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WJ…….According to Jeff Benner, a Hebrew Scholar the word GOD was view by the ancient Hebrews as a uni-Plural word meaning POWERS. It's originally pictorial symbol, was the head of an OX with a STAFF, the Ox symbol was the prime symbol for Power, and the Staff was what they leaned on for support. This was to them the symbol of the GOD of ISREAL. He was the POWER they LEANED on or TRUSTED IN. And if you takes this and apply it to Scriptures you can easily see how it fits. GOD the FATHER is the true POWER we and Jesus Lean or trust IN. Now if you apply this with the understanding that (ALL) POWERS came into existence by the ONE true POWER and was given from HIM to HIS CREATION, everything falls into place. WE are God's as Well as Jesus, but there is still (ONLY) ONE TRUE GOD were we derived our POWERS. When scripture speaks of false God's it is referencing Objects of Worship other than the ONE and ONLY TRUE GOD, not the fact that men are Gods and Sons of GOD, but putting something in HIS EXCLUSIVE PLACE IN OUR LIVES> WJ in John 1:1……> it could be read in the beginning was the word (expressed intelligence) and the word (expressed intelligence) was GOD (POWERS) and WAS POWERS. This is what created everything in existence in the beginning and distribute different POWERS to His creation. IT was the ONE ONLY (TRUE) GOD (POWER) as Jesus SAID.
gene
WJ and Thinker and CA…………> drop the trinity garbage, and let the TRUTH have a place in your lives, as long as you hold on to those false teachings you will not grow in understanding> IMO
Peace and Love……………….gene
Quote (Gene @ Sep. 30 2009,10:22) WJ…….According to Jeff Benner, a Hebrew Scholar the word GOD was view by the ancient Hebrews as a uni-Plural word meaning POWERS. It's originally pictorial symbol, was the head of an OX with a STAFF, the Ox symbol was the prime symbol for Power, and the Staff was what they leaned on for support. This was to them the symbol of the GOD of ISREAL. He was the POWER they LEANED on or TRUSTED IN. And if you takes this and apply it to Scriptures you can easily see how it fits. GOD the FATHER is the true POWER we and Jesus Lean or trust IN. Now if you apply this with the understanding that (ALL) POWERS came into existence by the ONE true POWER and was given from HIM to HIS CREATION, everything falls into place. WE are God's as Well as Jesus, but there is still (ONLY) ONE TRUE GOD were we derived our POWERS. When scripture speaks of false God's it is referencing Objects of Worship other than the ONE and ONLY TRUE GOD, not the fact that men are Gods and Sons of GOD, but putting something in HIS EXCLUSIVE PLACE IN OUR LIVES> WJ in John 1:1……> it could be read in the beginning was the word (expressed intelligence) and the word (expressed intelligence) was GOD (POWERS) and WAS POWERS. This is what created everything in existence in the beginning and distribute different POWERS to His creation. IT was the ONE ONLY (TRUE) GOD (POWER) as Jesus SAID. gene
GeneJust as I figured. No Greek concordance or Lexicon to support your theory that “God” means “powers”.
Jeff Brenner is not even a Greek or Hebrew scholar. His and your teaching has its roots in Gnostosism!
WJ
WJ………..If you really read the beliefs of the Gnostic's, you would see they and your belief are almost the exact same. And Jeff Benner is Highly acclaimed and recognized as a Ancient HEBREW SCHOLAR. Go to his web site and check it out for yourself, False accusations may distort truth but it can never change it WJ>
peace and love…………………gene
Quote (Gene @ Sep. 30 2009,10:52) WJ………..If you really read the beliefs of the Gnostic's, you would see they and your belief are almost the exact same. And Jeff Benner is Highly acclaimed and recognized as a Ancient HEBREW SCHOLAR. Go to his web site and check it out for yourself, False accusations may distort truth but it can never change it WJ> peace and love…………………gene
GeneI have looked everywhere for his credentials, and there is no evidence he has a Degree in Biblical Hebrew and Greek!
He is not even on “Wikipedia”.
Maybe you can show us since you are making this claim.
WJ
wj………..Go and type Jeff Benner on your computer and see for yourself he has a Pictorial for the word GOD and other words used by ancient Hebrews in their writings, and check it out for yourself. He is accredited by many as a Hebrew Scholar. I never said Greek Scholar. He also has several books in print Like the mechanical translation of Genesis, among others. As i said before the ancient Pictorial symbol for the word GOD was of and OX, with a STAFF and was view as the (POWER ) OX, STAFF, they leaned on and trusted in. WJ dump the Trinity garbage and start learn truth.
gene
Quote (Gene @ Sep. 30 2009,11:30) wj………..Go and type Jeff Benner on your computer and see for yourself he has a Pictorial for the word GOD and other words used by ancient Hebrews in their writings, and check it out for yourself. He is accredited by many as a Hebrew Scholar. I never said Greek Scholar. He also has several books in print Like the mechanical translation of Genesis, among others. As i said before the ancient Pictorial symbol for the word GOD was of and OX, with a STAFF and was view as the (POWER ) OX, STAFF, they leaned on and trusted in. WJ dump the Trinity garbage and start learn truth. gene
GeneI have looked, and nowhere can I find his formal education as a “Biblical Hebrew Scholar”, I can't even find where he has any degrees at all!
You should stop following this man and claiming that he is something that you cannot substantiate!
You should dump the “Arian” and “Unitarian” garbage which basically makes you akind to the JWs who are the modern day Arian followers!
WJ
Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 30 2009,14:00) t8 said: Quote Please tell WJ what you just said, that all instances of theos or elohim are not always in reference to the Most High God. And that sometimes they are in reference to being rulers or magistrates. WJ says that they are only in reference to false gods or the true God and this reasoning leads him to believe that Jesus is God as he couldn't be a false god. He is wrong about that and you obviously agree. t8,
You have been saying that there are lesser “deities” (or gods) in addition to God. I was refuting YOU. WJ is correct that there are no other deities of any kind lesser or greater. Jesus is God because “in Him dwells all the fulness of the THEOTOKOS bodily” (Colossians 2:9)You have said also that because men partake of the divine nature this makes them deities and that they will become gods. But the divine nature has to do with God's communicable attributes such as love, mercy, kindness, patience, longsuffering, etc., etc. Had you taken just one Systematic Theology course you would know this.
Men may partake of the divine nature but they cannot partake of the divine form. Paul explicitly said that Jesus existed in the form of God. Therefore, He was God. Jesus told the Jews that they had not seen God's form (John 5:37). But they had seen the divine nature. So your idea that men become deities or gods because they partake of the divine nature is fallacious.
WJ and all can see that you have twisted what I said.
thinker
Thinker,I need to make a very important correction. The Greek in Col. 2:9 reads “Theotetos” (Godhead) not “theotokos” (God-bearer or Mother of God or the one who gave birth to God).
Carry on.
Quote (t8 @ Sep. 30 2009,17:43) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 30 2009,17:04) Hi Jack Amen! Ask any Monotheistic Hebrew if they believe in other “gods”?
WJ
Ask any Monotheistic Hebrew if they believe in a Triune God or the Trinity.Then ask any Monotheistic Hebrew if Psalm 82:6 is part of scripture.
“I said, 'You are “gods”; you are all sons of the Most High.'Then ask them if the above text is talking about false gods.
Caught in your own craftiness WJ.
Ask any Orthodox Monotheistic Hebrew if they believe in Christ?Caught up in your rejection of who Messiah is? Or is it YOUR own craftiness?
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Oct. 01 2009,03:59) Quote (Gene @ Sep. 30 2009,11:30) wj………..Go and type Jeff Benner on your computer and see for yourself he has a Pictorial for the word GOD and other words used by ancient Hebrews in their writings, and check it out for yourself. He is accredited by many as a Hebrew Scholar. I never said Greek Scholar. He also has several books in print Like the mechanical translation of Genesis, among others. As i said before the ancient Pictorial symbol for the word GOD was of and OX, with a STAFF and was view as the (POWER ) OX, STAFF, they leaned on and trusted in. WJ dump the Trinity garbage and start learn truth. gene
GeneI have looked, and nowhere can I find his formal education as a “Biblical Hebrew Scholar”, I can't even find where he has any degrees at all!
You should stop following this man and claiming that he is something that you cannot substantiate!
You should dump the “Arian” and “Unitarian” garbage which basically makes you akind to the JWs who are the modern day Arian followers!
WJ
WJ,This is what I meant when I said that I believe there are many gullible people here.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 01 2009,05:42) Hi CA,
Yes.
Delusions of arks of safety abound.
Nick,Being moderator doesn't mean you have to get a word in after every post.
You are annoying as a runny nose.
Quote (CatholicApologist @ Oct. 01 2009,04:28) Thinker, I need to make a very important correction. The Greek in Col. 2:9 reads “Theotetos” (Godhead) not “theotokos” (God-bearer or Mother of God or the one who gave birth to God).
Carry on.
An even bigger correction should be pointed out.God doesn't have a mother.
God is the Father of all and has no source.
That is why he is called the Father.The notion of a mother of God goes back to Babylon.
NIck……..That is why they are Here to fish for more gullible fish that they can deceive with their false TRINITARIAN DOGMAS. Nick if there are some Gullible People Here that should be perfect for CA, and His co hearts WJ and Thinker. But unfortunately they seem to make no Head way Here, Interesting , so I don't think people Here are as gullible as they think or would like them to be.
Quote (t8 @ Oct. 01 2009,14:22) Quote (CatholicApologist @ Oct. 01 2009,04:28) Thinker, I need to make a very important correction. The Greek in Col. 2:9 reads “Theotetos” (Godhead) not “theotokos” (God-bearer or Mother of God or the one who gave birth to God).
Carry on.
An even bigger correction should be pointed out.God doesn't have a mother.
God is the Father of all and has no source.
That is why he is called the Father.The notion of a mother of God goes back to Babylon.
Jesus is God. And He has a mother.Jesus created His mother.
Mary is the theotokos/God-bearer. Jesus was God in her womb. God was born.
Great is the mystery of Godliness. God was manifested in the flesh.
The concept of a mother of God goes back to Genesis 3:15. And I could argue that it goes even farther back than that since this was God's plan before the foundation of the world.
Go ahead. You go back to unholy tradition to back up what you believe. (Babylon) I'll stick with holy tradition.
Quote (CatholicApologist @ Oct. 01 2009,16:40) Quote (t8 @ Oct. 01 2009,14:22) Quote (CatholicApologist @ Oct. 01 2009,04:28) Thinker, I need to make a very important correction. The Greek in Col. 2:9 reads “Theotetos” (Godhead) not “theotokos” (God-bearer or Mother of God or the one who gave birth to God).
Carry on.
An even bigger correction should be pointed out.God doesn't have a mother.
God is the Father of all and has no source.
That is why he is called the Father.The notion of a mother of God goes back to Babylon.
Jesus is God. And He has a mother.Jesus created His mother.
Mary is the theotokos/God-bearer. Jesus was God in her womb. God was born.
Great is the mystery of Godliness. God was manifested in the flesh.
The concept of a mother of God goes back to Genesis 3:15. And I could argue that it goes even farther back than that since this was God's plan before the foundation of the world.
Go ahead. You go back to unholy tradition to back up what you believe. (Babylon) I'll stick with holy tradition.
CA,What happend to reason and logic?
What you are proposing is against both, imo.
Love,
MandyQuote (CatholicApologist @ Oct. 01 2009,16:40) Go ahead. You go back to unholy tradition to back up what you believe. (Babylon) I'll stick with holy tradition.
You know that it is possible to nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition.Matthew 15:6
he is not to 'honor his father ' with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition.Matthew 15:3
Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?Quote (CatholicApologist @ Oct. 01 2009,04:28) Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 30 2009,14:00) t8 said: Quote Please tell WJ what you just said, that all instances of theos or elohim are not always in reference to the Most High God. And that sometimes they are in reference to being rulers or magistrates. WJ says that they are only in reference to false gods or the true God and this reasoning leads him to believe that Jesus is God as he couldn't be a false god. He is wrong about that and you obviously agree. t8,
You have been saying that there are lesser “deities” (or gods) in addition to God. I was refuting YOU. WJ is correct that there are no other deities of any kind lesser or greater. Jesus is God because “in Him dwells all the fulness of the THEOTOKOS bodily” (Colossians 2:9)You have said also that because men partake of the divine nature this makes them deities and that they will become gods. But the divine nature has to do with God's communicable attributes such as love, mercy, kindness, patience, longsuffering, etc., etc. Had you taken just one Systematic Theology course you would know this.
Men may partake of the divine nature but they cannot partake of the divine form. Paul explicitly said that Jesus existed in the form of God. Therefore, He was God. Jesus told the Jews that they had not seen God's form (John 5:37). But they had seen the divine nature. So your idea that men become deities or gods because they partake of the divine nature is fallacious.
WJ and all can see that you have twisted what I said.
thinker
Thinker,I need to make a very important correction. The Greek in Col. 2:9 reads “Theotetos” (Godhead) not “theotokos” (God-bearer or Mother of God or the one who gave birth to God).
Carry on.
CA,
Yes you are correct. I get the two mixed up. Anyway, t8 knows that all the fulness of the “theotetos” dwells in Christ. He should have turned a long time ago.thinker
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