Kerwin on the hotseat

[Ed J]

OK, so it's my turn now then.

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 04 2013,13:03)

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 04 2013,17:19) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 04 2013,01:35) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 04 2013,05:59) Ed, Mike has a point in that you did not answer my question in the yes/no format you demand. If I understand your answer is yes, as both offer and sacrifice can mean “TO GIVE UP” as in “TO NO LONGER HAVE”. IF this is your next question, can you please format it as a question. Ed, Actually,   I am testing to insure I understood your answer to my question correctly.  If I didn't then please try to rephrase your answer to my question so that I do. Thank you. Hi Kerwin, My words were clear and concise to “My understanding”. That is the purpose of our discussion is, to fully understand the “others” view and to compare it to what the Scriptures say. Rephrase my answer to fit your understanding if it doesn't, “huh”   Your brother     in Christ, Jesus. Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed J,

You are the one who chose not to give a yes, no answer to my question. I am fine with that as long as you certify I understand you correctly. I am asking you to either agree I understand you correctly or to correct my misunderstanding. That is good communications.

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 04 2013,13:04)

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 04 2013,17:23) Ed, My next question is, is a burnt offering dead? Hi Kerwin, I will save you from having to ask an additional question.               “a burnt offering” is a “sacrifice” If you don't want me aid you – by you requiring a “Yes” or a “No” response from me, just say so and I'll limit my help; OK? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed,

I am fine without a yes/no answer as long as you verify I understand you correctly.

To paraphrase your answer, Yes, a burnt offering is dead, a sacrifice.

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 04 2013,13:16)

OK, so it's my turn now then.

Ed,

I am fine with it being your turn though I would also like confirmation that I understand your answers.

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2013,06:46)

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 04 2013,13:04) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 04 2013,17:23) Ed, My next question is, is a burnt offering dead? Hi Kerwin, I will save you from having to ask an additional question.               “a burnt offering” is a “sacrifice” If you don't want me aid you – by you requiring a “Yes” or a “No” response from me, just say so and I'll limit my help; OK? God bless Ed J Ed, I am fine without a yes/no answer as long as you verify I understand you correctly. To paraphrase your answer, Yes, a burnt offering is dead, a sacrifice.

Hi Kerwin,

No, that was my answer to a question  that you did not ask yet.
And since you apparently don't want me to try an help you with your
words, I will refrain from trying to get you to the truth with less questions.

My answer to YOUR question is:

NO, “a burnt offering” results in death.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2013,06:43)

Ed J, You are the one who chose not to give a yes, no answer to my question.  I am fine with that as long as you certify I understand you correctly.  I am asking you to either agree I understand you correctly or to correct my misunderstanding.  That is good communications.

Hi Kerwin,

I brought you here to this thread asking you to answer “Yes” or “No”
questions because your were not trying to understand me correctly.
Whether you understand me correctly or NOT remains to be seen.

I believe that when you understand me correctly, you will certainly
agree with my view. So we are working on our communications skills.

Your brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Question #4:

---

Hi Kerwin,

“In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie,
 promised before the world began;” (Titus 1:2)

Is it possible for GOD to lie  “Yes” or “No”?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 05 2013,03:42)

Question #4: Hi Kerwin, “In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie,  promised before the world began;” (Titus 1:2) Is it possible for GOD to lie  “Yes” or “No”? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed,

God is not guilty of falsehood, and so in that way cannot lie so no, God cannot lie.

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2013,08:55)

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 05 2013,03:42) Question #4: Hi Kerwin, “In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie,  promised before the world began;” (Titus 1:2) Is it possible for GOD to lie  “Yes” or “No”? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org Ed, God is not guilty of falsehood, and so in that way cannot lie so no, God cannot lie.

Thank you!

Question #4 Answered:

[kerwin]

Ed,

Did God command Abraham to sacrifice Isaac?

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2013,12:25)

Ed, Did God command Abraham to sacrifice Isaac?

Hi Kerwin,

I thought you would have known by now  this is why I brought you to the Hot-Seat  to begin with.
NO, God did NOT command Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac.
The NIV attempts to turn God into a liar and make Abraham disobedient to God's command.

“he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah;
 and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.” (Gen 22:2)

                 OFFER HIM, not SACRIFICE HIM

             “By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that
               had received the promises offered up his only begotten son” (Heb 11:17)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Hi Kerwin,

It would seem that you have squandered a question, so I guess it is my turn then.
I would have responded sooner, but I don't know exactly what my next question will be yet.      (…I'll think of one soon though)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[kerwin]

Ed,

Genesis 22:9-10
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood. 10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son.

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 09 2013,10:46)

Ed, Genesis 22:9-10 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV) 9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood. 10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son.

Hi Kerwin,

Yes, that certainly fulfills the command to offer up Isaac!
But it would certainly not fulfill a command to sacrifice him!

If I have not proven this to you yet, I still have a few more questions before
I make my comprehensive presentation using my questions and YOUR answers.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 09 2013,07:57)

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 09 2013,10:46) Ed, Genesis 22:9-10 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV) 9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood. 10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. Hi Kerwin, Yes, that certainly fulfills the command to offer up Isaac! But it would certainly not fulfill a command to sacrifice him! If I have not proven this to you yet, I still have a few more questions before I make my comprehensive presentation using my questions and YOUR answers. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed,

No one said Abraham fulfilled God's command to sacrifice Isaac.  What was said is God commanded Abraham to sacrifice his son.  The Scripture I quoted demonstrated that Abraham did all the tasks associated with offering Isaac as a burnt offering and was in the progress of slaying him when the quote stopped.  

Genesis 22:11-12
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

11 And the angel of the Lord called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I. 12 And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me.

The angel stopped the sacrifice by commanding Abraham not to lay his hand on Isaac, a command that would not have been necessary unless Abraham was about to kill him.

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 09 2013,16:53)

Ed, No one said Abraham fulfilled God's command to sacrifice Isaac.

Kerwin,

The NIV is a perversion of God's word! GOD did NOT command Abraham to sacrifice Isaac.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Question #5:

---

Hi Kerwin,

Thus saith the Lord GOD; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but
the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord GOD.” (Ezek 12:28)

Will the word which God has spoken be done  –  “Yes” or “No”?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 09 2013,12:09)

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 09 2013,16:53) Ed, No one said Abraham fulfilled God's command to sacrifice Isaac. Kerwin, The NIV is a perversion of God's word!   GOD did NOT command Abraham to sacrifice Isaac. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed,

I don't see where this is productive communications as it is a claim that neither of us disagree with. I just look at the AKJV as flawed as well and flawed versions as the best versions God has chosen to give us.

God is living and willing to teach us despite these flawed tools.

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 09 2013,12:57)

Question #5: Hi Kerwin, Thus saith the Lord GOD; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord GOD.” (Ezek 12:28) Will the word which God has spoken be done  –  “Yes” or “No”? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed,

Your question is not as clear as you think it is. For example:

Exodus 32:9-14
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

9 And the Lord said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people: 10 now therefore let me alone, that my wrath may wax hot against them, and that I may consume them: and I will make of thee a great nation. 11 And Moses besought the Lord his God, and said, Lord, why doth thy wrath wax hot against thy people, which thou hast brought forth out of the land of Egypt with great power, and with a mighty hand? 12 Wherefore should the Egyptians speak, and say, For mischief did he bring them out, to slay them in the mountains, and to consume them from the face of the earth? Turn from thy fierce wrath, and repent of this evil against thy people. 13 Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, thy servants, to whom thou swarest by thine own self, and saidst unto them, I will multiply your seed as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have spoken of will I give unto your seed, and they shall inherit it for ever. 14 And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.

In this passage no, God did not do what he first spoke but instead chose to relent showing the words of a righteous man are powerful.

Ezekiel 12:27-28
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

27 Son of man, behold, they of the house of Israel say, The vision that he seeth is for many days to come, and he prophesieth of the times that are far off. 28 Therefore say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord God.

In this passage it is yes, as the house of Israel responded arrogantly instead of repenting.

[Ed J]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 10 2013,05:28)

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 09 2013,12:57) Question #5: Hi Kerwin, Thus saith the Lord GOD; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord GOD.” (Ezek 12:28) Will the word which God has spoken be done  –  “Yes” or “No”? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org Ed, Your question is not as clear as you think it is. For example: Exodus 32:9-14 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV) 9 And the Lord said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people: 10 now therefore let me alone, that my wrath may wax hot against them, and that I may consume them: and I will make of thee a great nation. 11 And Moses besought the Lord his God, and said, Lord, why doth thy wrath wax hot against thy people, which thou hast brought forth out of the land of Egypt with great power, and with a mighty hand? 12 Wherefore should the Egyptians speak, and say, For mischief did he bring them out, to slay them in the mountains, and to consume them from the face of the earth? Turn from thy fierce wrath, and repent of this evil against thy people. 13 Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, thy servants, to whom thou swarest by thine own self, and saidst unto them, I will multiply your seed as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have spoken of will I give unto your seed, and they shall inherit it for ever. 14 And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people. In this passage no, God did not do what he first spoke but instead chose to relent showing the words of a righteous man are powerful. Ezekiel 12:27-28 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV) 27 Son of man, behold, they of the house of Israel say, The vision that he seeth is for many days to come, and he prophesieth of the times that are far off. 28 Therefore say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord God. In this passage it is yes, as the house of Israel responded arrogantly instead of repenting.

Hi Kerwin,

You don't understand this question because it is at the core of our disagreement.

Granting mercy because one has repented of the 'WRONGDOING'
that punishment deserves is not at all changing your command.

Lets say you punish your kid for talking on the phone after bedtime, and the punishment is:
“you are grounded” – “You cannot go outside and play with your friends for three days”.
Now if your kid says (ON DAY 2) they are sorry and promise to never disobey again.  

Now has your command changed – “Don't talk on the phone after bedtime”? “No”!  Letting your
kid go out and play with their friends on day two DOES NOT CHANGE YOUR COMMAND either!

So will the word which YOU have spoken be done  –  “Yes”!      

God commanded Abraham to offer Isaac as a burnt offering,
God did not command Abraham to sacrifice Isaac!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

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