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T8 and Edj……What Jodi does is bring all the scriptures in that, apply and back up to her points. Sometimes there are a lot of scriptures that back up a point. She spends a lot of time writing them down for us. Why blame her because you guys have such a short attintion spand? She is simply driving her points in , like a well hammered nail, while you guys seem to be happy with a couple taps on it. I find what she brings out very well thought out. IMO
Now when you are talking about Carmel who adds to and changes words in scriptures, and sometimes LU, and Pilgrim and Berean, who post long quotes from other sources then our scriptures, that maybe true.
Peace and love to you all and yours……….gene
Hi LightenUp,
I agree with your post on Jehovah our righteousness. Both Jeremiah 23:6 and Jeremiah 33:16 are talking of the “Branch of righteousness to grow up unto David”, the one raised “unto David a righteous Branch”, a King that “shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth”, and “execute judgment and righteousness in the land”.
This we know to be Jesus, not the Father but the Son, unto whom God said “Thy throne, O God (The Son) is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy (the Son’s) kingdom. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God (the Father), even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows”.
How glorious is Jesus Christ the Son.
Hi Pilgrim,
So thankful for your comments, unity in truth is my purpose here, whether I have to let go of something that I have falsely believed in or I can show truth to someone else. To grow in love is certainly an area in which I have plenty of room to grow in and this forum is continually a training ground. I’m glad you are here!
1 Corinthians 13
1If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing. 4Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, 5does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, 6does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; 7bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.
Love in Christ, LU
Hi Edj,
First of all, I respect your concept regarding your participation and the sort of satisfaction you expect to receive from doing so!
But that is only yours and by the look of it T8’s and some others like Mike.
YOU: I don’t read your posts at all:
ME: DON’T READ THEM!
They are not just for you! I bet there are more who ONLY just read posts and take NO interest to post any.
YOU: because you make large posts with little to no content.
Yes, you are right, IN RELATION YOUR MATURITY, which I respect, but my interest is not to have a telephone conversation, A CHAT, or something like a PING PONG!
From my side, I am more interested to reveal SPIRITUAL things, and GOD’S HIDDEN WISDOM, which ONLY FEW CAN APPRECIATE, AND EXPECT TO FIND!
Ther’s something very vital as well that the SPIRIT OF TRUTH WORKS according to WHAT HE HEARS.
Let’s face it, scripture is right in
Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy to dogs; neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest perhaps they trample them under their feet, and turning upon you, they tear you.
Galatians 1:10 For do I now persuade men or God? Or do I seek to please men? If I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.
ME:We are not DISCUSSING a PAPERBACK FICTION,
Edj, WHAT DO YOU READ IN THE BIBLE?
IF YOU EVER EAD THE BIBLE.
DONT TELL ME THAT YOU EXPECT COMMENTS IN THE BIBLE!
DON’T TELL ME THAT YOU UNDERSTAND SOMETHING IN MERE FEW LINES!
THE BIBLE IS A MYSTERIOUS ENCYCLOPEDIA OF GODS’ WISDOM.
YOU: T8 and most others, likely do not read them as well.
ME: Now you are putting everybody in one basket!
Simply to prove you are right, MAYBE!
YOU: I usually read Gene’s posts,
because at least he tries to make a point. I don’t always agree with him,
but like I said: at least “he” tries to make a point.ME: WITH EVERY RESPECT TO Gene
HE DOESN’T EVEN RESPECT OTHERS’ POSTS WHEN HE ANSWERS, HE ONLY ANSWERS AS HE FEELS FIT TO SATISFY AND QUENCH HIS AIM, AND NEVER BOTHER TO PRODUCE OTHERS’ RESPECTIVE POINTS, SIMPLY TO MAKE SURE THAT HE IS ALWAYS RIGHT IN RELATION TO HIS BELIEF!
You, on the other hand try to make 9-15 points each post,
and I really don’t have the time to unpackage them.
And you will likely ignore my points anyways.I NEVER POSTED TO YOU LONG POSTS.
YOU: You are too busy wasting your time on each other,
ME: From your perceptions YES.
IN FACT I DON’T KNOW IF YOU EVER WRITTEN SO LONG
A POST,
TO PROVE NOT ONE POINT AS YOU SAID AND PREFER, BY ALL YOUR
POINTS
FROM THE OTHER HAND, YOU ARE NOT HEAVENNET.NET
YOU: instead you should try to establish truth like I do.
ME: IS TRUTH ESTABLISHED IN FEW WORDS OR IN ONE POINT?
MAY I ASK YOU ONE POINT AND MAKE SURE YOU POST THE FULL TRUTH?
WHAT IS THE MEANING OF
BORN!
JUST TO REMIND YOU!
IN FEW WORDS AND FULL TRUTH!
THIS IS THE LONGEST POST I POSTED TO YOU SIMPLY
TO ANSWER ALL YOUR POINTS! I’M AFRAID
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Satan is NOT the god of this age who blinds the hearts of the unbelieving to the glory of the gospel of Christ. YHVH has control of lifting the veil over unbeliever’s minds or letting it remain.
Look at the context of the passage and see that satan is not mentioned at all but instead God YHVH is the one who enlightens people or not enlightens people (blinds them) with true knowledge. Read the passage 2 Cor 3:12-4:6 without the interference of chapter and verse numbering and notice that context speaks about the veil over the hearts of the Israelites which can only be removed in Christ:
Therefore having such a hope, we use great boldness in our speech, and are not like Moses, who used to put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel would not look intently at the end of what was fading away. But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ. But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; 16but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.
Therefore, since we have this ministry, as we received mercy, we do not lose heart, but we have renounced the things hidden because of shame, not walking in craftiness or adulterating the word of God, but by the manifestation of truth commending ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God. And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, in whose case the God of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. For we do not preach ourselves but Christ Jesus as Lord, and ourselves as your bond-servants for Jesus’ sake. For God, who said, “Light shall shine out of darkness,” is the One who has shone in our hearts to give the Light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.
In other words, from what I can tell…the passage is about the believers who are boldly proclaiming the gospel should not lose heart when the gospel is not received because believer’s can’t remove the veil over the unbeliever’s minds/hearts, it is YHVH alone who removes the veil whenever a person turns to the Lord. Believers just keep boldly proclaiming the gospel and don’t try to determine who will turn to the Lord. Leave it to YHVH to remove the veil or not.
If satan had the power to put on the veil, he would also have the power to not put on the veil and thus he would be in control of who gets the true light or who doesn’t. However it is YHVH that removes the veil that came on mankind’s mind/heart when, ironically, the eyes of both Adam and Eve were said to have “opened” at the moment they disobeyed God’s command.
Gen 3:6When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make one wise, she took from its fruit and ate; and she gave also to her husband with her, and he ate. 7Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loin coverings.
YHVH has control of the blindness of people’s hearts, not satan. In the right time, YHVH sends the true Light of the gospel to man’s heart.
Eventually every eye will see who they have been believing in of not believing in and will expose their heart’s condition:
Rev 1:7 BEHOLD, HE IS COMING WITH THE CLOUDS, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the earth will mourn over Him. So it is to be. Amen.
Blessings, LU
Hi LightenUp,
re: righteousness – Just a point of clarification that our discussion has been about who was meant in the Jeremiah passages as Jehovah our Righteousness. This scripture clearly confirms that it is Christ as we see in this verse “of him (God) are you in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:” (1 Cor 1:30).
By this we are not saying God the Father is not righteous but on the contrary God the Father is righteous as Jesus said in John 17:25.
The point is that Man is unrighteous having fallen short of the glory of God through sin. But now the righteousness which God requires of Man is revealed in the gospel and obtained by faith, not by works of law (Romans 3:21-22; Phil 3:8-11).
As the Apostle Peter says we have “obtained like precious faith” with the Apostles and it is obtained “through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:” (2 Peter 1:1).
This righteousness of God is not the essential righteousness of God, the rectitude of his nature, his righteousness in fulfilling his promises etc, but that righteousness of obedience (in opposition to lawlessness and disobedience) which God achieved in Christ on our behalf by Christ obeying the precepts of God, and bearing the penalty of the law in the room of his people, and by which his people are justified in the sight of God.
Hi LightenUp,
re: blindness
It is Absolutely true that God is the giver of light and by turning to Christ all blindness is healed. We Give “thanks unto the Father, which has made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who has delivered us from the power of darkness, and has translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:” (Col 1:12-13).
But note that until that translation takes place all the world lies in the wicked one, that is, in darkness which entered mankind through the deception of the serpent and disobedience of Adam and drew all humanity into the kingdom of darkness and required God to exclude them from his presence and fellowship.That old Serpent the Devil opened their eyes to his world of sin (to aspire to be gods as he had aspired to sit as God) and blinded them to the true path on how to reign. This remains the state of all who are lost until they turn to Christ.
Note LightenUp that in 2 Cor 3 Paul is saying the Jews were blinded from seeing the glorious new covenant in Christ by being zealous for the old covenant of the law but that if they turned to Christ the blindness would be taken away as it had been for him and as he alludes to between 2 Cor 3 and 2 Cor 4:4 where Paul says in v.2 he had “renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God”. He came into the light by renouncing darkness and by rightly dividing the word of God.
God does not make men blind then judge them for being blind. Mankind is already in darkness through sin and Christ came to give light and redeem from sin. Those who reject the light shall be judged for rejecting the light, for not renouncing dishonesty etc, for rejecting the redemption in Christ Jesus.
For Jesus came into the world that the blind (those who are in the darkness of sin, ignorance, and unbelief, and who are sensible of the same, and desire spiritual illuminations) might see. But those who claim to see (who are wise and knowing in their own conceit, who fancy themselves to have great light and knowledge, and to have the key of knowledge, and to have the true understanding of divine things, and to be guides of the blind, such as the Scribes and Pharisees , who live in darkness) these are given over to, left in, their blindness and hardness of heart, because they shut their eyes, and harden their hearts against the Gospel.
Hi LightenUp,
Loved the quote from 1 Corinthians 13. In the beautiful epistle Of 1 John we see God revealed as Life, Light and Love. Through Christ Jesus being Son of God and Son Of Man, Life, Light and Love (the fullness of God) has been made accessible to us so we can have fellowship with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ, together with the Apostles and receive eternal life, be children of light and walk in love.
Praise the Lord. Delivered from death, darkness and being hateful and hating. This is the essence and purpose (aim) of the gospel and why we go to Christ himself rather than be one of those who search the scriptures thinking that we will find eternal life in them rather than Christ. At the end of the day theological correctness won’t save us. Jesus said to some who did mighty works in his name that he would “profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity” (Matthew 7:23). We must know Christ in spiritual intimacy, spiritual beings, being born of the Spirit and walking in the Spirit, bringing forth the fruit of the Spirit.
T8 and Edj……What Jodi does is bring all the scriptures in that, apply and back up to her points. Sometimes there are a lot of scriptures that back up a point. She spends a lot of time writing them down for us. Why blame her because you guys have such a short attintion spand? She is simply driving her points in , like a well hammered nail, while you guys seem to be happy with a couple taps on it. I find what she brings out very well thought out. IMO
Maybe she does that. What I see her do is take scriptures people are talking about that are very clear and use the method that you just mentioned. Simply put, the application is probably not bad, but the intention is not pure. If you cherry pick a whole lot of scriptures and make a conclusion in order to detract from other scriptures, then that is not an honest search for truth. Instead, what that is is simply starting with the so-called answer and forming the questions and evidence around it to support it. A similar method is implored by evolutionists.
I prefer to let the scripture and evidence speak no matter what it says and then through the grace of God see the big picture from there. Not the other way round. That is, start with the big picture and cherry pick scriptures to support the biased belief.
The other thing that she does that is not honest IMO is quote scriptures that Jesus is a man with the pure intention of trying to prove that there is no divine nature with this person. We already know that he is a man that he came in the flesh. She thinks somehow that ends the scriptures that say other important things. But all scripture is given by God, not just her favorite ones.
In short, she post essays that no one reads except maybe you, you praise her and make her feel good about the post and she goes again. But whatever, it is not illegal to do so. Just that she is really posting to you only. Oh and Carmel too. I think they waste each other’s time but it is their life to live and they are free to do so.
Hi Edj,
WHAT IS THE MEANING OFBORN!
JUST TO REMIND YOU!
IN FEW WORDS AND FULL TRUTH!
Hi Carmel, see this is not so hard (taken from Luke 2:11 – Born):
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance G5088
Original Word: τίκτω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: tiktóbear, be born, bring forth
A strengthened form of a primary teko tek’-o (which is used only as alternate in certain tenses);
to produce (from seed, as a mother, a plant, the earth, etc.), literally or figuratively
— bear, be born, bring forth, be delivered, be in travail.____________
God bless
Ed JHi T8,
I agree with your comments re: Jodi. Well said.
Jodi unfortunately refuses to acknowledge the plain meaning of text in scripture but instead has to manipulate it to fit in to a predetermined theological position she holds.
As you said she keeps quoting scriptures about Jesus as a man which (is already acknowledged by born again believers) and this does not refute Jesus’ divinity.
But even Jodi’s view on Christ’s human origins is unscriptural, as is her view on the anointing making Christ the Son of God.
T8…..I disagree with your and Pilgrims views, because Jodi drives the points home, that Jesus is a human being, who came “through” the loin of King David, which shows his origins, you both deny that by saying he preexisted as another being, which you both produce no proof of, and therefore your mispresentation of Jesus is a “morphed” being comming into existence as a flesh being from a past existence. Then you take scriptures that do not “specifically ” say that and try to force the text to say it. actually you people are doing exactly what you are accusing Jodi of. You all have not produced one “specific” scripture that says Jesus came from another existence of anykind. So Jodi and I repeat over and over scriptures “clear” scriptures that say where and what means he came from, even , words out of Jesus’ own mouth, like him saying this, “I am the root and “offspring ” of King David, that is just one of “many” solid and “clear” scriptures she keeps mentioning without any comments from either or any of you people.
Anyway I think your both wrong, I think she presents so many scriptures, because there is so much evidence, but it is you people who refuse to acknowledge them, you say your not disagreeing with her about Jesus being a man, but that is not her point , her point is, that is all he ever was and is still, a flesh man. Who God the Father raised up from humanity, then perfected , and placed him over us as a fellow human brother, Even when he return he said he will still be a “a son of man”.
The real question to me is do you people “really” believe what Jesus actually said?
Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene
Hi Pilgrim,
re: blindness…I am very certain that satan cannot blind people from the gospel. It is our choice to turn from seeing the Light (obeying God) to seeing the darkness (not obeying God). YHVH compels us one way, satan compels us to disobey. We can freely choose which way (obedience to God or disobedience to God) but it is because of the righteousness of YHVH that we have the option to be blind in darkness or walk in the Light. If YHVH did not create the option, we would not have been able to choose the wrong path. The evil one did not create the option, nor force us to choose the wrong path. The evil one cannot force us and cannot blind us to the gospel. Adam and Eve did not have the choice to obey God or obey the evil one. It was to obey God or not to obey God and choosing poorly gave power to the evil one over us. The choice was never to choose between two gods. There is only one God of this world and He provides the Light as well as the darkness. The evil one had nothing to do with providing the darkness as a choice to turn to. The evil one merely can entice/deceive us towards the darkness and further into the darkness.
The choice that God gave (not the evil one) is why I say it is God that blinds us. He has to blind us because that was His plan. He gave the option to obey or disobey and suffer the consequences. He is the designer of the path that He put Adam and Eve on and He designed the path to have two opposing directions to choose from and He designed the ramifications of the wrong choice, which includes spiritual blindness, btw. Fortunately, that is not the end of the story because we have a choice to turn towards the light and when we do, YHVH shines the light in our hearts. I’m so thankful for the love of YHVH to not make us puppets but human beings with a free will to choose and for the Son of God who redeems us through faith in His righteousness.
After Adam and Eve sinned, mankind was born facing darkness. We all have a choice to turn around because of the hope in the Messiah and His righteousness that is offered to cover us. I’m thankful that my parents pointed me to the Light right from the beginning.
Interesting discussion to think about. I spent hours yesterday just seeking the truth on this. The evil one would love to be considered the god of this world. Not by me.
Btw, another intriguing thing to think about, Saul on the road to Damascus was in darkness although very religious, and Jesus didn’t wait for him to turn from the darkness before Jesus interrupted Saul’s journey and showed him the Light. I say that to demonstrate that YHVH can show up right in front of us as we go down the path to darkness if that suits His purpose. Saul ultimately did have the choice though to receive the truth and turn from his ways which we know he did. Saul/Paul was not forced to choose Light but did and did so fervently.
Blessings, LU
Hi Pilgrim,
re: righteousness
Agree…good verses. Thank you!
Jesus is YHVH our Righteousness. One day all knees will bow and confess this to the glory of God the Father.
Hi Edj,
YOU: Hi Carmel, see this is not so hard (taken from Luke 2:11 – Born):
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance G5088
Original Word: τίκτω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: tiktóbear, be born, bring forth
Edj, Thanks for your prompt reply, I appreciate!
but that’s not
ALL TRUTH REGARDING BORN IS IT?
what about FOR INSTANCE born in
Genesis 4:18 And unto Enoch was BORN Irad: and Irad BEGAT Mehujael: and Mehujael BEGAT Methusael: and Methusael begat Lamech.
Genesis 4:1And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and BARE Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.
3205. yalad
yalad: to bear, bring forth, beget
Original Word: יָלַד
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: yalad
Phonetic Spelling: (yaw-lad’)
Definition: to bear, bring forth, begetNow how about
Meaning of born in English
After all, we are using the English language aren’t we
ADJECTIVE
1Existing as a result of birth.‘she was born in Aberdeen’
‘I was born with a sense of curiosity’
‘a newly born baby’More example sentences
Synonyms
1.1in combination Having a specific nationality.
‘a German-born philosopher’
1.2attributive Having a natural ability to do a particular job.
‘he’s a born engineer’More example sentences
Synonyms
1.3predicative, with infinitive Perfectly suited or trained to do a particular job.
‘men born to rule’More example sentences
1.4(of an organization, movement, or idea) brought into existence.
‘on 1 January 1992, the new company was born’More example sentences
1.5born ofExisting as a result of (a particular situation or feeling)
‘his work is born of despair’More example sentences
Usage
On the difference between born and borne, seebear
Phrases
born and bred
By birth and upbringing, especially with reference to someone considered a typical product of a place.‘he was a Cambridge man born and bred’
More example sentences
be born with a silver spoon in one’s mouth
Be born into a wealthy family of high social standing.‘it’s obvious that he wasn’t raised with a silver spoon’
in all one’s born days
Used to express surprise at something one has not encountered before.‘in all my born days I’ve never seen the like of it’
More example sentences
not know one is born
British used to convey that someone has an easy life without realizing how easy it is.‘you lot without families don’t know you’re born’
More example sentences
I (or he, she, etc.) wasn’t born yesterday
Used to indicate that one (or another person) is not foolish or gullible.More example sentences
there’s one (or a sucker) born every minute
informal there are many gullible people.More example sentences
Origin
Old English boren, past participle of beran ‘to bear’ (see bear).
Pronunciation
born
/bɔːn/Am I exaggerating Edj?\
ONE MORE THING!
Since we are discussing the BIBLE, IN A WAY,
THE WORD BORN IN ACTUAL FACT LITERALLY SPEAKING,
JESUS ALSO WAS BORN
BUT IT HAS ABSOLUTE NOTHING IN COMPARISON BOTH TO HIS CONCEPTION, HIS MYSTERIOUS TIME IN HIS MOTHER’S PARTICULAR WOMB, AND
HIS UNFATHOMABLE BIRTH AS
SON OF GOD/SON OF MAN
NOW ACCORDING TO YOU WHO WAS BORN FIRST
THE SON OF GOD (Abel) JESUS’DIVINE NATURE 100% OR
THE SON OF MAN? (Cain) ? JESUS HUMAN NATURE 100%
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Hi Lu,
YOU: Hi Carmel,
Please clarify:
Do you believe that Jesus is satan in some way?
Lu, DO YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS
YOU, THOUGH A FEMALE, IN SOME WAY?
Keep in mind that JESUS (MALE AND FEMALE)is not quite the same as
JESUS CHRIST!
FOR INSTANCE:
WE ARE DEFINITELY
ALL IN JESUS AND
JESUS IS IN ALL OF US!
BUT I BET WE STILL HAVE A LONG LONG, LONG WAY TO GO TO BE
CHRISTS LIKE
Peace and Love in Jesus Christ
Hi GeneBathrop,
You: “words out of Jesus’ own mouth, like him saying this, “I am the root and “offspring ” of King David”
My Response: this very scripture proves the point that was being made about the way you and Jodi interpret scripture to suit your theology. In that very scripture Christ is called “root” as well as “offspring”. You are happy to interpret “offspring” as an actual person but not “root”, even though “root” means the origins from which something comes. Your interpretation that “root” is only talking of God’s foreknowledge (knowing the end from the beginning) and while this scripture talks about the purpose and will of God before concerning the coming of Christ, you miss the point of what Jesus himself is saying. David’s origins were from Christ.
You were given other scripture where Jesus himself said he was “before” Abraham and John Baptist said Christ existed “before” he did. But again instead of allowing “before” in the context to mean what anyone would understand “before” to me, you attribute it mean in the foreknowledge of God only. This is the type of biblical hermeneutics you both use to suit your theological starting point.
Again you keep claiming contrary to scripture that Jesus Christ was a son of Adam, yet nowhere in scripture is this said. Even the lineage in Luke goes back to Adam as son of God. You deny Jesus was Christ until Jordan despite the fact that Simeon, under the revelation of the Spirit being led to see Jesus as a babe before Simeon died, called him the Lord’s Christ. And it is a great shame that you both take such an approach to scripture to suit your theology.
To LightenUp,
Praise God we have a common understanding regarding God the Father and Jesus Christ His Son.
Regarding the topic “god of this world”, we need to understand that the “world” Paul is talking of is “this present evil world” out of which born again children of God are delivered, not the created “world” that the Almighty God created which includes all things I.e. earth, heavens, seas and everything in them including principalities & powers, angelic beings etc.
T8 drew your attention to what the Apostle John said about that “present evil world” , namely “For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.” (1 John 2:16). These three ways were how the Serpent tempted Eve and Christ. This is his domain. The same Apostle says “the whole world lies in wickedness (or in the wicked one)” (1 John 5:19).
To the Jews Jesus said “You are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaks of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.” (John 8:44).
It was this “Old Serpent”, the Devil, that “deceived” Eve and drew a 1/3 of the angelic beings into rebellion. He deceived Eve into thinking they could be gods like God. I would call that blinding her to the truth. Had Adam Obeyed he would have “reigned in life” and exercised the dominion he had been given But all this was lost through disobedience.
The Jews of Paul’s day, and the majority of them still to day, “have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God”. They cannot SEE that “Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believes”. (Romans 10:2-4). Like Paul they need the entrance of Light, and like Paul’s conversion shows, it is Jesus who gives that Light (not blindness).
God is Light and the WORD is the Eternal Life, which Life is the light of everyone who comes into the created world. Jesus came to give light not blind people. Everyone who has ever lived lives in darkness under the Spirit of disobedience, blind to the light (by the Liar & Deceiver & Murderer), until they receive the Light, and “the day Star arise in their hearts” (2 Peter 1:19), at which point they “receive power to become sons of God” and be “translated out of darkness into the kingdom of the God’s dear Son”.
Hi Pilgrim,
I realize I need to go back and respond to a post I missed where you asked questions.
But seeing your last post to Gene, I would like to comment on that now.
Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out OF the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: 2 And the Spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the Spirit of wisdom and understanding, the Spirit of counsel and might, the Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD;
rod – choter, meaning branch or twig
stem – geza, meaning stem, trunk
branch – nester, meaning sprout, shoot, branch
roots – sheresh, root
there shall come forth a branch out of the trunk of Jesse, a shoot shall grow out of his roots.
Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
root – rhiza, meaning a root
that which like a root springs from a root, a sprout, shoot
metaph. offspring, progenyYou are mistaken to say that in this passage Jesus is the root to which then David sprouts from. We are given a metaphor and then the direct meaning of that metaphor, Jesus is a sprout OF David, meaning that he is OF David’s offspring.
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