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Terrarica,
please show me your version ,by changing the names between brackets like i did for this is my understanding so show me yours ?
I do not have to use brackets since my version is what John 1:1-10 literally states.
Terarica,
Col 1:15 He(Jesus) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
That is another assumption though it has more evidence from the context in it. Jews are known to call Wisdom the daughter of God so Son can actually be referring to the word of God. It does not care since Jesus is the Word that has been given the characteristics of humanity and so whether you choose to claim the “He” in verse 15 is Jesus Christ or the Word made flesh it does not change a thing.
Col 1:12 giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints in the kingdom of light.
Col 1:13 For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) he loves,
Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
Col 1:15 He(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
Col 1:16 For through him(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created through him(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) and for him.
Col 1:17 He(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) is before all things, and in him(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) all things hold together.
Col 1:18 And he(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) is the head of the body, the church; he(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh) might have the supremacy.
Col 1:19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him,(the Word that comes out of God’s mouth made flesh)Terrarica,
FYI: I use “the Word that comes out of God’s mouth” instead of just “the Word” as too many assume that “the Word” is the name of Jesus.
Kw
It is obvious that you do not following the scriptures, and so we have nothing in common for your truth as gone the way of men,s religion interpretations, and not as the scriptures are written, so you can deal with your view without me ,have a great day,
Kerwin……You have it right, it was GOD HIMSELF IN CHRIST SPEAKING. For it says “GOD” who in times past has spoken to us through the prophets, has in these latter days spoken to us “THROUGH” a son”.
God the FATHER, and his word are one and the same THING. It was God himself “in” christ Jesus, who came to hi own and they did not reconize him. They all knew JESUS and did reconize him, but they did not reconize GOD THE FATHER “IN” HIM.
peace and love to you and yours. ……………gene
guy’s if you cannot understand that the prophets where the spokes persons to talk to the nation of Israel or to the kings of it ,you have gone to the waste land ,
for Jesus the sons of God spoke to us the words he was given from his father to tell us and so was the spokesperson in the last days to speak in God’s name ,
your confusion is so great it can be seen from space ,
Terricca…..Col 2:9…..”For “IN” HIM ( Jesus Christ) “DWELLETH” ALL the “FULNESS” of the Godhead, “BODILY”.
GOD THE FATHER WAS INDEED “IN” JESUS” BODY. THAT IS HOW HE “DWELT” “IN” HIM. sorry you can’t see that Terricca, but that does not change the truth brother. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. …………..gene
terrarica,
It is obvious that you do not following the scriptures
What you mean is that I do not follow your words as I clearly follow a more liberal understanding of much of John 1 and then apply that understanding to Colossians 1.
Here is another passage.
Isaiah 38:4Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
4 Then came the word of the Lord to Isaiah, saying,
It is clearly the word that comes from the mouth of God that came to Isaiah and not Jesus because God did communicate with believers through Christ until the Age of Jesus Christ.
People are preconditioned to thing the word in John 1 is Jesus Christ and so they read that into the passage. Take away that preconditioning with the bias that accompanies it is seen that John 1 is true when understood literally.
Gene/kw
may God help you for it is obvious I can’t make you see what is written ,have a great day ;to me this conversation has been closed ,
you can not even read what it says in scriptures that you are quoting ,that bad his your blindness
Let’s be sober-minded about this.
The Antichrist spirit denies that Jesus came in the flesh and we know that the Word became flesh.
Yet some say that Jesus is not that Word.
If Jesus is not the Word, then which came in the flesh?
- Jesus
- Word
t8,
Every human comes in the flesh as “in the flesh” means physically present.
John spoke of it in two places and some think it was targeting Gnostics that taught Jesus was an immaterial being even as he lived his mortal life.
This reinforces the teaching that the word took on the characteristic of humanity.
T8……WE are PRESENTING it to you the right way, the word which was GOD. WHO IS SPIRIT, CAME TO BE IN FLESH, he was “IN” THE FLESH MAN JESUS, and spoke through him to us, GOD AND HIS WORD ARE ONE AND THE SAME thing, you must come to believe that the fulness of the GODHEAD DWELT “IN” JESUS, AND SPOKE “THROUGH” HIM, TO US. BUT JUST AS THEN, PEOPLE DO MOT RECONIZE HIM (GOD), JUST AS HIS PEOPLE DID NOT RECONIZE HIM WHEN HE CAME IN THE FLESH BODY OF JESUS THEN, IT WAS GOD THE FATHER WHO SAID “destory this temple and in three days I (GOD THE FATHER) shall raise “it” up”. That was not JESUS WHO SAID THAT, IT WAS THE FATHER FIRST PERSON, speaking through the sons (Jesus’) mouth.
Jesus did not prexist his berth on this earth, he was a prophesied human being that would come into existence by his berth on this earth at the time GOD HAD APPOINTED FOR HIM TO, HE DID NOT PREXIST HIS BERTH ON THIS EARTH.
If you understood what SPIRITS ARE AND CAN DO, then you should have no problem understanding that the FATHER WAS INDEED ACTUALLY “IN” JESUS, RECONCILING THE WORLD TO HIMSELF. Just as scripture says he was. Why do you think JESUS SPOKE THESE WORDS to his deciples,” why do you say show me the FATHER, DON’T YOU BELIEVE THE FATHER IS “IN” ME, IF YOU DON’T BELIEVE ME, THEN BELIEVE IN THE MIRCALES”, WHY, BECAUSE “ONLY” GOD THE FATHER COULD DO THOSE MIRACLES.
The FATHER TOLD Jesus every thing to do and say, in fact he even told him “HOW” to even say it. Jesus took no credit for what he did , saying HE COULD DO “NOTHING” OF OR FROM HIMSELF, THE FATHER WHO WAS “IN” HIM “HE” DID THE WORKS”. If se say we believe JESUS,THEN WE SHOULD ALSO TRULY BELIEVE WHAT HE SAID RIGHT?
peace and love to you and yours. ……………..gene
So while you say that all things are made because of him, I agree, but all things are ALSO created through him. Do you agree that all things were created through him?
Hi T8. …[b](Post ref.)[/b]
Yes, but your understanding of what “through” means in the context of the text is where I don’t agree.
As I said before, you are taking the word “through” to mean ‘by the means of’ – as in Jesus helped God.
In the context of God creating all things through Jesus Christ, through means because of, on account of.‘by the means of’ – as in Jesus helped God CANNOT BE TRUE or else these verse would be false…
“Thus saith the LORD,
thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I the LORD that maketh all things;
that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;” (Isaiah 44:24)“O LORD of hosts, God of Israel,
that dwellest between the cherubims, thou art the God, even thou alone,
of all the kingdoms of the earth: thou hast made heaven and earth.” (Isaiah 37:16)Those verses say that God had NO HELP Creating – therefore Jesus couldn’t have helped him.
That’s my second reason I do not accept your claim. Again my first reason was verses like Jer.18:5_______________
God bless
Ed J“the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit” (John 6:63)
The Words are spirit means “Ho Logos” is “Spirit”, not Jesus.Edj…….Good post brother. It is encombent on us to protray JESUS AS A FELLOW HUMA BEING ,COMMING INTO EXISTENCE, at the time of his berth on this erth, we must grow to relate with him as a true “human” brother. Humanity is the CROWN JEWEL OF GOD CREATION. All things created by GOD , HAS BEEN PUT “UNDER” HIS (MANS) FEET, AND IN THAT HE SAYS “ALL” THINGS , THERE IS “NOTHING” THAT IS NOT “UNDER” HIS, (MANS FEET).
We do not “YET” see all things yet under his (mans) feet, but what do we see?, we see JESUS CHRIST, (ANOTHER MAN) NOW CROWNED WITH GLORY AND HONOR AND ALL THINGS ARE “NOW” UNDER HIS FEET, Just as it is sid in the book of Hebrews 2:5-9
JESUS IS WHAT GOD THE FATHER HAS IN MIND FOR US ALL, HE IS THE “FIRST” TO ACHIEVE GOD THE FATHER’S PURPOSE FOR “ALL” HUMAN CREATION. THE “FIRST” BORN INTO THE KINGDOM OF GOD AND ETERNAL LIFE from ALL HUMAN creation.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……………gene
Hi Keith:
The Word “is that which God has spoken, and it pertains to Jesus but is not him as a sentient person. He was before all things in that he was fore-ordained when God when God begun to create all things. It was through him that God would fulfill his plan for everything that he created and he is the heir of every thing that God created. And what God had spoken in various ways from the beginning of creation pertaining to Jesus was made manifest to humanity when the fullness of time had come.
So when he came unto his own, they did not receive him. Is this speaking of the Jews since he was a Jew himself or was it speaking of his own as being the heir of all things that God created? There is no question that this is Jesus, but as I stated it is what God had prophesied pertaining to him. This Word that he had spoken was made flesh. You know the account of the virgin birth, and how that which God has spoken came into being.
John 1(c) states that the Word was God, and that is true, but Jesus is not God, but he is the express image of God’s person, and it is through that same Word in John that he was perfected as he obeyed it without sin even unto death on the cross.
In John 6 he states that he is the bread of life and speaks of eating his flesh and drinking his blood, but he explains that he is speaking of what he is about to do in the body, the blood his sacrifice, and the Words that God would speak to humanity through him.
Ephesians 1:
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
Galatians:
4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
John 6:
32 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
34 Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
John 6:
57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
1 Peter 1:
18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Love in Christ,
MartyEdj…….Good post brother.
Thank you Gene,
All I can do is present (and also explain)
the information my conclusions are based upon.________________
Your brother
in Christ
Ed JHi Marty,
It doesn’t matter how many times you tell people,
unless they are willing to study the matter for themselves,
most people will fight to hold on to the traditions they were taught.“Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world,
why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,(Touch not; taste not; handle not; Which all are to perish with the using;)
after the commandments and doctrines of men?” (Col 2:20-22)_______________
Your brother
in Christ
Ed J
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