JOHN 1:1 who is the WORD?

[942767]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 27 2013,03:13)

so it is not the WORDS OF THE MAN BUT THE ACTIONS OF THE MAN THAT SAVES BY BELIEVING IN IT ,RIGHT

Well, it depends what you mean by “believing it”.

This is what the scriptures state:

Quote

Hbr 5:7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; Hbr 5:8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; Hbr 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Wakeup]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 27 2013,01:22)

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 26 2013,18:05) Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 26 2013,11:34) W Quote 1. *No man* has been to heaven but he that came down   from heaven. any scripture Terra. Since you dont know your scriptures well enough, I will give you some help. John 3:13   And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. wakeup. W Jn 3:11 I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. Jn 3:12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? Jn 3:13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man. YOU MOST HAVE YOUR OWN BIBLE AND INTERPRETATION ,BECAUSE MY SCRIPTURES DO NOT MATCH YOURS ,I UNDERSTAND WHY I COULD NOT FIND WHAT WAS NOT THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE ;

Terra.

As I have said:

All new translations are not to be trusted.
For satan has his hand on them.

wakeup.

[942767]

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 27 2013,03:36)

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 27 2013,03:13) so it is not the WORDS OF THE MAN BUT THE ACTIONS OF THE MAN THAT SAVES BY BELIEVING IN IT ,RIGHT The *Words* of the Man is the Man. The *Word* made flesh. wakeup.

Wakeup:

When Jesus was born into this world as a man child, he had not obeyed the Word of God without sin unto death on the cross.

It is not “his Word” but it is God's Word that He obeyed, but yes, it is the life that a person lives that defines who he is. Jesus stated in John 6 “the Words that I speak, they are spirit and they are life”.

And here he states that it is the Father that told him what to say and do.

Quote

Jhn 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. Jhn 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. Jhn 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Wakeup]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 27 2013,03:56)

Wakeup…….You showed scripture that said, “No man has been to heaven but he that came down from heaven” right?. So according to that scripture Jesus was a “MAN” existing in Heaven “before” he came down from Heaven right? that is interesting because i thought you believe no flesh and blood person could inter into the Kingdom of God which is “IN” heaven.   peace and love……………………………………..gene

Marty.

This is where decerning the scriptures is important.
*HE* that was made flesh,is also *HE* that was the WORD
in spirit form.

*HE* that was with God, and had glory together.
Is also *HE* who dwelleth amongst men.

wakeup.

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 26 2013,22:13)

so it is not the WORDS OF THE MAN BUT THE ACTIONS OF THE MAN THAT SAVES BY BELIEVING IN IT ,RIGHT

T,

Yes, though words are also actions but both a man who says what is right but does not do it will not inherit the reign of God.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 27 2013,01:41)

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 26 2013,22:13) so it is not the WORDS OF THE MAN BUT THE ACTIONS OF THE MAN THAT SAVES BY BELIEVING IN IT ,RIGHT T, Yes, though words are also actions but both a man who says what is right but does not do it will not inherit the reign of God.

k

understand that in Christ it is HIS ACTION THAT SAVES US ,BUT TO US IT IS THE ACTION OF BELIEVING HIS WORDS THAT WILL OR CAN SAVE US ;

[mikeboll64]

Quote (2besee @ Oct. 24 2013,18:21)

Mike you are right. I really thought I was onto something then.

You tested all things, 2B. That is commendable. But what is even more commendable is that you adjusted your understanding to align with the results of the testing.

Well done.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (2besee @ Oct. 24 2013,18:25)

Quote Now look at the fourth Greek word. It is “en” – with a line over the top of the e , and it means “was”. eimi: I exist, I am Original Word: εἰμί Part of Speech: Verb Transliteration: eimi Phonetic Spelling: (i-mee') Short Definition: I am, exist Definition: I am, exist.

Yes.  It is the Greek verb “to be”, like the name of God is the Hebrew verb “to be”.

Depending on the tense and form in which it is written, it can mean “I am”, “I exist”, “I was”, “it was”, “I will be”, “they were”, etc.

Look on that same page, and see how the word is translated in the different Bibles.  You'll see that “was” is the most common translation – due to the form and tense in which the word was most often written.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 24 2013,18:58)

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 24 2013,07:26) 2Co 10:10 For his letters, say they, are weighty and powerful; but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech contemptible. Paul was strong in his written words ,but apparently in real live he was a man of no stature ,(small,no real imposing his person,) T, I never looked at that passage like you.

2 Corinthians 10:1 NIV
By the humility and gentleness of Christ, I appeal to you—I, Paul, who am “timid” when face to face with you, but “bold” toward you when away!

[mikeboll64]

Quote (carmel @ Oct. 25 2013,00:25)

Wakeup, and Mike, BE SPECIFIC! MY TEACHING IS ALL SCRIPTURAL! SO: BE SPECIFIC AND CONTRADICT ME USING SCRIPTURES!

For one, Charles, Jesus is said to be God's firstborn…….. as opposed to this “lucifer” person you claim to be the firstborn.

Can you show me scripturally were “lucifer” is even a proper name of a person – let alone the first person God created?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (942767 @ Oct. 25 2013,07:42)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 25 2013,10:26) The answer is “Jesus”, Marty.  That is the answer to my question.   Jesus is the one whose name is called “The Word of God”. (BTW, Jesus is also the one who is called by that same name in John 1) Hi Mike: It is true that Jesus name is called “the Word of God” in Rev. 19:3, but where is the scripture which supports your statement that his name is called “the Word of God” in John 1?

Here's a bunch of them:

The italicized words below are things said about “the Word” in John 1.  The scriptures listed in parenthesis identify some of the places in scripture where those same exact things are said about Jesus.

1.  And the Word was a god:  (Is 9:6, Heb 1:8-9, etc.)

2.  He was with God in the beginning:  (John 17:5)

3.  All things were made through him:  (Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6, Heb 1:2)

4.  In him was life, and that life was the light of men:  (John 5:26, John 8:12)

5.  The light shines in the darkness:  (Matthew 4:16; John 3:19; 2 Corinthians 4:6)

6.  John the Baptist came as a witness to testify concerning that light:  (John 1:29-34; 3:26; 5:32-36)

7.  The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world:  (Isaiah 42:6-7; John 3:19, 9:5, 12:35-36, 46; Luke 1:78-79)

8.  Though he was in the world, the world did not recognize him:  (Isaiah 53:3, John 4:10, Acts 13:27, John 12:37-38, 1 John 3:1)

9.  He came to that which was his own: (Col 1:16; Matt 11:27; John 3:35, 13:3, 16:15; Eph 1:10; Heb 1:2)

10.  but his own did not receive him:  (Luke 9:53; John 5:43; Acts 13:46)

11.  to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God:  (Acts 4:12; John 3:14-16; Gal 3:26; Heb 2:10; Eph 1:5)

12.  The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us:  (1 John 1:1-2, 4:2; Phil 2:6-7; Rom 8:3; Gal 4:4-5)

13.  We have seen his glory, the glory of the only begotten:  (John 1:18, 3:16-18; 1 John 4:9)

14.  who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.:  (John 1:16, 14:6; Luke 2:40; Romans 1:5)

15.  John testified concerning him.:  (Mark 1:7-8; John 1:32, 34; John 3:26; John 5:32-33; John 10:41)

16.  He cried out, saying, “This is the one I spoke about when I said, ‘He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.’”:  (John 1:29-30; John 3:28,30; Micah 5:2; Acts 19:4)

But you really only need ask yourself one simple question:  Who is the ONLY being to have EVER dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son?

The answer is “Jesus”.

And according to John 1:14, “the Word” is the one who was made flesh, and dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son.  

So from my point of view, I see a very simple teaching from John, supported by his teaching that Jesus is definitely the one named “the Word” in Rev 19:13.

But because of personal wishes, you choose to see the words, The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth

as

The Word came to be IN someone who was already flesh, and after the Word came to be IN him, the person who was already flesh began to dwell on earth with the glory of God's only begotten Son.

Marty, consider the last words of the CORRECT version I listed above:  “full of grace and truth”.  Now consider the exact moment in John 1 where John stops calling this person “the Word” and starts calling him “Jesus”.  (Follow the words “grace” and “truth”):

16 Out of his fullness we have all received grace……..

At this point, “the Word” is still the subject of the teaching, and the name “Jesus” has not yet been written.  So at this point, we know that grace came to us through “the Word”.

Now watch:

17 ……grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

So “grace came through the Word“, and “grace came through Jesus Christ“.  Hmmmm…………..

Now look back to verse 14:  We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Verse 14 is written about the one that had so far only been identified as “the Word”.  Do you agree?  And this “Word” came FROM the Father, full of grace and truth.  Do you agree?

So how in the world could the Word actually BE the Father if he came FROM the Father?  (That right there is enough to tell anyone with a brain that “and the Word was God” is a faulty translation.)

And why in the world are you able to see that the Word came from the Father, full of grace and truth, and grace and truth came to us from Jesus, who was sent from the Father……….. yet you can't see the plain, simple, and obvious connection between these things?

I will pray that God allow you to see what is written in black and white for all to see.  I will pray He removes your self-inflicted blinders so you can be able to see these obvious things.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 25 2013,09:12)

Marty………..You are right…………

Gene,

Is the Word God Himself? Or did the Word come FROM God, full of grace and truth?

Which one does John 1:14 say?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 25 2013,11:28)

Jammin, I already admitted “aspect” is the wrong word in English…….. In English the formula “x is a” can mean “a is an aspect of x”.

So you admitted that “aspect” was the wrong word, and then showed a formula to support your use of this “wrong word”?  

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 25 2013,12:49)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 24 2013,08:19) Would anyone ever say, “2B went to the market, and his word went WITH him.” ? The lyrics is various Kitchen Utensils and surprise of all surprises all people but you seem to understand it.

Kerwin,

Would you ever say the supersized words above? At any time in your life, would you say them?

I only saw ONE reply about your lyrics, and that was from 2B, who only said, “Funny”.

So I'm not sure you can claim that “all people but me” understand your nonsense.

Now, if those lyrics give us a VALID reason that people in the world WOULD say those supersized words above, then by all means, let's discuss each lyric, one at a time.

If they don't, then you are wasting my time as you so often do.

Come on, Man!

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 25 2013,13:40)

I do lack knowledge and so seek it.

Agreed.  Do us all a favor, and FIND the knowledge BEFORE you begin to teach us that knowledge.

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 25 2013,13:40)

Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Also, Genesis 1 doesn't actually say God CREATED light at that time, does it?  God said, “Let there BE light”, which for all we know, could mean that God allowed light to shine ON the earth for the first time. No, it could not as the lights of earth were not created until the fourth day.

So the earth was dark.  And then God said, “Let there be light”.  Then there WAS light.  And God saw that the light was good.

BUT THE EARTH REMAINED IN DARKNESS, DESPITE ALL THESE THINGS, UNTIL THE FOURTH DAY?  

Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 25 2013,13:40)

Quote (mikeboll @ 64) And the angels shouted for joy when God made the earth.  That's also in the scriptures. It does not say that.  What it says is that the angels celebrated when the cornerstone of earth was placed.

I'm addressing these posts in chronological order, but as yet I haven't seen an answer to this problem in your theory:

Are you saying God STARTED TO create the earth, then left that project to create the angels, and then came back and FINISHED the earth – at which time those recently created angels shouted for joy?  YES or NO?

Also, from Dictionary.com:

cor·ner·stone  noun  

1. a stone uniting two masonry walls at an intersection

2. a stone representing the nominal starting place in the construction of a monumental building, usually carved with the date and laid with appropriate ceremonies  (“Appropriate ceremonies” like morning stars singing and angels shouting for joy, perhaps?   )  

3. something that is essential, indispensable, or basic  

4. the chief foundation on which something is constructed or developed

Where did you find support for your claim that the “cornerstone” of a thing is the LAST stone laid, or
“capstone”?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 26 2013,12:32)

Terra. As I have said: All new translations are not to be trusted.

As if the KJV was the FIRST English Bible? Or as if there was no truth in scripture UNTIL it was written in English?

[Wakeup]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 27 2013,09:29)

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 26 2013,12:32) Terra. As I have said: All new translations are not to be trusted. As if the KJV was the FIRST English Bible?  Or as if there was no truth in scripture UNTIL it was written in English?

Mike B.

Jesus says; for us to seek.
Not only for the last generations,but all generations.
He must also provide us with a book that we can depend upon.Not only for the english speaking,but al languages.

If there is none for them to seek and read,
Then they will be judged by their works.
By the book of life. Not all can read.
God's judgement is righteous judgement.

For the english speaking would be the early translations.
Not the latter.
I find the kjv translation with no contradictions.
The latter translations is not the better,but the worse.
Mans curruption is not getting better,but worse and worse.

Learned man with no understanding of scripture
will twist the scriptures to their own understanding.

wakeup.

[terraricca]

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 27 2013,09:17)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 27 2013,09:29) Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 26 2013,12:32) Terra. As I have said: All new translations are not to be trusted. As if the KJV was the FIRST English Bible?  Or as if there was no truth in scripture UNTIL it was written in English?   Mike B. Jesus says; for us to seek. Not only for the last generations,but all generations. He must also provide us with a book that we can depend upon.Not only for the english speaking,but al languages. If there is none for them to seek and read, Then they will be judged by their works. By the book of life. Not all can read. God's judgement is righteous judgement. For the english speaking would be the early translations. Not the latter. I find the kjv translation with no contradictions. The latter translations is not the better,but the worse. Mans curruption is not getting better,but worse and worse. Learned man with no understanding of scripture will twist the scriptures to their own understanding. wakeup.

W

But the Latin version was before the English one and so was the German,and French one ,

You are mis informed about the history of the bible,

And the old English does not stands well in our days ,why do you not use the Greek version it is the best the closes to the original,but let me guess ,you do not read Greek ,I mean the old Greek,

But all are on the Internet for all to learn for free,amazing does it

[Wakeup]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 27 2013,14:46)

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 27 2013,09:17) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 27 2013,09:29) Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 26 2013,12:32) Terra. As I have said: All new translations are not to be trusted. As if the KJV was the FIRST English Bible?  Or as if there was no truth in scripture UNTIL it was written in English?   Mike B. Jesus says; for us to seek. Not only for the last generations,but all generations. He must also provide us with a book that we can depend upon.Not only for the english speaking,but al languages. If there is none for them to seek and read, Then they will be judged by their works. By the book of life. Not all can read. God's judgement is righteous judgement. For the english speaking would be the early translations. Not the latter. I find the kjv translation with no contradictions. The latter translations is not the better,but the worse. Mans curruption is not getting better,but worse and worse. Learned man with no understanding of scripture will twist the scriptures to their own understanding. wakeup. W     But the Latin version was before the English one and so was the German,and French one , You are mis informed about the history of the bible, And the old English does not stands well in our days ,why do you not use the Greek version it is the best the closes to the original,but let me guess ,you do not read Greek ,I mean the old Greek, But all are on the Internet for all to learn for free,amazing does it

Terra.

The latin for the latin to read.
The greek for the greeks to read.
The german for the germans to read.
The english for the english to read.

The latter the translations;the worse.
Not the better.
I find the kjv perfect,you may not.

People that can not read are not lost;
for there is always the second resurrection.

wakeup.

[terraricca]

Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 27 2013,13:54)

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 27 2013,14:46) Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 27 2013,09:17) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 27 2013,09:29) Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 26 2013,12:32) Terra. As I have said: All new translations are not to be trusted. As if the KJV was the FIRST English Bible?  Or as if there was no truth in scripture UNTIL it was written in English?   Mike B. Jesus says; for us to seek. Not only for the last generations,but all generations. He must also provide us with a book that we can depend upon.Not only for the english speaking,but al languages. If there is none for them to seek and read, Then they will be judged by their works. By the book of life. Not all can read. God's judgement is righteous judgement. For the english speaking would be the early translations. Not the latter. I find the kjv translation with no contradictions. The latter translations is not the better,but the worse. Mans curruption is not getting better,but worse and worse. Learned man with no understanding of scripture will twist the scriptures to their own understanding. wakeup. W     But the Latin version was before the English one and so was the German,and French one , You are mis informed about the history of the bible, And the old English does not stands well in our days ,why do you not use the Greek version it is the best the closes to the original,but let me guess ,you do not read Greek ,I mean the old Greek, But all are on the Internet for all to learn for free,amazing does it Terra. The latin for the latin to read. The greek for the greeks to read. The german for the germans to read. The english for the english to read. The latter the translations;the worse. Not the better. I find the kjv perfect,you may not. People that can not read are not lost; for there is always the second resurrection. wakeup.

w

rolling on the floor,

so the english are now the blessed people in your mind yes

and the KJV is the version of their victory,WARS,CRIMES ,DEPORTATIONS,HANGING,JUST TO MAKE THAT VERSION ,THE BEST WITH YOUR DELUDED MIND ,

I CANNOT SHARE YOUR DELUDED VIEW ON THE KJV,IN OLD ENGLISH, I TAKE THEM ALL ,I MEAN THE VERSION AND LANGUAGES;

[Author]

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