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Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 30 2011,12:11) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 29 2011,18:35) For the record here, are you saying that you don't believe
that Hebrews 7:28 is saying ” “The Word” maketh the son? “
Ed,I have answered that question very CLEARLY in the Incarnation thread. Page 238, second post.
ADDRESS IT OVER THERE, PLEASE.
Hi Mike,Though you don’t believe that Hebrews 7:28 is saying: “”The Word” maketh the son”,
can you see that James 1:18 and 1Peter 1:23 both are saying God will beget us by “The Word”?
How is The Word’s glory seen in us? …the same way The Word’s glory was seen in Jesus. (John1:14 / Rom.8:18)Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. (James 1:18)
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. (1 Peter 1:23)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Aug. 31 2011,13:13) So using your logic (quoted in my post) it's pretty simple to see that “The Word” is God; right?
Ed, have you forgotten what the little word “OF” means?The Holy Spirit is OF God. That little word “OF” makes it impossible for the Holy Spirit to BE God.
Similarly, if all things came through the Word “OF” God, then that “WORD” cannot possibly BE the God it is “OF”.
Ed, do you believe that the Word in Rev 19 is also God Himself?
Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 31 2011,13:21)
How is The Word’s glory seen in us? …the same way The Word’s glory was seen in Jesus. (John1:14 / Rom.8:18)
I'm sorry………………where exactly does it say it is the Word's glory in Romans 8:18?
James 1:18 NKJV ©
Of His own will He brought us forth by the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of His creatures.First, I already told you that every mention of “logos” or “rhema” in the scriptures does not mean the same thing. DO YOU AGREE WITH THIS FACT? Or do I have to bust out some scriptures on you?
Second, since Jesus IS the Word of God, then what you've really done is point us to yet another example where something was created through Jesus. Check out the MSG translation of the same scripture: He brought us to life using the true Word, showing us off as the crown of all his creatures.
1 Peter 1:23 NKJV ©
having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever,Ed, the above point stands also for this scripture. The scripture could refer to, “God WILLED this to happen, and God never lies, so His word can be trusted.” But it could also be another reference to the disciples being born again through Jesus, who IS God's Word.
Ed, I learned about God creating the heavens and the earth through God's word. But I didn't learn this from God Himself, or even from Jesus Christ. In this case, I am merely referring to God's WORDS, as recorded by Moses in the Book of Genesis, and calling those WORDS “God's word”.
Not one thing you've so far posted inclines me to believe that the Word OF God is God Himself. Like I said before, the word “OF” in that phrase is a dead giveaway.
Now, will you address the point of this thread? The point is that all things came through the Word, God's Son, AND our Lord Jesus Christ. This is what the scriptures actually say, Ed. Do you deny this?
mike
Mike………….No one is “GOD'S WORD” but GOD HIMSELF Now if you ask who speaks GOD'S WORD, there were many who did , first the Prophets and Jesus and the Saint do also. But just as Jesus said those words were not theirs but the FATHERS WORD. You still seem to not believe that the FATHER who is GOD was truly (IN) Jesus as the LOGOS do you. Jesus is not the LOGOS the LOGOS was (IN) Jesus, Just as Paladin brought out and that LOGOS is also IN all true SAINTS of GOD TO> IMO
peace and love…………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 02 2011,08:50) Mike………….No one is “GOD'S WORD” but GOD HIMSELF Now if you ask who speaks GOD'S WORD, there were many who did , first the Prophets and Jesus and the Saint do also. But just as Jesus said those words were not theirs but the FATHERS WORD. You still seem to not believe that the FATHER who is GOD was truly (IN) Jesus as the LOGOS do you. Jesus is not the LOGOS the LOGOS was (IN) Jesus, Just as Paladin brought out and that LOGOS is also IN all true SAINTS of GOD TO> IMO peace and love…………………………………….gene
genethis is not for you to answer we know your answer and we know that scriptures do not mean much unless they comply with Gene mind of understanding,
Pierre
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2011,10:49) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 31 2011,13:13) So using your logic (quoted in my post) it's pretty simple to see that “The Word” is God; right?
Ed, have you forgotten what the little word “OF” means?The Holy Spirit is OF God. That little word “OF” makes it impossible for the Holy Spirit to BE God.
Similarly, if all things came through the Word “OF” God, then that “WORD” cannot possibly BE the God it is “OF”.
Ed, do you believe that the Word in Rev 19 is also God Himself?
Hi Mike,Revelation 19:11-21 refers to the “HolySpirit”, which is “The Word” of God.
Neither the Hebrew nor the Greek Scriptures have a word for “OF”; have you forgotten?
You build your doctrinal beliefs based on a word that doesn't exist in Greek or Hebrew Scripture?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,06:21) Hi Mike, Though you don’t believe that Hebrews 7:28 is saying: “”The Word” maketh the son”,
God will beget us by “The Word”?
can you see that James 1:18 and 1Peter 1:23 both are saying
How is The Word’s glory seen in us? …the same way The Word’s glory was seen in Jesus. (John1:14 / Rom.8:18)Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. (James 1:18)
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. (1 Peter 1:23)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Hi Mike,So you don't believe these verses refer “The Word” begetting children?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2011,11:18)
Now, will you address the point of this thread? The point is that all things came through the Word, God's Son, AND our Lord Jesus Christ. This is what the scriptures actually say, Ed. Do you deny this?mike
Hi Mike,I'm trying to answer your question, so go with me here; OK?
Do you believe that it was determined, before the foundation of the world,
that Jesus would be slain (as in crucified) based on Revelation 13:8 says?Your brother
in Christ, Jesus!
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,14:29)
Revelation 19:11-21 refers to the “HolySpirit”, which is “The Word” of God.
Really? Let's see:Revelation 17
12 “The ten horns you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but who for one hour will receive authority as kings along with the beast. 13 They have one purpose and will give their power and authority to the beast. 14 They will make war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will overcome them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings—and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers.”Ed, who is the Lord of lords in this passage? Is it not the Lamb of God who was slain? And who is it that will make war with this Lord of lords? Is it not the kings of the earth along with the beast?
Revelation 19
11 I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. 12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14 The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. “He will rule them with an iron scepter.”He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. 16 On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written:
KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and mighty men, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, small and great.”
19 Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to make war against the rider on the horse and his army.
Is the rider of the white horse the one named “The Word of God” here? Is this same person named “The Lord of lords” here?
Now look at verse 19 and see who is making war against this rider and his army. Is it not the same beast and kings of the earth who were going to make war with the OTHER Lord of lords in 17:14? And do you remember who that OTHER Lord of lords was? It was the Lamb of God who was slain, wasn't it? As it turns out, I guess there wasn't really an OTHER Lord of lords, after all. Both passages refer to the SAME Lord of lords. And that Lord of lords is the Lamb of God.
Ed, do you believe that the Lamb of God who was slain is God's Holy Spirit?
Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,14:29)
Neither the Hebrew nor the Greek Scriptures have a word for “OF”; have you forgotten?
You build your doctrinal beliefs based on a word that doesn't exist in Greek or Hebrew Scripture?
Is that TRULY what I'm doing, Ed? Or is this a game you've already played with me a couple of other times? Ed, was there a particular way that the Greeks conveyed the meaning of our English word “OF”? How did they do it, Ed? Wasn't it by using a genitive form of the word?Don't play stupid games with me, Ed. You know darn well that when the genitive form of, for example, “God” was used, it means “OF God”. Please acknowledge that you know this fact, so I don't ever have to play this stupid game with you again. And then AFTER you acknowledge this well known FACT of Greek grammar, answer my question:
Have you forgotten what the little word “OF” means, Ed?
mike
Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,14:33) Hi Mike, I'm trying to answer your question, so go with me here; OK?
Do you believe that it was determined, before the foundation of the world,
that Jesus would be slain (as in crucified) based on Revelation 13:8 says?
You mean this scripture?Revelation 13:8 NET ©
and all those who live on the earth will worship the beast, everyone whose name has not been written since the foundation of the world in the book of life belonging to the Lamb who was killed.NASB ©
All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.NRSV ©
and all the inhabitants of the earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb that was slaughtered.No, I don't think this scripture says what you are saying. In fact, this scripture teaches that even from the foundation of the world, Jesus had this Book of Life in his possession. And therefore Jesus must have existed from the foundation of the world in order to possess this Book at that time.
And how is this line of questioning helping you to answer my very SIMPLE point?
Ed, all things were said to have come through the Word, God's Son, AND our Lord Jesus Christ. Do you deny this?
mike
Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 02 2011,06:53) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 02 2011,08:50) Mike………….No one is “GOD'S WORD” but GOD HIMSELF Now if you ask who speaks GOD'S WORD, there were many who did , first the Prophets and Jesus and the Saint do also. But just as Jesus said those words were not theirs but the FATHERS WORD. You still seem to not believe that the FATHER who is GOD was truly (IN) Jesus as the LOGOS do you. Jesus is not the LOGOS the LOGOS was (IN) Jesus, Just as Paladin brought out and that LOGOS is also IN all true SAINTS of GOD TO> IMO peace and love…………………………………….gene
genethis is not for you to answer we know your answer and we know that scriptures do not mean much unless they comply with Gene mind of understanding,
Pierre
Terricca………..Who is the we here YOU and MIKE thats a joke at best. IMOpeace and love…………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 03 2011,06:32) Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 02 2011,06:53) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 02 2011,08:50) Mike………….No one is “GOD'S WORD” but GOD HIMSELF Now if you ask who speaks GOD'S WORD, there were many who did , first the Prophets and Jesus and the Saint do also. But just as Jesus said those words were not theirs but the FATHERS WORD. You still seem to not believe that the FATHER who is GOD was truly (IN) Jesus as the LOGOS do you. Jesus is not the LOGOS the LOGOS was (IN) Jesus, Just as Paladin brought out and that LOGOS is also IN all true SAINTS of GOD TO> IMO peace and love…………………………………….gene
genethis is not for you to answer we know your answer and we know that scriptures do not mean much unless they comply with Gene mind of understanding,
Pierre
Terricca………..Who is the we here YOU and MIKE thats a joke at best. IMOpeace and love…………………………….gene
GeneI have shown you many times that spirit means many things
and so the word WORD means sometimes something else ,but you have made up your mind not to understand truth so be itPierre
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2011,13:05) Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,14:33) Hi Mike, I'm trying to answer your question, so go with me here; OK?
Do you believe that it was determined, before the foundation of the world,
that Jesus would be slain (as in crucified) based on Revelation 13:8 says?I don't think this scripture says what you are saying. In fact, this scripture teaches that even from the foundation of the world, Jesus had this Book of Life in his possession. And therefore Jesus must have existed from the foundation of the world in order to possess this Book at that time.
mike
Hi Mike,You believe that Rev.13:8 teaches that Jesus preexisted,
and that Jesus also had the “Book of Life” in his possession.
Why don't you believe that his being slain was also predetermined?
Jesus death on the cross was the means of the question you keep asking.Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath
made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
1 Corinthians 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of
whom are all things (are Created), and we in him; and one
Lord Jesus Christ, by whom (his death burial and
resurrection) are all things, and we by him.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2011,11:18) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 31 2011,13:21)
How is The Word’s glory seen in us? …the same way The Word’s glory was seen in Jesus. (John1:14 / Rom.8:18)
I'm sorry………………where exactly does it say it is the Word's glory in Romans 8:18?mike
Hi Mike,And we beheld his(The Word's) glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father (John 1:14)
Though you don’t believe that Hebrews 7:28 is saying: “”The Word” maketh the son”,
can you see that James 1:18 and 1Peter 1:23 both are saying God will beget us by “The Word”?
How is The Word’s glory seen in us? …the same way The Word’s glory was seen in Jesus. (John1:14 / Rom.8:18)Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. (James 1:18)
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. (1 Peter 1:23)Romans 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with [The( Word's)] glory which shall be revealed in us.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2011,11:18) Now, will you address the point of this thread? The point is that all things came through the Word, God's Son, AND our Lord Jesus Christ. This is what the scriptures actually say, Ed. Do you deny this? mike
Quote All things are said to have been created by God. All things are said to have been created by YHVH.
All things are said to have been created by our heavenly Father
Does this mean that THREE persons have created all things? Or does it mean that the ONE person who created all things has been called by many different names?
I'm sure that everyone here will agree it is the latter, right?
Hi Mike,The Bible also says that “The Word” of God makes everything as well…
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by The Word of God. (Heb 11:3)
All things were made by him(The Word); (John 1:3)So using your logic (quoted in my post) it's pretty simple to see that “The Word” is God; right?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2011,11:18) Not one thing you've so far posted inclines me to believe that the Word OF God is God Himself. Like I said before, the word “OF” in that phrase is a dead giveaway. mike
Hi Mike,You keep forgetting I said that “The Word” of God is the “HolySpirit” of God.
“The Words” that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. (John 6:63)
“The Word” which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me. (John 14:24)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2011,12:55) Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,14:29)
Neither the Hebrew nor the Greek Scriptures have a word for “OF”; have you forgotten?
You build your doctrinal beliefs based on a word that doesn't exist in Greek or Hebrew Scripture?
Is that TRULY what I'm doing, Ed? Or is this a game you've already played with me a couple of other times? Ed, was there a particular way that the Greeks conveyed the meaning of our English word “OF”? How did they do it, Ed? Wasn't it by using a genitive form of the word?Don't play stupid games with me, Ed. You know darn well that when the genitive form of, for example, “God” was used, it means “OF God”. Please acknowledge that you know this fact, so I don't ever have to play this stupid game with you again. And then AFTER you acknowledge this well known FACT of Greek grammar, answer my question:
Have you forgotten what the little word “OF” means, Ed?
mike
Hi Mike,The way I understand the Genitive form of a word in Greek,
it can be worded in English all of the following ways…God's Spirit
Spirit of God
The God SpiritGod bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2011,12:55) Ed, do you believe that the Lamb of God who was slain is God's Holy Spirit?
Hi Mike,Not entirely: At Jesus birth he was 1/2 HolySpirit, and after
his baptism he was filled with the HolySpirit. (See John 3:34)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2011,12:55) Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 01 2011,14:29)
Revelation 19:11-21 refers to the “HolySpirit”, which is “The Word” of God.
Really? Let's see:Revelation 17
12 “The ten horns you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but who for one hour will receive authority as kings along with the beast. 13 They have one purpose and will give their power and authority to the beast. 14 They will make war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will overcome them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings—and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers.”Ed, who is the Lord of lords in this passage? Is it not the Lamb of God who was slain? And who is it that will make war with this Lord of lords? Is it not the kings of the earth along with the beast?
Revelation 19
11 I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. 12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14 The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. “He will rule them with an iron scepter.”He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. 16 On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written:
KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and mighty men, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, small and great.”
19 Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to make war against the rider on the horse and his army.
Is the rider of the white horse the one named “The Word of God” here? Is this same person named “The Lord of lords” here?
Now look at verse 19 and see who is making war against this rider and his army. Is it not the same beast and kings of the earth who were going to make war with the OTHER Lord of lords in 17:14? And do you remember who that OTHER Lord of lords was? It was the Lamb of God who was slain, wasn't it? As it turns out, I guess there wasn't really an OTHER Lord of lords, after all. Both passages refer to the SAME Lord of lords. And that Lord of lords is the Lamb of God.
mike
.God's Signature
Proof of God=117
GOD(26) → The Bible(63) → AKJV Bible(74) → The LORD JEHOVAH(151)יהוה=26 (God's Name: YHVH pronounced YÄ-hä-vā)……………………(Psalm 68:4)
YHVH=63 (God's Name יהוה translated into English)………………….(Exodus 6:3)
Jesus=74 (God's Son's name in English is: “Joshua”)………………..(Isaiah 12:2)
HolySpirit=151 (“FATHER: The Word”: in all believers)……………..(Isaiah 26:4)
God The Father=117 (Representing “GOD”: יהוה האלהים)…………….(Psalm 83:18)Hi Mike,
You have said in past posts that the title “King of kings”
applies to ever the context is referring to, now you
attempt to use it as an absolute to someone?Have you noticed how the translators of the “AKJV Bible”(74)
CAPITALIZED both of these TITLES in Rev.19:16, but not in Rev.17:14?
Rev.17:14 refers to Jesus, while Rev.19:16 refers instead to the “HolySpirit”.Theomatics is a second witness here.
“The Word”(HolySpirit) is called KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS in Revelation 19:16.
LORD of Lords(117) is 117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD), the “God Spirit”(117). (John 14:28 / Rev.1:5)
KING of Kings(101) is GOD(26) ((26)יהוה), because 101 is the 26th prime number. (Psalm 29:10 / Psalm 10:16)
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
(LINK to the thread THAT PROVES GOD’s EXISTENCE)
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