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Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 29 2012,15:22) Hi KW,
There are several places that we do not see.
The fact that scripture does not SAY that he died is no proof that HE DIDN'T
Nick,In this case Scripture not only did not say he died but also tells us what happened instead by making it an alternative to death. It spells it out for us to show that those that seek God will have eternal life.
Right on, Kerwin.
What happened to Enoch is clearly distinguished as something OTHER THAN what happened to all those who “died”.
It is similar with Elijah:
Kings 2:1
When the LORD was about to take Elijah up to heaven in a whirlwind, Elijah and Elisha were on their way from Gilgal.Kings 2:11
As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared and separated the two of them, and Elijah went up to heaven in a whirlwind.Also, who are these………………
Revelation 6
9 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. 10 They called out in a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?” 11 Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed.…………….and why are they in heaven?
I'm sorry Nick. All this time I was under the impression that we were discussing whether or not those who have lived on earth as men ever go to “heaven”.
It seems to me that your stance was “NOT A CHANCE”.
But now I've come to find out that your stance is really, “Well, perhaps they go to A CERTAIN heaven, but not the one you guys meant!”
Am I up to speed with your position now, Nick?
I know that Paul mentions “the third heaven” in scripture.
But how do you give a flat “NO” answer to the question of this thread, and only much later start to distinguish the heavens from each other?
Nick, do/will men ever go to ANY OF THE HEAVENS?
And is “in the air” where Enoch and Elijah have been dwelling all this time?
How about the souls of men who have died under the altar? Are they not in the same heaven as God is in, according to the context? Are they not told to wait until more of their brethren are killed like they were killed?
Hi MB,
Did I say that?Their final place of rest is not mentioned so why speculate?
Where is the altar?
Where IS under the altarRead Revelation to find out, Nick. I assume it is the altar that is before God and the four beings.
And there is no “final resting place” mentioned for Enoch or Elijah, because they are alive and dwelling in heaven.
Nick, I've shown you the scriptures. You can either believe them or not. I don't have time for the games, okay?
Revelation 8:3
………..on the golden altar before the throne.Revelation 9:13
……….the golden altar that is before God.I don't see any mention of a different altar in Revelation. The only one I notice is the one that is before the throne of God Himself. Should we not use our God-given logic to deduct that this is also the altar that the ex-human beings are under?
Do you have any reason to believe it would be a different altar in a different heaven?
Hi MB,
Acts 7:49
‘ HEAVEN IS MY THRONE, AND EARTH IS THE FOOTSTOOL OF MY FEET; WHAT KIND OF HOUSE WILL YOU BUILD FOR ME?’ says the Lord, ‘OR WHAT PLACE IS THERE FOR MY REPOSE?Nick,
The question of this thread has been answered. Jehovah took the man Elijah to heaven.
And although it is not spelled out exactly for you, it is evident that God also took Enoch to heaven.
Genesis 5:24 NET ©
Enoch walked with God, and then he disappeared 1 because God took 2 him away.Footnote #2 says:
The text simply states that God took Enoch. Similar language is used of Elijah’s departure from this world (see 2 Kgs 2:10). The text implies that God overruled death for this man who walked with him.As for Revelation, these souls are the souls of men who were put to death for remaining loyal to God and His Christ under duress. They are in the same heaven as the throne of God is in, according to the verses I quoted for you. They were told to wait until others, who were to be killed as they had been killed, were to join their number.
Some men (ex-men) go to heaven, Nick.
Scripture says so, and I believe. End of story.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 01 2012,08:39) Hi MB,
Which heaven is specified?
Nick,Acts 1
King James Version (KJV)11Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Which heaven is specified here?
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