JOHN 1:1 who is the WORD?

[kerwin]

T,

I already did but you did not understand and so I put it to you to say it in your own words. You have yet to do so.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,06:04)

T, I already did but you did not understand and so I put it to you to say it in your own words.  You have yet to do so.

K

no you did not ;you where horse ridding and got stuck on the horse not knowing which side to get off ,

Ge 3:8 Then the man and his wife heard the sound of the LORD God as he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and they hid from the LORD God among the trees of the garden.
Ge 3:9 But the LORD God called to the man, “Where are you?”
Ge 3:10 He answered, “I heard you in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid.”
Ge 3:11 And he said, “Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from? ”
Ge 3:12 The man said, “The woman you put here with me

THE MAN (CALLED ADAM) THE GUY (CALLED ADAM) WAS THERE ANY ONE ELSE (OTHER MAN )

[kerwin]

T,

Man as in male or man as in gender?

Did mankind sin in the garden or did they remain pure?

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,06:36)

T, Man as in male or man as in gender? Did mankind sin in the garden or did they remain pure?

K

again ,does it says THE MALE NO,

DOES IT SAY THE MAN YES ,DO WE KNOW THE NAME OF THE MAN YES HIS NAME HIS ADAM ,OR DID YOU DO NOT  KNOW

THE WOMEN ,IS CALLED EVE ,DID YOU KNOW

SHE IS A FEMALE ,DID YOU KNOW DID YOU KNOW BOTH KIND ARE STILL AROUND TODAY ;DO YOU KNOW THAT

KERWIN ,I AM NOT AS SMART AS YOU ;SO I DO NOT MAKE THINGS UP AS YOU DO ,WHAT SCRIPTURES SAYS THAT IS WHAT I BELIEVE ,I MAY GO A LITTLE FURTHER SOMETIMES FOR A REASON BUT THERE AS TO BE A GOOD REASON ;AND YOUR INTERPRETATION IS SELF REJECTION OF THE TRUTH ,

[kerwin]

T,

You are what you are and belief is what is necessary. Man is used to mean both male and human. I believe God addressed the male in the the story of Genesis. At the time of Genesis both the male and female were the sum of mankind. There was no other human beings and yet all of mankind pays the price of death for their sins. These things take no special intellect to understand.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,08:53)

T, You are what you are and belief is what is necessary.  Man is used to mean both male and human.  I believe God addressed the male in the the story of Genesis.  At the time of Genesis both the male and female were the sum of mankind.  There was no other human beings and yet all of mankind pays the price of death for their sins.  These things take no special intellect to understand.

K

same again ,i am tired from your game ;so iether the scriptures or nothing ;

your views are so placed ;THAT YOU FIND THE REASON IN SCRIPTURES NOT TO BELIEVE IN THEM ,

TIME OUT

[kerwin]

T,

It seems you are having trouble with the use of English.

Mankind is guilty of the Holocaust.
Mankind was the victim of the Holocaust.
Mankind brought the Holocaust to and end.

Is every man guilty of the Holocaust?
Was everyman the victim of the Holocaust?
Did every man bring the Holocaust to an end?

Mankind is guilty of the sin in the Garden because humans sinned.
Not every man is guilty of the sin but only those that committed it.

Quote

1Cr 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

This passage is speaking of mankind because it neither states “a man” or “the man”.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,12:44)

T, It seems you are having trouble with the use of English.   Mankind is guilty of the Holocaust. Mankind was the victim of the Holocaust. Mankind brought the Holocaust to and end. Is every man guilty of the Holocaust? Was everyman the victim of the Holocaust? Did every man bring the Holocaust to an end? Mankind is guilty of the sin in the Garden because humans sinned. Not every man is guilty of the sin but only those that committed it. Quote 1Cr 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. This passage is speaking of mankind because it neither states “a man” or “the man”.

K'

do not get yet ?????????

Paul does not talk about humanity ,IT HIS YOU ;PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ;

BUT YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ENGLISH UNDERSTANDING AND SO KNOW BETTER ,

THIS TYPE OF UNDERSTANDING KILLS THE TRUTH OF GOD ,

SO LEARN TO UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES WITH GOD SPIRIT ;;;NOT YOURS ;;;

TELL ME THAT IT IS ME THAT DO NOT UNDERSTAND ENGLISH ;SOME TIMES YOU COULD BE RIGHT ;

BUT HAVE NO CLUE OF ANY UNDERSTANDING IN SCRIPTURES ; WHAT DO YOU KNOW HOW DO YOU KNOW I HAVE SHOWN YOU OVER AND OVER AGAIN .

TELL HOW WILL YOUR ENGLISH SAVE YOU ????

DON'T WANT TO KNOW ,IT IS YOUR PROBLEM ,FOR OVER FOUR YEARS I TALKED TO YOU .AND SEE HOW YOU THINKING ;

[942767]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 09 2013,05:26)

Quote (942767 @ Sep. 08 2013,09:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 08 2013,09:11) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 07 2013,14:43) …..like us in every way, although he was not born of the sperm of man………. Like us in every way – except that none of us were fathered directly by God Almighty? Marty, Jesus was always different than we are.  He had to be made somewhat like us to complete God's purpose. Hi Mike: Does the scripture say that he was a man? Love in Christ, Marty Yes Marty, that is PART of what the scriptures say. Scripture also says that since we are of flesh, he too had to partake in flesh. Scripture also says he was existing in the form of God before being made in the likeness of a human being. Scripture also says he came down from heaven to do the will of He who sent him. But you only believe the portion of the scriptures that align with your doctrine.

Hi Mike:

You can add a word here and there to change the scriptures, and that is what you are doing when you said that the scriptures stated that Jesus was in the form of God “before” he was made a man. You are adding the word “before”.

Quote

Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Do you see the word “before” in verse 6 above?

Don't you see that overcoming sin for as super human being or someone who is fully man and fully God would be no challenge at all, but the fact that he was like us in every way and that he obeyed God without sin even unto death out of his love for us is what makes him so awesome.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[terraricca]

Quote (942767 @ Sep. 09 2013,22:18)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 09 2013,05:26) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 08 2013,09:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 08 2013,09:11) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 07 2013,14:43) …..like us in every way, although he was not born of the sperm of man………. Like us in every way – except that none of us were fathered directly by God Almighty? Marty, Jesus was always different than we are.  He had to be made somewhat like us to complete God's purpose. Hi Mike: Does the scripture say that he was a man? Love in Christ, Marty Yes Marty, that is PART of what the scriptures say. Scripture also says that since we are of flesh, he too had to partake in flesh. Scripture also says he was existing in the form of God before being made in the likeness of a human being. Scripture also says he came down from heaven to do the will of He who sent him. But you only believe the portion of the scriptures that align with your doctrine. Hi Mike: You can add a word here and there to change the scriptures, and that is what you are doing when you said that the scriptures stated that Jesus was in the form of God “before” he was made a man.  You are adding the word “before”. Quote Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: Do you see the word “before” in verse 6 above? Don't you see that overcoming sin for as super human being or someone who is fully man and fully God would be no challenge at all, but the fact that he was like us in every way and that he obeyed God without sin even unto death out of his love for us is what makes him so awesome. Love in Christ, Marty

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 09 2013,19:55)

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,12:44) T, It seems you are having trouble with the use of English.   Mankind is guilty of the Holocaust. Mankind was the victim of the Holocaust. Mankind brought the Holocaust to and end. Is every man guilty of the Holocaust? Was everyman the victim of the Holocaust? Did every man bring the Holocaust to an end? Mankind is guilty of the sin in the Garden because humans sinned. Not every man is guilty of the sin but only those that committed it. Quote 1Cr 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. This passage is speaking of mankind because it neither states “a man” or “the man”. K' do not get yet ????????? Paul does not talk about humanity ,IT HIS YOU ;PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ; BUT YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ENGLISH UNDERSTANDING AND SO KNOW BETTER , THIS TYPE OF UNDERSTANDING KILLS THE TRUTH OF GOD , SO LEARN TO UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES WITH GOD SPIRIT ;;;NOT YOURS ;;; TELL ME THAT IT IS ME THAT DO NOT UNDERSTAND ENGLISH ;SOME TIMES YOU COULD BE RIGHT ; BUT HAVE NO CLUE OF ANY UNDERSTANDING IN SCRIPTURES ; WHAT DO YOU KNOW HOW DO YOU KNOW I HAVE SHOWN YOU OVER AND OVER AGAIN . TELL HOW WILL YOUR ENGLISH SAVE YOU ???? DON'T WANT TO KNOW ,IT IS YOUR PROBLEM ,FOR OVER FOUR YEARS I TALKED TO YOU .AND SEE HOW YOU THINKING ;

T,

We are talking about English and in that language saying the action of man is the same as saying the action of mankind.

Quote

PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ;

That is what I have been saying though I choose to use the word mankind instead of the word man.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 10 2013,00:23)

Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 09 2013,19:55) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,12:44) T, It seems you are having trouble with the use of English.   Mankind is guilty of the Holocaust. Mankind was the victim of the Holocaust. Mankind brought the Holocaust to and end. Is every man guilty of the Holocaust? Was everyman the victim of the Holocaust? Did every man bring the Holocaust to an end? Mankind is guilty of the sin in the Garden because humans sinned. Not every man is guilty of the sin but only those that committed it. Quote 1Cr 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. This passage is speaking of mankind because it neither states “a man” or “the man”. K' do not get yet ????????? Paul does not talk about humanity ,IT HIS YOU ;PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ; BUT YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ENGLISH UNDERSTANDING AND SO KNOW BETTER , THIS TYPE OF UNDERSTANDING KILLS THE TRUTH OF GOD , SO LEARN TO UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES WITH GOD SPIRIT ;;;NOT YOURS ;;; TELL ME THAT IT IS ME THAT DO NOT UNDERSTAND ENGLISH ;SOME TIMES YOU COULD BE RIGHT ; BUT HAVE NO CLUE OF ANY UNDERSTANDING IN SCRIPTURES ; WHAT DO YOU KNOW HOW DO YOU KNOW I HAVE SHOWN YOU OVER AND OVER AGAIN . TELL HOW WILL YOUR ENGLISH SAVE YOU ???? DON'T WANT TO KNOW ,IT IS YOUR PROBLEM ,FOR OVER FOUR YEARS I TALKED TO YOU .AND SEE HOW YOU THINKING ; T, We are talking about English and in that language saying the action of man is the same as saying the action of mankind. Quote PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ; That is what I have been saying though I choose to use the word mankind instead of the word man.

K

so measure your words with truth in scriptures NOT WITH HUMAN VIEWS ,INTELLECTUAL EGO ,

BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPEN WHEN YOU MOVE AWAY FROM SCRIPTURES ;CONFUSION ,AND IT DOES NOT TEACH THE TRUTH ;BUT DECEIT

[mikeboll64]

Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 09 2013,10:43)

Quote (942767 @ Sep. 09 2013,22:18) Do you see the word “before” in verse 6 above?

My sentiments exactly, Pierre.  

Marty, your God-given common sense should tell you that Jesus was existing in one form BEFORE emptying himself and taking on a different form.

But the only thing you really need to take away from that passage is that Jesus had already been EXISTING when he was made into the likeness of a human being.

I don't really care to have this discussion with you again, Marty.  Believe what you want.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 08 2013,13:19)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 09 2013,00:22) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 07 2013,17:36) What do you mean when you claim Jesus was fathered “directly” by God? I mean that Jesus wasn't made BY God and THROUGH a human father as well. We all have a heavenly Father and a human father.  Jesus was fathered directly by Jehovah Himself. Mike, Are you claiming Jesus was born of natural descent, a husband’s will? If not then please explain?

I'm claiming that Jesus WASN'T born of a husband's will – like all other human beings.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 08 2013,13:25)

A passage in Philippians 2 seems to hint at that possibility but it also seems to hint that he was not a servant and then became one. Is it wise to base a teaching on hints?

Actually, that passage in Phil 2 directly and plainly explains how Jesus was existing in one form BEFORE emptying himself and being made in the likeness of a human being.

It is only those who have personal wishes for Jesus to have been “exactly like us” who twist these easy-to-understand words from Paul……… and pretend that they don't understand the clear message he teaches in Phil 2.

But even if it was just “hinted at” in Phil 2, there are loads of other scriptures that would change the “hint” to a sure thing.  (“I had glory with God before the world began”, “I came down from heaven”, “before Abraham existed, I have been”, etc.)

You guys are as adept at pretending these scriptures (and many more) don't say what they're clearly saying as the Trinitarians are at pretending certain scriptures teach that Jesus is the very God he is the Son of.

I don't have the patience to wade through your and Marty's semantics and word games anymore, Kerwin.

Believe what you want.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 08 2013,17:19)

Mike B. T8,gave a very good analogy regarding the one torch lighting up the second torch, and the second torch lighting up all the torches.

That's akin to a Trinitarian “explanation”, Wakeup.

For the fire of the latter torches is exactly the same as the fire of the first torch.

And Jesus is lesser than his and our God, just like we are lesser than Jesus.

So the analogy doesn't really work, unless you think we are EXACTLY the same as Jesus, who is EXACTLY the same as the God who created him.

[Wakeup]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 10 2013,07:41)

Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 08 2013,17:19) Mike B. T8,gave a very good analogy regarding the one torch lighting up the second torch, and the second torch lighting up all the torches. That's akin to a Trinitarian “explanation”, Wakeup. For the fire of the latter torches is exactly the same as the fire of the first torch. And Jesus is lesser than his and our God, just like we are lesser than Jesus. So the analogy doesn't really work, unless you think we are EXACTLY the same as Jesus, who is EXACTLY the same as the God who created him.

Mike B.

God is the flaming torch;then he brought forth from within him another torch also burning.(torch=body/shape)
(flame=life).
The fuel comes from the first torch(God).
The second torch,which came forth from within the first torch,is also the first torch. Christ in God, and God in Christ.
They are one spirit. God and his word, within him.
Gods Word can not act on it's own.

Let's try again.
God's Word steps out of God,and was given a shape(body). They communicated with one another.
God commands his Word to do the creating.

And also all the communicating: All starting from
creating the heavens and the angels,the earth and Adam.
Dont forget; the power source comes from the father,so *not all have the same power*.

Yes;we will be as Jesus in God,but not with the same power as of God and Jesus,for he is our master,and God our Father. We are not called servants anymore,because God has revealed all his plans to us. Which a master will not do to his servants.

The Word of God is today speaking to us through his printed Words,for they are not just paper and ink.
But there is a strong spiritual message within those words.
And that massage is *the flesh(spiritual) of Christ* that we must digest.

wakeup.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 09 2013,16:50)

The second torch,which came forth from within the first torch,is also the first torch.

Let me stop you right there, Wakeup. The Son OF the Most High God is not also the Most High God.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 09 2013,16:50)

Let's try again. God's Word steps out of God,and was given a shape(body). They communicated with one another. God commands his Word to do the creating.

The first one, as flawed as it was, still made more sense than this one.  

Wakeup, I like you and don't mean to ridicule, because I know you are a serious student of scripture and follower of God.

But God's literal spoken words did NOT come out of God and start speaking back to Him.

Jesus is called “the Word” because he is God's main spokesman.  Jesus is called by this title in only 4 or 5 scriptures in the entire Bible.  All other times, the word “word” simply refers to any word that was spoken, written, or thought by anyone……….. including God.

God's literal spoken words are simply spoken words.

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 10 2013,01:10)

Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 10 2013,00:23) Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 09 2013,19:55) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 09 2013,12:44) T, It seems you are having trouble with the use of English.   Mankind is guilty of the Holocaust. Mankind was the victim of the Holocaust. Mankind brought the Holocaust to and end. Is every man guilty of the Holocaust? Was everyman the victim of the Holocaust? Did every man bring the Holocaust to an end? Mankind is guilty of the sin in the Garden because humans sinned. Not every man is guilty of the sin but only those that committed it. Quote 1Cr 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. This passage is speaking of mankind because it neither states “a man” or “the man”. K' do not get yet ????????? Paul does not talk about humanity ,IT HIS YOU ;PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ; BUT YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ENGLISH UNDERSTANDING AND SO KNOW BETTER , THIS TYPE OF UNDERSTANDING KILLS THE TRUTH OF GOD , SO LEARN TO UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES WITH GOD SPIRIT ;;;NOT YOURS ;;; TELL ME THAT IT IS ME THAT DO NOT UNDERSTAND ENGLISH ;SOME TIMES YOU COULD BE RIGHT ; BUT HAVE NO CLUE OF ANY UNDERSTANDING IN SCRIPTURES ; WHAT DO YOU KNOW HOW DO YOU KNOW I HAVE SHOWN YOU OVER AND OVER AGAIN . TELL HOW WILL YOUR ENGLISH SAVE YOU ???? DON'T WANT TO KNOW ,IT IS YOUR PROBLEM ,FOR OVER FOUR YEARS I TALKED TO YOU .AND SEE HOW YOU THINKING ; T, We are talking about English and in that language saying the action of man is the same as saying the action of mankind. Quote PAUL JUST MENTION THAT IT WAS SOME THING THAT CAME FROM THE ACTION OF MAN ;AND WE KNOW BECAUSE GENESIS STORY ; That is what I have been saying though I choose to use the word mankind instead of the word man. K so measure your words with truth in scriptures NOT WITH HUMAN VIEWS ,INTELLECTUAL EGO , BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT HAPPEN WHEN YOU MOVE AWAY FROM SCRIPTURES ;CONFUSION ,AND IT DOES NOT TEACH THE TRUTH ;BUT DECEIT

T,

Your words confuse me as I am not sure where your disagreement with my words is. As far as I can tell is because of choice of the word “mankind” instead of man and possibly other like word choices.

[Author]

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