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Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,06:26) 2besee……..The seven Eyes pictured in Revelations are the Seven (distinct) Spirit (intellects) or Attributes of the One GOD. They go before the Throne of God and go out into all the earth, they give Life to all creation . That is the “Let US “spoken of in Genesis. IMO, Jesus has all seven of the Eyes or Spirits (enlightenments of intellects) in him and (YAHWEH) has also given him the Powers (horns) that go with them and with these he shall set up the Kingdom of God , it is really God himself “IN” Jesus that will set up and rule the Kingdom.
Therefore it says, “thy Kingdom “O” God is and everlasting Kingdom”, and again, “UNTIL I (YAHWEH) Make your enemies your footstool”, how by the Seven Sprits of God with the pwoer to execute them “IN” Christ Jesus, and the Saints will bringing it all about.
So in that sense it really is God the Fathers Kingdom, and at the end of the thousand year period Jesus will completely step out of the picture and God the Father will sit as the Head of the Kingdom which He brought about “through Jesus and the Saints”> And the “ALL” people including Jesus and the Saint will be subject to the one and “ONLY” TRUE God.
2besee i believe the biggest problem is not understanding what Spirit “IS”. Most see Spirit from a personified view as a person like a man, and scripture does present them that way i.e , Satan, God the Father, demonic Spirits, Devils, and the like. But Spirit is not a Person, Spirit is an “IT” and comes in different “TYPES” and “KINDS” in simplest form they are “INTELLECTS” which enlighten the mind, and can come and go in people. The LORD (YAHWEH) uses Seven types or kinds of Spirits as eyes for him and with these seven Spirits of God he created all creation that exists. Therefore they (the seven spirits of God ) are before the Throne of God, they are Creations of (YAHWEH) and he used them in his creative works. The Spirit (intellect) of the Truth is just one of those Seven Spirits or eyes of God and “IT” is given to indwell us also sent to us from LORD (YAHWEH) to be with us forever. IMO
This Spirit ( is an intellect that give us cognate awareness of the truth) also as a result of knowing the truth, it gives us comfort and is therefore also called the comforter.
2besee my hope is you will not get discouraged by some of the commits made here by some incentive people and leave this site as other have. Would like to know if you are involved in other sites, and ministries, you can send me a private messenger, i would like to stay in contact with you brother.
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………gene
Hi Gene,Amen, great post.
Peace brother..
sins wen are “the seven spirits (angels) intellect
REV 5:6 And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders a Lamb standing, as if slain, having
seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth.
it is the seven horns that have the seven eyes and it his the LAMB THAT HAS OR WARE THE SEVEN HORNS ,
so what are talking about
and we all know who his the lamb = Jesus Christ ,the son of GodQuote (2besee @ Feb. 03 2013,04:37) I would love to comment but I won't. Except Mike I also felt that I had something wrong with the eyes, head and the diadems part of Rev 19, and it needs further reading from me and understanding.
And Terraricca, there is an alternative possible rendering of Col 1:15-17 which I have made elsewhere.
But, enough said from me (:
Peace.
2beesee,It is clearly a passage using symbolism but it may be symbolism used elsewhere in scripture. The sword of his mouth is that he uses the Word as a weapon, in this case I believe judgement.
John 12:48
King James Version (KJV)48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
Your point about the clothing being Jesus' body sounds interesting, though I do not see his body as being literally stained with blood at this time. As symbolism it could be speaking of salvation.
Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 04 2013,04:14) sins wen are “the seven spirits (angels) intellect REV 5:6 And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders a Lamb standing, as if slain, having
seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth.
it is the seven horns that have the seven eyes and it his the LAMB THAT HAS OR WARE THE SEVEN HORNS ,
so what are talking about
and we all know who his the lamb = Jesus Christ ,the son of God
Tericca……..Since when are Sprits, Angels who stand before the throne of God where is that even mentioned at, anywhere in scripture, and even if you believe that which of the merions of Angels are the Seven ones before the throne of God with Seven Powers (horns), In fact Show us where does it mention any angels that are before the throne of God, I see the Lamb and the 24 elders there. The scriptures say the Seven Spirits “ARE” the “EYES” of God and we know God is a Spirit and “NOT” an Angel accoding to Jesus , that is if you want to believe Jesus or not.Your assumption are false and misleading, And do not have Bibical base. You need to correct your thinking Pierre, IMO.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………gene
Gene and all,
Quote The seven Eyes pictured in Revelations are the Seven (distinct) Spirit (intellects) or Attributes of the One GOD. They go before the Throne of God and go out into all the earth, they give Life to all creation . I see a more solid case of the seven eyes of Jehovah the go to and fro throughout the world being the seven sons of God that go throughout the world. I am not sure they are the same as the seven spirits that are before the throne of Jehovah.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,23:49) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 04 2013,04:14) sins wen are “the seven spirits (angels) intellect REV 5:6 And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders a Lamb standing, as if slain, having
seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth.
it is the seven horns that have the seven eyes and it his the LAMB THAT HAS OR WARE THE SEVEN HORNS ,
so what are talking about
and we all know who his the lamb = Jesus Christ ,the son of God
Tericca……..Since when are Sprits, Angels who stand before the throne of God where is that even mentioned at, anywhere in scripture, and even if you believe that which of the merions of Angels are the Seven ones before the throne of God with Seven Powers (horns), In fact Show us where does it mention any angels that are before the throne of God, I see the Lamb and the 24 elders there. The scriptures say the Seven Spirits “ARE” the “EYES” of God and we know God is a Spirit and “NOT” an Angel accoding to Jesus , that is if you want to believe Jesus or not.Your assumption are false and misleading, And do not have Bibical base. You need to correct your thinking Pierre, IMO.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………gene
gRev 2:8 “To the angel of the church in Smyrna write:
Rev 2:7 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will
These are the words of the Son of God, whose eyes are like blazing fire and whose feet are like burnished bronze.
Rev 1:1 The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John,
there is more but I think this would do
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 04 2013,03:26) 2besee……..The seven Eyes pictured in Revelations are the Seven (distinct) Spirit (intellects) or Attributes of the One GOD. They go before the Throne of God and go out into all the earth, they give Life to all creation . That is the “Let US “spoken of in Genesis. IMO, Jesus has all seven of the Eyes or Spirits (enlightenments of intellects) in him and (YAHWEH) has also given him the Powers (horns) that go with them and with these he shall set up the Kingdom of God , it is really God himself “IN” Jesus that will set up and rule the Kingdom.
Therefore it says, “thy Kingdom “O” God is and everlasting Kingdom”, and again, “UNTIL I (YAHWEH) Make your enemies your footstool”, how by the Seven Sprits of God with the pwoer to execute them “IN” Christ Jesus, and the Saints will bringing it all about.
So in that sense it really is God the Fathers Kingdom, and at the end of the thousand year period Jesus will completely step out of the picture and God the Father will sit as the Head of the Kingdom which He brought about “through Jesus and the Saints”> And the “ALL” people including Jesus and the Saint will be subject to the one and “ONLY” TRUE God.
2besee i believe the biggest problem is not understanding what Spirit “IS”. Most see Spirit from a personified view as a person like a man, and scripture does present them that way i.e , Satan, God the Father, demonic Spirits, Devils, and the like. But Spirit is not a Person, Spirit is an “IT” and comes in different “TYPES” and “KINDS” in simplest form they are “INTELLECTS” which enlighten the mind, and can come and go in people. The LORD (YAHWEH) uses Seven types or kinds of Spirits as eyes for him and with these seven Spirits of God he created all creation that exists. Therefore they (the seven spirits of God ) are before the Throne of God, they are Creations of (YAHWEH) and he used them in his creative works. The Spirit (intellect) of the Truth is just one of those Seven Spirits or eyes of God and “IT” is given to indwell us also sent to us from LORD (YAHWEH) to be with us forever. IMO
This Spirit ( is an intellect that give us cognate awareness of the truth) also as a result of knowing the truth, it gives us comfort and is therefore also called the comforter.
2besee my hope is you will not get discouraged by some of the commits made here by some incentive people and leave this site as other have. Would like to know if you are involved in other sites, and ministries, you can send me a private messenger, i would like to stay in contact with you brother.
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………gene
Hi Gene, thank you. Still reading now and then, just a bit busy.I find that if I over post on forums then I have an inner conscience showing me to quieten down. So I have my times.
Still reading all of your posts, thanks!
God bless you.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,23:49) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 04 2013,04:14) sins wen are “the seven spirits (angels) intellect REV 5:6 And I saw between the throne (with the four living creatures) and the elders a Lamb standing, as if slain, having
seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent out into all the earth.
it is the seven horns that have the seven eyes and it his the LAMB THAT HAS OR WARE THE SEVEN HORNS ,
so what are talking about
and we all know who his the lamb = Jesus Christ ,the son of God
Tericca……..Since when are Sprits, Angels who stand before the throne of God where is that even mentioned at, anywhere in scripture, and even if you believe that which of the merions of Angels are the Seven ones before the throne of God with Seven Powers (horns), In fact Show us where does it mention any angels that are before the throne of God, I see the Lamb and the 24 elders there. The scriptures say the Seven Spirits “ARE” the “EYES” of God and we know God is a Spirit and “NOT” an Angel accoding to Jesus , that is if you want to believe Jesus or not.Your assumption are false and misleading, And do not have Bibical base. You need to correct your thinking Pierre, IMO.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………gene
Gwere those assembly on vacation
DA 7:10 “A river of fire was flowing
And coming out from before Him; Thousands upon thousands were attending Him,
And myriads upon myriads were standing before Him
;
The court sat,
And the books were openedI hope you do not believe that only 26 beings are in the presence of God ,???
you should take your own advise very seriously for your own sake ,
Terricca……..none of what you posted has any revelance on what I was posting about. Pierre.
Peace and love to you and yours………………………………gene
Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 04 2013,05:00) Gene and all, Quote The seven Eyes pictured in Revelations are the Seven (distinct) Spirit (intellects) or Attributes of the One GOD. They go before the Throne of God and go out into all the earth, they give Life to all creation . I see a more solid case of the seven eyes of Jehovah the go to and fro throughout the world being the seven sons of God that go throughout the world. I am not sure they are the same as the seven spirits that are before the throne of Jehovah.
Kerwin……….I believe the word sons can include distinct kinds and type of spirits and these spirits are part of YAHWEH'S creation too. Spirits are personified in scriptures at times like wisdom is called a she, we all know wisdom is not a she or a he but an “it” a kind of intellect, a type or kind of intelligence .Jesus said he spoke of the Father in a proverbial language the word proverb means a “fictious illustration” but a time would come when he would show them plainly about the Father. Jesus always personified God as the Father , but the question is, is GOD the Father who is a spirit a real “person”, as we perceive a person? Aparently not, or why would Jesus have said that.
Kerwin I believe the key is to understand what a spirit really is and once we do that then the pieces will come together. To me as I have said here before a spirit is not a person “it” is what is “in” a person.
I believe this whole subject about what a spirit is needs to be discussed further , as you remember we had a post about it before it might be good to reopen it and see what 2besee and others have to say also.
Peace and love to you and yours…………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 04 2013,09:57) Terricca……..none of what you posted has any revelance on what I was posting on about. Pierre. Peace and love to you and yours………………………………gene
G
What is the sense to show scriptures you brush them away in a blink of an eye,For three years I have seen you do that ,what's Gene think and says is the truth ,and God as to line himself up with it.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 04 2013,10:43) Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 04 2013,05:00) Gene and all, Quote The seven Eyes pictured in Revelations are the Seven (distinct) Spirit (intellects) or Attributes of the One GOD. They go before the Throne of God and go out into all the earth, they give Life to all creation . I see a more solid case of the seven eyes of Jehovah the go to and fro throughout the world being the seven sons of God that go throughout the world. I am not sure they are the same as the seven spirits that are before the throne of Jehovah.
Kerwin……….I believe the word sons can include distinct kinds and type of spirits and these spirits are part of YAHWEH'S creation too. Spirits are personified in scriptures at times like wisdom is called a she, we all know wisdom is not a she or a he but an “it” a kind of intellect, a type or kind of intelligence .Jesus said he spoke of the Father in a proverbial language the word proverb means a “fictious illustration” but a time would come when he would show them plainly about the Father. Jesus always personified God as the Father , but the question is, is GOD the Father who is a spirit a real “person”, as we perceive a person? Aparently not, or why would Jesus have said that.
Kerwin I believe the key is to understand what a spirit really is and once we do that then the pieces will come together. To me as I have said here before a spirit is not a person “it” is what is “in” a person.
I believe this whole subject about what a spirit is needs to be discussed further , as you remember we had a post about it before it might be good to reopen it and see what 2besee and others have to say also.
Peace and love to you and yours…………………..gene
Gene,Much of what you say is correct but the seven eyes the seven witnesses of Yahweh's glory in action throughout creation. I do not see a non-person written of as if he was a person as having the ability to fulfill the role.
Except for the number seven and being in front of the throne, I see no link between the seven eyes and the seven spirits.
To Kerwin …….. Brother Here is what I am referring to ….Rev 1:4..John to the seven churches what are in Asia: Grace unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come: (Now notice Kerwin) and from the seven “Spirits” which are “Before” his throne Verse 5…..> and from Jesus Christ …..>
So three thing are mentioned there, from Him who is (YAHWEH) , and The seven “SPIRITS, and from Jesus the Christ.
And Notice the Seven Spirits “ARE” before His (YAHWEH)'s “throne. They are not YAHWEH or Jesus and they are before the Throne.
There is more……….Rev 4:5…….And out of the throne proceeded lightings and thunderings and voices: and seven lamps of fire (intellects of Judgments) which “ARE” the seven Spirit of God.
(intellects or Judgments) are my insert because to me Lamps mean (intelligences that illuminate the mind and Fire in scripture means intense Judgment)
But there is also more……> Rev 5:6 ….> And i beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven “horns “AND” seven eyes, “WHICH ARE” the “seven Spirits” of God (now notice also) sent out into “ALL” the “earth”.
In conclusion the seven Spirit are before the throne of YAHWEH and the Seven Spirit are what compose GOD. Therefore ELOHIM which is our Word for GOD is a “UNI-PLURAL” WORD and God consists of all Seven Spirits and that is the “LET US Create Man” spoken of in Genesis.
These Spirit are sent forth into all the earth they go to and fro through out the earth because they are in the creation of all the earth every animal or living flesh that exists has Spirit in them or they simply could not exist. Spirit “IS” what LIFE “IS” they come in “TYPES” and “KINDS”. The HOLY SPIRIT is a Special Spirt The word Holy means (SETAPART) or SPECIAl , So the holy Spirit is a Special setapart Spirit of God.
The key is to understand what a Spirits really “ARE”, IMO Brother.
peace and love to you and yours Kerwin………………..gene
Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 04 2013,17:00) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 04 2013,09:57) Terricca……..none of what you posted has any revelance on what I was posting on about. Pierre. Peace and love to you and yours………………………………gene
G What is the sense to show scriptures you brush them away in a blink of an eye,For three years I have seen you do that ,what's Gene think and says is the truth ,and God as to line himself up with it.
Terricca……….May God be With you Brother, and forgive your accusatory Spirit, I see that Spirit in a lot of older folks like you and me brother, We tend to be like cement, the older it gets the more it sets up and the harder it is to change.I can state what i Believe to be true from what i see in scripture and i do quote them also. It is not my place to accuse you or anyone of any thing, i will leave that up to God the Father no one has made me a Judge over any man.
Peace and love to you and yours brother………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 04 2013,20:29) To Kerwin …….. Brother Here is what I am referring to ….Rev 1:4..John to the seven churches what are in Asia: Grace unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come: (Now notice Kerwin) and from the seven “Spirits” which are “Before” his throne Verse 5…..> and from Jesus Christ …..> So three thing are mentioned there, from Him who is (YAHWEH) , and The seven “SPIRITS, and from Jesus the Christ.
And Notice the Seven Spirits “ARE” before His (YAHWEH)'s “throne. They are not YAHWEH or Jesus and they are before the Throne.
There is more……….Rev 4:5…….And out of the throne proceeded lightings and thunderings and voices: and seven lamps of fire (intellects of Judgments) which “ARE” the seven Spirit of God.
(intellects or Judgments) are my insert because to me Lamps mean (intelligences that illuminate the mind and Fire in scripture means intense Judgment)
But there is also more……> Rev 5:6 ….> And i beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven “horns “AND” seven eyes, “WHICH ARE” the “seven Spirits” of God (now notice also) sent out into “ALL” the “earth”.
In conclusion the seven Spirit are before the throne of YAHWEH and the Seven Spirit are what compose GOD. Therefore ELOHIM which is our Word for GOD is a “UNI-PLURAL” WORD and God consists of all Seven Spirits and that is the “LET US Create Man” spoken of in Genesis.
These Spirit are sent forth into all the earth they go to and fro through out the earth because they are in the creation of all the earth every animal or living flesh that exists has Spirit in them or they simply could not exist. Spirit “IS” what LIFE “IS” they come in “TYPES” and “KINDS”. The HOLY SPIRIT is a Special Spirt The word Holy means (SETAPART) or SPECIAl , So the holy Spirit is a Special setapart Spirit of God.
The key is to understand what a Spirits really “ARE”, IMO Brother.
peace and love to you and yours Kerwin………………..gene
Gene,I followed you until you stated “the Seven Spirit are what compose GOD”.
The seven candlesticks are mentioned in the Law.
Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 05 2013,06:46) Gene, I followed you until you stated “the Seven Spirit are what compose GOD”.
The seven candlesticks are mentioned in the Law.
Hi Kerwin, (ref. Isaiah 11:2)Here are the seven spirits of the LORD:
1) the spirit of the LORD
2) the spirit of wisdom
3) the spirit of understanding
4) the spirit of counsel
5) the spirit of might
6) the spirit of knowledge
7) the spirit of the fear of the LORDYour brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Feb. 05 2013,02:25) Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 05 2013,06:46) Gene, I followed you until you stated “the Seven Spirit are what compose GOD”.
The seven candlesticks are mentioned in the Law.
Hi Kerwin, (ref. Isaiah 11:2)Here are the seven spirits of the LORD:
1) the spirit of the LORD
2) the spirit of wisdom
3) the spirit of understanding
4) the spirit of counsel
5) the spirit of might
6) the spirit of knowledge
7) the spirit of the fear of the LORDYour brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
edji did not know that God fears
from whom ?Hi Gene,
I'm going to tell you some facts, and you'll probably just ignore them as usual, and keep making the same error ridden posts anyway.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,07:35) Mike…….That is the exact teachings of the Gnostic's They believed Jesus was a “God” sent out from the Gods to straighten out and save this world.
Jesus IS called a god, both in the OT and the NT. Can you deny this scriptural fact? If not, don't bring this point up ever again.Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,07:35) Paul and John both Fought those teachings…….
John and Paul are the two NT writers who called Jesus a god, Gene. How can you say they “fought those teachings” when those teachings CAME FROM them?Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,07:35) ………that is what lead John to say anyone who does not admit Christ came in the Flesh is Antichrist.
I don't deny Jesus came in the flesh, Gene. In fact, it is YOU who denies that he CAME in the flesh. You claim that he never was anything EXCEPT FOR flesh. But YOUR understanding doesn't match the words “CAME in the flesh”.Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,07:35) The voice from heaven said this day I have begotten you” , not some preexistent time in creation but it said this “DAY”
The Hebrew word “yowm” can mean “day”, or it can refer to ANY general period of time. So Psalm 2:7 could just as well be translated as, “AT THIS TIME, I have begotten you”. Personally, I believe “day” is the correct translation. But are you telling me that IF Jehovah had begotten Jesus before the ages, as many scriptures attest, He wouldn't be allowed to say “This DAY”? Why not? What word SHOULD have Jehovah used to convey to the psalmist that He had begotten Jesus at a particular time before the world began?Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2013,07:35) 2besee is completely right in what he explained and again as before you are denying the truth.
Gene, I like you and 2B very well. But you both suffer from the same ailment: You have already decided for yourselves what the scriptures should teach about the origins of Jesus, and are therefore not able to see beyond those self-inflicted blinders to the REAL truth of the scriptures.You must make up all kinds of oddball twistings of scripture. You say, the Word CAME TO BE IN SOMEONE WHO WAS flesh – even though that's not what John wrote. You say, glorify me now with the glory YOU'VE HAD WAITING FOR ME since before the world began – even though that's not even close to what Jesus said.
I could go on and on, Gene. You guys pull this NONSENSE with MANY, MANY scriptures. You FORCE the scriptures to teach what you already think they SHOULD teach. You'll NEVER come to the truth of the scriptures that way, Gene.
Look at Kerwin's recent post to 2B about Rev 19:13 for an example. 2B just got done telling me that HE HIMSELF thinks his own understanding “needs work” in that passage. Yet Kerwin, thinking this could be a chance to eliminate Jesus from being the “Word of God” 19:13, implied that 2B's scenario was interesting and worth looking into.
Why Gene? Is because Kerwin SERIOUSLY believes that passage speaks about the Holy Spirit, who rides on a white horse, and whose eyes and head and robe are all Jesus Christ? Of course not. He realizes that is just silly talk. BUT…….. because that understanding will allow him to get rid of a thorn in his side, he is willing to jump on the “Nonsense Bandwagon”. And why is 19:13 a thorn in his side? Because he knows that John calling Jesus “the Word” in 19:13 lends MUCH credence to the idea that the same author also calls Jesus “the Word” in John 1:1, 1:14, and 1 John 1:1.
So you see what we true believers put up with from you guys? It's like your “RIGHT ON!” posts that you make to ANYONE who doesn't believe in pre-existence. I know from discussions with you that you don't believe HALF of what the other person wrote………… but you tell them they have posted it correctly- simply because their bottom line is that they don't believe in the pre-existence of Jesus.
Seriously Gene, do you believe Rev 19:11-16 describes the Holy Spirit? You stated many times before that you know it refers to Jesus, right? So how can you say 2B has posted it correctly, when you don't even agree with what he has posted?
See what I mean? You guys don't really agree as much as you pretend to. But as long as the other guy's bottom line is “non-preexistence”, you say he made a “good post” – no matter WHAT he said. Isn't that right, Gene?
Now, I've been waiting for your answer to this question for quite a while:
How do you explain the fact that Jesus said “only God is good”, but then called himself “the good shepherd”?
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