Soul, spirit, life and death, biblical definitions

[Proclaimer]

Being real is accepting reality

The scriptures in my last post tell you a clear simple fact which you just want to deny, hence why you chose to SKIM the scriptures I gave.

The clear simple facts of your quoted scriptures are not counter to the ones I quoted. I believe all, but you only believe the ones you quote because you can squeeze them into your narrative while the ones I quote cannot.

A half truth is not the full truth. Take the next step and embrace this fact stated by none other than the messiah himself. A rejection of his words brings to pass Jesus own words when he stated that only his sheep hear his voice, while others listen to a different voice.

And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.

I came from the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going back to the Father.”

I know in advance that you will reject his words, so it makes me wonder who your shepherd is? Sounds very much like the Islamic Jesus. Is it that one?

 

[Jodi]

Hi t8,

I am glad that you are replying.

YOU:

And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.

I came from the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going back to the Father.”

ME: The person speaking asking for glory that was of God before the world began was a MAN, and it was by God’s foreknowledge and determined purpose that this MAN would be crucified and slain but then be raised up to be the firstborn of the dead. Thus this man received the glory FIRST to that which God spoke before the world was, eternal life.

You are told that we are promised to be heirs of God, joint heirs with Christ, being glorified together (Romans 8). He as Firstborn is appointed to divide the spoil, the inheritance, (Isaiah 53). 

PUNCTUATION,

John 16:28 I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world again; I leave the world, and go to the Father.

Acts 13:22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will. 23 Of this man’s seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: 24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel.

Matthew 18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.

The PROMISE spoken by Isaiah quoted by Jesus as being fulfilled in himself.

Luke 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written, 18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, 19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

Jesus SENT, the Son of Man of the seed of David SENT to save that which was lost upon having been anointed with God’s Spirit without measure. Jesus came forth into the world neither doing his own will or speaking of his own, he came forth from the Father to do the Father’s will. Jesus DIED and then was raised to life unto the power of God coming into the world AGAIN where many witnessed him and heard him preach again, teaching them about himself according to OT prophecy. This Son of Man then ascended to the Father to sit at his right hand. 

Acts 7:56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

[Jodi]

Hi T8,

I am unclear as to exactly what you believe.

I believe Mary’s conception occurred from the power of God’s Holy Spirit and that which she conceived was the promised child of the seed of David. Her virgin conception was the fulfillment of God’s promise that by a sign of a virgin birth the house of David would have their promised savior and king.

You believe? …an anointed spirit son who dwelt in the form of God chose to empty himself and allow for his Father by the power of His Spirit enter Mary’s womb creating not just a human but a human who is also an anointed spirit, a one of a kind temporary being?

Am I close?

Luke 2:4 and the child grew and was strengthened in spirit, being filled with wisdom, and the grace of God was upon him.

John 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

John 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them,When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

Questions,

What exactly did this anointed spirit son empty himself OF?

More curious to know, what remained that actually came down from heaven and was combined with human flesh to make a one of a kind being?

AND even more curious to know, that which remained and came down what purpose did it serve? 

[Jodi]

Hi t8,

Another question if you don’t mind.

I apologize if I am in error anyway of what I understand that you believe.

You say Jesus asked God for the glory that he had before the world was and that glory was of him as a pre-existing spirit son.

We are told that he is firstborn of the dead of many brethren, and we are promised to be made into the image of God’s Son, and we are said to be heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, where we will be glorified together.

Now if we are to be made into the image of God’s Son, and that equates to his existence before the world was, and he is the firstborn of many, then WHY didn’t God just go ahead and also make us all when He made the pre-existing Jesus? 

Also if Jesus went back to being a spirit, why is he still said to be still a Son of Man? Why is he said to be the last Adam (human), why is the lord from heaven called the second man (human)?  

Also you equate Christ to be the part of Jesus that was the pre-existing anointed spirit, correct? Then why on earth are we told that Christ is OF the fruit of David’s loins, and Christ sits on his father David’s throne ACCORDING to the FLESH? 

Doesn’t make sense t8.

Makes sense however if Christ represents the son of David who God rested His Spirit upon, AN ANOINTING (Chrio made into thus a Christos), and then SENT him out into the world upon that anointing. He was SENT not of his own will, he was being sent from heaven, from God according to God’s will.

 

 

[carmel]

Hi Jodi,

YOU: We are told that

he is firstborn of the dead of many brethren,

 

Where, and which scripture says that Jesus

IS FIRSTBORN OF THE DEAD OF MANY BRETHREN?

Hereunder is the only scriptures which mention the word

FIRSTBORN in relation to what you posted.

 

Romans 8:29 For whom he foreknew, he also predestinated to be made conformable to the image of his Son: that he might be
the Firstborn amongst many brethren.

Rev.1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the first begotten of the dead

Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead,

 

Now In Romans above it says:

That He  MIGHT BE 

THE FIRSTBORN AMONG MANY BRETHREN.

In Colossians 1:18 it says:

THE FIRSTBORN FROM THE DEAD

In Rev. 1:5  it says:

THE FIRST BEGOTTEN OF THE DEAD.

 

Now Jodi, answer please:

ARE THE ABOVE SCRIPTURES COMMON IN THEIR EXEGESIS.?

ARE THEY REFERRING TO THE SAME PARTICULAR STATE ?

To me, they are not 

Especially Romans, and Colossians.

Peace and love in Jesus Christ

[carmel]

Hi Jodi,

YOU: Now if we are to be made into the image of God’s Son, and that equates to his existence before the world was, and he is the firstborn of many,

Again Jodi you said :

HE IS THE FIRSTBORN OF MANY!

Firstborn of many, OF WHAT?

firstborn from the dead or

firstborn among many brethren?

 

YOU: then WHY didn’t God just go ahead and also make us all when He made the pre-existing Jesus?

Jodi, read:

Genesis 1:1In the beginning God created

heaven, and earth.

Jodi, What does the above scripture say?

 

Peace and Love in Jesus Christ

 

[carmel]

Hi Jodi,

YOU: Also if Jesus went back to being a spirit, ……

Jodi, that’s where you are wrong.

YOU DON’T BELIEVE IN THE TWO FULL NATURES OF JESUS.

JESUS LEFT THE FATHER AS “THE WORD” ONE SPIRIT, by which spirit GOD CREATED ALL IN HIM,…THEN HE “THE WORD” WAS MADE  FLESH,

A UNIQUE MAN OF THE HOLY GHOST.

SON OF MAN and SON OF GOD

TWO separate SPIRITS “THE WORD” and THE HOLY GHOST.

FULLY GOD FULLY MAN

TWO IN ONE PERSON!

John 4:36 And HE  that reapeth receiveth wages and gathereth fruit unto life everlasting: that both HE that soweth and HE  that reapeth

MAY REJOICE TOGETHER

(GLORIFIED INTO ONE SUBSTANCE TWO IN ONE FLESH IN

JESUS CHRIST)

37For in this is the saying true:

That it is ONE MAN, (SON OF MAN) that soweth, and it is another (SON OF GOD) that reapeth.  (THE HOLY GHOST)

THUS JESUS RETURNED TO THE FATHER GLORIFIED AS

JESUS CHRIST

GODMAN MANIFESTED ON EARTH  AS

THE TRUE GOD.

1John5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come. And he hath given us understanding that we may know the true God and may be in his true Son.

This is the true God and life eternal.

Now read hereunder:

Isaiah 55: 11 So shall my word be, which shall go forth from my mouth: it shall not return to me

VOID,

 (OK Jodi, Jesus never returned as He left the Father just a SPIRIT, but

Both SPIRIT AND FLESH, both HEAVENLY AND EARTHLY, both

GOD and MAN.

Colossians 1:20 And through him to reconcile

ALL THINGS UNTO HIMSELF (BOTH DIVINE AND MAN, GOD MAN) making peace through the blood of his cross,

BOTH AS TO THE THINGS THAT ARE ON EARTH AND THE THINGS THAT ARE IN HEAVEN.

but it shall do whatsoever I please, and shall

 PROSPER in the things for which I sent it.

 

Attention Jodi:

 PROSPER IN THE THINGS FOR WHICH NI SENT IT. OK Jodi?

Though Jesus left the world as

THE MOST HIGH, THE MOST POWERFUL,

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying:

All power is given to me in heaven and in earth.

He remained on earth AS

THE JUSTIFIED SPIRIT AND TRUTH, BOTH AS “THE WORD” THE SON OF MAN SEALED IN THE PROCESS OF THE WORLD, John 6:27 AND IN ALL SOULS, AS

THE SPIRIT OF THE SON( SON OF GOD)

JUSTIFIED IN THE HEART OF THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE

AT ALL COSTS.

Galatians 4:6 And because you are sons, God hath sent the Spirit of his Son

into your hearts,

CRYING, ABBA FATHER.

 

Peace and love in Jesus Christ

[carmel]

Q

[GeneBalthrop]

Carmel…..Jesus is the first born from the dead, he said , “I am he who was dead and am alive forevermore. ” 

No split personalities about it. Why not BELIVE SCRIPTURES AS THEY ARE WRITTEN?

Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene

[carmel]

Questions,

Hi Jodi,

YOU: What exactly did this anointed spirit son empty himself OF?

More curious to know, what remained that actually came down from heaven and was combined with human flesh to make a one of a kind being?

AND even more curious to know, that which remained and came down what purpose did it serve?

 

YOU: What exactly did this anointed spirit son empty himself OF?

The above question speaks for itself. Jodi! Read:

 

Philippians 2:5For let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6Who

being in the form of God,( A SPIRIT)

thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

7But emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made

IN THE LIKENESS OF MEN, and

IN THE HABIT OF MEN.

 

Jodi, The above scripture declares  that Jesus was

DEFINITELY A SPIRIT, and HE WAS MADE A HUMAN, FLESH!

Now, You, with your question, confirmed that

HE IS A SPIRIT, but then you asked what He emptied Himself of,

IN ORDER TO BE MADE FLESH.

With YOUR question, you simply admitted and showed what you

A CARNAL PERSON ARE, and that is, that you are not only

MORE THAN EMPTY OF YOUR SPIRIT, AND FROM THE OTHER HAND

NOT EMPTY AT ALL OF YOURSELF,

I MEAN CARNALLY, but

YOU ARE EVEN MORE CARNALLY THEN CARNAL ITSELF IS, ESPECIALLY

WITH YOUR MENTALITY, with every respect.

Now if Jesus is “THE WORD” of God,

A DIVINE SPIRIT, confirmed in the above scripture, and was MADE FLESH,

THE OPPOSITE, isn’t clear enough to you that In order for Him to become FLESH  He

DEFINITELY emptied Himself of

HIS SPIRIT? As much as you are  more than enough

CARNALLY after all, and EMPTY YOURSELF OF YOUR SPIRIT.

Isn’t it clear enough to you that since scripture is as clear as crystal that God achieved

ALL IN HIM, (IN HIS SPIRIT) ALL BY HIM,(BY HIS SPIRIT) AND ALL FOR HIM, (FOR HIS SPIRIT)

JESUS CHRIST! Colossians 1:15:20.

HE, GOD THE FATHER, USED MORE THAN ENOUGH

“THE WORD” MADE FLESH, JESUS, THE SON OF MAN TO BE,  IN ORDER TO DO SO?

THE FACT THAT JESUS EMPTIED HIMSELF OF HIS SPIRIT?

HOW LONG WILL YOU REMAIN BLIND?

 

NOW, JESUS, as a spirit, WHILE FOR THE SAKE OF THE LOST, HE EMPTIED HIMSELF OF HIS DIVINE SPIRIT,

HE SIMPLY POURED IT ALL AND SHOWERED THE ENTIRE CREATION WITH HIS SPIRIT, AND BECAME AS WEAK AS HUMANS ARE,

He furnished the entire HUMANITY and its process with

ETERNAL LIFE IN HIS OWN SPIRIT, IN THEIR HEART, though SLAIN!

TO BE CLEAR, Jesus, THE SON OF MAN TO BE, as a spirit, through the process of creation, as He was moving from creature to creature, He simply left an infinitesimal speck of his spirit engrafted one substance in every creature’s heart at all costs, BY THIS MOST FORMIDABLE MYSTERIOUS TASK, not only He furnished the entire HUMANITY and its process with

ETERNAL LIFE IN HIS OWN SPIRIT, IN THEIR HEART, but God

IN THE SAME TIME REMAINED DOMINANT OVER CREATION ALL IN JESUS’ SPIRIT.

JESUS SLAIN…. Rev.13:8 simply patiently, humbly and meekly waited for

THE TIME OF HIS DEATH ON THE CROSS.

PRECISELY THE MOMENT IN TIME HE NOT ONLY  INITIATED THE PROCESS OF

ETERNAL LIFE, but 

HE SIMPLY

ANNULIFIED AND BROUGHT TO VOID DEATH.

BY WHICH DEATH

HE GLORIFIED  and

CREATED ANEW IN HIS SPIRIT THE ENTIRE CREATION, AS CHILDREN OF GOD, AND HIMSELF

THE FATHER AND GOD OF IT, OF THE ENTIRE

PHYSICAL CREATION.

Well asserted by Jesus in

John17:1 These things Jesus spoke: and lifting up his eyes to heaven, he said:

THE HOUR IS COME (OF HIS DEATH)

GLORIFY THY SON, (AS GOD ON EARTH ONE SUBSTANCE WITH THE HOLY GHOST)

THAT YOUR SON GLORIFY THEE. ( AS SON OF MAN IN HEAVEN ONE SUBSTANCE WITH “THE WORD” MADE FLESH)

2As thou hast given him power over ALL FLESH,( GOD OF ALL FLESH) that he may give ETERNAL LIFE to

ALL whom thou hast given him.

3Now this is

ETERNAL LIFE: That they may know thee,

(BOTH) THE ONLY TRUE GOD, AND JESUS CHRIST,  whom thou hast sent.

4I have GLORIFIED YOU (IN YOUR SUBSTANCE AS FLESH. Hebrews1:3) on the earth; I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

5And

NOW

glorify thou me, O Father, with thyself,( AS GOD ON EARTH AS MUCH AS I GLORIFIED YOU AS MAN ON EARTH) with the glory which I had, (AS GOD IN HEAVEN) before the world was,

with thee. ( NOW AS MUCH AS THEN) on the CROSS!

 

YOU: More curious to know, what remained that actually came down from heaven and was combined with human flesh to make a one of a kind being?

POOR JODI!

All that in the next post

 

Peace and love in Jesus Christ

[GeneBalthrop]

Carmel……it should read Jesus thought not to rob God by making himself equal to him.  Your reading a bad translation.

Example where this could have happened ,  Jesus Said to Mary when he was going raise Lazarus  , “have I not told you,  that if you believed you shouldest see the glory of God”,   but the right after he said that , he said this,  “Father, I thank thee that you have heard me. And I knew that you hear me always”: (now please pay attention ) “but because of the people which stand by I said it, that they may believe that you sent me”. 

Question said what?,  “that you shouldest see the GLORY OF GOD”.  By saying that,  the people there might have thought Jesus himself was God that raised Lazarus. So Jesus wanted to make sure that God the Father understood why he said what he said. That he wasn’t trying to steal Glory from God by saying that. Jesus could have easely let the people think he was the one who raised Lazarus and that would have been robbing God of his glory. Jesus never tried to be “equal” to God. 

Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene

[carmel]

Hi Jodi,

YOU: More curious to know, what remained that actually came down from heaven

Hereunder Jodi, are scriptures which clearly say:

WHAT REMAINED ON EARTH THAT ACTUALLY CAME DOWN FROM HEAVEN.

Now Jodi, if you are a spiritually-minded person, it’s up to you, to be aware of hidden truths in these scriptures and quench your thirst with, in relation to your question. ENJOY!

John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him: Amen, amen, I say to thee, unless a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

5Jesus answered: Amen, amen, I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 6That which is born of the flesh is flesh: and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7Wonder not that I said to thee: You must be born again. 8The Spirit breatheth where he will and thou hearest his voice: but thou knowest not whence he cometh and whither he goeth. So is every one that is born of the Spirit.

16For God so loved the world, as to give his only begotten Son: that whosoever believeth in him may not perish, but may have life everlasting. 17For God sent not his Son into the world, to judge the world: but that the world may be saved by him.

John6:27 Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that which endureth unto life everlasting, which the Son of man will give you. For him hath God, the Father, sealed. 

33 For the bread of God is that which cometh down from heaven and giveth life to the world.

39 Now this is the will of the Father who sent me: that of all that he hath given me, I should lose nothing; but should raise it up again in the last day. 40And this is the will of my Father that sent me: that every one who seeth the Son and believeth in him may have life everlasting. And I will raise him up in the last day.

51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven. [52] If any man eats of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, for the life of the world.

53 Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen, I say unto you: except you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you. 

John14:23 Jesus answered and said to him: If anyone loves me, he will keep my word. And my Father will love him and we will come to him and will make our abode with him. 

25These things have I spoken to you, abiding with you. 26But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you.

28: You have heard that I said to you: I go away, and I come unto you. If you loved me you would indeed be glad, because I go to the Father: for the Father is greater than I. 29And now I have told you before it come to pass: that when it shall come to pass, you may believe.

John15: 4Abide in me: and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, so neither can you, unless you abide in me. 5I am the vine: you the branches. He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same beareth much fruit:

for without me you can do nothing. 6If any one abide not in me, he shall be cast forth as a branch and shall wither: and they shall gather him up

26 But when the Paraclete cometh, whom I will send you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceedeth from the Father, he shall give testimony of me.

 

John16:7 But I tell you the truth: it is expedient to you that I go. For if I go not, the Paraclete will not come to you: but if I go, I will send him to you. 8And when he is come, he will convince the world of sin and of justice and of judgment. 9Of sin: because they believed not in me. 10And of justice: because I go to the Father: and you shall see me no longer. 11And of judgment: because the prince of this world is already judged.

John 17:20 And not for them only do I pray, but for them also who through their word shall believe in me. 21That they all may be one, as thou, Father, in me, and I in thee; that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

John 19: 26When Jesus therefore had seen his mother and the disciple standing whom he loved, he saith to his mother: Woman, behold thy son. 27After that, he saith to the disciple: Behold thy mother. And from that hour, the disciple took her to his own.

John20:17 Jesus saith to her: Do not touch me: for I am not yet ascended to my Father. But go to my brethren and say to them:

I ascend to my Father and to your Father, to my God and to your God.

Luke 17: 29And in the day that Lot went out of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 30Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man shall be revealed. 31In that hour, he that shall be on the housetop, and his goods in the house, let him not go down to take them away: and he that shall be in the field, in like manner, let him not return back. 32Remember Lot’s wife. 33Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose it shall preserve it. 34I say to you: In that night there shall be two men in one bed. The one shall be taken and the other shall be left. 35Two women shall be grinding together. The one shall be taken and the other shall be left. Two men shall be in the field. The one shall be taken and the other shall be left. 36They answering, say to him: Where, Lord? 37Who said to them: Wheresoever the body shall be, thither will the eagles also be gathered together.

YOU: and was combined with human flesh to make a one of a kind being?

 

[Jodi]

Hi Carmel,

Sorry your scriptures did not show AT ALL what remained concerning the doctrine that says Jesus pre-existed and emptied himself coming down from heaven.

Jesus tells you directly that God’s Spirit came to rest upon him, it was an anointing, and he was then sent TO preach God’s word and His coming kingdom, to perform signs and miracles, and to deliver captives.

You are likewise told that he hadn’t COME until AFTER the baptism John preached, which after that is when Jesus was baptized and the Spirit descended upon him like a dove and he is said to have left the river Jordan having been filled with the Spirit.

You are also told that it is a Son of Man that has COME and thus was SENT to save that which was lost, not some spirit son coming down from heaven.

Likewise you are told, “23 Of this man’s seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

God’s WORD, His promises were declared before the world was, IN that WORD is Jesus the seed of David who God promised He would raise up to be a savior. God created all things by himself, ALONE God says, and He did so thus through and for this seed who God would call to righteousness and direct all his ways for to deliver captives.

Carmel, God’s promise to David was that He would be a Father unto David’s son, NOT that God would take a one of a kind spirit son and make him into David’s son. First you have a son of David and THEN God becomes a Father to him.

 

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