Christians remaining silent

[TimothyVI]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 17 2012,11:06)

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 17 2012,05:19) Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 17 2012,07:42) Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 16 2012,23:50) If everything needs a creator, then what source created God? If God is eternal, and has always existed, why did he wait so long to finally create something that only took him six days to create? He must have been pretty bored for trillions of years. Tim tim six days does not mean six times 24 hours   Genesis 1:5 New International Version (NIV) “5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.” Sounds like one 24 hour day to me. Tim tim it seems that way but if you look it a little closer you start to see more things like does a day start in the evening and end in the morning if yes why

Hi T,

You have a propensity for reading things into the bible that aren't there.
Genesis doesn't say that a day starts in the evening and ends in the morning.
You left out the light of day and the dark of night. in your rendition.
That verse merely says that within a day there was evening and morning.

Unless of course you are trying to make the case that God created the heavens and the earth in six half days, instead of six days.

Actually I can't figure out if that is what you are saying or that God created the heavens and the earth in six periods of time using thousands of angels to actually build it for him.
You have some strange ideas for a Christian, and the bible says whatever you imagine it to say.

Tim

[terraricca]

2BEES

Quote

Can you point out to me where it says that an evening and a morning, which Genesis says was one day, means thousands of years or more? One verse?

can you point out that it is 24 hours one verse

if not I show you why it is not a 24 hour day, first answer my question

[terraricca]

tim

Quote

(1) that God created the heavens and the earth then in six periods of time using thousands of angels to actually (2)manage to change the surface of the earth in those six parts and the angels build it for him.

you are mixing two creation periods

look I fix your quote 1 and 2

[terraricca]

tim

Quote

Hi T, You have a propensity for reading things into the bible that aren't there. Genesis doesn't say that a day starts in the evening and ends in the morning. You left out the light of day and the dark of night. in your rendition. That verse merely says that within a day there was evening and morning.

you should refresh you reading ,and pay attention to what it says and not make up your assumption into reality 's,,

Ge 1:2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

do you understand what it says here and what it does not say

Ge 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.
Ge 1:4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.
Ge 1:5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

LET THERE BE LIGHT ” WHAT LIGHT DOES HE TALKING ABOUT ? AND AS A RESULT OF LIGHT DARKNESS IS CREATED BUT WHAT DARKNESS IS IT HIS THIS THE LIGHT AND NIGHT OF THE DAY 'S OF THE WEEKS AND MONTHS AND YEARS ?

IF SO WHAT WAS CREATED ON THE FORTH DAY;;
Ge 1:14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years,
Ge 1:15 and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so.
Ge 1:16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars.
Ge 1:17 God set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth,
Ge 1:18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good.
Ge 1:19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day

[TimothyVI]

Hi T,
I can understand you being confused by the two different creation stories.
Many people are.

Tim

[terraricca]

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 18 2012,00:48)

Hi T, I can understand you being confused by the two different creation stories. Many people are. Tim

tim

your quote is useless but fulfills your opinion

[Stu]

Quote (2besee @ Oct. 17 2012,17:52)

Quoted: There is no God. All of the wonders around us are accidental.  No almighty hand made a thousand-billion stars.  They made themselves.   No power keeps them on their steady course. The earth spins itself to keep the oceans from falling off toward the sun.  Infants teach themselves to cry when they are hungry or hurt.  A small flower invented itself so that we could extract digitalis for sick hearts. The earth gave itself day and night, tilted itself so that we get seasons.  Without the magnetic poles man would be unable to navigate the trackless oceans of water and air, but they just grew there. How about the sugar thermostat in the pancreas?  It maintains a level of sugar in the blood sufficient for energy.  Without it, all of us would fall into a coma and die. Why does snow sit on mountain-tops waiting for the warm spring sun to melt it at just the right time for the young crops in farms below to drink?  A very lovely accident. The human heart will beat for 70 or 80 years without faltering.  How does it get sufficient rest between beats?  A kidney will filter poison from the blood, and leave good things alone.  How does it know one from the other? Who gave the human tongue flexibility to form words, and a brain to understand them, but denied it to all other animals? Who showed a womb how to take the love of two persons and keep splitting a tiny ovum until, in time, a baby would have the proper number of fingers, eyes, ears, and hair in the right places, and come into the world when it is strong enough to sustain life? There is no God? http://www.clarion-call.org/prose/nogod.htm

Seriously? Are you really citing these as examples of things that cannot be explained?

I guess that's the kind of ignorance a slavish commitment to Bronze Age superstition can give you.

Stuart

[2besee]

Quote (Stu @ Oct. 18 2012,20:13)

Seriously?  Are you really citing these as examples of things that cannot be explained? I guess that's the kind of ignorance a slavish commitment to Bronze Age superstition can give you. Stuart

So you think that things just 'happened'? That there was a big bang and suddenly everything was just there, all working perfectly, every single thing? No way.

Where is all the new stuff then?

[2besee]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 18 2012,04:14)

2BEES Quote Can you point out to me where it says that an evening and a morning, which Genesis says was one day, means thousands of years or more? One verse? can you point out that it is 24 hours one verse if not I show you why it is not a 24 hour day, first answer my question

Exodus 20:11

For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: why the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Which day was made the sabbath?

[TimothyVI]

Maybe each day is 2,000 years and He has been resting
and that is why nobody has seen him lately.
Tim

[Proclaimer]

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 17 2012,07:50)

If everything needs a creator, then what source created God? If God is eternal, and has always existed, why did he wait so long to finally create something that only took him six days to create? He must have been pretty bored for trillions of years. Tim

Infinity has no beginning and no end. No number precedes it.

And if you are a logical person you would know that whatever the cause of the universe as, it has to be eternal or infinite. If it wasn't then it would mean that everything came form nothing and if nothing was the earliest state, there would be nothing now.

Scripture is clear that he is the God of Ages. Ages is the same word as eons or worlds.

No one can say that we were the first created. And who knows but God what he did before the universe.

Even statistically speaking it is more likely that everything is the product of consciousness and intelligence than something that is not conscious or intelligent.

And if you still stick to the latter, then you have an oxymoronic problem. How did the source create that which the source did not possess. i.e., consciousness and intelligence. Scientists are adamant that all we see in the universe was determined at the moment of the bang.

Yes God can seem like a hard to believe idea especially when you go to work each day, watch TV, and sleep without thinking about God. But the fact remains that we exist, we are intelligent, we are alive. This proof when reversed engineered has only one conclusion.

[terraricca]

stu

Quote

I guess that's the kind of ignorance a slavish commitment to Bronze Age superstition can give you.

yeah,the carbon14 tested on the ice man between swiserland and Italy was found with a bronze weapon and so history ad to revise the bronze age

did you adapted to those changes

[TimothyVI]

Quote (t8 @ Oct. 19 2012,00:29)

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 17 2012,07:50) If everything needs a creator, then what source created God? If God is eternal, and has always existed, why did he wait so long to finally create something that only took him six days to create? He must have been pretty bored for trillions of years. Tim Infinity has no beginning and no end. No number precedes it. And if you are a logical person you would know that whatever the cause of the universe as, it has to be eternal or infinite. If it wasn't then it would mean that everything came form nothing and if nothing was the earliest state, there would be nothing now. Scripture is clear that he is the God of Ages. Ages is the same word as eons or worlds. No one can say that we were the first created. And who knows but God what he did before the universe. Even statistically speaking it is more likely that everything is the product of consciousness and intelligence than something that is not conscious or intelligent. And if you still stick to the latter, then you have an oxymoronic problem. How did the source create that which the source did not possess. i.e., consciousness and intelligence. Scientists are adamant that all we see in the universe was determined at the moment of the bang. Yes God can seem like a hard to believe idea especially when you go to work each day, watch TV, and sleep without thinking about God. But the fact remains that we exist, we are intelligent, we are alive. This proof when reversed engineered has only one conclusion.

Hi T8,

Thanks for your input.
I have never heard anybody say that the universe came from nothing. Can you show me where that has been stated?

My question is this, If complex things can only arise from things more complex still, can you offer any explanation for the actual origin of complexity.

Tim

[Stu]

Quote (2besee @ Oct. 18 2012,19:35)

Quote (Stu @ Oct. 18 2012,20:13) Seriously?  Are you really citing these as examples of things that cannot be explained? I guess that's the kind of ignorance a slavish commitment to Bronze Age superstition can give you. Stuart So you think that things just 'happened'? That there was a big bang and suddenly everything was just there, all working perfectly, every single thing? No way. Where is all the new stuff then?

What things do you mean?

The explanation for why stars form is not the same as the explanation for how so many species of life came to live on earth.

Do you actually know anything about your origins, and the origins of the solar system you inhabit?

Stuart

[Stu]

Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 19 2012,02:04)

stu Quote I guess that's the kind of ignorance a slavish commitment to Bronze Age superstition can give you. yeah,the carbon14 tested on the ice man between swiserland and Italy was found with a bronze weapon and so history ad to revise the bronze age did you adapted to those changes

You might have to be a bit more specific. Have I adapted to what exactly?

Stuart

[Stu]

Quote (t8 @ Oct. 19 2012,00:29)

And if you are a logical person you would know that whatever the cause of the universe as

On what basis do you claim the universe had a cause?

Stuart

[Ed J]

Hi Stuart,

On the Scientific basis that every “effect” has a “Cause”.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Stu]

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 21 2012,00:44)

Hi Stuart, On the Scientific basis that every “effect” has a “Cause”. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

How is that “scientific”?

Stuart

[david]

Quote

If everything needs a creator, then what source created God? If God is eternal, and has always existed, why did he wait so long to finally create something that only took him six days to create? He must have been pretty bored for trillions of years. Tim

I have wondered this myself. It's a troubling question.

God existing forever (but possibly without time, since time is a function of the physical universe) and only extremely recently did he decide to create the universe. Why wait so incredibly long?

If creating the universe and humans was an act of great love, why wait so incredibly long? Not just a trillion of our years, or a trillion times a trillion. Not just a trillion to the power of a trillion. Not just a 1 with a trillion to the power of a trillion zeros behind it, far more zeros than there are atoms that exist in the universe. NO! All those numbers I mentioned above, if multiplied together would only be one grain of sand in a universe of time filled with sand. And even that is a gross under exaggeration, for understanding infinite time.

“Why” did god wait so very long? Does anyone else find this question troubling?

[TimothyVI]

Hi David,
It is even more troubling if you consider that in this period of trillions and trillions of years, in this eternity, we have existed for a mere blink of God's eyes, and yet he is still concerned with whether one of us picks up sticks on a certain day of the week.

Tim

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