JOHN 1:1 who is the WORD?

[terraricca]

Quote (jammin @ May 05 2014,09:26)

mike is Christ God? yes or no? i am not asking you if Christ is God the father. i am asking you if he is God. yes or no? are you HUMAN? yes or no? i am not asking you if you are your father. i am asking you if you are HUMAN. yes or no?

J

so you really ask if Christ is a god right i think we all agree to that

[jammin]

Quote (terraricca @ May 06 2014,03:46)

Quote (jammin @ May 05 2014,09:26) mike is Christ God? yes or no? i am not asking you if Christ is God the father. i am asking you if he is God. yes or no? are you HUMAN? yes or no? i am not asking you if you are your father. i am asking you if you are HUMAN. yes or no? J so you really ask if Christ is a god right i think we all agree to that

T

no. a god is not a true God. man can be a god but not God by nature.

the father is God and not a god.
Christ is God just like his father because they do have the same form, God.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:17)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 04 2014,01:59) So here's the difference between me and Gill: 1. I believe Jesus was existing in the OUTWARD APPEARANCE of HIS OWN FATHER AND GOD, JEHOVAH. 2.  Gill believes Jesus was existing with the NATURE AND ESSENCE of HIS OWN FATHER AND GOD, JEHOVAH. And on this point, Gill and I DISAGREE with you, because you think the word “God” refers to a “nature” or “species”……. and NOT to Jesus' own God, the Father. Can you see the difference, jammin?   i thought you dont believe morphe is nature but now you are saying that YOU DO BELIEVE GILL'S commentary saying that morphe is nature. hahaha

Apparently you CAN'T see the difference.  

jammin, who does Gill think the word “God” refers to in Phil 2:6?

1. Nature/species – like YOU think?

2. The Father God – like I think?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:20)

you are not your father but you are HUMAN just like your father. Christ is God just like his father.

But “human” IS a “nature” or “species”, jammin.

“God” is NOT.

“God” is the name/title of a particular PERSON – not the name of a “nature/species”.

When you say, “Christ is God just like his Father”, it is like me saying, “Mike is Robert just like his father”.

Because both “God” and “Robert” are names of particular PEOPLE, jammin. “Robert” is not a “nature/species” – and neither is “God”.

Just ask Gill. He'll tell you.

Phil 2:6 teaches us that Christ was existing in the form of the Father, but didn't consider equality with the Father something to be grasped. It has nothing to do with the word “God” referring to a “nature” or “species” – like you imagine. Instead, the word “God” in Phil 2:6 refers to “The Father”.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:26)

mike is Christ God? yes or no?

Christ is A god, jammin.  But he is not the Most High God who created all things, and therefore he is not “God”.

Let me see if I can help you out even more………….

HUMAN is a NATURE.

ROBERT is a PERSON.

So you can say that I am HUMAN like my father, but you can't say that I am ROBERT like my father.

SPIRIT is a NATURE.

GOD is a PERSON.

So you can say that Jesus is SPIRIT like his Father, but you can't say that Jesus is GOD like his Father.

Do you understand now?

[mikeboll64]

jammin,

It's time to focus on the second part of Phil 2:6.

When Paul told us that Jesus “didn't consider equality with God something to be grasped” – who exactly is the God Paul was talking about?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:36)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 04 2014,02:32) 1.  Barclay says “morphe” cannot be different. 2.  Scripture says Jesus appeared to them in a DIFFERENT “morphe”. barclay is a professor, a leading greek scholar, and author of many books and commentaries.

Well, he is apparently a professor who has no problem teaching things that CONTRADICT clear scriptures.

Of course that is normal for TRINITARIAN “experts”.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:57)

Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Matthew 25:41 Then he will say to those on his left, “Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.” Does the fact that the fire is ETERNAL mean that fire has existed FROM eternity?  YES or NO? did you read what matthew said?

Just answer the question, jammin.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ May 05 2014,09:00)

Mike, Quote Angels have, on occasion, appeared on earth in the “morphe” of men.  They do not look like that in heaven, Kerwin.  That is not their normal appearance, according to many scriptures that describe angels when they are not on earth. Are you speaking of the one one that look like a son of man.  I always though that meant they looked like a human being. I also do not remember in Scripture where it is written angels are shape shifters.

Ezekiel 1
4 I looked, and I saw a windstorm coming out of the north—an immense cloud with flashing lightning and surrounded by brilliant light. The center of the fire looked like glowing metal,

5 and in the fire was what looked like four living creatures. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man.

6 but each of them had four faces and four wings.

7 Their legs were straight; their feet were like those of a calf and gleamed like burnished bronze.

8 Under their wings on their four sides they had human hands. All four of them had faces and wings,

9 and the wings of one touched the wings of another.

These also had the appearance of a son of man, Kerwin. But in what ways were they DIFFERENT from a human being? See if you can spot the differences.

This seems like a joke. Surely you can't be serious with this line of questioning, can you?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (jammin @ May 05 2014,10:53)

a god is not a true God.

Are you sure? Because Jesus calls his and our God “the ONLY true God”. He surely didn't say those words in John 17:3 to HIMSELF, right?

So do you suppose that means Jesus is a “false god”?

[kerwin]

Quote (jammin @ May 05 2014,22:53)

Quote (terraricca @ May 06 2014,03:46) Quote (jammin @ May 05 2014,09:26) mike is Christ God? yes or no? i am not asking you if Christ is God the father. i am asking you if he is God. yes or no? are you HUMAN? yes or no? i am not asking you if you are your father. i am asking you if you are HUMAN. yes or no? J so you really ask if Christ is a god right i think we all agree to that T no. a god is not a true God. man can be a god but not God by nature. the father is God and not a god. Christ is God just like his father because they do have the same form, God.

Jammin,

Do you know what the sinful nature is?

[kerwin]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 06 2014,06:21)

Quote (kerwin @ May 05 2014,09:00) Mike, Quote Angels have, on occasion, appeared on earth in the “morphe” of men.  They do not look like that in heaven, Kerwin.  That is not their normal appearance, according to many scriptures that describe angels when they are not on earth. Are you speaking of the one one that look like a son of man.  I always though that meant they looked like a human being. I also do not remember in Scripture where it is written angels are shape shifters. Ezekiel 1 4 I looked, and I saw a windstorm coming out of the north—an immense cloud with flashing lightning and surrounded by brilliant light. The center of the fire looked like glowing metal, 5 and in the fire was what looked like four living creatures. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man. 6 but each of them had four faces and four wings. 7 Their legs were straight; their feet were like those of a calf and gleamed like burnished bronze. 8 Under their wings on their four sides they had human hands. All four of them had faces and wings, 9 and the wings of one touched the wings of another. These also had the appearance of a son of man, Kerwin.  But in what ways were they DIFFERENT from a human being?  See if you can spot the differences.   This seems like a joke.  Surely you can't be serious with this line of questioning, can you?

Mike,

Technically they are called living creatures and not angels though I would call them angels if I knew they actually existed. They are like the stork winged women. A possible creature but not one I am sure of.

[kerwin]

Erroneous post.

[kerwin]

Mike,

I do believe that angels come in different forms as there are angels that guard the mercy seat that do have wing and may bear similar shape to the ones Ezekiel saw in his vision.  That does not mean there are not ones that look like human beings.  After all God said let us create human beings in our image and our likeness.  

I am confused how the living creature Ezekiel saw looked.  Basically they have three faces and four wings and are bipeds.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ May 05 2014,19:28)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 06 2014,06:21) Quote (kerwin @ May 05 2014,09:00) Mike, Quote Angels have, on occasion, appeared on earth in the “morphe” of men.  They do not look like that in heaven, Kerwin.  That is not their normal appearance, according to many scriptures that describe angels when they are not on earth. Are you speaking of the one one that look like a son of man.  I always though that meant they looked like a human being. I also do not remember in Scripture where it is written angels are shape shifters. Ezekiel 1 4 I looked, and I saw a windstorm coming out of the north—an immense cloud with flashing lightning and surrounded by brilliant light. The center of the fire looked like glowing metal, 5 and in the fire was what looked like four living creatures. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man. 6 but each of them had four faces and four wings. 7 Their legs were straight; their feet were like those of a calf and gleamed like burnished bronze. 8 Under their wings on their four sides they had human hands. All four of them had faces and wings, 9 and the wings of one touched the wings of another. These also had the appearance of a son of man, Kerwin.  But in what ways were they DIFFERENT from a human being?  See if you can spot the differences.   This seems like a joke.  Surely you can't be serious with this line of questioning, can you?   Mike, Technically they are called living creatures and not angels though I would call them angels if I knew they actually existed.

Ezekiel calls the same creatures “cherubim” in chapter 10. (See verse 15)

So, how does knowing they were angels change your answer? How does it change your understanding?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ May 05 2014,19:49)

Mike, I do believe that angels come in different forms as there are angels that guard the mercy seat that do have wing and may bear similar shape to the ones Ezekiel saw in his vision.

That's because they too are cherubim.

[kerwin]

Mike,

They are also possibly similar to those that guard the the garden of Eden.  The messenger angels are often, if not always, human shaped.

It does not change my answer as I believe some angels are shaped like humans while others are not though they may a two legged appearance.  

Since the angels were created first it seems we were created in the physical likeness of the human shaped ones.

[jammin]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 06 2014,11:02)

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:26) mike is Christ God? yes or no? Christ is A god, jammin.  But he is not the Most High God who created all things, and therefore he is not “God”. Let me see if I can help you out even more…………. HUMAN is a NATURE. ROBERT is a PERSON. So you can say that I am HUMAN like my father, but you can't say that I am ROBERT like my father. SPIRIT is a NATURE. GOD is a PERSON. So you can say that Jesus is SPIRIT like his Father, but you can't say that Jesus is GOD like his Father. Do you understand now?

how do you understand the word GOD? i am not referring to the father. you must understand that my question is about his nature God.

is he GOD? yes or no?

are you HUMAN? yes or no?

if jesus is God just like his father, he should be God and not a god. a god is not TRULY GOD. God is truly God.

do you understand???

if you do understand that you and your father have the same HUMAN nature, then you must accept that you are LIMITED just like your father.

God is not LIMITED. HE IS ALL POWERFUL, HE IS ALMIGHTY, HE IS ALL KNOWING, HE IS UNIQUE ETC. THAT IS THE NATURE OF GOD.
do you understand?

[jammin]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 06 2014,11:09)

jammin, It's time to focus on the second part of Phil 2:6. When Paul told us that Jesus “didn't consider equality with God something to be grasped” – who exactly is the God Paul was talking about?

i do understand english mike but i am not sure if you do understand the language.

i do understand the phrase “WIH GOD” and that tells us that he is with his father. the phrase WITH GOD is not the same as form of God.

you cant say that you have the form WITH GOD – that is incorrect usage of english.

you should say you have the FORM OF HUMAN.

do you have the form of HUMAN? yes or no?

if yes, are not you HUMAN? yes or no?

[jammin]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 06 2014,11:15)

Quote (jammin @ May 04 2014,21:57) Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Matthew 25:41 Then he will say to those on his left, “Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.” Does the fact that the fire is ETERNAL mean that fire has existed FROM eternity?  YES or NO? did you read what matthew said? Just answer the question, jammin.

fire has nothing to do with john 1.1
hahaha

phil 2.6 has nothing to do with fire. hahaha

is fire God or created by God?
your example is non sense!

matthew explained phil 2.6 and supported with john 1.1 verse. matthew believes Christ is God but you dont! hhahaha

therefore, it is very clear that you DONT understand what matthew said. you are a big clown .hahaha

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