his being to be born on Earth? You are still avoiding the question. If you cannot anser the question then I will categorize you with the Trinitarians whoes Christ is a mystery and unknowable.NOW STOP STOP STOP GIVNG ME PLATITUDES AND ANSWER THE QUESTION. WAS JESUS ALIVE BEFORE HIS BIRTH ON EARTH AND WHAT HAPPENED TO THAT LIFE UPON HIS BIRTH ON EARTH.
Quote Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 01 2008,05:19)
Hi martian,
He was man, just like us.
No infant has any memories and he was no different.
In heaven he was the likeness of God, a spirit being, the firstborn of the sons of God.So this likeness of God, This spirit being, this firstborn of the sons of God was not a conscious being? He was not alive? Did H give up his being to be born on Earth? You are still avoiding the question. If you cannot anser the question then I will categorize you with the Trinitarians whoes Christ is a mystery and unknowable.
NOW STOP STOP STOP GIVNG ME PLATITUDES AND ANSWER THE QUESTION. WAS JESUS ALIVE BEFORE HIS BIRTH ON EARTH AND WHAT HAPPENED TO THAT LIFE UPON HIS BIRTH ON EARTH.
Hi Martian;
John says that Jesus was in the world and the world was made by him so that pretty much states what his position was with God the Father. He was begotten before the foundation of the world because he was with the Father before the foundation of the world. He said he came not of his own “will” so he was a Son at the time he was sent because a Word alone does not have a “will”. He said he was returning to where he was before so if you do not believe that he pre-existed as the Son of God, your only alternative is to believe he does not exist now either, but is a spirit again or the Word, which the bible says is God. Read John
Quote (Mr. Steve @ Mar. 01 2008,10:34) Quote Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 01 2008,05:19)
Hi martian,
He was man, just like us.
No infant has any memories and he was no different.
In heaven he was the likeness of God, a spirit being, the firstborn of the sons of God.So this likeness of God, This spirit being, this firstborn of the sons of God was not a conscious being? He was not alive? Did H give up his being to be born on Earth? You are still avoiding the question. If you cannot anser the question then I will categorize you with the Trinitarians whoes Christ is a mystery and unknowable.
NOW STOP STOP STOP GIVNG ME PLATITUDES AND ANSWER THE QUESTION. WAS JESUS ALIVE BEFORE HIS BIRTH ON EARTH AND WHAT HAPPENED TO THAT LIFE UPON HIS BIRTH ON EARTH.
Hi Martian;
John says that Jesus was in the world and the world was made by him so that pretty much states what his position was with God the Father. He was begotten before the foundation of the world because he was with the Father before the foundation of the world. He said he came not of his own “will” so he was a Son at the time he was sent because a Word alone does not have a “will”. He said he was returning to where he was before so if you do not believe that he pre-existed as the Son of God, your only alternative is to believe he does not exist now either, but is a spirit again or the Word, which the bible says is God. Read John
Wrong interpretation of John. Try again.Mr. Steve…..> Who did come of their own Will. Were you born of your own will, And while a word alone doesen't have a will, it certainly came from a Will, and it is connected to the will of the person who spoke it.
IMO……gene
Quote (martian @ Mar. 01 2008,10:41) Quote (Mr. Steve @ Mar. 01 2008,10:34) Quote Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 01 2008,05:19)
Hi martian,
He was man, just like us.
No infant has any memories and he was no different.
In heaven he was the likeness of God, a spirit being, the firstborn of the sons of God.So this likeness of God, This spirit being, this firstborn of the sons of God was not a conscious being? He was not alive? Did H give up his being to be born on Earth? You are still avoiding the question. If you cannot anser the question then I will categorize you with the Trinitarians whoes Christ is a mystery and unknowable.
NOW STOP STOP STOP GIVNG ME PLATITUDES AND ANSWER THE QUESTION. WAS JESUS ALIVE BEFORE HIS BIRTH ON EARTH AND WHAT HAPPENED TO THAT LIFE UPON HIS BIRTH ON EARTH.
Hi Martian;
John says that Jesus was in the world and the world was made by him so that pretty much states what his position was with God the Father. He was begotten before the foundation of the world because he was with the Father before the foundation of the world. He said he came not of his own “will” so he was a Son at the time he was sent because a Word alone does not have a “will”. He said he was returning to where he was before so if you do not believe that he pre-existed as the Son of God, your only alternative is to believe he does not exist now either, but is a spirit again or the Word, which the bible says is God. Read John
Wrong interpretation of John. Try again.
Hi martian,
So you are the final arbiter of truth?
How is that functional for us?Some here do not have the Spirit of truth in them, if you all did, there would be no questions as to which of you is righteous in your doctrinal beliefs. Now, how many of you can say you sin no more since you have the belief of Jesus?
His followers do not sin on purpose, so that means they keep the law (guard the commands) follow Torah. They rest on the Sabbath which is the 4th command.
Laurel
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
