The Creations of Genesis 1 and John 1 Revised

This topic contains 224 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  Anthony 1 day, 16 hours ago.

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  • #844346
     Truthcomber 
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    Hi All,

     

    Does “seed” of man has to pertain to the flesh only. In the context of the whole bible, Romans 1:3 it doesn’t pertain to one definition flesh as some think does. Otherwise, all Christians would be physical descendants of David.

    https://biblehub.com/greek/4561.htm

    H4561.sark (flesh)
    NASB Translation
    bodily (1), bodily condition (1), body (2), earth (1), earthly (1), fellow countrymen (1), flesh (129), fleshly (4), life (3), man (1), mankind (1), nation (1), personally (1).

    As you can see, flesh can mean a spiritual condition of the body. Christ was fully God in his spirit mind and man in his human mind. That is why Christ could say:

    https://biblehub.com/interlinear/luke/17-21.htm
    Luke 17:21 (bible Hub) Nor will they say Behold here or There Behold for the kingdom ___ of God in the midst of you is.

    Romans 1:3 (NKJV) concerning His Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who 4 was born of the seed of David according to the flesh, 4 and declared to be the Son of God with power according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead.

    Me: Nowhere in the bible does it say that Christ was born of the seed of the holy spirit. Why? This is because God was fully in him from birth.

    2 Cor 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

    New American Standard Bible
    Isa 43:11 “I, even I, am the LORD, And there is no savior besides Me.

    Young’s Literal Translation
    John 1:14 And the Word became flesh, and did tabernacle among us, and we beheld his glory, glory as of an only begotten of a father, full of grace and truth.

    Me: The Word became one with flesh. As we obtain a regenerated spirit mind and thus have a mind of the holy spirit besides our human mind, God acquired a mind of the flesh. This fleshly mind bonded and grew as one with the holy mind of God himself.

    Matt 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

    #844494
     Truthcomber 
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    New American Standard Bible
    1 Cor 10:4 and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them; and the rock was Christ (G5547: the ANOINTED ONE).
    https://biblehub.com/greek/5547.htm

    2 Sam 22: For who is God, save YHWH? and who is a rock, save our God?
    Me: The Messiah was anointed to be our savior before he was born, not at Jordon.

    Young’s Literal Translation
    Luke 135 And the messenger answering said to her, ‘The Holy Spirit shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee, therefore also the holy-begotten thing shall be called Son of God;

    Me: God’s mind dwelt in Christ fully. The spirit aspect of his mind was the completely compatible with Father himself. CHRIST HAD THE HOLY SPIRIT IN HIM FROM BIRTH. To say that Christ had the holy spirit in him from Jordan is not biblical and is of another spirit. The human aspect of the mind of Christ is the Son of God of man. This aspect grew in its bond with the holy mind of God through the holy spirit (John 1:14).

    New American Standard Bible
    John 8:19 So they were saying to Him, “Where is Your Father?” Jesus answered, “You know neither Me nor My Father; if you knew Me, you would know My Father also.”

    Matt 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

    .John 1:27 He it is, who coming after me is preferred before me, whose shoe’s latchet I am not worthy to unloose.

    Me: So is Christ not greater than John?

    Luke 17:21 (Bible Hub) Nor will the say here or there for the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.

    Me: Christ was not born of woman the way we are. He was conceived in the womb of his mother Mary supernaturally by God himself. He is greater than John

    #844496
     Truthcomber 
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    Hi All,

    Psalm 139:7 Whither shall I go from thy SPIRIT? or whither shall I flee from thy presence? 8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there 9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.

    Matt 6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.

    Me: God is ONE PERSON.  He is mind and spirit. His mind is in heaven. His Spirit is omnipresent. He will reconcile all things to himself (Col 1:20).

    John 4:24 (NIV) God is SPIRIT, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.

    Me: Spirit is invisible and inaudible. His mind is in heaven. Yet he could be inside of the Messiah here on earth through the holy spirit.

    New American Standard Bible
    Gen 19:24 Then (YHWH) rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from (YHWH) out of heaven,

    Me: YWHW that executes the will of our heavenly father in heaven is the Word of God.

    NASB Translation
    account (7), account* (1), accounting (2), accounts (2), answer (1), appearance (1), complaint (1), exhortation* (1), have to do (1), instruction (1), length* (1), matter (4), matters (1), message (10), news (3), preaching (1), question (2), reason (2), reasonable (1), remark (1), report (1), said (1), say (1), saying (4), sayings (1),SPEAKER (1), speech (10), statement (18), story (1), talk (1), teaching (2), thing (2), things (1), utterance (2), what he says (1), what* (1), word (179), words (61).

    Psalm 33:6 By the word of YWHW were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth.

    John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

    Me: Christ is the EMBOIDEMENT  of all the words of God.

    Example of the word of God in the OT.
    1 Kings 12:22 But the word of God came unto Shemaiah the man of God, SAYING, 23 Speak unto Rehoboam, the son of Solomon, king of Judah, and unto all the house of Judah and Benjamin, and to the remnant of the people, saying, 24 Thus SAITH YHWH, Ye shall not go up, nor fight against your brethren the children of Israel: return every man to his house; for this thing is from me. They hearkened therefore to the word of the YHWH, and returned to depart, according to the word of the YHWH.

    Me: Notice that YHWH himself is the Word that SPOKE.

    Me: The father is strictly spirit that is audible and visible through his word that put on the TABERNACLE  of the Messiah.

    John 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

    Me: So did Father speak here in John 3:16-17. No one can approach or heard him or hath seen him.

    Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

    Me: It was an angel of God speaking for God as if the message came directly from our heavenly Father.

    New American Standard Bible
    John 5:37 “And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form.

    Me: The Father sent the Word of God that existed eternally with him and was before all creation. This same Word became one with flesh (John 1:14).

    Psalm 33:6 By the word of the YHWH were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth.

    Gen 1:3 And God SAID, Let there be light: and there was light…6 And God SAID, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters…9 And God SAID, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so…11 And God SAID, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so…

    #844497
     Truthcomber 
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    Hi All,

    Berean Literal Bible
    Romans 1:20 For from the creation of the world His invisible qualities, both His eternal power and divinity, are clearly seen, being understood by the things made, for them to be without excuse.

    1 John 1:1 (NASB) What was from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have seen with our eyes, what we have looked at and touched with our hands, concerning THE WORD of Life 2 and the life was manifested, and we have seen and testify and proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and was manifested to us— 3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ. 4 These things we write, so that our joy may be made complete.

    Me: We have seen and heard God through the tabernacle of the Word of God.

    Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

    1 Cor 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. 27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. 28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

    1 Tim 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; 16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man (one)hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

    Me: The Father is greater than the son, both are two different aspects of God.

    #844498
     Truthcomber 
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    Hi All,

    Prov 16:4YHWH hath made all things for himself

    Psalm 89:11 (NKJV) The heavens are Yours, the earth also is Yours; 12  The world and all its fullness, You have founded them.

    Me: God, created all things for himself

    Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created (1223: on account of Him) and for Him. 17 And He is before (4253:pre-eminence and in time) all things, and IN Him all things consist.:

    https://biblehub.com/greek/1223.htm
    through, on account of, because of

    https://biblehub.com/greek/4253.htm
    c. of superiority or pre-eminence (Winer’s Grammar, 372 (349)): πρό πάντων, above all things, James 5:12; 1 Peter 4:8.

    Me: Did God change his mind and thus had created all things for Christ and not himself?

    New American Standard Bible
    Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the (4416: pre-eminent) of all creation.
    4416 prōtótokos (from 4413 /prṓtos, “first, pre-eminent” and 5088 /tíktō, “bring forth”) – properly, first in time (Mt 1:25; Lk 2:7); hence, pre-eminent (Col 1:15; Rev 1:5).

    Me: Or did God know that he would take upon himself a visible image of himself of the seed of David. Was the Word of God the expression of the reality of God himself and thus God? Did God need to express himself before anyone or anything exist? Or did God have this ability at any time during his eternal existence? God expressed himself as the Word in a vision or dream, a burning bush, etc. but finally as the Messiah (John 1:18). The Word is the expressed image of his substance and spokesman of God.

    Col 2:9 (Bible Hub) For in him (Christ)  dwells the fullness of the deity bodily.

    Me: This is the image of the person of God or the Word of God in the Messiah.
    New American Standard Bible

     

    #844499
     Truthcomber 
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    John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

    Me: This passage proves that God came in the flesh, not that Christ is purely man. Christ was completely led by the holy spirit

    #844517
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Truthcomber ……God is a spirit, he is not flesh.   The spirit of God came into the flesh man Jesus, when he was anointed with the holy spirit at the Jordan river.   Scripture say’s spirit begets spirit, flesh beget flesh.  The sprit never became flesh.  IT CAME TO DWELL IN THE FLESH MAN JESUS. Just as Jesus said  “the father is “in” me,  and again the words I am telling you are “not” my words, but the words of him who sent me. 

    GOD’S spirt is also given to us and comes to be “in’ us also.  That is what Paul meant when he said , ” know you not that your “body” is the temple of the living GOD.  Jesus body was also the “temple” of the living God. And GOD SPOKE THROUGH HIM TO US,.  When Jesus said “destory this temple and in three days I (God) shall raise it up”. That was not Jesus saying that,  it was GOD THE FATHER, speaking first person through Jesus’ mouth. Why?,  because when Jesus was “dead” there was no way he could have raised himself up.  Scripture tell us that it was God who raised the man Jesus up from the grave. Jesus did raise himself up.

    Jesus is not a GOD, NOR A “ASPECT” of God either. Imo. He does speak God’s words to us,  but so did Moses and all the prophets speak God’s word to us. Non of them were God’s either. 

    Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene

     

     

     

     

    #844768
     Truthcomber 
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    Gene:

    The Word of God is the spokesman for God and speaks for his Father.  I never said Jesus is an aspect of God.  I said the Word of God became one with the seed or nature of David.  Our father said there is no salvation but through him.

    Christ said he is the resurrection.  You don’t seem to understand that.  Your lack of understanding and stupidity never seizes to amaze me.

     

    #844769
     Truthcomber 
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    Phil 2:0 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

    John 5:23 That all men should honour (5091. timaó) worship) the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
    5091. timaó:
    https://biblehub.com/greek/5091.htm

    2. to honor (so uniformly A. V.), to have in honor, to revere, venerate;…
    Christ is God in his heart and mind, not in his body.

    Heb 2:16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed (nature) of Abraham. We also take on the nature or seed of Abraham. David was of the nature or seed of Abraham.

    Rom1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh.

    Me: Christ was made of the human nature of David not of the body of David.

    Ezj 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

    Me: We receive the human nature of Christ when we are baptized of the spirit.

    Young’s Literal Translation

    Col 2:9 because in him doth tabernacle all the fulness of the Godhead bodily,

    Me: The Messiah is God spiritually—not of body.

    #844770
     Truthcomber 
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    Hi All,

    Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

    Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, (by which) all have sinned:

    Me: It is death in our bodies that causes us to sin. Ever notice how children are basically more honest than adults were death is more ominous. Death is the opposite of life as jointly righteousness is the opposite of unrighteousness.

    Gal 3:21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

    John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

    Me: Abundant life brings on Godly righteousness. We receive abundant life when we are born again and grow therefore.

    #844771
     Truthcomber 
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    Psalm 82:1 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children (1121. ben: sons) of the most High.

    Me: The Messiah declares his bodily divinity to be like the angels at this point.

    Comment: Jesus did not become the Son of God with power until after he was born completely of the spirit. This happened after his ascension into heaven.

    Heb 2 is compared to Psalms 8.

    “Heb 2:7 Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; …

    Comment: The Messiah is comparing himself with those in the divine council in Psalm 82:1. This is in the substance of his body being like that of an angel. Obviously he is not addressing the rest of mankind, is he? Are men made a little lower than angels–NO?

    Young’s Literal Translation
    Matt 17:2 and he was transfigured before them, and his face shone as the sun, and his garments did become white as the light,

    John 20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

    Me: The Messiah had a body not like ours as a human. He did not receive a body with sin and death in it. If he had, he would have sinned.
    Made like us in every way. This has to be made unto us in every way that we will be in the future.

    https://biblehub.com/interlinear/hebrews/2-17.htm

    Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

    John 3:2 Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. 3 And everyone who has this hope fixed on Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.

    Heb 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

    Me: Christ is not going to become like us so he can make propitiation for our sins. He is not going to become a sinner. Rather the opposite, he is a propitiation for our sins so we can become like him. READ IT in the Greek, not man’s interpretation.

    Young’s Literal Translation
    Gal 5:17 for the flesh doth desire contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit contrary to the flesh, and these are opposed one to another, that the things that ye may will — these ye may not do;

     

    #844772
     Truthcomber 
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    Hi All,

    Comment: This part of Heb 2 pertains to both the Messiah and mankind.

    Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

    New American Standard Bible
    Psalm 8:5 Yet You have made him a little lower than God (Elohim), And You crown him with glory and majesty!

    Psalm 8:5 (KJV) For thou hast made him a little lower than “Elohim”, and hast crowned him with glory and honour.
    “Elohim”:
    https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H430&t=KJV

    If it pertains to God, Elohim is singular, plural intensive. Glory and majesty pertains to the glorification of the Messiah, a little lower than God himself. The church and mankind will share in that Glory. So, eventually it will pertain to the church first and then to the rest of mankind,

    Yet it could pertain to angels if Elohim is plural in number. “a little lower than angels” has to pertain to the Messiah only. Men were not created a little lower than angels. I believe both dual meanings are correct depending on the context–not just the context of the paragraphs here but the whole bible.

    Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels (G32) for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

    Me: This verse was translated this way as angels (aggelos) and not God (theos) by Jews and for Jews in the Heb 2:7 thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:

    Heb 2:8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.
    Psalm 8:6 Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:7 All sheep and oxen, yea, and the beasts of the field; 8 The fowl of the air, and the fish of the sea, and whatsoever passeth through the paths of the seas. 9 O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth!

    Me This pertains to the Messiah first and then mankind.

     

    #844774
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Truthcomber. … Those scriptures are directed at mankind in a general sense “first”, and then they  CHANGE and address another individual  “man”,  Jesus, who has already , because of his “death” and “resection”, achieved, the glory and honor, and all thing put under his feet,  that is exactly what is in store for the rest of “mankind” also.

    Why is it that you people have such problems with simple and clearly written scriptures?  You don’t have to force the text to meet your personal arangments.   You inject so many  things into texts not even remotely implied by them, it doesn’t add anything,  it only destorts what being said by them. IMO

    Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene

    #844775
     Truthcomber 
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    Gene:

    It is you that doesn’t  understand scripture.  I have never encounter someone so grossly uninformed.  I showed you all the scriptures.  Christ was not made physically a man like us but spiritually of the seed or nature of David.  It is our bodies that have death in them that causes us to sin.  Christ did not sin.  Christ was the second Adam, not the second man Adam.  “Son of man” is different than “man” in Psalm 8.  Christ, the son of man,  was made a little lower than angels with a body similar to theirs here on earth, not man.  We become like the second Adam far above the angels in glory.  Gene, I have no respect for your “understanding” which is of a different spirit.  No one here subscribes to your heresy.

    John 5:23 That all men should honour (5091. timaó:  worship) the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
    5091. timaó:

     

     

    #844776
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Jesus said, it is not what goes (physically)  into a mans mouth ,  that defiles him, no it is what comes out of his mouth, his words are what defiles him,  not his physical food or make up.  Words are spirit, they are not physical bodies.  Of anykind.

    The spirit of God has power over the Body, to keep it from sinning m need proof? Jesus. 

    Jesus “clearly” said he was not a spirit, even after his body was resurected from the Grave,  need proof? Ask me and I will give it to you.  It is “clearly’ written. 

    We are also told this ,

    Rom 8:11……But if the spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the “dead” dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the “dead” shall also quicken  ( bring to life) “your” “mortal” “bodies,  by his spirit that dwells “in” you.

    Now tell us again “WHAT IS GOING TO BE “RESURECTED”.  IS IT NOT OUR PHYSICAL BODIES, JUST LIKE JESUS WAS RAISED IN.?  Heres another one  you can chew on,  Paul said this,  1 Cor 6:14,  know you not that your bodies are members of Christ? Verse 19 what know you not that that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, which is in you, which you have of God, and you are not your own, 20….For you are bought with a price; therefore glorify God in your “body” “and ” your spirit,  which are God’s . (God owns us) .

    Rom 8:23…..And not only they but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even  we ourselves groan within ourselvesm waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of “our body” 

    On and on it goes, but to what avail?,  “none”.

    Truthcomber see how you can twist those simple and clearly written scriptures up, I sure you can find  a away to. Tell us how they real don’t mean what they say.  OK.?

    Peace and love to you and yours. ……..gene

    #844778
     Truthcomber 
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    Gene:

     

    You: Jesus said, it is not what goes (physically) into a mans mouth , that defiles him, no it is what comes out of his mouth, his words are what defiles him, not his physical food or make up. Words are spirit, they are not physical bodies. Of anykind.

    Me: yes, I have always said words are spirit. But we all sin.

    You The spirit of God has power over the Body, to keep it from sinning m need proof? Jesus.
    :
    1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

    Me: Gene, I guess you are a liar.

    New American Standard Bible
    John 6:63 “It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.

    Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, (by which) all have sinned:

    Me: It is death in our bodies that causes us to sin. Death is the opposite of life. Death in us causes us to sin. The spirit of life from God causes righteousness.
    I have always said that God was mind and spirit. Both are invisible. God is invisible.

    1 Tim 1:17 Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.

    Me: God is mind and spirit. These are two different invisible components of the one God.

    Romans 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

    Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

    2 Tim 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

    Me: Mind and spirit are two different aspects that are invisible. These are two aspects of the one God. Duet 6:4 Hear, O Israel: YHWH our God is one YHWH:

    John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

    Me: The mind is greater than the spirit.

    John 14:28….I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

    #844779
     Truthcomber 
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    Gene:

    John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

    Me: “the Word was with God” shows that the Word or spirit was subservient to the mind of God.

    Psalm 33:6 By the word of the YHWH were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath (7307. ruach:spirit) of his mouth.
    https://biblehub.com/hebrew/7307.htm

    Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the SPIRIT of God moved upon the face of the waters. 3 And God SAID (the Word of God), Let there be light: and there was light….

    #844780
     Truthcomber 
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    Gene:

    You: Jesus “clearly” said he was not a spirit, even after his body was resurected from the Grave, need proof? Ask me and I will give it to you. It is “clearly’ written.

    Me:

    John 1:14 And the Word (spirit of God) was made (became one with) flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

    New American Standard Bible
    1 Cor 15:45 So also it is written, “The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL.” The last Adam became a life-giving SPIRIT.

    Me: The Word, spirit of God became one with the seed or nature of David of the seed (nature of Abraham). This is still spirit. At this point, the bonding of the seed of David is not complete until the Messiah’s glorification into heaven. Then he becomes a life giving spirit. We can be baptized into his death and resurrect with him into a new life.

    John 5;25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. 25 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

    Me: The Son is the Word of God completely bonded to the seed of David (mind, nature and heart). Thus, the resurrected and glorified Christ is the Word of God with the seed of David in it. The human mind of the Word (now Son) can give life now.

    Rev 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

    John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: 26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

    #844782
     Truthcomber 
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    Gene:

    You: We are also told this ,
    Rom 8:11……But if the spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the “dead” dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the “dead” shall also quicken ( bring to life) “your” “mortal” “bodies, by his spirit that dwells “in” you.

    You: Now tell us again “WHAT IS GOING TO BE “RESURECTED”. IS IT NOT OUR PHYSICAL BODIES, JUST LIKE JESUS WAS RAISED IN

    Me: This spirit is the Word of God as I have shown you.

    1 Cor 15:36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: 37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain (seed), it may chance of wheat, or of some other (seed of the holy spirit):

    1 Cor 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

    Me: Christ was the only one whose body did not perish.  His was a body made a little lower than angels.  It is now a glorified body made so much higher than the angels.

    We on the other hand, receive new bodies of the holy spirit made in the image of our old bodies. We will not have physical but spiritual bodies.  Our mortals bodies are made spiritual bodies reserved in heaven for us.

     You: Heres another one you can chew on, Paul said this, 1 Cor 6:15, know you not that your bodies are members of Christ?

    Me: Yes, our now physical bodies are members of Christ.  But it cannot be after our deaths as I have shown you by the scriptures above.

    Matt 9:17 Neither do men put new wine (holy spirit) into old bottles (old bodies): else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved.

    You: Verse 19 what know you not that that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, which is in you, which you have of God, and you are not your own, 20….For you are bought with a price; therefore glorify God in your “body” “and ” your spirit, which are God’s . (God owns us) .

    Me: I believe that Christ is the resurrection now if we endure to the end, we do not die spiritually. So, “Glorify God in your body and your spirit” in 1 Cor 6:20.  We glorify God with the holy spirit, not with the human spirit. We will share Christ’s glory in our spirits and bodies later as he shares in the glory of God.  We glorify God with the spirit of God and with our new bodies

    Romans 8:17 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

    John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

    2 Cor 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

    2 Cor 6:1 For we know that when this earthly tent (Me: temporary dwelling)  we live in is taken down (that is, when we die and leave this earthly body), we will have a house in heaven, an eternal body made for us by God himself and not by human hands. 2 We grow weary in our present bodies, and we long to put on our heavenly bodies like new clothing. 3 For we will put on heavenly bodies; we will not be spirits without bodies.[a] 4 While we live in these earthly bodies, we groan and sigh, but it’s not that we want to die and get rid of these bodies that clothe us. Rather, we want to put on our new bodies so that these dying bodies will be swallowed up by life. 5 God himself has prepared us for this, and as a guarantee he has given us his Holy Spirit.

    You: Rom 8:23…..And not only they but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselvesm waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of “our body”

    Me: 

    1 Thes 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall (450. anistémi appear) first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    Me: The “dead in Christ” are those that died with him and was resurrected with him that will never die spiritually. This happened at the baptism of the spirit.

    Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

    #844783
     Truthcomber 
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    • Topics started 6
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    Gene:

     

    Now it is your turn Gene. Tell me what every scripture I shown you means and how they fit into a coherent understanding.

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