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Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 02 2012,01:58) Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 01 2012,05:58) mikebulls'64 actually believes that this idol bovine god Chemosh that the king of Moab sacrificed his son to was an actual living being “god”! 
Frank,Angels and demons do exist and Scripture does call them gods…….
Thank you Kerwin! Some people just can't get this SCRIPTURAL teaching through their heads, because they are blinded by what they've been taught by men.The Bible speaks of numerous gods, of whom Jehovah is the God. And scripture NEVER uses the words “false god”, or “so-called god”. So when the gods of Egypt turned staffs into snakes, it doesn't mean that man-made idols that cannot speak or move somehow had the power to do this.
Frank has a lot to learn about what the scriptures truly teach. For example:
Daniel 10
13 But the prince of the Persian kingdom resisted me twenty-one days. Then Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, because I was detained there with the king of Persia.Who was this “prince of the Persian kingdom”? Surely not a man, since a man could not detain an angel of God, right?
Daniel 10
20 He said, “Do you know why I have come to you? Now I am about to return to engage in battle with the prince of Persia. When I go, the prince of Greece is coming.Who is this “prince of Greece”? Again, obviously not a human being.
We know from scripture that Jehovah gave Satan the kingdoms of the world. (Luke 4:6)
We know that powerful demons exist. And we know that demons and angels are called gods in scripture.
How hard is it to piece together that Satan has handed over the authority of his many kingdoms to those demons who serve him, and that each kingdom worships the demon(s) placed over their kingdom as their god(s)?
Notice that it was Michael who came to Daniel's angel's assistance and battled against the “prince of Persia”. (Dan 10:13) Compare that to who Michael battles against in Rev 12:7……………. “the dragon and his angels”.
Frank, these angels of Satan, or “princes”, are the gods of the nations they rule over. They can do nothing for or against those nations if not allowed by Jehovah, the God of gods. But, just as Jehovah DOES allow mankind to rule over the animals as we see fit – for the most part, He also allows these spiritual sons of God to rule over their nations as they see fit – for the most part. (Consider the things Jehovah ALLOWED Satan to do to Job. He had free reign over Job – up to a certain point.)
I believe this is similar to the Moabite god Chemosh being ALLOWED by Jehovah to act in defense of his kingdom. He had free reign over the Israelites – up to a certain point. He was ALLOWED by his own God to bring wrath, but not physical harm, down upon the Israelites to drive them away.
Consider what Paul said in Ephesians 6:12……..
12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.These “rulers”, “authorities”, “powers” and “spiritual forces” are REAL, Frank. We battle against them. They are not man-made idols that cannot speak or move.
Anyway, I'm quite sure that all this is wasted on you, for you are set in your ways, and don't really care what the scriptures actually teach.
Quote (jammin @ Oct. 01 2012,04:57) limjunus, the bible said Christ left us an example.
And how exactly does Christ leaving us an example equate to “Jesus is God Most High”?
How does it equate to “God Almighty prayed to, obeyed, and worshiped Himself to show us how it was done”?
jammin, you very rarely address the actual point in question.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2012,04:19) Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Sep. 30 2012,16:05) There is no mention in Scripture of “a man-made idol [“god”] that couldn't speak [or could] or move [or could] who turned staffs into snakes, and water into blood, and made frogs cover the land in Egypt.”
Okay Frank,Then by whose power did the priests of Egypt match the first three signs and wonders that Jehovah did through Moses? For example, can human beings turn staffs into snakes? Yet the Egyptian priests WERE able to do this – and turn water into blood, and make frogs cover the land.
1. By whose power did these priest do these things, Frank?
2. And who were the “gods of Egypt” that Jehovah punished? (Exodus 12:12, Numbers 33:4, etc.) Were these “gods of Egypt” merely man-made idols that couldn't speak or move? How does Jehovah “punish”, or “bring judgment upon” a man-made idol that couldn't speak or move?
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Sep. 30 2012,16:05) You also need to read 2 Kings 3:27 as it is related within it's proper context…………. There also is most certainly no mention of “a man-made idol that couldn't [or could] speak or move [or could] who brought great wrath down on God's nation in 2 Kings 3:27″!
Okay, let's discuss the context of 2 Kings 3 then. The way I understand it, Elisha told the three kings that Jehovah would deliver Moab into their hands. (3:18)Then the Israelites slaughtered the Moabites, cut down their trees, and stopped up their springs and wells with stones.(3:24-25)
When all seemed lost, the king of Moab tried to fight through to the king of Edom. (3:26)
When that failed, he sacrificed his son (presumably to his god Chemosh). Immediately after this sacrifice, a severe wrath came upon the Israelites, causing them to flee for home instead of continuing their destruction of Moab. (3:27)
3. WHO brought this wrath down upon the Israelites after the king sacrificed his son to his god Chemosh?
mikebulls'64,Scripture nowhere mentions that Pharaoh's “MAGICIANS” used the power of “gods” to perform their tricks! Yes, human beings can SEEMINGLY turn staffs into snakes, water into blood and cause frogs to cover the land. They are called illusionist or magicians! Should I take it that you also believe that David Copperfield made the Statue of Liberty LITERALLY vanish by the power of “gods”?
Pharaoh then summoned wise men and sorcerers, and the Egyptian MAGICIANS[/I] also did the same things BY THEIR SECRET ARTS: Each one threw down his staff and it became a snake. But Aaron's staff swallowed up their staffs (Exodus 7:11-12 – New International Version ©1984).
What translation are you using that suggests that Father Yahweh “punished” any of YOUR so-called “LIVING BEING GODS”? Obviously Father Yahweh judges the gods of the nations as “nothing” and “not gods at all (having no power whatsoever)” just as I also judge YOUR “Gods”!
It seems that you are siding with Mesha's erroneous report on the Moabite Stone, that his pagan god Chemosh had power in defeated Ysryl, right? Please consider the following excerpt and it's source:
THE GREAT INDIGNATION THAT CAME AGAINST ISRAEL
Verses 26, 27
And when the king of Moab saw that the battle was too sore for him, he took with him seven hundred men that drew sword, to break through unto the king of Edom; but they could not. Then he took his eldest son that should have reigned in his stead, and offered him for a burnt-offering upon the wall. And there was great wrath against Israel: and they departed from him, and returned to their own land.The best explanation of what happened here is perhaps that of Honeycutt. “The scene of the king sacrificing his oldest son on the wall, the one destined to succeed him as king, so moved and excited the Moabites that they fell upon the coalition and defeated it.”F12 It is certainly ridiculous to suppose, as Mesha reported it on the Moabite Stone, that his pagan god Chemosh defeated Israel.
He took seven hundred men. to break through to the king of Edom
(2 Kings 3:26). In this maneuver, Mesha, the king of Moab, evidently supposed that the king of Edom, a vassal of Jehoshaphat, might actually change sides and help him, or at least be a less enthusiastic fighter than others of the coalition. Montgomery called this passage a contradictionF13 of the fact of Edom being a part of the coalition. However, he merely misunderstood the thinking of Mesha.
And there was great wrath against Israel
(2 Kings 3:27). The source of this wrath is NOT stated, and scholars have different views of its origin. Keil believed that, The Israelites brought upon themselves the wrath of God by occasioning the offering of an abominable human sacrifice.F14 Adam Clarke agreed with that view, writing that, The Lord was displeased with Israel for driving things to such an extremity.F15 Jackson declared that, The great wrath that came upon Israel was from the god of Moab who accepted the human sacrifice of his worshippers.F16
We cannot agree with either of these opinions. God would hardly have been angry with Israel for carrying out the same kind of victorious destruction of Moab that God's prophet had prophesied, as Keil thought. Nor is it possible to suppose that a nonentity like Chemosh, the Moabite's pagan god, could either have “accepted” or “rejected” anything. However, in this case, it must be admitted that the defeat of Israel following Mesha's appeal to Chemosh by the sacrifice of his son and heir gave that pagan ruler ample excuse for attributing the victory to his pagan god. In this connection, the words of Dentan are helpful:
“It may seem strange that our Bible would contain a story that can be interpreted as teaching the efficacy of human sacrifice, even such a sacrifice to a heathen god, Chemosh of the Moabites; but this is another striking bit of evidence of basic honesty.”F17
If there had been any such person as that mythical Deuteronomist so sternly jealous of the honor of the One True God and his unique sanctuary in Jerusalem, why would he have allowed anything like this to appear in the Bible? The existence of it proves that no such person existed!
Another possible explanation of Israel's repulse here is that of LaSor:
“It is possible that the Israelites believed that human sacrifice was efficacious to Chemosh in his own land, because the popular beliefs of the Israelites were often in opposition to revealed truth, as spoken by the prophets.”F18 If that was the case, it is easy to see how there might have ensued a general panic following the sacrifice of Mesha's son.
It appears, therefore, that the great wrath that came upon Israel was that of the Moabites who were aroused to a fran
tic frenzy by their kings abominable sacrifice of his son. At any rate, the campaign ended then and there.END EXCERPT
SOURCEYou have a lot to learn about what Scripture truly teaches, but it is quite obvious that you choose to instead pervert Father Yahweh's inspired prophetic word to your own destruction!
WHO IS THE WORD?
John Chapter OneELOHIM: ONE, OR MORE THAN ONE?
Exodus 32
By Voy Wilks
3/9/98The Pre-existence
Philippians 2:5-11
By Voy Wilks
1/29/92Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?
…
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2012,05:15) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 02 2012,01:58) Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 01 2012,05:58) mikebulls'64 actually believes that this idol bovine god Chemosh that the king of Moab sacrificed his son to was an actual living being “god”!
Frank,Angels and demons do exist and Scripture does call them gods…….
Thank you Kerwin! Some people just can't get this SCRIPTURAL teaching through their heads, because they are blinded by what they've been taught by men.The Bible speaks of numerous gods, of whom Jehovah is the God. And scripture NEVER uses the words “false god”, or “so-called god”. So when the gods of Egypt turned staffs into snakes, it doesn't mean that man-made idols that cannot speak or move somehow had the power to do this.
Frank has a lot to learn about what the scriptures truly teach. For example:
Daniel 10
13 But the prince of the Persian kingdom resisted me twenty-one days. Then Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, because I was detained there with the king of Persia.Who was this “prince of the Persian kingdom”? Surely not a man, since a man could not detain an angel of God, right?
Daniel 10
20 He said, “Do you know why I have come to you? Now I am about to return to engage in battle with the prince of Persia. When I go, the prince of Greece is coming.Who is this “prince of Greece”? Again, obviously not a human being.
We know from scripture that Jehovah gave Satan the kingdoms of the world. (Luke 4:6)
We know that powerful demons exist. And we know that demons and angels are called gods in scripture.
How hard is it to piece together that Satan has handed over the authority of his many kingdoms to those demons who serve him, and that each kingdom worships the demon(s) placed over their kingdom as their god(s)?
Notice that it was Michael who came to Daniel's angel's assistance and battled against the “prince of Persia”. (Dan 10:13) Compare that to who Michael battles against in Rev 12:7……………. “the dragon and his angels”.
Frank, these angels of Satan, or “princes”, are the gods of the nations they rule over. They can do nothing for or against those nations if not allowed by Jehovah, the God of gods. But, just as Jehovah DOES allow mankind to rule over the animals as we see fit – for the most part, He also allows these spiritual sons of God to rule over their nations as they see fit – for the most part. (Consider the things Jehovah ALLOWED Satan to do to Job. He had free reign over Job – up to a certain point.)
I believe this is similar to the Moabite god Chemosh being ALLOWED by Jehovah to act in defense of his kingdom. He had free reign over the Israelites – up to a certain point. He was ALLOWED by his own God to bring wrath, but not physical harm, down upon the Israelites to drive them away.
Consider what Paul said in Ephesians 6:12……..
12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.These “rulers”, “authorities”, “powers” and “spiritual forces” are REAL, Frank. We battle against them. They are not man-made idols that cannot speak or move.
Anyway, I'm quite sure that all this is wasted on you, for you are set in your ways, and don't really care what the scriptures actually teach.
mikebulls'64,You are quite right in saying all this is wasted on me concerning your belief that the gods that you worship have power, since I have told you many times “I am no mere “god” worshiper!”
In fact, I will tell you again as I have told you from Jump Street, “I do not wish to enter into a discussion or a dispute with you concerning ANYTHING that you have to say!”, but you can persist in doing so until you are blue in the face for all I care, since you so enjoy continuing to be owned on the very forum that you co-moderate!
WHO IS THE WORD?
John Chapter OneELOHIM: ONE, OR MORE THAN ONE?
Exodus 32
By Voy Wilks
3/9/98The Pre-existence
Philippians 2:5-11
By Voy Wilks
1/29/92Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?
…
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2012,06:09) Quote (jammin @ Oct. 01 2012,04:57) limjunus, the bible said Christ left us an example.
And how exactly does Christ leaving us an example equate to “Jesus is God Most High”? How does it equate to “God Almighty prayed to, obeyed, and worshiped Himself to show us how it was done”?
jammin, you very rarely address the actual point in question.
mike,i believe what apostle paul said.
he is equal with God
Philippians 2:6GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
6 Although he was in the form of God and equal with God,
you are just making things complicated
read and believe what the bible said. do not add your own words in the bible.sorry boy but you are a false teacher. your doctrine is not in the bible.
the bible said christ left us an example
the bible said he is equal with God.Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 02 2012,18:58) Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 01 2012,05:58) mikebulls'64 actually believes that this idol bovine god Chemosh that the king of Moab sacrificed his son to was an actual living being “god”!
Frank,Looks like a minotaur. A Greek hero is said to have killed one of those demons; the issue if a woman cursed with unholy lust towards a bull. The four arms are new to me.
Obviously someone took some liberties with the truth but there are beasts numbered among the host of God; and therefore reasonably among the angels of Satan.
Revelation 19:4
King James Version (KJV)4 And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia.
Angels and demons do exist and Scripture does call them gods; nevertheless there is but one true God that is the source of all righteous things and the only one worthy to be worshiped. To worship an angel as if he/she were Jehovah is an abomination.
kerwin,The Chemosh image that I presented is nothing more than an artist's rendition. Following are some artists renditions of mikebulls'64's so-called “powerful god” Baal/Molech/Chemosh:
Well! Would you look at that! It actually is a “living being god” just as mikebulls'64 had proclaimed, since it is obviously holding a child! I mean, it has to be an actual “living being god” for it to hold a child, right?
Look ma! No hands! Ooops! Dropped the child right into my fiery lap!
You seemed to have a problem with this so-called “god” having four arms, so here I have presented you with some artists renditions with IT having only two arms. Whether these renditions be “TRUE“? or not (?
?) …, since I have never read anywhere in Scripture where it had said that IT had two, three, or any arms at all. You and mikebulls'64 can worship your FALSE “gods” till you are blue in the face for all I care! For me and my house though, I believe that will will only worship the ONE AND ONLY TRUE Mighty One, Father Yahweh!
But if serving Yahweh seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves at this point in time whom you will serve, whether the gods your forefathers served beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you are living. But as for me and my household, we will serve Yahweh! (Yahshua 24:15).
WHO IS THE WORD?
John Chapter OneELOHIM: ONE, OR MORE THAN ONE?
Exodus 32
By Voy Wilks
3/9/98The Pre-existence
Philippians 2:5-11
By Voy Wilks
1/29/92Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?
…
Frank,
This is what Scripture states.
Deuteronomy 32:17
King James Version (KJV)17 They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new gods that came newly up, whom your fathers feared not.
Obviously they in some manner sacrificed unto devils; which this passage also calls gods.
Demons have powers; just as angels do.
Deuteronomy 13
King James Version (KJV)1 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder,
2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;
3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the Lord your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.So if a magician giveth a sign of wonder, and it come to pass, then Jehovah is proving you.
This is a Skeptical Age; beware less it lead you astray.
Jehovah does not share in the nature of angels, man, or beast as he is not created and they are.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 03 2012,15:11) Frank, This is what Scripture states.
Deuteronomy 32:17
King James Version (KJV)17 They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new gods that came newly up, whom your fathers feared not.
Obviously they in some manner sacrificed unto devils; which this passage also calls gods.
Demons have powers; just as angels do.
Deuteronomy 13
King James Version (KJV)1 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder,
2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;
3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the Lord your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.So if a magician giveth a sign of wonder, and it come to pass, then Jehovah is proving you.
This is a Skeptical Age; beware less it lead you astray.
Jehovah does not share in the nature of angels, man, or beast as he is not created and they are.
kerwin,I have alraedy made it quite clear to you and everyone else here from Scripture in CONTEXT and with SCRIPTURE AS A WHOLE that it clearly makes known and teaches that theses SO-CALLED or FALSE “gods” are “nothing” or “no gods at all”. You can take one verse of Scripture out of CONTEXT of SCRIPTURE AS A WHOLE and build your “own private interpretation” till you are blue in the face for all I care, but Scripture says and teaches AS A WHOLE the following concerning these SO-CALLED or FALSE “gods”:
From your KJV version:
They sacrificed unto devils, NOT TO GOD [This translation is clearly giving reference to Father Yahweh the ONE and ONLY TRUE Mighty One]; to [FALSE or SO-CALLED] gods whom THEY KNEW NOT, to NEW GODS THAT CAME NEWLY UP, whom YOUR FATHERS FEARED NOT – http://www.bible.cc/deuteronomy/32-17.htm .
Note that it says “… to NEW GODS THAT CAME NEWLY UP …”. Now, where did these “NEW GODS THAT CAME NEWLY UP” come from. Do you believe that Father Yahweh all of the sudden created these “NEW GODS THAT CAME NEWLY UP” and gave them power, [authority], strength or might? If so, you are greatly deceived!
The word translated as “god” has it's origin from the Hebrew root 'yl, ul, or wl' and simly means power [authority], strength, or might. In accordance with Scripture, it is Father Yahweh Who is the ONE and ONLY TRUE source of power [authority], srength or might. ALL other so-called or false “gods” have no power [authority], strength or might whatsoever and Father Yahweh most certainly would not give these false or so-called “gods” power [authority], strength or might and they most certainly have no power [authority], strength or might of their own. For example, the compition that was set up between Yahweh and Baal clearly showed that Baal had no power whatsoever.
As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto *idols [“gods”], we know that an *idol [or “a god”] IS NOTHING IN THE WORLD, and that there is NONE OTHER God [“Mighty One” or source of power] BUT ONE [Again, this ONE and ONLY source of power in this translation is clearly giving reference to Father Yahweh.] – http://www.bible.cc/1_corinthians/8-4.htm
*NOTE
For ALL the gods of the nations are idols, but Yahweh made the heavens (Psalm 96:5; 1 Chronicles 16:26).
Now note what Barnes' Notes on the Bible says:For all the gods of the nations are idols – All the gods worshipped by the people of other lands are mere “idols.” None of them can claim to have a real existence as gods. The word here rendered “idols” is translated by the Septuagint, δαιμόνια daimonia, “demons.” So the Latin Vulgate “daemonia.” The Hebrew word – אליל 'ĕlı̂yl – means properly “of nothing, nought, empty, vain.” See Job 13:4. The meaning here is, that they were mere nothings; they had no real existence; they were the creations of the imagination; they could not in any sense be regarded as what it was pretended they were; they had no claim to reverence and worship as gods. Of most of them it was a fact that they had no existence at all, but were mere creatures of fancy. Of those that did really exist, as the sun, moon, stars, animals, or the spirits of departed people, though it was true that they had an actual existence, yet it was also true that they had no existence “as gods,” or as entitled to worship; and hence, it was also true that the worship offered to them was as vain as that which was offered to mere beings of the imagination. This verse is extracted literally from 1 Chronicles 16:26. The Hebrew is the same.
SOURCE: http://bible.cc/psalms/96-5.htmEven Yahshua made it quite clear that he could do nothing on his own:
By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but Him Who sent me (Yahchanan 5:30).
Yahshua had no power [authority], strength or might on his own, but he received his power [authority], strength or might from on high from his and our Father Yahweh. This is why he had clearly said that ALL power [authority] had been GIVEN to him in heaven and in the earth (Mattithyah 28:18; cf. 9:6).
WHO IS THE WORD?
John Chapter OneELOHIM: ONE, OR MORE THAN ONE?
Exodus 32
By Voy Wilks
3/9/98The Pre-existence
Philippians 2:5-11
By Voy Wilks
1/29/92Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?
…
mikeboll64,Sep. wrote:[/quote]
Quote Read again Acts 2:22, Charles. It was GOD who did the works THROUGH His HOLY SERVANT Jesus Christ. Mike,
It seems, you are about to admit that Jesus is God in flesh, since
GOD WAS IN HIS HOLY SERVANT JESUS’FLESH BODY.In view of your above statement ,regarding the word SERVANT.
I WOULD LIKE YOU TO CLARIFY YOUR mentality DEU TO THE FACT THAT SCRIPTURE STATES :
IN THE FORM OF A SERVANT, Which is quite different.
DON’T YOU THINK SO???READ and compare these scriptures,
Philippians 2:6 Who, being in the
FORM OF GOD,
thought it not robbery to be equal with God: (SO JESUS IS EQUAL WITH GOD!!)
compared WITH:
Philippians:2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the
FORM OF A SERVANT,
and was made in the likeness of men:
Now:
How come YOU considered JESUS a SERVANT when scripture used the term :
THE FORM OF A SERVANT???
And in the previous verse, YOU did not consider Jesus GOD ALTHOUGH SCRIPTURE USED ALSO THE TERM:
THE FORM OF GOD???
If according to you when it stated
IN THE FORM OF a servant, HE IS A SERVANT,
why isn’t He also GOD when it is also stated IN THE FORM OF GOD???
! NOW:
You are convinced that Jesus is only the Son of God, but not God.
Reflect on this:
You as son of man, have a CARNAL FATHER, therefore you are also MAN like your father.
Why is it so difficult to accept that:
Jesus as SON OF GOD and have GOD as FATHER He is also God???
And in the same instant you accept that He was a son of man, therefore MAN notwithstanding the fact that He had no carnal father???
NOW TO YOUR CONTRADICTION:
You stated:Quote Read again Acts 2:22, Charles. It was GOD who did the works THROUGH His HOLY SERVANT Jesus Christ.
You also stated:Quote God Almighty never prayed to God Almighty, Charles. But Jesus did – many times. So, “NO”, he wasn't “the true God manifested”. He is, was, and has always been the Son of God – from the very first moment God brought him into existence.
Let’s start with Acts 2:22:
Acts 2:22 ………………..which God did by him
Mike the way I see it, it’s clear enough,
GOD DID BY HIM!!
How?? Obvious God conceived Mary,(JESUS’SPIRIT transformed through nature and born AS WOMAN) BY THE HOLY SPIRIT FROM THE FATHER, AND BECAME MAN.
Isn’ it clear enough that THE FATHER HIMSELF ABIDED IN JESUS.
Read:
Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead BODILY.
It is even more clear in the above scripture Mike!!
So the only body God has is JESUS’
Now:
Reflecting on your statementsIT IS OBVIOUS, THAT WHEN IT PLEASES YOU GOD DID HIS WORKS THROUGH JESUS, BUT WHEN IT DOESN’T,
IT WAS JESUS THAT DID HIS WORKS!!!( Like when he was praying)IF THE GODHEAD IS IN JESUS' BODY, IT ISN'T GOD HIMSELF AS MAN IN JESUS WHO IS PRAYING TO HIS FATHER IN HEAVEN???
TOTAL CONFUSION MIKE:
IT’S EITHER ONE OR THE OTHER!!
IT IS EITHER ALWAYS THE FATHER WORKS IN JESUS IN EVERY WAY HE LIKES, WHICH DEFINITELY IT IS, OR NOT.
So without realizing with your own words you are admitting that JESUS IS GOD MANIFESTED:Reflect on your own words Mike AGAIN!!
Quote God Almighty never prayed to God Almighty, Charles. But Jesus did With these words above you are declaring that JESUS IS GOD.
YES MIKE I KNOW THAT YOU ARE PUZZLED,BUT A PERSON LIKE YOU WOULD NEVER SEE THE TRUTH REGARDING JESUS, BUT I WILL GUIDE YOU THROUGH A QUESTION, IN ORDER TO REFLECT WHAT I MEAN OTHERWISE YOU WOULD REMAIN IN THE DARK:
WHAT GOD ACQUIRED THROUGH JESUS, WHICH HE NEVER HAD, BEFORE, although He could have achieved it in a flick of time, BUT OPTED TO REALIZE IT IN MILLIONS,AND MILLIONS OF YEARS, SIMPLY TO ALLOW OUR EVIL WORLD TO EXIST,AND THROUGH THAT SAME EVIL, HE ADDED TO HIS ATTRIBUTES???
Isaiah;45; 7 I (GOD) form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD ( CHRIST)do all these things.(THROUGH MY FATHER BY THE HOLY SPIRIT)
YOUR CONFUSIONS REIGN:
Quote He is, was, and has always been the Son of God – from the very first moment God brought him into existence. SO the SON OF GOD WAS NOT ALWAYS IN EXISTENCE
You mean as MAN/GOD, NOT AS GOD BECAUSE AS GOD SCRIPTURE IS CLEAR:HE WAS, IS ,AND REMAINS ETERNAL WITH THE FATHER.
NOW read and confirm through scripture!!JOHN 1:1:2 For the life was MANIFESTED; and we have seen and do bear witness, and declare unto you the LIFE ETERNAL, which was with the Father, and hath appeared to us:
Isaiah 45:14 Thus saith the LORD,( THE FATHER, THE SON, OR BOTH???)
The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, ( UNTO WHOM ,THE FATHER, THE SON OR BOTH???)
saying, Surely GOD IS IN YOU; ( IN WHOM??? IN THE FATHER, IN THE SON , OR IN BOTH: I’M IN THE FATHER,AND THE FATHER IS IN ME)
and there is none else, there is no God.
15Verily thou art a God that hidest thyself,(IN WHERE
OBVIOUS IN JESUS’ SPIRIT, SOUL AND BODY)Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead BODILY.
O God of Israel, the Saviour. (THE FATHER THE SON OR BOTH???)
16They shall be ashamed, and also confounded, all of them: they shall go to CONFUSION together that are makers of idols.
Peace and love in Jesus
Charlescharles
Quote It seems, you are about to admit that Jesus is God in flesh, since
GOD WAS IN HIS HOLY SERVANT JESUS’FLESH BODY.Is the vice president acting in some president activity for any reason ,would this actions of his make him president
yes or noQuote (terraricca @ Oct. 04 2012,12:33) charles Quote It seems, you are about to admit that Jesus is God in flesh, since
GOD WAS IN HIS HOLY SERVANT JESUS’FLESH BODY.Is the vice president acting in some president activity for any reason ,would this actions of his make him president
yes or no
We must stick to the proper knowledge given by the true preachers of God.The true God, is only one. He is spirit in nature, invisible, never died and Father of all and He has no Vice-God.
President: There are many president and true Vice President and we should not compare the one true and only true God with them.
As what God, warning us. “WHOM YOU HAVE COMPARE ME?”
Quote Is the vice president acting in some president activity for any reason ,would this actions of his make him president yes or noTerraricca,
It seems to me that for you there is no difference:
BETWEEN GOD AND HIS EVIL CARNAL CREATURES
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 04 2012,12:33) charles Quote It seems, you are about to admit that Jesus is God in flesh, since
GOD WAS IN HIS HOLY SERVANT JESUS’FLESH BODY.Is the vice president acting in some president activity for any reason ,would this actions of his make him president
yes or no
the vice president is not the president but they are both HUMAN by nature. and hUMAN by nature is limited unlike God by nature.Quote (jammin @ Oct. 05 2012,04:24) Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 04 2012,12:33) charles Quote It seems, you are about to admit that Jesus is God in flesh, since
GOD WAS IN HIS HOLY SERVANT JESUS’FLESH BODY.Is the vice president acting in some president activity for any reason ,would this actions of his make him president
yes or no
the vice president is not the president but they are both HUMAN by nature. and hUMAN by nature is limited unlike God by nature.
carmel and JaminnQuote the vice president is not the president but they are both HUMAN by nature. and hUMAN by nature is limited unlike God by nature. you have been sold to your own will and desires,and are rolling in your own garments ,constructing out of scriptures what it does not mean or say,so their is no truth in your hearts ,and so have stopped to progress in your knowledge ,and remained in the only constructed lies you still believe ,because of your contesting hearts.
it is useless to talk to you guys ,you do not even understand your own comments
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,15:40) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2012,04:19)
1. By whose power did these priest do these things, Frank?2. And who were the “gods of Egypt” that Jehovah punished? (Exodus 12:12, Numbers 33:4, etc.) Were these “gods of Egypt” merely man-made idols that couldn't speak or move? How does Jehovah “punish”, or “bring judgment upon” a man-made idol that couldn't speak or move?
3. WHO brought this wrath down upon the Israelites after the king sacrificed his son to his god Chemosh?
mikebulls'64,1. Scripture nowhere mentions that Pharaoh's “MAGICIANS” used the power of “gods” to perform their tricks! Yes, human beings can SEEMINGLY turn staffs into snakes, water into blood and cause frogs to cover the land.
Frank,I am surprised to see that you actually addressed my questions for once! Good for you!
Your answer to my first question is that the Egyptians didn't really turn staffs into snakes and water into blood, but that Moses and Aaron, who were standing right there, were duped by slight of hand illusions. Is that it?
1. Does your explanation truly match what those scriptures say, Frank? Don't those scriptures say that the Egyptians “did the same thing”? If by “same thing”, it is meant that the Egyptians pulled a slight of hand illusion, then it means that Aaron's staff turning into a snake was ALSO a slight of hand illusion. Your explanation is lacking, and doesn't align with the actual words of the scriptures.
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,15:40) 2. What translation are you using that suggests that Father Yahweh “punished” any of YOUR so-called “LIVING BEING GODS”? Obviously Father Yahweh judges the gods of the nations as “nothing” and “not gods at all (having no power whatsoever)”………..
The Contemporary English Version (CEV) has “punished the gods of Egypt” in Exodus 12:12 and Numbers 33:4. The Douay-Rheims Bible has “upon their gods also he had executed vengeance“.Most versions have “executed judgments”. But my point remains the same, Frank: How does the Creator of the universe “execute a judgment” upon a man-made idol that cannot speak or move?
Numbers 33:3-4 American King James Version
For the Egyptians buried all their firstborn, which the LORD had smitten among them: on their gods also the LORD executed judgments.If the smiting of the firstborns was a real thing, then why would you think the passing of judgment upon the gods was something other than real?
Consider:
Psalm 82:1
God stands in the assembly of El; in the midst of the gods he renders judgment.Does this “judgment” also concern man-made idols who cannot speak or move? Do these idols congregate with Jehovah in “the assembly of El”?
Frank, your explanation that Jehovah executed judgment upon man-made idols who cannot speak or move is lacking. If your understanding were to be accepted, Jehovah would REALLY be passing judgment upon the MEN who MADE these idols – thinking they were gods. The judgment would not REALLY fall upon pieces of wood and stone.
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,15:40) 3. Please consider the following excerpt and it's source: THE GREAT INDIGNATION THAT CAME AGAINST ISRAEL
The best explanation of what happened here is perhaps that of Honeycutt. “The scene of the king sacrificing his oldest son on the wall, the one destined to succeed him as king, so moved and excited the Moabites that they fell upon the coalition and defeated it.”
Hmmmm……………. The passage doesn't SAY these things though, does it? Also, this interpretation goes against the words in verse 18, where Elisha prophesied about Jehovah: “he will also hand Moab over to you”. It also goes against the rest of the passage, where we learn that the Israelites completely slaughtered the Moabites. The above interpretation calls for a MOABITE victory, since it calls for the MOABITES rallying and sending the Israelites running for the hills. In fact, your source says, …..it must be admitted that the defeat of Israel following Mesha's appeal to Chemosh by the sacrifice of his son…... The “defeat of Israel”? I thought God promised a victory for Israel. Consider these other words from your source:
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,15:40) It is certainly ridiculous to suppose, as Mesha reported it on the Moabite Stone, that his pagan god Chemosh defeated Israel. Nor is it possible to suppose that a nonentity like Chemosh, the Moabite's pagan god, could either have “accepted” or “rejected” anything.
Frank, are you unable to see this circular reasoning? They are stating, in effect, Since we've already accepted the fact that Chemosh is a “non-entity”, we must now try to figure out a DIFFERENT explanation for the events described.The underlined part is where they fail, Frank. They have accepted as truth what they don't really know to be truth.
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,15:40) “It may seem strange that our Bible would contain a story that can be interpreted as teaching the efficacy of human sacrifice, even such a sacrifice to a heathen god, Chemosh of the Moabites; but this is another striking bit of evidence of basic honesty.”
Do you see that last word “honesty”? If the Bible was HONESTLY written to teach that the Moabite king sacrificed his son to his god, and then wrath came upon the Israelites, who are we to let our own personal pre-conceptions get in the way of this HONESTY?Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,15:40) Jackson declared that, The great wrath that came upon Israel was from the god of Moab who accepted the human sacrifice of his worshippers.
This is the ONLY LOGICAL conclusion for those of us who aren't already pre-disposed to the fantasy that Jehovah is the ONLY power in the heavens. Read the words of Paul once more, Frank:Ephesians 6:12
For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.IS Jehovah the ONLY power in the heavens, Frank? And why would our struggle be against man-made idols that cannot speak or move?
These are REAL powers and REAL spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. We are powerless against them. They can crush us like a bug any time they want to. It is for this reason that we must relinquish any idea we have of our own human strength, ability, and intelligence – and realize that we must let our God protect us from these powers, and let Him fight this battle for us.
Quote (jammin @ Oct. 02 2012,16:59) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2012,06:09) And how exactly does Christ leaving us an example equate to “Jesus is God Most High”?
mike,i believe what apostle paul said.
he is equal with God
Philippians 2:6
In Phil 2:6, Paul teaches that Christ didn't consider equality with his God was a thing to be grasped.But at least you are ALMOST acknowledging that Christ being an example does NOT mean Christ is God Almighty. That is a step in the right direction – which brings us back to my question:
jammin, do you think that God Almighty prayed to, obeyed, and worshiped HIMSELF to show us how it is supposed to be done? YES or NO?
Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Oct. 02 2012,17:27) You and mikebulls'64 can worship your FALSE “gods” till you are blue in the face for all I care!
Frank,Why do you post that Kerwin and I “worship” other gods? Have either of us ever given any indication that we “worship” any god other than Jehovah, the God OF these other gods”?
Please post accurately about the other members here – to the best of your ability. Failure to do so will result in tiles. Also, address the members here by their user names, or a RESPECTABLE equivalent. If you purposely butcher the other members names here anymore, it will also result in a tile.
You can address me as “mikeboll 64”, or “mike”, or “m” or “64”, or things to that effect. You are not allowed anymore to address me as “mikebulls'64”. Nor will you address Terraricca as “Pie-ear”.
Grow up and show some common courtesy, or go somewhere else.
Quote (jammin @ Oct. 04 2012,04:24) the vice president is not the president but they are both HUMAN by nature…………
So then you understand that Jesus (vice-president) is not God Almighty (The President)? Good for you, jammin.Quote (carmel @ Oct. 03 2012,13:54) Mike, It seems, you are about to admit that Jesus is God in flesh, since
GOD WAS IN HIS HOLY SERVANT JESUS’FLESH BODY.
No Charles,Because, unlike you, I am able to understand the DIFFERENCE between “God was in him” and “He was God”.
God was also in Moses, doing the signs and wonders for Pharaoh. Surely you don't think that means Moses was God Almighty, do you?
Quote (carmel @ Oct. 03 2012,13:54) How come YOU considered JESUS a SERVANT when scripture used the term :
THE FORM OF A SERVANT???
Scripture calls Jesus a SERVANT of God 4 different times in Acts.Quote (carmel @ Oct. 03 2012,13:54) You are convinced that Jesus is only the Son of God, but not God.
Yes Charles. Just as I would be convinced that the son of the President is not the President he is the son of.I find it fascinating that certain people, who must believe astronomically astounding things to keep their man-made doctrine afloat, would point the finger at us – implying that WE are the ones understanding things illogically.
You seem truly shocked that I would come to the conclusion that Jesus is not God from the information that he is the Son of God. Yet that is the only logical conclusion to which a sane person would ever come.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 05 2012,02:18)
jammin, do you think that God Almighty prayed to, obeyed, and worshiped HIMSELF to show us how it is supposed to be done? YES or NO?
Hi Mike,Good luck on getting this question answered!
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
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